he said. “We’ll be gone, and it’ll be gone because of an advertiser boycott.”… eeer, no.
Elon made deals w/ hedge funds to funnel him money as they shorted the stock (not to mention 100x leverage derivatives against Twitter).
Since canceling his PR team, Elon’s entire MO has been to run it into the ground in a manner that seems plausible to the SEC so he doesn’t get out-right sued.
He just isn’t this stupid, whether you want him to be or not.
“Fuck you” to his advertisers seems like a fairly on-brand way to telegraph his true intentions.
Do you have evidence of him committing insider trading?
Yeah I find I hard to believe that this man that has constantly done illegal shit to maniuplate the stock market would go as far as to illegally manipulate the stock market.
He’s not the one trading the stock(s) in the above scenario.
So you’re just talking out of your ass?
TSLA is his Twitter collateral. Really surprised nobody else sees what I see lol…
Well he’s spent the last decade committing market manipulation, not that far of a jump.
So “no, there is none.” Would have sufficed.
Always a great sign if posts asking for evidence are getting downvoted.
Lol, I’m no fan of Elon either.
Because its kind of pointless to the point t of sealioning.
Like take for example when the leader of Wagner group died in a plane crash and it was pretty obvious putin had him killed. Would asking a random lemmy user to provide proof of that claim add anything to thr discussion?
In this case and the Wagner example, if the point isn’t obvious it’s reasonable to ask for some kind of proof to get a better understanding of the point. But I do agree that there’s no reason to ask for proof in this case, because the conspiracy theory is already so nonsensical that any proof would just compound the nonsense.
People simply need to stop putting him on a pedestal and accept that he isn’t some genius businessman whose inner machinations are an enigma. He made a stupid deal and bought a company he doesn’t know how to run so he’s running it into the ground, that’s it. No grand conspiracy required. You need a grand conspiracy only if you can’t accept that Musk is just an ordinary man whose biggest contribution to his success is having wealthy parents.
The question doesn’t make sense in context because that’s not what my comment was implying. It’s down-voted for being silly, not pedantic.
You clearly imply insider trading going on. The fact that it might not be (I’m not sure if the law) musk being guilty of insider trading, but just commiting fraud so others could do so, is being pedantic and silly.
TSLA is his Twitter collateral. Really surprised nobody else sees what I see lol…
He only bought Twitter because he was forced to or admit he was trying to manipulate the stock again.
He bought a much higher stake, used Twitter to telegraph a higher price than it was worth. Then he didn’t use his own money when he was finally forced to purchase Twitter at the higher price he tweeted. The money he used to purchase Twitter came from countries who have stated they didn’t want Twitter to be around because it hurt their public perception when they were caught doing shady things.
His Twitter gift started the same way the SEC sued him for market manipulation for his Tesla manipulation years before. Publishing his $420 price point then selling stock when the price goes beyond his tweeted price point.
He was never savy enough to use shorting like the Hedge funds do, but his reach among the idiot masses to cause jumps in price to artificially male a bigger profit.
I’m a little confused by this comment, Twitter isn’t a publicly traded stock anymore?
Unless you mean he made deals with them before he BOUGHT twitter (for well beyond market value), meaning the hedgies would be taking a loss…?f
edit: that doesn’t preclude the possibility he’s tanking the company so he can declare bankruptcy to get out of his loans, but that doesn’t involve conspiring with hedge funds, it’s just a different kind of financial fraud
Your edit has been my pet theory for some time. That and he gets to ruin a platform that leftists have used to organize around the world.
Yea, I mean I think it’s probably his best play. But I don’t really grant him to be so principled as to have originally bought twitter for that purpose: I think he’s a dumbass who got called on a shitpost, and now he has to weasel his way out.
Doesn’t mean he’s not also a reactionary cunt, but I personally think that plays second fiddle to this situation.
That just tells me that he doesnt understand how leftists work. We change platforms on the reg.
There are no twitter stocks, you can’t buy or sell them, and therefore can’t short them, since you need to borrow them to do just that. This could work if Elon had some percent of the company, so other people’s money would enter the equation, but right now it is not possible.
Making deals with hedge funds to ruin a brand they have shorted seems illegal.
Is there any legislation that prohibits this in the United States?
Every insider trading law in existentiality.
Those only apply to poor people
He’s the primary owner of the private shares. The shares are not publicly traded. None of what you said makes any sense.
Why is he calling the act of people not using his shitty product a boycot?
Persecution fetish. It’s a prerequisite for all MAGA trash
Plus it’s buzzwords to rile up and gain favor with the authoritarian chuds who speak on the court of public opinion
You mean he kissed Netanyahu’s ass for nothing?
Not for nothing. His Nazi fans loved it. And all he seems to care about now is what they think.
Skirting awfully close to a nazi boycott! Luckily the nazis will probably understand it was freeze peach. They know as no other what it means to disavow.
Musk is playing 3d checkers and saves free speech once again.
Well, as dumb as this was (and it was very, very dumb), I found myself distracted by just how… weird he looked. Not just his face, which reminded me of Lady Cassandra from Dr Who (“Moisturize me, moisturize me!”), but his weird, jerky movements, and just his general vibe. He’s like the personification of the uncanny valley. Eggar-from-MiB “get me sugar water” lookin’ ass. If someone were to come out with a tell-all saying that Musk had been secretly replaced by aliens, I wouldn’t even be terribly surprised at this point.
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It’s always fun to play is he weirdly out of touch because he’s a billionaire or is he weirdly out of touch because he’s autistic. I think this might be a bit of both.
Hand gestures don’t come naturally to everybody. Some people learn them just to fit in and some try and evoke the same emotions from them without understanding the emotions or the motions completely because they’re just not physically capable of connecting those brain synapses. Add to that the fact Elon doesn’t hang out with normal people. He only hangs out with engineers and sycophants. So he doesn’t get to naturally see people in their everyday environment. He only sees people acting in videos and then he tries to imitate that and the sycophants and engineers around him applaud him. The dumb shit he says gets retweets so he thinks everyone agrees. Then he goes out into the real world and continues parroting this end stage meming with gestures he learned from Hitler speaches, not realizing the jerky movement was due to low frame rate and high meth rate, and is stun locked when everybody else is trying to figure out what the fuck is happening. And what the fuck is happening is that we are witnessing a man who is so far up his own ass that even basic hand gestures are oddly shitty.
I think it might be tourette’s, my son has the same jerkey movements but without the verbal symptoms.
People are also speculating drug use, and I personally wouldn’t rule that out considering just how stressful his life currently is. Hell, I feel as though his hairline has receded a bunch (again) too.
I think it’s likely that’s it’s a mixture of all three. Drug use (even some completely above-board prescriptions. I know that my ADHD prescription makes me act strangely when I’m low on sleep or over-caffeinated) would dull his ability to mask his other behavioral idiosyncrasies, which could originate with his placement on the spectrum and the fact that he’s surrounded by sycophants. But who fucking knows.
Isn’t it fun playing armchair doctor for Elon Musk! If you’re wrong, who are you hurting, fuck that guy. And if you’re right, it’s fucking hilarious because fuck that guy.
I’m not so self-involved as to think my anonymous comments have any material impact on Elon’s well-being, but if they did I’d be pleased.
Fuck the rich, but especially fuck the fascist ones.
He claims to be autistic. As far as I know, there has never been a formal diagnosis. But he sure does like to use it to excuse the things he says and does.
I think it’s the ketamine
Being a social media ceo turns you into an uncanny valley monster apparently.
And little of value was lost.
Ahh, the negotiator
I always feel like there’s this low-key conspiracy to deed out every proper noun a cinematic treatment
It’s the -or at the end. Makes everything sound cool. Almost as cool as the letter X.
Xor
The sexiest logical operator.
Its definitely—ahem—alternative
but muh 20-d chess
What a fucking clown. Shareholders should be holding him personally liable for tanking the company.
The whole conversation sounds like he is pissed and already accepted that this was a waste of money.
I’m wondering if someone else is also unofficially paying?
I mean it’s clear he had accepted that already, what with all the waffling and basically being forced to complete the transaction.
Wise notion. I’ve always understood that only new money is loud. Old money is silent.
BTW, cool user identity!
He bought it so he’s the only shareholder. It’s not publicly traded anymore.
The banks that finaced him are extremely furious though.
They should learn not to give someone free money just because they have money already.
Pretty sure he’s paying a massive amount of interest on those loans, and he would have to liquidate his other assets before he could declare bankruptcy and erase any of the debt… The banks are probably laughing.
If you owe the bank $10,000, you’re in trouble. If you owe the bank 10,000,000,000 dollars, the bank is in trouble.
If they aren’t, I am.
No that’s not how leveraged buyouts are structured. Musk isn’t on the hook for the loans, Twitter the company is (basically, Twitter took on debt to help buy its former shareholders out).
Precisely, Musk has no personal risk for destroying Twitter. It’s absolutely fucking insane how much free money we give rich people.
Oh, and one of the reasons Twitter will inevitably fail is because of the massive interest payments the company accepted during the purchase.
Oh, no. Musk has $20b in Tesla stock guaranteeing the loans. He could lose control of Tesla if X fails.
So what happens then?
With debt is a bit different, as long as he pays it off I don’t think they care what he does with Twitter.
He’s not the only shareholder though.
First off, they didn’t pay $44bn, that number includes a $13bn loan that Twitter took out to buy itself on behalf of the new owners. Musk paid ~$27 including fees, $20bn of this was Tesla stock (which since shortly after has been underperforming), then $5bn was other investors, including that Saudi Prince.
Edit: there was also Musk’s existing shares, which iirc was around $2bn, but I think that’s included in the $27bn - so his payment was something like $25bn, made up of $20bn in stock and $5bn in cash. /e
Musk is the majority owner, owning roughly around 26/31 of the value. However he isn’t the only shareholder.
In any case the leveraged buyout has been structured with the intent of killing the business. There was never any sincere hope of paying off the $13bn debt, and the intent was all but proven when they almost immediately stopped paying rent on their offices. This might not have been the goal along, but since Musk was forced to make the purchase that’s what it turned into.
Ah, I didn’t realise that, thanks for the explanation.
In any case the leveraged buyout has been structured with the intent of killing the business. There was never any sincere hope of paying off the $13bn debt, and the intent was all but proven when they almost immediately stopped paying rent on their offices.
i don’t know that this is certain. Withholding rent is not an uncommon tactic to force a landlord to renegotiate a lease (in fact, that was the stated reason for withholding rent, for whatever Elon’s statements are worth). Certainly a very dirty one, and one that could blow up in his face if the landlord called his bluff and evicted him (last i heard they were handed an eviction notice in June, but I assume that’s either currently being litigated or already settled). It may have been HIS intent, but that doesn’t mean his shareholders weren’t intent on being repayed.
Regardless, I think ‘shareholder’ is a bit misleading (even if completely accurate and justified), because people (possibly the original commenter) think of CEO’s having fiduciary obligation to shareholders for publicly traded companies, and that’s not the case here.
There are other contractual obligations he would have to his co-investors and lenders (more serious ones I think) if he’s found guilty of intentionally tanking the company. I think that’s probably why he’s being so vocal here about it being the fault of the advertisers; if he tanks the company, whether he’s held to those contracts or if he’s allowed to declare bankruptcy depends on whether the plaintiff’s can prove he tanked it intentionally. If he did (as I think is pretty clear to most people at this point) and he’s found guilty of that, he’d be held liable for the total repayment of those loans plus whatever damages determined.
While he himself didn’t pay $44b for twitter, he could end up personally paying that much if all of the above comes to fruition, and that’s worst-case for him. Considering his net worth is mostly tied up in his other companies, he could stand to loose most of his net worth. If he gets tied up in a fraud trial, chances are high that his other companies’ stock values would plunge, too (TSLA has a beta value of 2.3, which means it’s more than twice as volatile as the rest of the market).
TLDR: Elon has every reason to be completely loosing his shit
TLDR: Elon has every reason to be completely loosing his shit
I’m just picturing Elon slinging shit like arrows from a bow. LOOSE!
I’m leaving it, is a much better description of his current mental state.
What do you think is the endgame here? Im so lost with regard to this whole storyline
Endgame now is to kill off Twitter (and grassroots public forums in general) then replace them with right wing alternatives. Musk’s old friend Peter Thiel failed with Parler, with Twitter out the way they have a much stronger chance.
Meanwhile, as Twitter crashes and burns, they can experiment with ludicrous ideas. Most of them will fail, but anything they get away with becomes a template for whatever comes next.
Like I say, that wasn’t the plan all along - most likely he just wanted to manipulate the stock price and make a bit of profit - but that’s what this has turned into.
You think he’s aware of Lemmy? What do you think he thinks about us if so?
No idea really, but I think he generally dismisses the platform as a non-threat. Which is good, I don’t want him anywhere near it.
[excellent]
It’s an interesting question.
Musk was forced to buy Twitter after accidentally promising to do so in legally binding terms. So, to a very great extent, there is no endgame, just the endless flailing of a rich kid who can’t comprehend just how much luck (rather than genius) got him where he is.
But, his supporters are primarily far right authoritarians, and his partners in Twitter include some extremely authoritarian regimes which have an interest in being able to suppress speech (and have had more help to do so with X compared to old Twitter). And his idea of free speech is being able to say whatever he likes without criticism, which means silencing any ideas that could possibly be construed as criticism, whether directed at him or not. The standard far right nonsense. If you point out the existence of racism you’re attacking white people. If you point out the existence of sexism you’re attacking men. If you choose not to advertise on a website promoting far right ideas, you’re attacking him personally.
Is he trying to turn Twitter into a more successful version of Gab or Truth Social, or is that just a by-product of his peculiar psyche? Is it with the intention of influencing elections, or is it just that his particular type of narcissism happens to be very useful to authoritarians? Are the ideas of the far right anything other than extreme narcissism anyway?
He’s not an evil genius but evil clowns can do a lot of damage too.
There is no endgame plan. He is a fucking idiot that got rich on accident.
that got rich on accident
He got super-wealthy accidentally. He got rich because his father is rich.
Ah, I thought he only acquired a controlling stake, rather than buying the full company outright.
Why burn 23 billions if you can burn 44?
This cunt wearing dogtags…
I hope he needs them.
Edit: they’re Israeli dog tags… Woooow…
So did he steal them off a dead soldier?
Apparently he was given them by the father of a hostage when he visited Israel yesterday.
Just an aside, what a weird moment. Why would you, father of a hostage, give this man anything? And dog tags at that
why would you give this man anything?
Should have given him a lobotomy.
deleted by creator
I made an edit to my comment above yours.
I’ve been saying this for years and nobody made a news article about me
Adult man acting as edge lord is the cringiest thing ever. I feel embarrassed for him whenever I see him talk.
Not sure how anybody worships the guy once they have actually heard him speak.
Jewish people are funding causes meant to “annihilate” them
This is what happens when your CEO overdoses on his own farts.
We’ll be gone
Don’t threaten me with a good time…
Short X 📉
“X” isn’t publicly traded. When he bought it, he took it private, so you can’t short it. The ticker symbol X is for the United States Steel Corporation. You could definitely short that, though; it’s entirely possible that it’ll tank just the same because people confuse it with Xitter. Like when that Chinese company that had the ticker symbol ZOOM shot to the moon at the start of the pandemic because people thought it was the video conferencing app (whose symbol was ZM).
It’s… Not public…
This is the free market at work, not black mail like he claims.
Yeah, they seem to have problem understanding that businesses want to make money, and you make the most of it, if you preferably don’t exclude any. They don’t give damn about anything else.
Lol dude is falling apart
