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- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
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Yeah quite a large portion of lemmings are politically insane. It’s either ‘burn the rich, overthrow the government’ or ‘Maybe the windmill party has a valid point’
Like why can’t people just be chill and get along
I suspect we needed a baseline level of insane to not just threaten to jump Reddit, but actually follow through on it.
It’s insane not to leave, but there’s certainly a baseline level of “gives a fuck”
Based
Well put! I love this place and have had some good discussions but I’ve also seen a lot of teenage political craziness and had that “oh, I’m talking to a lunatic or a child” sensation more often than I’d have liked to.
teenage political craziness
That’s a much more accurate description
Like why can’t people just be chill and get along
I think the hurtling toward climate crises has a lot of people desperate for governments to actually do something to help assuage it, not make it worse.
Well, the people “being chill and getting along” (i.e. just keeping the status quo going) is nowadays supporting a genocide,so…
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Even if all that was true, it supports genocide my man?
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Baby, I asked you if some people doing bad stuff justifies genocide as retaliation in your mind. It’s not a difficult question.
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How is turning Gaza into a concentration camp and bombing everyone indiscriminately, including refugee outposts and hospitals, until none are left, not a genocide?
Not a tankie and many independent and respected experts on the subject of genocide said that Israel is commiting genocide
Hey now, don’t go lumping “eat the rich” in with these crazies. I can hate tankies and hate our growing wealth inequalities
eat the rich? I bet they would taste funny but I am open to the idea
You are thinking of clowns.
The rich have been fattened up for decades and massaged on a weekly basis. Their meat is juicy and tender.
Mmmmmmm
Communists are the only way to solve that wealth inequality
God that would be a depressing thought. Thankfully, a tankie’s idea of communism is in fact not the only solution, we need only look at democratic socialist countries like Denmark.
I think it’s fine for people to be rich. I don’t think it’s fine for that to be at the expense of the poor to such a ridiculous magnitude that the wealth has long become moot for that individual’s quality of life:
we need only look at democratic socialist countries like Denmark
Sure helps when Europe benefits from literally trillions of dollars a year in net extraction from the global south
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S095937802200005X
Denmark
Only communists in the US are calling for nationalization of oil. About 75% of Denmark’s oil is nationalized and lets them fund social programs. Liberals in the US would never accept that.
Just wanted to point out that Denmark is a Social Democracy, not Democratic Socialist. The vast majority of the economy is fully Capitalist, paying for Social Programs isn’t Socialism, Worker Ownership of the Means of Production is.
If you want to argue for Social Democracy, go for it, but don’t pretend it’s actually Socialism.
A rich diet is sectarian-agnostic on the left
I’m not familiar with the incident with Khrushchev, but the others didn’t just kill the anarchists for no reason. Each leader was faced with an incredibly unstable country and economy. Anarchists hate government. So naturally, they’ll join with the other leftists to take down the government. But, once the revolution is over, it’s time to reorganize and reestablish a government. As I said though, anarchists hate government. So, they continue to destabilize and fight against the government, even though the new government is trying to reorganize and develop a stable economy.
Each groups was told to stand down and join in rebuilding the their respective countries or risk causing more widespread famine and throw the country into… Well anarchy. The problem isn’t that these leaders are necessarily evil men for what they did to the anarchists. The problem is the dangers that the anarchists created for the people of China and the Soviet Union. This is why Anarchism has never succeeded on a large scale. It’s only good at disruption and destruction. Read about Spain in the late 19th century for examples. No country can survive under constant revolution.
You didn’t mention the Prague Spring or the whole of the assassination attempts on Tito or the East German uprising in 1953.
I mean, there is only so much space… I think the point stands.
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Blame others for what you are doing. Pretty facist of you.
Typical tankie response.
Don’t know that they’re necessarily a tankie. People can have illusions of left unity, or just have bad experiences with specific memes, without being tankies.
Alright, fair.
Strange fascists you hang around, but alright.
Meanwhile, OP: 🍿
I like how all the pictures are wojacks or hand drawns and Khrushchev is just his character from Oversimplified
NNNOOOO!!! HOW DARE YOU UN-WHITEWASH LENIN!!! NOOOO!!! Tankies tried SO HARD to make Makhno disappear like Trotsky! You LIBERAL AMERICANS!!! REEEEEE!!!
Here is Makhno in 1920 after agreeing to a temporary ceasefire:
"Military hostilities between the Makhnovist revolutionary insurgents and the Red Army have ceased. Misunderstandings, vagueness and inaccuracies have grown up around this truce: it is said that Makhno has repented of his anti-Bolshevik acts, that he has recognized the soviet authorities, etc. How are we to understand, what construction are we to place upon this peace agreement?
What is very clear already is that no intercourse of ideas, and no collaboration with the soviet authorities and no formal recognition of these has been or can be possible. We have always been irreconcilable enemies, at the level of ideas, of the party of the Bolshevik-communists.
We have never acknowledged any authorities and in the present instance we cannot acknowledge the soviet authorities. So again we remind and yet again we emphasize that, whether deliberately or through misapprehension, there must be no confusion of military intercourse in the wake of the danger threatening the revolution with any crossing-over, ‘fusion’ or recognition of the soviet authorities, which cannot have been and cannot ever be the case."
— quoted in Nestor Makhno: Anarchy’s Cossack, a pro-Makhno book
Just because people are enemies doesn’t mean they can have a truce. Who broke that truce?
it appears to have been mutually understood
After the Seige of Perekop, Makhno’s aide-de-camp Grigori Vassilevsky, announced the agreement was over:
That’s the end for the agreement! Take my word for it, within one week the Bolsheviks are going to come down on us like a ton of bricks!
— Grigori Vassilevsky, quoted in the same book
Welp you win, you have sources and all that.
I read a book by Anne applebaum on the gulags. It was terrifying
Calling people “tankies” calls forth an imagine of old men yelling at everyone to stay off their lawn.
For me it gets me picturing the tank man getting turned into ground beef by a tank while his countrymen cheer.
You mean, instead of the definition of being fans of genocidal maniacs who would turn tanks onto the population?
I couldn’t care less what they are, it using derogatory terms to describe someone is childish.
“libertarian socialist” •_•
can’t wait to see the hexbear response to this one
You don’t have to wait you can just go look at them whenever you want.
https://hexbear.net/post/1070892
They won’t be showing up here, this is a lemmy.world community and they are defederated afaik.
My God, they’re just fanscreeching there and trying to make themselves interesting in the cringiest way about it. As always, tbh
The larger response is in this thread where the meme was crossposted, almost 400 comments
They’re never going to be able to argue Stalin didn’t send firing squads to murder the Spanish revolutionaries. After seeing this meme they’d be crazy to try.
The Spanish Civil War is a bit weird in nomenclature, though. The ‘revolutionaries’ were the fascist branches of the military and monarchists, who were mad at the leftist elected governement.
Usually revolutionaries aren’t conservatives, but in the Spanish Civil War they were. Both Hitler, Mussolini and Stalin jumped at the chance to test out their offensive capabilities and sent their armies there. And it was a bloody affair where both parties slaughtered civil parties.
But Russia, for once, supported the democratically elected party in this war.
I’m not affiliated with the tankies and hate the fables they spin, but as an historian this one point really needed some context.
Stalin sent his army to Spain, huh? So what, you’re like a video game historian or something?
Aside from massive military ‘aid’ there was between 2000-3000 Russian millitary personel active in Spain during the war.
So many words to say you were lying but want it to count as truth. Putting the Soviet Union in the same line as the fascist forces that sent ~30 times the number of people. If you’re an historian then you know you’re being a slimy little shit lying about that, and if you’re not an historian (and it doesn’t seem like you are frankly) you’re a slimy little shit for lying about that. Scare quotes around ‘aid’. Absolutely deranged.
Not that you’ve stopped lying, equivocating ‘military personnel’ as troops when even wikipedia won’t call them that.
Ok good arguments, solid conversation.
Bye Felicia
Guess we’ll never witness your mental alchemy that turns sending ‘aid’ to the republicans into putting them in front of a firing squad as the meme implies.
Anticommunists never actually have to have a coherent though though lol
But Russia, for once, supported the democratically elected party in this war.
Man, that’s not even close to how it went down. The Soviet-supported PCE was all about infighting and sabotaging other members of the Republicans for not bootlicking Stalin enough.
The ‘revolutionaries’ were the fascist branches of the military and monarchists
I mean, can it really be called any kind of “revolt,” then? It’s essentially just a coup that went south and spun into a civil war thanks to the CNT-FAI’s intelligence networks.
Hence why I put revolutionaries in quotations and felt like a little context was necessary.
Fair enough.
Hexbear: [image of a pig pooping on its own balls]
Truly, walking in the shoes of Marx and Engels. Such eloquence.
Are the hexbears in the room with you right now?
No, they were defederated. Although I’m sure many of them have alt accounts here because trolls love to troll and get sad when you exile them.
I get it.
They’re completely irrelevant for people like you and me, though. I don’t worry about who’s trolling me (tbh, haven’t been trolled on lemmy yet), and I don’t let them live rent free in my mind. They’re not politically important, they’re small, they’re isolated.
Politically, I belong in the group in the meme with our backs against the wall. This weird fixation on hexbear feels like a sort of online red scare. I know full well I’ll be called a communist and grouped in with the tankies by 99% of people who don’t post on places like lemmy. Most people don’t distinguish between trade unionists and anarchists, and stalinists/maoists.
Idk, I see comments from a group calling for nuking a hemisphere of the planet almost daily there to eradicate groups based on skin color and political beliefs.
‘Red scare’ is a bullshit term when the comments are still there for anyone to see. It’s the difference between a storm watch and a storm warning.
I have 0 patience for violent authoritarians, be they liberal, conservative, communist, white or brown or black. You shouldn’t either, be better.
They aren’t the only internet echo chamber. I feel no need to wring my hands over the fact they exist. They have no influence over me, my instance is defederated from them, just like lemmy.world. And, it’s not like they’re out there banning books and participating in local elections, like other groups are. I see no likely future where they can do anything but shitpost.
If you feel like you’re improving the world by heading over there and reading distressing stuff, I’m not going to stop you, buddy. I’ll start worrying when they start having any influence at all. There are bigger fish to fry out there.
That’s just what a tankie would say. /s
If Trump gets elected again, I don’t think he’s gonna differentiate between tankies, anarchists, socialists, Marxists, liberals, etc. if you are left of him, it’s the wall. But these “leftists” keep shadow-boxing an imaginary enemy. Kinda Sus.
Just stopping by to say fuck tankies. Ok bye.
Blessed stop; thank you
But the tankies now call themselves as “right wing christian, conservative, nationalists”, see orban, trump, putin, etc…
hexbear had an entire thread with hundreds of comments where they all agreed they hated trump and viewed him as an odious fascist
https://lemmy.ml/post/4040923?scrollToComments=true
The closest thing you find to support for trump in there is some of them thinking he is a less effective imperialist.
Funny they only mention biden. Everyday. Multiple dozens of times.
He does suck for a lot of reasons, but if you’re not an accelerationist you don’t have much choice.
It just so happens that he’s the less bad choice that we happen to have. We could be a lot better, we could be a lot worse.
Better doesn’t necessarily mean good, just… Better.
Better.
Better than?
There are still plenty of members of the Leninist tankie cult left - look at the positions of most Communist Parties in Europe. To make things worse, I think most of them don’t even realize that the Soviet Union is gone and that China became a cyberpunkish corporatocracy that puts the worst western country to shame.
I’m a fan of the term Kleptocracy. It seems to describe well a lot of newish regimes in south east Asia and south America, and it applies well to China and the United States of America as well.
If tankies when they’re gonna be real surpises when the qouta for poets was met ages ago and it’s time to go to the coal mines.
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