Maybe we’ll have a nice Article 5 party this time.
Uh, last I checked, Britannia rules the waves, not the Falklands. Checkmate, Margaret.
Just a reminder: that there was no one living in the Falklands prior to the UK and France showing up. My understanding is that no one even wanted the islands until they found oil nearby. While it’s weird that the UK has a colony all the way down at the tip of South America, there’s no reason to argue for Argentinian ownership of the Falklands. Hell, Argentina taking ownership of the Falklands is more colonialist than UK maintaining ownership due to the population being mostly British and French.
I personally think calling them a colony is incorrect. They are an island where UK citizens live and have lived since the beginning of human habitation. They get to vote. They have the same culture and want to stay in the UK. The only thing that matches the colonial definition is that they are far away which is a relative term.
They are an island where UK citizens live and have lived since the beginning of human habitation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkland_Islands_sovereignty_dispute
What in tarnation
What in tarnation
Dang nabbit!
I think the people living there are technically indigenous.
beginning of human habitation
They’re not Aboriginal though.
The Falklands were never inhabited by aboriginals.
In fact, there is no evidence that Aboriginal or Argentinian people had ever visited or had knowledge that the islands existed prior to the British arriving.
The Falklands were never inhabited by aboriginals.
Yep. That was one of reasons of Argentina’s objections to the British claim, that the british citizens are not indigenous to the island.
In fact, there is no evidence that Aboriginal or Argentinian people had ever visited or had knowledge that the islands existed prior to the British arriving.
That’s not true. Check out the wiki page about it, it has a whole timeline, including who lived on it when.
Also, Argentina claims ownership by inheritance from Spain when they won their independence from Spain.
So Britain was controlling the Islands before Spain, yet you’re still claiming Argentina inherited them by Spain. Wouldn’t they technically belong to France by your logic?
So Britain was controlling the Islands before Spain, yet you’re still claiming Argentina inherited them by Spain. Wouldn’t they technically belong to France by your logic?
Depends on when who vacated the island and who took it over after that, and if vacating even means giving up on ownership or not (IANAL).
The link I’ve been posting goes over the history, and nations have come and gone and come and gone and come and kicked out others, on that island. Its a mess.
I don’t know what you’re reading, but the actual history of the island reads as follows:
“The islands were uninhabited when discovered by Europeans. France established a colony on the islands in 1764. In 1765, a British captain claimed the islands for Britain. In early 1770 a Spanish commander arrived from Buenos Aires with five ships and 1,400 soldiers forcing the British to leave Port Egmont. Britain and Spain almost went to war over the islands, but the British government decided that it should withdraw its presence from many overseas settlements in 1774.”
I mean the original US states were also British colonies with ethnically British people having fairly British culture. They just revolted over unfair taxes and the culture diverged with immigration of other Europeans.
The main difference between the pre revolution colonies and the Falklands is that there weren’t any natives on the Falklands that had to be removed first, and the Falklands are much smaller and less important.
Falklands is that there weren’t any natives on the Falklands that had to be removed first
Actually I believe there were a few Argentinians there they were removed forcefully, in 1833.
It was discovered and settled by Britain, France, and Spain (in that order). But nobody lived there except some gauchos and soldiers (many of whom were British)
Pinedo entertained plans for resisting, but finally desisted because of his obvious numerical inferiority and the want of enough nationals among his crew (approximately 80% of his forces were British mercenaries who refused to fight their countrymen).[citation needed] The British forces disembarked on 3 January and switched the flags, delivering the Argentine one to Pinedo, who left on 5 January.[3]
Recognising Vernet’s settlement had British permission, Onslow set about ensuring the continuation of that settlement for the replenishment of passing ships. The gauchos had not been paid since Vernet’s departure and were anxious to return to the mainland. Onslow persuaded them to stay by paying them in silver for provisions and promising that in the absence of Vernet’s authority they could earn their living from the feral cattle on the islands.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reassertion_of_British_sovereignty_over_the_Falkland_Islands_(1833)
The modern nation of Argentina didn’t exist in 1833. They were the “United Provinces of the Río de la Plata”. If you think they have a claim, then Bolivia, Brazil, and Uruguay have an equal claim. Do you believe that?
But nobody lived there except some gauchos and soldiers (many of whom were British)
I mean, that’s blatantly not true.
From the wiki article …
France was the first country to establish a permanent settlement in the Falkland Islands, with the foundation of Port-Saint-Louis on East Falkland by French explorer Louis Antoine de Bougainville in 1764.[2] The French colony consisted of a small fort and some settlements with a population of around 250.
A pop of 250 is not “some gauchos and soldiers”. They were not even “(many of whom were British)”.
I mean, we can go down the rabbit hole and start a population census conversation based on year-to-year, but that seems excessive for the conversation being had, and something that is really not needed.
Its fair to say that the French had a presence there, they gave that presence to Spain, and Argentina inherited that presence from Spain (going around the long way, as the Doctor would say).
The gauchos are the settlers you mentioned. The soldiers were mostly British mercenaries. Did you read the article?
A colony of 240 people are not a few people, and are not all comprised of just gauchos or British mercenaries, they were French there as well.
I’m going to “bow out” of further replies. I’ve been at this for coming up on 24 hours now, and am tired of everyone wanting their “pound of flesh”, and have said pretty much everything I can say. No disrespect meant to you, just thing the conversation has reached a termination point. Take care.
Heh, getting tired of copy/pasting this link, but so many bad takes are being stated as fact on this topic…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkland_Islands_sovereignty_dispute
Maybe you should read what you’re posting instead and realize you’re on the wrong side of this?
Maybe you should read what you’re posting instead and realize you’re on the wrong side of this?
Why, because you say so? There are some good facts documented in that link. The issue is not clear cut.
My understanding is that no one even wanted the islands until they found oil nearby.
Bingo!
there’s no reason to argue for Argentinian ownership of the Falklands. Hell, Argentina taking ownership of the Falklands is more colonialist than UK maintaining ownership
The United Nations says otherwise.
The Wiki page is really interesting reading on the ownership of that island, really jumps around over the centuries.
This one part of the article really jumps out at me…
That self-determination is further rendered inapplicable due to the disruption of the territorial integrity of Argentina that began with a forceful removal of its authorities in the islands in 1833, thus there is a failure to comply with an explicit requirement of UN Resolution 1514 (XV).[93][94]
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and Argentina has never made any honest attempt to negotiate in good faith.
How do you know this? Honestly curious.
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Read the fucking reply. It’s right there.
Any link to a source?
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Soooo trouble in Middle East is back from standby and Argentina is making demands about the Falklands. How about we just stop there and let other famous Conflicts in pease. * sweats in german *
Sorgerechtsverhandlung für Elsass Lothringen 2024?
Nee danke. Ich bin mit den Besuchsrecht zufrieden
“Now we have to see how we are going to get them back. It is clear that the war option is not a solution.”
If more people actually read instead of knee-jerk reacting to click-bait headlines they might have a better understanding of what is going on around them.
British people lose all sense of logic anytime falklands get mentioned.
They need them for strategic sheep reserves
Yeah, since New Zeeland became an indepent nation there really hasn’t been any proper fallback if anything happens to Wales…
Gotta hang on to colonialism because: English.
There was nobody living there before the British arrived, but after the British arrived British people moved there. It seems to me that the only country with a good claim, is Britain
Actually the first colonists were French. The claim was transferred to Spain via a pact between the Bourbon kings of both countries. The Spanish name for The Falklands derives from the French, Îles Malouines, named after Saint-Malo/Sant-Maloù.
The Argentinians only ever occupied the islands for six months, for a penal colony - which ended via mutiny, not military expulsion. They’ve otherwise been under continuous British occupation since 1833, barring the 1982 war.
I’m English, and by no means pro-English colonialism, but the Argentine claim is spurious nonsense.
According to Wikipedia, The French and English colonized two separate islands within months of each other, though the French are credited with being there first. Historians apparently disagree on whether or not the two settlements knew the other was there for the first year.
The English have the longest claim that was never relinquished, since the French gave their settlement to Spain years after the French and English set up the original two colonies.
Why do you keep posting this link? It’s not convincing anybody of the validity of an Argentine claim, it’s presumptuous of you to assume people haven’t read it, and it doesn’t back up a number statements you’ve made (“The UN asked Great Britain to give the island back to Argentina, but they refused.” for instance).
Why do you keep posting this link?
Because most people are just saying stuff that is not true, which the link corrects.
It’s not convincing anybody of the validity of an Argentine claim
If you read their comments that I reply to with that link, the facts documented contradicts what they are saying, and hence, may convince people of the validity of the claim.
it’s presumptuous of you to assume people haven’t read it
Not if I see people getting facts wrong its not.
There was nobody living there before the British arrived
That’s not true.
Why does this falsehood keep getting repeated over and over?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkland_Islands_sovereignty_dispute
Not true, it was sparcely populated and in 1831 an American warship raided the area dissolved the government and rolled back out. 1833 the English come back and claimed the island and the dispute keeps on.
The government, was literally 1 German man who the argentines said “yeah your the government now go live there”
That’s a population, though sparce.
It’s a singular person, that doesn’t give them much of a claim
The government, was literally 1 German man who the argentines said “yeah your the government now go live there”
There’s another rock sticking out of the ocean further south that Great Britain claims ownership over, and its just got a plaque on it to state ownership, no people live there.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkland_Islands_sovereignty_dispute
Yeah because it would be such a great Idea just to straight up say :“I’m going to attack you. But please don’t prepare or anything. Just act surprise.”
Are we just doing out of order reruns of the 20th century?
Are we just doing out of order reruns of the 20th century?
When it comes to humans, it’s been my experience that if you don’t resolve issues they come back to bite you in the ass, at some point.
Oh God. Pls no. 🇩🇪
Gotta get people reading more history textbooks and visiting more 20th-century museums. Some, like the Holocaust Museum in DC, are about as pleasant as getting a fishhook caught in your open eye. Which is some of the most compelling arguments for peace I’ve ever seen. The pictures are etched into my mind decades later, and I still remember the smell of all the leather shoes in there.
I’d like to visit France and Belgum and Italy soon to see the WW1 sites. We’ve done Normandy and WW2 across Europe and the Pacific. It’s also incredibly somber arguments for peace.
There was a fight for them and they’re still British. There was a referendum and the islanders overwhelmingly want to stay British.
The UN asked Great Britain to give the island back to Argentina, but they refused.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkland_Islands_sovereignty_dispute
That’s what you understood after reading the page you linked?
The UN asked Great Britain to give the island back to Argentina, but they refused.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkland_Islands_sovereignty_dispute
That’s what you understood after reading the page you linked?
I should have been more precise in my language, and that say that the UN wanted them to negotiate a peaceful end to the war and ownership, but generally speaking, yes, based on follow up votes/press releases that the UN made on the subject (like this one).
You keep saying this, I’m starting to question your ability to read or understand english.
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UK twice offered Argentina to take the matter to the International Court of Justice
Still couldn’t find any citiation to your statement, but I did find this …
https://www.ejiltalk.org/why-the-falklands-dispute-will-probably-never-go-to-court/
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I’m not sure that this link really helps your case, given these key points from the description:
The resolution by the British representative, Ambassador Sir Anthony Parsons
demanded an immediate cessation of hostilities between Argentina and the United Kingdom and a complete withdrawal by Argentine forces
Resolution 502 was in the United Kingdom’s favour by giving it the option to invoke Article 51 of the United Nations Charter and to claim the right of self-defence
I’m not sure that this link really helps your case
The parts you quoted were about self-defense and stopping the fighting, not about the ownership of the islands.
I quote it because it also talks about negotiations that should be begun when it comes to the ownership of the islands, in lieu of continuing the fighting.
I’m already on record about stating that the fighting was wrong, though I don’t know how long anyone would expect a nation to wait for a diplomatic solution.
This press release from the UN goes into more detail on the basic structure of what I’m arguing about: https://press.un.org/en/2021/gacol3347.doc.htm
(I really shouldn’t bother with attempting nuanced conversation on the Internet, it never ends well.)
Negotiations are great, but surely you realize that Argentina shouldn’t expect (or want) to gain sovereignty over the Falklands?
but surely you realize that Argentina shouldn’t expect (or want) to gain sovereignty over the Falklands
No, quite the opposite actually. I believe they have more of a claim to the islands than anyone else, via Spain’s ownership of said lands that Argentina inherited when they gained their independence from Spain, as well as the proximity to Argentina, and finally to the fact that Great Britain was speaking with Argentina about turning them over, before the stupid war was started.
Now, having said that, IANAL, so don’t know what the law would say about that. Really don’t think we’ll resolve the issue here on Lemmy.
It also talked about the starting negotiations to discuss the future of the Islands, aka return them (because I doubt they would have gone with a timeshare/co-op plan.
There’s been other UN discussions on the matter as well: https://press.un.org/en/2021/gacol3347.doc.htm
Why return or timeshare/coop, why not sovereignty under British support which is happening right now. And which the people staying there demand.
Argentina: we will retake Las Malvinas!
Royal Navy: Oh really? Try it. We’d really like a chance to demonstrate the combat effectiveness of our QE2 Class Carriers. And Bob here hasn’t shot his destroyer’s deck guns since '82 and he’s bored!
RAF: (Rapidly dusting off the Vulcans and Nimrods)
Royal Marines: (Lights up a Benson & Hedges cigarette)… Right… (Slaps knees and stands up)… Grab yer Bergens and Bayonets lads!
I really hope Argentina doesn’t hand the UK’s faltering Conservative government a nice patriotic war just before the next election. If they hadn’t done that in 1982 we might have seen the back of Thatcher before the worst damage was done.
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OK, so maybe you can explain this, many things all over western Canada are naned for “Mount Pleasant”, a cemetery in Swift Current, a neighborhood in Vancouver, it pops up all over, and no one seems to know why, what or anything about the term, from old timers to Google.
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I’m aware the Vulcans have been scrapped, I was just memeing.
I saw the Vulcan’s last flight as Cosford Airshow about 10 years ago. The sheer size of that aircraft flying overhead at under 100ft, the rumble and roar of the engines will stay with me for a lifetime. It was an awesome aircraft.
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Oh you lucky sod. The only old plane I got to look inside was the Lancaster based at RAF Scampton they use for memorial flights, still a another good aircraft but it’s no Vulcan.
Also, good to meet a fellow former ATC Cadet in the wilds of the internet.
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our QE2 Class Carriers
Plural? Huh, TIL they’ve got more than one of them.
(I always found it kind of crazy and hilarious that the US has like 10 CATOBAR nuclear-powered carriers and then also a bunch of STOVL diesel-powered ones that we don’t even bother counting as “carriers,” when every other country has maybe one or a few at best, and most of those are STOVL or worse. I guess the last time I counted was before 2017, though.)
During world War II, the United States had over 150 aircraft carriers which would be the equivalent of a wasp class amphibious assault ship/helicopter carrier.
I mean, the Brits might be chomping at the bit for it. I mean with Brexit and all, I’m pretty sure it’s been greyer than usual in the UK. Nothing like completely mopping up some country trying to invade your land to put on a slightly brighter disposition.
That said, I think Milei has mostly been talking about attempting to get them back diplomatically. Which I’m highly doubtful anyone remotely responsible for making that kind of decision in the UK is vaguely affable towards entertaining. Just a hunch.
Say what you will. I find it a bit insane that a country can just own an island like that which is nowhere even near their mainland. If you just look at the map it’s quite obvious to who that land belongs to.
Something like Hawai is a more difficult case since it’s in the middle of ocean. Maybe it should just be a sovereign nation.
EDIT: Though since most people living there are native born Falkland islanders that speak English and voted to stay as a part of the UK then it’s perhaps something we should leave be as it is. Kind of similar case as with Israel to be honest.
Hawaii used to be a sovereign nation.
People lived on Hawaii since time immemorial. They had a proper Kingdom and everything with the US meddling with putsches and coups, then they had a Republic, then the US annexed the whole thing, very much not with consent of the Hawaiians. That was 1898, statehood was granted in 1959. The Falklands were uninhabited, settled first by the French in 1764. They also enjoy autonomy in everything but foreign relations and defence and if they wanted to they would readily be granted independence, the situation couldn’t be more different. Practically speaking the relation of the Falklands to the UK is much more similar than that of Greenland to Denmark than that of, say, Indiana to the US federal government, which is the exact relationship Hawaii has with the federal government.
Also it’s not by far the largest European overseas territory, that’d be French Guyana. Who btw overwhelmingly voted against becoming an overseas collectivity, they kept their status as “just another department” with no more autonomy than the departments in Europe. European colonialism died pretty much exactly with Algerian independence, what’s left are a flurry of overseas territories which we couldn’t get rid of if we wanted because they want to stay, politically, part of Europe.
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By similar to Israel I mean that non-optimal decisions were made in the past but it’s done now and trying to undo it would just cause further pointless harm to people.
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There are a thousand kilometres of open ocean between Argentina and the Falklands.
If you look at the map on the above link, that distance is not straight East to West, its to the center of Argentina, SE to NW. I checked a couple of web sites, and they all measure a longer, diagonal distance, that gives a false impression of longer distances.
If you use the Google Maps measuring tool, and you measure from the West coast of the islands to the East coast of Argentina, going directly East to West, you get this answer …
Total distance: 338.20 mi (544.28 km)
The Malvinas are allot closer than Hawaii is to the US.
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and still massively outside any recognised concept of territorial waters
The distance West to East is a little over 350 miles. That’s pretty damn close.
planting a flag somewhere and then abandoning it for hundreds of years
Are you even aware of the history? That link I’ve been plastering all over this topic, talks about this.
Also, The Great Britain laid claim to another chuck of rock sticking out of the ocean further South, and all they have there is a plaque designating it as their property.
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territorial waters is 12 nautical miles
Most nations defend out to 200-300 miles.
Regardless, “we’re the nearest continental landmass, but it’s still a really fucking long way” is not, and never has been, a valid excuse to fucking invade somewhere.
Never said it was, just that it bolsters their claim of ownership.
Having said that, would any nation wait indefinitely on a diplomatic solution for another nation to return land that they believe belongs to them?
If the British refused to give Hong Kong back to China, what would the Chinese have done?
If the Chinese had taken over Hawaii or the Catalina Islands off the coast of California, what would the US have done?
As for the history, they were either discovered by the British or the Dutch, uninhabited. The only people to have ever lived there that weren’t part of a temporary garrison are the ancestors or the current population. It’s their home, and Argentina’s only interaction with the place is as a failing state engaging in a war of conquest.
That’s not correct. If you read over the link that I’ve posted way too many times in this thread, you’ll see that. Also, their claim is based on the fact that Spain owned the islands, and they inherited them when they won their independence from Spain, so its not just about if Argentinian boots were on the ground there (though there WERE boots at one point as well).
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If you just look at the map it’s quite obvious to who that land belongs to.
Denmark isn’t going to be happy about having to give Greenland to Canada but I guess it is what it is.
I’m not advocating for UK to give Falklands to Argentina. It’s too late now. Otherwise yes, makes no sense for Denmark to have Greenland either.
find it a bit insane that a country can just own an island like that which is nowhere even near their mainland. If you just look at the map it’s quite obvious to who that land belongs to.
The UN agrees with you, and asked Great Britain to give the islands back to Argentina.
Not quite.
The Special Committee on Decolonization concluded its 2021 substantive session today, approving 18 draft resolutions, including one requesting that the Governments of Argentina and the United Kingdom resume negotiations as soon as possible to reach a peaceful resolution of their sovereignty dispute over the Falkland Islands (Malvinas)*.
I was speaking more about this, but that’s an interesting read as well.
The link you shared shows UN resolution 502 which states:
- immediate cessation of hostilities
- withdrawal of argentine forces
- start diplomatic means to settle the matter.
Nowhere does it mention telling British to return the island to Argentina.
The actual verbage of the third bullet item you listed is as follows …
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Security_Council_Resolution_502
- Calls on the Governments of Argentina and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland to seek a diplomatic solution to their differences and to respect fully the purposes and principles of the Charter of the United Nations.
I’m assuming thats meant to say negatiate the return of the islands, because there sure as shit nothing else that would be discussed to resolve the diplomatic solution, unless they went for some funky kind of co-op/timeshare solution. They can’t state the return blatently because the UK would not agree to that in an initial resolution.
https://press.un.org/en/2021/gacol3347.doc.htm
In the ensuing debate, delegates, many from the Latin American and Caribbean region, supported Argentina’s claim of sovereignty and urged Buenos Aires and London to begin negotiations as soon as possible on the basis of the relevant United Nations resolutions. Several cautioned against unilateral actions, expressing concern about the United Kingdom’s military presence in the Falklands (Malvinas), and by extension, the South Atlantic.
The actual verbiage never said that United Kingdom had to return the island to Argentina.
The purposes and principles of UN which is described in chapter 1, says the member nations will not use force to threaten territorial integrity or political independence of any state.
It also states that nations should respect principles of equal rights and self determination.
Argentina is guilty of both of using force to threaten political independence of island and disrespect of self determination of the islanders
The actual verbiage never said that United Kingdom had to return the island to Argentina.
It wouldn’t, or else it would never get passef by vote because the UK would vote against it. You need to understand how diplomats state things publicly, especially when they have to vote on them.
When the terminology of ‘negotiation’ is used, that’s what is meant, because there’s no other issue to negotiate about, than the return of the islands.
If we’re going by proximity, there’s some Caribbean nations that are even closer to the US than the Falklands are to Argentina, would you argue that we should annex Cuba or the Bahamas?
And from what I understand, the people of the Falklands overwhelming want to be a British territory. I think that’s probably the more important consideration.
It is wild that it came to be the way it is. It certainly doesn’t make sense to me in the world before modern air travel, the internet, etc. that they’d be ruled by a country so far away, but in this modern era where just about anywhere in the world is only about a day’s travel time, or available on-demand 24/7 by phone or computer, it makes every bit as much sense to me that they be a UK territory as it does that Alaska is a US state.
Hawaii is actually a pretty interesting comparison to make, because most Hawaiians did not want to become a US territory at the time, but that’s really begging a whole 'nother discussion with lots of complex talking points about imperialism/colonialism, indigenous rights, etc. but I’m frankly just not going to go into that right now. Suffice it to say that it’s similar in the sense of it being a small island territory located far from the colonial power that laid claim to it, but the attitudes of the people living there were very different.
I’m no historian or anything of the sort, so take my thoughts on this for what it’s worth (and I am certainly biased being an American, don’t exactly get a whole lot of Argentinian history books to study, and most of the Spanish I know is food-related, so if someone wants to enlighten me more on the Argentinian side of things, I welcome the education.) But in general my understanding is that the British were the first people to land there, didn’t really do much with it at that time, and pretty much just said “finders keepers”
Maybe worth noting, there were no indigenous inhabitants there, so that’s probably about as ethical as colonization can get.
Then France showed up and set up shop since the British weren’t doing anything with it. Britain came back and also set up shop, and it’s not totally clear if either of them even knew the other was there. France eventually decided to fuck off, and let Spain have their bit of the Falklands.
Spain and Britain coexisted for a while, had some scuffles, but more or less worked things out. Eventually Britain pulled out to focus on other things but still considered their “finders keepors” claim to be valid.
Spain eventually pulled out as well, so for a little while no one was really doing much of anything with it officially.
Argentina (technically Buenos Aires at the time if we want to split hairs, I’m going to just use Argentina and Britain to keep the sides easy to follow) comes along, and decides it’s theirs, and this is pretty much the root of the dispute. While Britain still held their claim of “finders keepers” Argentina countered with “losers weepers”
Argentina gave some German dude permission to set up a colony for them there to fish and hunt feral cows. Eventually he gets into a fight with an American navy captain over fishing and hunting rights, Captain America kicks their ass a bit and declares the colonial government disolved, and pretty much continues on his merry way. Argentina tries to get things there started back up again but never quite gets their shit back together in the Falklands. A little while later the Brits come back around, still claiming finders keepers, and take charge of everything again, and this time the colonies stick and continue to grow. Argentina spends the next hundred years or so muttering “this is bullshit” to themselves.
Around the 1960s, Britain starts talking about decolonizing, and Argentina gets excited thinking they’re going to finally get the Falklands. Britain even quietly floats the idea of giving them the islands, figuring the Islanders would just kind of accept that decision if it was made, and running these islands from halfway around the world was getting kind of expensive. Turns out though that pretty much everyone on the Falklands is pretty damn happy to be British subjects and don’t really want to be part of Argentina, which made things a bit complicated.
Argentina gets kind of impatient with all of this, and eventually decided “fuck it, we’ll just take them ourselves,” Britain cannot abide Argentina’s inability to wait patiently in the queue and was starting to really wrap their heads around the idea that the Falklands would rather stay part of Britain and so we get the Falklands war.
Britain wins, Argentina goes back to muttering to themselves, and that pretty much brings us up to the present day.
Great comment! Accurate and entertaining to read. Well done! Was giving up hope, after reading so many bad factual takes on the ownership situation on this topic.
I’ve been posting the wiki link about the conflict all over this topic. If people ended up not reading that link, I would hope that they read your comment at least.
While Britain still held their claim of “finders keepers” Argentina countered with “losers weepers”
One minor quibble, and to be fair, Argentina is claiming based on the fact that Spain owned the islands, and when Argentina won their independence from Spain, they also got the islands.
British owned it before Spain came into picture. They have a older claim than Spain and therfore Argentinian.
Step 1: dissolve central bank
Step 2: piss off capitalists
Step 3: ???
Step 4: profit
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He’ll send an army of dog ghosts.
He’ll fart in their general direction. That’ll show them!
I think this one is just populist sabre rattling.
Oh so THIS is how ww3 starts
I wouldn’t call the Falkland Islands War 2: Electric Boogaloo “WW3”. More like a police action, to be honest. The Argentine Navy and Air Force these days is frankly laughable in comparison to their military strength before the first FI war, let alone the strength of the RN and RAF today.
Who knows, maybe some friends will lend a nuke or two
Not gonna happen
It’d be kinda funny if Putin gave them a “nuke” only for it to be a dud because of lack of maintenance
Why on earth would nukes be given over some islands with a population of only a few thousand?
It’s a question of principle
No, it’s just nonsense.
Argentina wouldn’t last a day against a modern military.
They’d last a day against the Royal Navy because it would take longer than a day to get there.
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There are 1500 troops stationed in the Falklands and a sizable force at Royal Air Force Station Ascension.
Oh, I’d expect a British ship or two to hang out very near the Falklands for as long as he’s in power.
At the moment the patrol is a single River class whose largest armament is a 30mm cannon. In the past there tended to be either a frigate or a destroyer in the area, but while the Argentine navy is much diminished they can probably overpower or outmanoeuvre that defence.
The guy might be a nutjob but I don’t think he’s talking about getting them back through war, Argentina has next to no military.
Having colonies in the year 2023 is ridiculous though, I don’t know why so many comments act like Britain is in the right here in any way whatsoever.
Since when were the Falklands an example of colonialism? Nobody lived there until the Europeans showed up.
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Okay but these days when someone says colonialism, they typically mean the colonisation of already inhabited lands and the subjugation of natives. It’s a pretty loaded word these days.
The original commenter has slightly missed the point that there were no previous inhabitants, in my opinion.
That’s why I was careful to choose the word “colonialism” (which is what the comment I replied to was implying) instead of just “colony.”
My point was the original commenter never said it was an example of colonialism.
The original commenter wrote:
Having colonies in the year 2023 is ridiculous though, I don’t know why so many comments act like Britain is in the right here in any way whatsoever.
If you can’t see how that heavily implies colonialism, I don’t know what more to tell you.
Because the people of the Falklands literally voted to stay with the UK?
[insert obama awarding obama meme here]
I mean the UK won’t return Gilbraltar to Spain who were in the EU with them they won’t obviously return the falklands.
I’d like to see the UK also defending the “vote of the people” if Ireland voted to leave the UK
I’d like to see the UK also defending the “vote of the people” if Ireland voted to leave the UK
They literally did. Ireland became its own country 100 years ago. NI wanted to stay with the UK
Well the all island vote wasn’t the source of change, a war unfortunately had to follow.
And point of clarification - Ireland didn’t “leave the UK” - the British were forced to withdraw from 26 of the 32 counties of Ireland.
“NI” was carved out of the island by Britain holding on to as much industrialised land as they could, with as big a majority of British settlers vs native Irish.
… what?
do you want a cookie?
Scotland had a vote, a legitimate one. Ireland, as in the Republic, isn’t part of the UK.
How can the Falklands be returned? Stop talking about this as if you know anything.
return the falklands.
To who, the French?! They’re the only ones who settled there before the British (beating them by a whopping 1 year), and they left again two years after they showed up. (And I say “settled there,” by the way, because if we went by who discovered it then the only people the British could return it to would be themselves.)
To who, the French?!
They claim ownership via Spain’s ownership, when Argentina won their independence from Spain.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkland_Islands_sovereignty_dispute
I mean the UK won’t return Gilbraltar to Spain who were in the EU with them they won’t obviously return the falklands.
“Return the Falklands”
… do you know the history of the Falklands? At all?
I’d like to see the UK also defending the “vote of the people” if Ireland voted to leave the UK
Ireland literally did, almost a hundred years ago. North Ireland voted to stay. There was a legally binding Scottish referendum on independence a few years back that the UK pledged to abide by. Are you shitting me?
You talk like it’s a done deal and recent talks about a referendum to revisit never existed.
I… what?
No, I talk about it like it was literally a “vote of the people” which the UK pledged to abide by, which is what is being discussed.
He literally did not do that
If you think the Falklands should be part of Argentina, logically Hawaii should be part of Kiribati. Alaska should be Russian/Canadian, etc etc. If you think about it for more than a minute it becomes clear that geographical location is not the only factor or even the most important one.
geographical location is not the only factor or even the most important one
I’m pretty sure that if another country took over Hawaii, or the Catalina Islands off the coast of California, especially just for being able to put a marker down on future oil reserves, that the US would not be ok with that claim.
Also, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkland_Islands_sovereignty_dispute .
Even if your bullshit wasn’t bullshit, theres another huge difference you are ignoring - the US is capable of doing something about it, Argentina is not.
the US is capable of doing something about it, Argentina is not.
Well, they did try, and failed, but it was costly for both sides, so it wasn’t a hard one-sided affair.
Besides, that’s not the point I’m trying to make, and not relevant to this discussion. The point of legal ownership by “first rights”, and not “might makes right”, is what I’m speaking towards.
Cool, so since Britain has held the islands longer than Argentina has existed you consider the matter settled?
Cool, so since Britain has held the islands longer than Argentina has existed you consider the matter settled?
No. Think Argentina has the strongest claim based on previous ownership from Spain, and being the nearest nation to the islands.
But the first settlement there was french, so you’re wrong.
Wait, can we give Sarah Palin to Canada? Seems like a fair trade to me.
You guys can take Justin Bieber and Pierre Polivre. We don’t want them. I’m sure we can find some remote shed to lock Palin away in while you look after those two.
Because the population of the Falklands (that we installed there) want to remain part of Britain for whatever stupid reason.
No one else was there. Why would they want to be part of anything else?
Agreed about owning colonies. But that’s not what this is.
Lol I was wondering just yesterday how long it would take this guy to bring up the Falklands after getting elected.
Normally right-wingers in the UK would be pleased to see someone like him elected, but because of the Argentina-Falklands connection, they’re going to hate him lmao
Milei is a lot less focused on the Falklands than the presidents before him. Every Argentinian politician says “we have to get the Falklands back”. It’s literally in their constitution. Milei says that Thatcher legit kicked their asses and they should try diplomatic means, and maybe try not having 140% inflation so that the islanders would be less opposed to becoming Argentinian.
I mean the Falklands war did Thatcher no harm.
I think they’re going to love him.
If I remember it correctly the whole Falklands affair worked wonders for Thatcher’s popularity.
Mind you, these types have been gutting everything in Britain including the military, so who knows what the outcome would be in a Falklands War v2.
Argentina has esentially no navy to speak of, and what it can field would be conpletely smashed by the typhoons stationed on the islands.
