- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
(does not reflect my opinion, just thought it looked funny)
Less hostile when in context.
Taken from a YouTube channel called Not Just Bikes.
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And car sound systems.
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No, because there aren’t any businesses which pay a livable wage within walking distance of 98% of Americans. yay logic!
So let’s make it so that cities are easily traversable without cars!
And in 80 years we might get the report from the committee about the proposal to create a committee to study the feasibility of possibly allowing four story homes.
Oh, wait, no, some NIMBY killed it.
True but this really has little to do with the excessive noise issues. Really easy to build quieter cars, we just let assholes choose how loud they want to be and the results are predictable.
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They’re agreeing with y’all tho?
“Yay logic!” means they think it’s dumb logic.
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That’s exactly their point though? The people who argue for cars argue that they’re necessary because US cities aren’t walkable, while conveniently ignoring that that’s entirely due to the auto industry and that making cities more walkable is still an option. They’re pointing out how fucked that logic is.
If that’s not what they’re saying, then they’re a terrible communicator as well as an idiot.
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Ugh, that’s what I get for having faith in people
Cars are already subject to noise restrictions. So effectively loud cars are banned. There is just little enforcement for most of it.
Let’s refocus the police funds of shooting or falsely arresting POC, and instead ticketing and enforcing the loud car situation.
Who needs cops? I believe CA passed a bill to trial automatic enforcement of this issue last year. Detects excessive noise and photographs the license plates just like speed cameras.
I’m waiting to see where they will trial it. I haven’t heard anything recently.
Agreed. Take 90+% of their funding, and use it for preventative measures instead.
Habeas corpus makes those tickets unenforceable
Is that true? They still send them out.
https://www.findlaw.com/traffic/traffic-tickets/speeding-and-red-light-camera-tickets.html
This goes over a lot of the legal problems of these systems. You should always contest a camera ticket
This article says the opposite though.
Therefore, federal courts have affirmed the right of municipalities to use speeding and red light cameras. Additionally, lawsuits challenging the use of private companies to operate red light cameras have been dismissed or defeated.
I am not a lawyer and I have wondered about the constitutional questions of these. But according to this the courts have largely allowed them.
That part is incorrect. There have been many districts that have thrown them out or outlawed them entirely.
Our po-po don’t shoot POC (generally) but we still have loud cars.
I know what I’m saying is not objective data, but where I live I hear a ton of motorcycles that are tweaked to remove the silencers and noise protections
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What does it matter if they aren’t enforceable?
They’re enforceable if your government body isn’t afraid of irritating private companies. Or in simpler terms: set a reasonable but strong noise limit, and forbid cars that exceed it in a controlled test to be imported or manufactured in your country.
I don’t think you understand why some cars are louder than others
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Amen brother. If your engine doesn’t make every dog in the neighborhood bark can you even call yourself a man? I wanna make every glass of water on the block shake like that scene in Jurassic park.
That’s not what homie is getting at.
Irritatingly loud cars don’t come from the manufacturer like that. When you buy a car there’s no “annoyingly loud” option.
People modify their cars. The objective is better performance, but the car will probably be louder.
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That may work to a point, people who get off on their noisy shits are more than willing to put in the work themselves.
Yep, 99% of the time that’s the case around here. Live next to a well trafficked road and have heard enough to identify a modded exhaust. It’s very rare that the loud assholes have stock exhausts, they usually put money into buying loud shit or just slice their old one off for good measure.
Also, even the modded exhausts wouldn’t be so bad if the drivers didn’t intentionally gun it just to make noise.
Then come the motorcycle groups, they’re the absolute worst. Even one is bad, but when a group of 50 travel through here on a quiet day it’s just… sad, enraging etc.
They’re the loudest we get around where I live, if ANYONE is breaking a noise ordinance it’s them, 50× over but I’ve never seen them pulled over or ticketed.
I don’t care if they’re loud, go do that on a “back road” where the houses are an acre away, don’t do it on a small street where babies are sleeping barely 20 feet away from you. At that volume, being that close they’d might as well knock on your door and scream in your face.
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Just screenshot and reupload?
Probably would’ve taken less time than the whiny comment
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Fair
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You guys lump motorcycles in on this, right? There’s some biker rally/meetup relatively close by this week/weekend, so I’m busy giving the finger to every asshole that passes with their stupid straight-pipe harleys and dumb shitty radios screaming skynard or AC/DC.
I drive an EV, fwiw. There’s literally zero public transportation here, so I’m not on the fuckcars train, sorry.
You can have a car and still want to fuck cars… wait no… and still be fuckcars. I do, and I’m mad I need one at all without losing hours a day.
My town has a “bike week” every few months it feels like, where all the people with their way too damn loud bikes get the privilege of blocking off half the city for a week to… I don’t even know?? Drink, I guess? Whatever the case, a major road becomes impassable and the entire city gets too loud to have a conversation on the sidewalk. It’s awful, god knows why the city thinks it’s a good idea. Ugh, now l’m annoyed again just thinking about it…
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I’d argue fossil motorcycles should be banned before fossil cars. If it’s about riding with nothing between you and the ground, an electric MC will do plenty. Otherwise, cars serve the same need.
I’m intending to get an electric bike, when I can. For me, nothing beats cruising down fire roads and a bit of single-track on a quiet vehicle.
They’ve both gotta go. The order is not important to me as long as it’s soon.
Driving an EV does not mean you don’t make noise, the noise is also mostly tires on the road above 30 km/h
Fuckcars is not necessarily about not having a car. It’s about wanting the conditions in which you’re able to get rid of your car.
In the right column should also have : cannot be aware of others on the road if you can’t hear their regular engines around you.
You don’t need loud vehicles for that, you can still hear quiet vehicles today
Not if you have a louder vehicle.
The only situation here in Europe where I hear individual cars is when I’m a pedestrian on a fairly empty road or when they’re obnoxiously loud.
Otherwise, I mostly hear my own car due to modern soundproofing and maybe the overall din of all the cars combined.
The former situation is actually addressed legislatively for really quiet cars (like EVs): They’re required to have a minimum noise level. If they drive slow enough to be really quiet, they have to generate an artificial sound.
(Edit: I do hear motorcycles, because they tend to have a unique, loud sound.)
that’s what all the windows are for. use eyes
Hearing adds benefits. You cannot deny it.
benefits maybe. deaf ppl still drive fine
Never said they didn’t. I can see you live up to the user name.
my point proves yours moot. doesn’t matter what you said or didn’t say
I found that a straight-through muffler made for a 99% reduction of pedestrians stepping into the road without looking.
Ah, you’re a troll, thx for letting us know.
But what about that one dude who wants to go rrrrrRRRRRRRRRRRRR at three in the morning and wake up everyone in a five mile radius?
Or the dude who installed a cheap car alarm himself and it goes off all the time because somebody is gonna steal his 15 year old Civic
Or when these two idiots team up and guy one sets off the alarm of guy two.
And you’ve barely slept in three weeks and you just got the baby to sleep.
Take his license.
I’ll say that so much of this is unnecessary or even BS. Ban loud cars because they’re annoying, that’s all that is necessary. Set a decibel limit and if you exceed it then you can be fined. Set time limits like when most people are sleeping so you can have loud cars at some more reasonable times and ban them when people aren’t expecting stupidly loud noises.
Points 1-9 are empirically proven effects of noise, none of them are BS. Point 10 is an arbitrary opinion.
Points 1-9 being empirically proven is still a BS argument unless you’re also supporting banning all loud noises. Using it as a justification for banning loud cars when we are around loud sounds elsewhere.
Uh… yes? This is commonly the case.
Germany e.g. has maximum noise immission levels of 55 dB(A) during daytime in mixed zoning areas to 35 dB(A) at night in hospital and similar areas…
So you didn’t bother reading the comments right next to yours where I already explained this?
Ambient sound levels from bugs can exceed 55dBa. We banning bugs?
35 is literally unobtainable, I don’t understand. Wearing high heels will get you a fine. Laughter. Rain.
Immission, not emission. Generally the regulations deal with noise made by humans and especially their appliances. Also, of course there are exceptions, e.g. for children.
And yes, 35 dB(A) is achieveable. A hospital at night is no place to have a party around. Also nobody will wait for you to run around in high heels to give you a fine. But if you regularly do that in your flat and your neighbor below is sick of it, that might get you in trouble.
Edit: does anyone think downvoting will change those facts? 🤡
Yeah, immission isn’t a word I’ve ever heard before so excuse my ignorance. Seems to correlate with how things are measured around here, where basically you take a historic ambient sound level and then the adjusted sound level after a source is introduced. For development, obviously doable. For people traversing the local roadway? Literally impossible. In fact, where I am from, the vehicle traffic associated with a use is typically exempt from their land use application because it’s just not feasible to get an accurate representation. It’s also not feasible to have a business put a “No popcorn tunes” sign up, and then actually enforce it.
Do you have any info on how this 35dB rule is enforced? Genuinely curious. My familiarity with the technology is through the testimony of experts in a quasi-judicial setting, and so I am far from an expert, but what I’ve heard with enough frequency is that it’s difficult if not impossible to pull out vehicle noise from ambient noise.
In that vein, there are restrictions based on the duration of noises and their level. Basically, a car door slamming is instantaneous. The backup alarm on a truck is constant. But yeah, unrelated. I just don’t know that you can use decibels to limit the motoring public.
And I say all of this being so staunchly against aftermarket tunes making your exhaust sound like you’re running rich. Shit is stupid. I say this having, at a point in my life, drove a car (factory stock) that had a loud exhaust. And so I think if you’re concerned, the best place to make a change is in regulations associated with vehicle exhausts. Neuter pickups and cars if they can’t cc comply. You need noise to get horsepower and torque? Too bad, muffle and restrict your pipes, and if you can’t make your vehicle strong enough, maybe make it smaller.
Most of all it’s just that there’s written rules, and that you can point at them if you feel things are too loud. With immission a lot is already considered when building new houses, train rails, streets, for example.
With cars and motorcycles there’s also emission guidelines, and you have to register aftermarket changes with the inspection authority. And if the police catch you with unregistered alterations they can fine you, ask to show proof of registration within a week, or even impound your vehicle on the spot.
And if there’s a e.g. noisy party in your area, you can call the police (a rite of passage for every German – your first noise complaint (“Ruhestörung”)) and they will ask nicely one time, if they have to come a second or third time they might confiscate your stereo, disband the party, etc. But it’s just their decision what’s too loud, they won’t take measurements.
If it’s something that’s not immediately obvious (e.g. dogs constantly barking), or the government is… less eager to act (e.g. airports) then it can evolve into a tedious and nerve wrecking legal battle. Which frequently happens.
I have lived in 4 different cities, two have no noise limit (just a generic don’t be loud when it will bother others noise ordinance), the other has an 85 db night time ordinance, and the last is 55/45 db residential day/night (60/55 mixed use, 70/60 industrial).
Yeah.
This is commonly the case
… outside the US…
Idk, I’m curious how common it is outside of Germany specifically. I’ve heard that Germany has exceptionally strict noise restrictions.
Ok well regardless of surrounding habitats; it’s a driving hazard. Loud cars are a hazard on the road if the owner cannot hear those around them. It’s not on the list but it should be front and center when it comes to road safety around others cuz the road is shared.
That doesn’t really make a lot of sense either though. Most cars have built in sound proofing and while you can hear other cars, it’s rarely a useful sense when driving. If not being able to hear is a significant hazard then why are deaf people allowed to drive?
Doesn’t mean there isn’t a benefit with hearing.
There is for sure, but I would argue that a quieter sports car with too much power for an inexperienced driver to handle is more of a hazard than a loud old beater car. I guess I’m just trying to add that there are other things that people drive that are more dangerous than a loud vehicle that we should probably focus on first, as much as loud vehicles can be a nuisance.
Focus on first?
Why do you need this to be a competition? That’s pretty toxic approach to problems.
A loud motorcycle is annoying, but way less dangerous than a quiet truck that the driver can’t see over, at least to other drivers and pedestrians. That’s all I was trying to add. No competition or toxicity, so I don’t know why you are getting that vibe. I even gave you that 1 up vote you have on that last comment there.
Better ban radios too then.
Well you sound unreasonable.
Fine the manufacturer for each incident with each vehicle and make them recall and fix every one to stop it. Unless it’s the result of someone modifying their own vehicle, then you seize the vehicle and suspend their license.
People modify their vehicles to be loud.
Most cities already have noise ordinances. But as usual owning a car gives you situational immunity to the law.
This was the line of thought I had as well, it should be so easy to stop this problem as it stands
You can’t just bust out a sound meter and take a reading. There are so many factors that it makes it unenforceable, because at the end of the day the burden of proof would still be placed on the enforcement arm that it was that vehicle. How do you control for ambient noise? Distance? Temperature? It is just unenforceable to make a dB level a mark.
If your car goes pop pop pop, though, I think you need to have your car taken away, and maybe your freedom, because you’re just an asshole.
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They are not enforced.
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Yeah everything from the list except last point is forced and overdone
Anybody else remember the trucker convoy protestors? Good times.
Imagine trying to ban trucks from the cities.
Many places around me have banned Jake braking.
some people see cognitive decline as a benefit to their bottom line
I moved to an apartment adjacent to an intersection on a medium-high traffic stroad and it was the biggest mistake of my life. I have never been so stressed. I can barely even enjoy music now because half the time if I hear bass in a song I think its coming from outside and I get annoyed for a few seconds.
As somebody who lives in a questionable neighbor, I would personally sacrifice a lot if we could ban vehicles from playing music above personal listening levels while in residential zones. Feeling house-reverberating bass at all hours of the day is way worse than normal car noises.
Kind of like the no wake zone for boats. You don’t even have to change the name.
On vehicles modified for sporting purposes the silencers no longer work because the propagation of sound is different and therefore db-killers are applied or it is avoided to drive them around the city center or during off hours. Then there are people who purposely remove the silencer just to make noise and this also reduce factory performance, these deserve to have their license withdrawn because they take advantage of the fact that noisy vehicles occasionally exist.
Very similar arguments apply for church bells, too.
