I’m on the market to buy a new laptop, and Lemmy has successfully coaxed and goaded me to give Linux a serious try.
I’ve never used *nix as my personal OS.
Which hardware/laptop do you recommend? And which OS to pair it with for a Linux newbie?
I’m a software engineer, and quit my job to pursue an MSc in AI. So my uses will be:
- programming
- study
- browsing lemmy
- gaming
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No no no no. I love the pinebook pro. But please don’t suggest it to anyone as a newbie hardware choice trying to get anything done. There are so many little quirks on hardware this slow and moreso having to deal with arm repos and all of the incompatible software/workarounds.
A few examples.
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If you want to watch YouTube you basically have one browser option. Chromium. Additionally if you want to watch any drm content then you need to install a docker container that runs chromium that has drm enabled.
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App images and flatpak software repos are nowhere near complete which can be not great for someone who is just trying to get some work done. Really not great when some devs are exclusively distributing via flatpak.
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No virtualization. It just doesn’t have the capability. Sure there are docker containers but that isn’t exactly virtualization.
I love my pinebook. It’s a great machine for just have a very cheap low spec thin client with a decent keyboard and screen but I would never ever recommend it to a newbie.
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How is a netbook good for his use case? I don’t think you could game on it unless you exclusively play Quake III.
uhh ThinkPad yes ThinkPad ThinkPad is linux THINKPAD PENGUIN
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fine print: oh yea also framework
Which ThinkPad?
Rocking E15 Gen2 with AMD CPU for about 3 years now, can’t complain besides the fucking fingerprint reader having proprietary drivers (thus not working on Linux).
So, the E model line is a nice work laptop with basically no GPU performance whatsoever.
I’ve been rocking a first gen X1 Yoga (6th gen intel) for like 5-6 years, three or so of those years I’ve been using Pop!_OS and its been pretty good. I suspect that a 6th gen intel may be a little lacking for your uses, just to say that most ThinkPads will be good.
yes
We use about seven ThinkPad T16 and P16s professionally with zero issues. Can recommend
Edit: the AMD versions, those generally work better with Linux
https://linuxpreloaded.com/ for a longer list
These are my favorites (EU based)
Tuxedo Computers can get you a very good dev laptop for ~1500€ (64GB RAM, AMD/Intel CPU, NVIDIA/AMD graphics card). If you will be working in AI, I imagine you’ll need CUDA (?) aka NVIDIA.
If you don’t go for anything on linuxpreloaded (which I wouldn’t recommend), it’s good to check whether what you’re buying has linux hardware support by checking the Linux Hardware DB. Even if you don’t look, it’ll probably work, but better safe than sorry if you’re going to dump 1/3 or 1/2 of your months salary into something (depending on where you are).For a distro, I dunno what level you are, but Distro Chooser can help you out with making a choice. My recommendations:
linux beginner
Linux mint. nice desktop environment, looks like a mashup between windows and mac, still missing advanced options, but quite customisable. comes with suitable standard software and cloud integrations (you can connect to a bunch of clouds), relatively up to date
Ubuntu is well-known, some proprietary companies even consider it “the linux” and only make linux versions for it. It’s quite stable. However, it isn’t my first recommendation anymore as they are going down a proprietary route. I’m not sure if they have ads yet, but wouldn’t surprise me if they started.
desktop environment
This is the desktop suite, a bundle of packages that work well together on any distro, with its own look and feel. There are basically 3 camps:
- windows look n feel
- KDE: is the most known, is very customisable, has an abundant amount of themes, icon sets, login screens, fonts, and a well-sized userbase. They prefix many app names with “K”. Ubuntu even has a distro version called “Kubuntu” with KDE on it
- Cinnamon: main user is Linux Mint
- LXDE and XFCE: look closer to windows 95 and windows XP, consume minimal resources. configuration is through the interface, advanced configuration through files
- mac look n feel
- Gnome: they are well known and source of flame wars (gnome vs KDE). windows don’t have title bars, things are very rounded, not very configurable, heavily mac inspired
- tiling window managers
- these aren’t desktop environments, but sit more in the middle, they manage windows. best to watch a video about tiling window managers. they are very geeky and perfect if you love using nothing but your keyboard
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- windows look n feel
I’m just here to say that lemmy should have an integration with Midjourney that automatically creates an image based on the content of the text.
I just want a modern AMD apu laptop with coreboot, slotted ram and multiple nvme slots, but like everything these days it would seem I’m asking for too much.
That would be perfect.
My modded t440p goes with me everywhere until then. I have that IIRC core2 dell(?) armored laptop running fully blobless too but it’s just a server backing up my 2fa emergency keys and such things. It was a fun little side project building and flashing coreboot but the hardware is a bit dated these days. The t440p is good for anything other than gaming or 4k movies at least.
I bought a lenovo p14s AMD 2 years ago without OS, 32GB RAM and M.2 SSD, very happy with Arch, BTW. Coreboot would be nice, but it doesn’t seem feasible yet…
Coreboot would be nice, but it doesn’t seem feasible yet…
Why not?
Modern CPUs, especially AMD. Correct me If I’m wrong !
Yeah, that’s incorrect. System 76 is producing machines with modern CPUs that use coreboot:
Nice , but my question was more if it possible to put it on other commercial machines, especially AMD one
my current dell one has an amd cpu, slotted ram (no soldered on crap) and nvme + sata (with space for a drive); too bad the build quality and the touchpad sucks
my old lenovo one also had replacable slotted cpus (with Pentium 2020m pre-installed). The lid also just slid off (like on a rail), with only one screw needing removal, no flimsy plastic clips. I broke plastic part of the hinge on that one by just flipping it over, oh well.I miss the old days and what I thought the future of tech would be like back then…
Linux runs on literally anything. The hardware doesn’t matter too much these days, but which distro you pick does. I would say to just load a flash drive with a live image of a distro you think looks cool and see how you like it on a trial basis. Try a couple of them before you reqlly make a decision and then load the full image
I use manjaro xfce but i would reccommend fedora or mint if ya starting out. Fedora seems to just work most of the time hardware wise.
All distris that have GNOME look the same. Same for KDE. I wouldn’t go the looks cool route
Distro choice doesn’t matter too much. Even ubuntu if you ignore snaps
snaps
Gross.
The hardware doesn’t matter too much these days
WiFi, Bluetooth and Nvidia graphics have entered the chat
Fingerprint reader and webcam standing by
WiFi and Bluetooth yeah, if you run Linux mint setting up the proprietary drivers us literally like 2 buttons in the drivers menu
The proprietary Nvidia graphics drivers works pretty well in most distros. Just go to your distro’s driver manager and enable the proprietary driver.
Nvidia cards can still be tricky, especially on optimus laptops. It’s not nearly as problematic as it used to be, but I still run into occasional issues with it. If I ever buy a new computer for gaming, I’m going to go with AMD.
I did, and I’d do it again next time. You can eventually convince NVIDIA cards to go, but relatively, AMD just works.
If you just want stuff to work with minimal hassle, Linux Mint is an excellent choice. PopOS is also often recommended, especially for laptops. If you really want to get into the nitty gritty, something Arch based might fit the bill.
I’ve heard great things about system76, never had one of their laptops myself but still have the desktop I got in 2011 (Wild Dog Pro). I personally use the frame.work 13, and it has been working great with Arch installed. I do not recommend Arch, use something like PopOS, or LinuxMint.
What generation of framework do you have?
Intel 11th gen. I was in the first few batches when it came out and haven’t had a need to upgrade, but love that I can if needed.
Oh man that’s the same as me! I’ve been having all sorts of issues with reliability with mine so I was curious if it was different generations. I guess I’m unlucky?
I’ve had no issues that weren’t caused by me, but I also have a pretty minimal setup.
I was typing up a reply and realized this said most of what I was saying. The only thing I’d add is that support matters, popularity matters. Supported or popular HW platforms are less likely to have small random niggles than an off the shelf dell laptop. System 76 or tuxedo lines are ideal supported platforms. Think pads area super popular.
PopOS or Mint are as easy to use as ubuntu, but without being chained to snaps, which everyone is moving towards flatpaks except canonical
I have been eyeing a framework laptop. Just curious how you use the modular ports in your case: do you have different ones you swap sometimes?
I have a “typical” set of ports (2x USB-C, HDMI, USB-A) that’s on my laptop most of the time. I also have the 2.5GbE adapter that I use occasionally.
I assume for charging you have to have the USB C one, and have it on a specific slot?
I can’t speak for all of the models, but my AMD Framework 13 can charge on any slot. I really like being able to charge from either side of my laptop.
That’s actually nice little bonus!
I keep a copy of Windows installed on a storage card, saves from having to mess about with partitioning for dual booting.
Oh, they have extra storage cards, that’s pretty sweet actually
2 type c’s and 2 type A USB are in it 99% of the time. I have the HDMI, and display port modules but have rarely used them. I also keep the 2.5Gb Ethernet for when I break the WiFi to get back into the router, and a microsd for when I reflash my raspberry pi’s .
Is there any advantage to having extra ports over a dongle with all of those at once?
IMO, modular ports is not the main selling point for Framework. I was sold on their commitment to a platform that is repairable/upgradable.
Other than they fit nicely into a pocket in my backpack…no. The main reason I love their product is the reparability aspect, allowing me to swap ports is just a neat feature.
I guess that makes sense, I can still just put the dongle I already have for edge cases like plugging into a DisplayPort monitor, needing Ethernet, etc. Also I didn’t realize until someone else commented that they have extra storage ones, that would probably be one for me
Check out the Framework 16. Ubuntu and Fedora are officially supported. I run Debian on my Framework 13 no problem.
I have a framework. Hands down the best laptop I’ve ever worked with/on.
Choose whatever laptop you like, and do a quick search on the model for incompatibilities. If there’s something critical or long-term, like a very specific hardware module not working well without its proprietary driver, consider changing, but most of the time, Linux will just work.
For distro, PopOS is good. It doesn’t come with a bunch of bloatware, but it is also not barebones. Mint is also a great choice.
Any modern Thinkpad will run any Linux distro easy, from bios updates up to gaming with Proton. Dell laptops also have a good linux support. Try to avoid laptops with Nvidia cards though, AMD driver installation is way easier if not completely invisible/painless.
@Toldry System76 hardware is great and they run their own distro Pop!_OS. Highly recommend their machines. I have one otw as we speak.
Hard to make a real recommendation without knowing your budget and general likes/dislikes. Like screen size, weight, clamshell vs convertible, integrated graphics vs dedicated GPU. I know you said gaming but integrated is great for indie and retro gaming and can handle some.modern stuff but a dgpu is needed if you’re playing AAA titles and care about graphics and framerate, etc.
For everyone who says Linux runs on anything, that’s mostly true but specific hardware components are still problematic. Most fingerprint scanners won’t work if the laptop comes with Windows and you’re installing yourself, the same for any unique hardware feature.
I have the Thinkpad x1 yoga gen 7 and everything works including the OR camera for facial recognition and the fingerprint scanner.
System 76, Framework or Tuxedo. Ignore the people telling you to buy a 10 year old Thinkpad.
Ugh, don’t use Linux for anything ever. It’s so hard to use and you might actually have to learn something new. Just stick to windows so you know every single piece of software ever created will definitely work 100%.
/s
For the software side I would recommend Linux Mint as a great simple starter distro with good support and a nice community. The overall design paradigm is about maintaining familiarity while also making sane defaults and simplifying processes. Because it is Ubuntu based it is also easy to get documentation and support because what works for Ubuntu also works for Mint.
For hardware it really depends on your budget and locality as well as use case. Laptops vary much more country to country than you may think, so it may be worth thinking about what is local to you. For example, I live in Australia so System76 is a bad choice here, same with SlimBook (I think that is the name, European KDE laptop that advertises with that French(?) YouTuber, they don’t ship here.
Also, when looking at laptops the RAM configuration is important. If you have two RAM slots but only one RAM stick you will have really slow memory access. This will bottleneck for both the CPU and GPU if you are using both at the same time, say during gaming or doing AI work. Swapping out the single stick for a matching pair or just adding one more stick that matches what it already has will let both ports work together, making everything faster. Also when I say matching I mean in terms of size and speed. If you put 3200MHz and 2400MHz in the system at the same time the 3200MHz won’t just down tune to match, they will both go slower as far as I am aware. Best to match not only the speed but if possible the brand and ideally model, there are lots of little differences between RAM sticks and honestly it has never been worth the trouble in my experience to have mismatched sticks, I just replace with a matching pair.
