Windows 10 end of life could prompt torrent of e-waste as 240 million devices set for scrapheap::As Windows 10 end of life approaches, analysts are concerned that millions of devices will be scrapped due to incompatibility

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      82 years ago

      Why cheap, why separate? Just use your current one and slap in another disk. I’ve been doing it for decades. Many games run surprisingly well in Linux, sometimes even better than windows

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        142 years ago

        These Win10 EoLs are going to flood eBay at dirt cheap prices, and they make great server/project boxes. They’re going to be new toys for the hobbyist crowd, not primary machines.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    English
    202 years ago

    Incompatibility with what? Things are only just starting to be incompatible with Windows 7. I’ve still got customers running variants of Windows XP.

    And Windows 11 doesn’t really contain much that won’t work on 10.

    I reckon the TPM and secure boot requirements will eventually be dropped. They’re the Kinect of Windows 11.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      62 years ago

      I’m still not even sure why they decided to require TPM anyways. But yeah my computer is among the many that can’t upgrade until that’s gone. I guess it’s either that or I learn a lot more about Linux…

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        92 years ago

        At least if you switch to Linux there’s no shortage of people on the fediverse willing to answer questions.

        • @[email protected]
          cake
          link
          fedilink
          English
          72 years ago

          There should be a “Linux hotline” community where people can post whatever is stopping them from switching and get solutions

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            English
            102 years ago

            Elsewhere, Linux support areas seem more likely than not to have a large contingent of “WHY ARE YOU ASKING A DUMB QUESTION, you horror of a human being? Why didn’t you Search the site for words you don’t know using our broken search engine, instead of infecting us with your congenital idiocy?” folks.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        52 years ago

        Going the linux way can be troublesome at first, but you will be free from ms bullshit in the long run and will have your hardware lasting much longer. Unless you need something specific to windows for work, I recommend trying linux.

    • hamid
      link
      fedilink
      English
      6
      edit-2
      2 years ago

      You’re probably not correct about TPM and secure boot being dropped. Microsoft’s entire enterprise line of security products including Intune and Defender for Endpoint are integrated to it and Microsoft Azure AD/Entra ID uses it for their certificate based enrollment and authentication. This is their primary profit drivers, not consumers.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        22 years ago

        Disabling the tpm requirement is just a registry hack in win 10, or a selectable option when creating an install usb with rufus.

        I think they will make a simple calculation; What is going to cost more: The bad PR of nolonger updating 240 million pc’s, or accepting that a small portion of your users does not have tpm?

        They haven’t stopped advanced users from installing win11 on older hardware so far. So no loss there. I also doubt they lose enterprise money if they allow win10 to upgrade regardless, as tpm is now well entrenched as the default on new hardware.

  • GreenBottles
    link
    fedilink
    English
    432 years ago

    Windows 10 should not require such a short life time. 11 isnt much different other than the security\TPM chip shit. And 11 is fucking terrible UX

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      22 years ago

      Not to boast MS, but its service life is longer than Linux at 10 years. Lts on Linux is generally at best 8. Ltsc on Windows is much longer. Windows 10 released on 2015 and the ltsc ends at 2027 on the enterprise channel, or 2025 for the consumer general availability.

      I’m only commenting because I dislike misinformation more than I dislike MS.

    • Josh
      link
      fedilink
      English
      232 years ago

      I like that it’s completely arbitrary and you can force windows 11 to install on unsupported hardware.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        62 years ago

        You just need to set a couple of registry bypasses and you can upgrade any Computer to Windows 11. Downside is that some security features won’t work, but its not a big deal for consumers.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        142 years ago

        In one sense, I’m glad they put this stupid barrier up so that I don’t have to keep deleting the forced upgrade as part of regular Windows Updates like I did with Win10, but on the other hand it’s bullshit that they’re creating so much waste for no other reason than personal profit for their company.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      42 years ago

      TPM 2.0 will be over 10 years old at that point, I’m pretty sure most of the hardware they’re talking about will have been retired by then no matter the support for Windows 10.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        52 years ago

        I built a $1500 pc 6 years ago that doesn’t have a tpm. One gpu upgrade and this thing still does everything I want it for, including running modern games and VR with entirely acceptable performance. When windows 10 stops getting security updates, I’m just going to install arch on it.

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          22 years ago

          It was on everything Intel starting in October 2017 (8th gen) and a year later it started on AMD’s consumer grade hardware with full integration in 2019 (3000 series)…

          So 11 years after it started existing W10 stops receiving free updates, 10 years after the tech was fully integrated W10 stops receiving free and paid updates… And that’s not taking into consideration that W11 can still be installed on unsupported hardware…

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            English
            32 years ago

            I must have missed the cutoff by a couple of months. But here’s the thing: that cpu is still more than enough to drive 60fps on all the games I play, which includes typically demanding categories like fps, while running discord and YouTube and recording software. So the fact that Microsoft decided to fuck me over feels bad. TPM is garbage design from the hardware up, but I know to run secure workloads in secure places already.

            The right thing to do should have been to force oem-licensed win11 to have TPM, and allowed retail versions to install with a pop up about security features which won’t be supported without it. Fuck Microsoft for not doing this obvious, simple thing.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        72 years ago

        It might be 10 years old, but it’s not widely deployed until a few years ago, just like how Wayland is 15 years old but only recently starting to see widespread use.

  • kingthrillgore
    link
    fedilink
    English
    23
    edit-2
    2 years ago

    I can’t upgrade to W11, I can’t afford nor am I ready to upgrade my gaming PC, its likely I’ll be moving to Linux or keeping to use W10 w/o support.

    Microsoft really did no favors with limiting official W11 support. Its not just TPM.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      142 years ago

      I migrated to linux when Windows 7 died. So I’m you from years ago, lol.

      If you’d like any advice, I would just say check ProtonDB for the games you regularly play (especially if they are MMOs) to make sure they work, cause anything that uses restrictive kernal level anticheats arent going to run.

      and if you are looking for a distro, I would personally recommend Nobara. it stays up to date, it has a lot of the gaming stuff built in (Some of which might require compiling from github otherwise), and its been rock solid for me personally. but you should poke around and find whatever tickles your fancy… and anything you don’t get from X, that you can get from Y, can usually be manually installed on Z.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      12 years ago

      This obviously doesn’t solve any of the larger problem about MS pushing TPM, but you can bypass most of those W11 requirements.

  • newcockroach
    link
    fedilink
    English
    402 years ago

    Where can i get this waste .my linux pengiun will love it🤩.but it saddens me that people relay on windows so much.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      3
      edit-2
      2 years ago

      This is corporate talk, no ones work station is going to be running Linux anytime soon.

      Oh yeah everyone, tell me where you work with Linux?

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        4
        edit-2
        2 years ago

        Large ISP, in the global operations computing department. I am an exception to the rule though. I mostly touch network gear and *NIX servers so I’m not limited to Linux but I will say most of our *NIX stuff is RHEL now and doesn’t even boot past run level three so it’s all CLI.

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          52 years ago

          Our company doesnt usually allow linux other than our products. If we run a linux machine they want us to run this funky command that opens a backdoor for them lol after all the yearly trainings about how we arent supposed to do sketchy things like that. We still use linux machines because our windows machines are so locked down we cant do much with them but dont tell IT

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            English
            92 years ago

            Corporate IT requires a backdoor on all systems, the only thing sticking out is how automated they can make that on windows and macOS. And they do need that backdoor, so that they can check on and force patches so that you don’t end up with anyone else’s backdoor. Pretty reasonable when you really think about it.

            • @[email protected]
              link
              fedilink
              English
              22 years ago

              Pretty crazy that my company does similar with Macs. When I started, my manager assigned me a Windows laptop, but it is so locked down that you can’t do anything technical. I eventually insisted on the Mac and life is easier simply because they let you do more

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    English
    282 years ago

    It’s 8 years old. FFS install Linux and have a little server or some shit if you really can’t be bothered to upgrade.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      12 years ago

      It’s corporations. My company is currently upgrading a shit ton of PCs before our windows 11 push.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      302 years ago

      Ok so if you built a computer in like 2019 or 2020 it’s only 4-5 years old. This was before windows 11 came out. 4-5 years is not that old for a computer, especially if you built a good one.

      • Corgana
        link
        fedilink
        English
        11
        edit-2
        2 years ago

        This is what happened to me, a really high end PC built in 2018 and I couldn’t even upgrade because of the TPM stuff! Decided to try out Zorin and have been pleasantly surprised.

        • kingthrillgore
          link
          fedilink
          English
          92 years ago

          9 times out of 10 you can turn TPM on on these machines, and even then, i’m told “Can’t upgrade to Windows 11.”

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          32 years ago

          Been using Linux for years, it’s my daily driver and does everything I need except for a few headaches with a AAA game here or there, other than that it runs all my games does all my web browsing and all my video editing and other stuff without issues.

      • Corgana
        link
        fedilink
        English
        52 years ago

        Adobe suite is the only one I’ve encountered

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          72 years ago

          I mean the software I’m running on Win 10. As far as I know, a lot of it still won’t run on linux.

          Anyway, moot point since people said in this thread that you can bypass the TPM and Microsoft account requirements with Rufus. So anyone should be able to upgrade to Win 11.

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            English
            32 years ago

            Oh shit, I’ve been installing win 11 on a bunch of old hardware, didn’t realize what the big fuss was about it. I also use Rufus exclusively. Didn’t realize it was working so smoothly because I used Rufus haha

            • GNU Dude
              link
              fedilink
              English
              32 years ago

              Huh. It’s almost as if Microsoft just wants more money from people buying a new computer with their new OS. No one could see that coming.

              • @[email protected]
                link
                fedilink
                English
                1
                edit-2
                2 years ago

                Yeah Microsoft is ripping EVERYONE off with a free upgrade 🙄

                Bunch of nerds screaming over a free upgrade. Shocked.

                • GNU Dude
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  22 years ago

                  The free upgrade part is not the thing that upsets me, if you even bothered to read the context. It’s the fact that you may not be able to upgrade an old machine to Windows 11 by “traditional means” (clicking a button), because Microsoft deems it “unsupported”, which the above commenter disproved by saying they were able to install it even on this “unsupported” hardware.

                  Don’t mean to disrespect, but I recommend you read the context before you start rolling your eyes and calling people names. Applies to real life too. Have a good day!

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      22 years ago

      Or simply use an easy workaround to disable the tpm check and set up an offline account. I literally have win11 running on an old T460.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        22 years ago

        Anything you need to do beyond Rufus or the like for installation? How did activation, auto updates, etc work?

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          3
          edit-2
          2 years ago

          No, you don’t need anything else. Activation works the same if you log into your ms account or you can simply use https://massgrave.dev/ . I’m pretty sure there’s a way to get your key and enter it manually but I haven’t tried that yet.

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          12 years ago

          Wine or emulation? When I had to use Windows for work I used WSL to run my tooling and didn’t notice any performance degradation. Does it apply too vice versa?

          Although I’m with you on the hardware side. Because I have an Nvidia card my Linux install has been relegated for personal projects only. I already have a workstation supplied by my employer for work.

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            English
            12 years ago

            Sadly the things I need don’t work in Wine, Proton etc. I’m looking into running a Windows KVM with hardware pass through, but it’s quite the project, and requires a second GPU that I don’t have.

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          32 years ago

          Curious what you’re using. Ms office kinda sucked but LibreOffice works incredibly well, and Adobe products last I tried (years ago) sucked. But gimp and DaVinci resolve work great. Most of my games run absolutely fine. For everything else you just need a web browser and those have worked great always.

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            English
            32 years ago

            Yeah office products and vide editors have Linux alternatives, but to me the main offenders are Native Instruments Maschine (proprietary USB controller that doesn’t work in Linux + software that doesn’t work in Linux) and DTP software like Affinity Publisher or Adobe Indesign that have no Linux equivalent.

            I’m lookin into running those things in a Windows KVM in Linux though but it’s quite the project.

  • mittwerk
    link
    fedilink
    English
    102 years ago

    I don’t know how to install Windows 11 and I’m totally ok with it. I’ve been on linux for about 10 years.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    English
    12 years ago

    Where does the assumption that owners of these devices care about updates comes from? I regularly see people still using Windows 7, willing to use sketchy workarounds to continue using it. We all wish that this would mean The Year Of The Linux Desktop in 2025, but that would mean users would have to suddenly start caring about their OS.

    • A Wild Mimic appears!
      link
      fedilink
      English
      82 years ago

      Actually, that’s a real problem. The issue isn’t that features stop working or some slowdown, it’s millions of devices going without security updates and getting swooped into gargantuan bot networks.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    English
    21
    edit-2
    2 years ago

    How many non-tech people actually know about this? And how many of that small percentage are actually going to toss their computer as a result of it?

    Because for the average computer user, they will never wonder why there are no more updates. And as long as their computer still browses the internet they don’t care even if you notify them.

    Microsoft tried for years to get people off of fucking internet explorer and barely succeeded.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      12 years ago

      I expect there to be a lot of nagging. MS doesn’t want to miss out on all the Windows 11 licences they can sell with new hardware.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        62 years ago

        You underestimate people’s ability to dismiss pop ups and notifications without retaining any of the information in them.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      English
      62 years ago

      Yeah, no one actually cares. Just look at phones, people don’t actually stop using them when they aren’t supported and don’t care as long as it keeps working.