What is the difference between cellular data being used on my phone and cellular data being used on my notebook? Data is data.
I’ve been using SecureTether https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.panjava.internet.sharing.tethering.mobile.hotspot.secure.wifi.securetether to get around it. Requires a bit of setup but works without issues after.
I dont believe something like this is possible on iOS.
AT&T are like:
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Using a phone purchased through them or unlocked? Locked phones will have proprietary bullshit to check if you are using a hotspot
Do they actually slow it down? I have 8GB of data and many months I use a lot more than that and they send me some messages that they will slow it with some links to purchase more data but it never happens, or at least not in a noticeable way
I’m sure this is an unpopular opinion, but I kind of get this one. Unlimited data on your phone is constrained a bit because it’s your phone. If you make your phone a hotspot and the whole family is using it to watch videos and stuff (and not paying for their own data plan), that’s a pretty big difference to the infrastructure needs.
Yeah. You have unlimited data but they don’t want you to actually use that.
They take the risk that you’re not going to use more than they want you to from your phone but it is very likely that you’ll use it from your computer or if you connect multiple devices to your phone.
I find the idea to be reasonable because they can’t actually supply everyone with unlimited data but they really shouldn’t be calling it unlimited if there are any limits.
Yeah, it’s unlimited for you on your phone, and they have estimates and ranges for what that amounts to for people that they use to determine pricing. But if not it’s not just you and your phone, but multiple people with multiple uses, those estimates aren’t sufficient.
Use a VPN. ISP are being disingenuous when they claim a data connection is unlimited at the point of purchase and then slug us with restrictions when we try and use it. If they can detect a tether, the VPN should obscure it.
Start the VPN from the phone though, otherwise the TTL-trick will still work for them.
It’s because at&t also sells home Internet. If you have unlimited hotspot, then you wouldn’t want that sweet sweet DSL or whatever shit Internet ATT sells
How do they know if the source of data is hotspot? I’d imagine there is a way to stop your phone grassing on you.
TTL in the packet header is 29 instead of 30
Well that’s an easy fix.
There’s different internal network configs (APNs), and hotspot uses a different one than regular mobile data. ( or at least it used to). Those can be configured and metered separately from the carrier’s end.
LineageOS, and maybe some other custom ROMs, wouldn’t do that and would put the hotspot and mobile data on the same APN to get around that.
Even on my unlocked, non vendor phone it seems to not recognize hotspot data as different for some reason.
Can confirm, switching to Graphene solved this problem for me a long while ago.
Doesn’t unlocking the bootloader break Google Pay?
You can in theory still use Google Pay with a Magisk module called Play Integrity Fix and using a fingerprint from a different phone to pass Basic and Device integrity. I’m currently doing it on my Pixel 7 Pro.
But it has a steep learning curve and is a temporary solution that will disappear in roughly a year once Google sunsets legacy integrity methods and starts requiring Strong integrity, which can’t be faked under known methods. Google is also actively disabling fingerprints that are being spoofed, making the whole thing frustrating and even more temporary even when it works.
Just let us use our devices, sheesh.
Don’t know, wouldn’t touch that with a 10 foot pole.
What’s wrong with Google Pay?
the Google part
You can lock the bootloader again after the flashing process is done(because it will add the signing key of the new OS), but unfortunately the NFC Payments in Google Pay still won’t work because Google only allows it on ‘certified’ Android systems (aka only the preinstalled OS)
Isn’t this dependent on the ROM, like lineage shouldn’t be locked where as calyx is locked likewise for graphine os
Yes, afaik LineageOS shouldn’t be locked, but I was talking about GrapheneOS specifically because @[email protected] was talking about that.
Ugh. I was dumb and got a Samsung that was offered to me for cheap on the spot. If I had done any research I would have learned that there’s no alternative OS options. Now I’m stuck with it, because I’m poor, so I just try to avoid using it. I should keep an eye out for something used that’s compatible.
While it’s not at the same level as Graphene OS, Samsung is pretty well supported by Lineage OS. AFAIK at least in Europe Samsung phones have an unlockable bootloader, but YMMV.
Nah. Nobody’s figured out how to access the ROM on my specific model, unfortunately, and I’m 900% sure Canadian telecom oligopolists will not be cool about unlocking like that.
In my defense, if it was a laptop it would have been much less foolhardy.
I’m still hoping for LineageOS on the Nord N30 but I can’t Even find a stock ROM to root it.
Back when they just began recognizing it, they noted peculiar traffic. Desktop websites, batch downloads normally unavailable to that system. This assumes that you utilized the internal hotspot system and didn’t create a separate one. Now? Not sure whether their system is more robust but it should, theoretically, be possible to obfuscate your traffic using third party hotspot software. No clue where to look for that anymore.
I used to routinely use 100gb of data on my jailbroken sprint iPhone. Did that for almost 3 years. Never heard a peep from them. But this was forever ago.
If you used the package I think you did, that’s not unusual. Absolutely will not remember the name but there were numerous tweaks that just flipped the hotspot switch but a couple that allowed you to use a hotspot without directly using the inbuilt function. One was free and broadly used.
That was great, and you didn’t have to pay some extra tethering fee every month either (or something like that, it was so long ago for me).
You have to turn that feature on.
Could you install a different OS like suggested here https://dubvee.org/comment/1855949 / by Admiral Patrick below?
Yeah, installing a new OS on a phone isn’t something you do easily like on a PC.
You have to unlock the bootloader, which requires an unlock code from the manufacturer, then you have to factory reset it, and that’s even if your phone/carrier allows it. Many don’t (which is why it’s so hard for me to replace my phone…grrr).
So yeah, installing a new OS on your phone is typically going to require quite a bit of effort and some level of commitment as well as a device that’s bootloader unlockable and supported by an alternate OS (each device and model requires a custom build).
It’s…a whole thing. It really shouldn’t be, but it is :(
I haven’t done it in a while, but it kinda depends on the phone, some were very easy to flash in the earlier days of Android.
Yeah, my old Moto Play G4 was a breeze. Wasn’t quite “Press any key to continue” but not much more difficult.
My OnePlus was a little more work, but that was mostly because of the OP website acting up and refusing to generate my bootloader unlock key. Also had to do things differently since it didn’t have an SD card to hold my install stuff like the Moto Play did.
I had one where you could literally run an app on the phone, no ADB or anything. Can’t remember what phone it was now but it might’ve actually been a Moto Droid
One one hand, that sounds extremely convenient. On the other, I shudder thinking what a malicious app could do with that 😆
Edit: Unless you’re talking about doing it through TWRP. I had to flash that over fastboot, but once installed to the recovery partition, I could boot into that and install the rest of Lineage and extra packages straight from the SD card. Updating the system was just downloading the new Lineage .zip to the SD card, booting into TWRP, and clicking install.
and that’s even if your phone/carrier allows it.
This is why you should buy the phone outright yourself then get a SIM only deal, rather than paying for your phone in contract.
Yeah I do, but SIM unlocked and bootloader unlockable are two different things. Sadly, not every phone (or even the same phones made for different carriers) are allowed to be bootloader unlocked; I have no idea why, but it is and sucks.
Yeah it’s definitely true, even with the same manufacturer it can be hit and miss. You gotta do your research before you buy.
Maybe, but it’s not worth it just for a few days, which is all I’ll need it for. I just forked over $15 for another 10 gb.
negotiate. i called my last carrier from my new carriers retail store front. they practically begged me to stay and said they’d give me everything i asked for.
$15 for 10GB?! USA phone bills are extortionate!
Yeah, it really sucks, but at least there aren’t roaming charges anymore.
Lol when I travel to the US I get 12GB roaming per month included for no extra charge.
I just have unlimited data in 200 countries on Fi in the US.
You think our phone bills are extortionate? Try Canada. They’re worse. Which is really saying something.
It’s worth it for more than a few days, custom ROMs ftw.
Personally my minimum features are:
- Long press back button to force close and kill an app.
- Call recording.
All the other stuff and customisation is just tasty gravy.
If you root your phone and install a custom rom, you can get around it and they can’t tell.
If you’re factory, it sends that hotspot info to them.
My ISP’s a dick, but to my knowledge, unlimited has to mean unlimited around here. There where months where we had Problems with our fibre, so I did everything over a hotspot from my phone. Used 100’s of GB’s no one ever complained.
Get proper consumer protection laws, people.
*Cries in American.*
Get proper consumer protection laws, people.
California is trying its best, but I’m not sure the other US states will get onboard (except New York, and maybe Oregon and Washington state).
Yeah. I mean, the state I live in right now just passed a bill to forbid officers of the state from using gender neutral, but technically grammatically incorrect language, while the ruling party is campaigning on not being a party of bans, while claiming their rivals are, so things aren’t all that green here either.
I say take the wins you can get.
Where are you?
unlimited has to mean unlimited around here.
This is the case in a lot of countries. In Australia, some ISPs got fined a lot of money (something like $300,000 I think?) because they advertised mobile phone plans as “unlimited” when in reality they slowed down the speed once you hit a limit.
Dunno if 300k is necessarily a lot for an ISP, but having rules and fining firms for non-compliance is pretty nice.
The maximum ISPs could be fined for misleading/deceptive conduct (including things like this) was $1.1 million at the time, and I don’t think they considered this bad enough to hand out the maximum fine. They bumped the maximum to $10 million at some point afterwards though.
it’s not especially in the US, i’ve seen ISPs essentially break kneecaps forcing the consume to pay for the initial hook up, and then immediately rolling it out to every available house in the subdivision or neighborhood.
That shit should be illegal. If you do the math on how long it would take to profit from running it yourself it’s only a few years given an ENTIRE neighborhood.
Get proper consumer protection laws, people.
And if you’re homeless, just buy a house 🫶
It really is the same energy
It wasn’t supposed to be quite serious, but yeah, depending on where you live it’s pretty much a lost cause, at least in the short-, or even mid-term.
Bad comparison.
Get Google fi if it’s available. Very consumer friendly. Actually let me rephrase that. More consumer friendly than most other cell providers. But it’s still Google.
At least all the pricing and features are straight forward and they don’t lock any features (like Hotspot) behind paywalls.
It’s too expensive. Visible is cheaper and unlimited everything, even hot spot, and no soft data cap.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Visible/comments/efsmwg/warning_there_is_a_data_cap/
I know I know, Reddit post. But there is in fact a soft data cap. The guy who made the post was torrenting and received an email for reaching the data abuse threshold.
If you’re using FI, and you set the device your using the phone hotspot for to metered connection you’re not too terribly likely to reach the data cap on pretty much any of the unlimited fi plans. I do this for work.
lol… 30 terabytes?! Okay. I’m sure even Google Fi has a cap like that. Most people would struggle to even come close to that. It’s 30x the cap of even a home internet provider like Comcast, which usually limits you to 1 terabyte. Most people would have a really hard time hitting even that on their mobile.
The other thing to consider is Visible is cheaper than Google FI too. And most people aren’t going to use anywhere near 30 terabytes.
Yeah, even using a hotspot internationally it’s the same price, with the same data limits.
And with data-SIMs, it’s possible to share that data with a few other devices, still at no extra cost.
Those features are often overlooked when people ask why it’s more expensive than e.g. Mint.
Yeah. I haven’t used mint, but the apps, account management and overall ease of use and transparency is legendary with Google fi. Those things are also easy to overlook. It’s just so easy and doesn’t get in my way when I want to manage something like all other carriers.
Every time the ATT sales people bug me at stores I tell them what I’m paying and that I get unlimited hotspot and they usually say “oh, you’re good.”
Add to this that Fi actually allows you to add data only SIMS at no cost.
Laptops have large screens and windows software isn’t designed to be data efficient. Unlimited data doesn’t mean at full speed infinitely. They sell way more than they can support otherwise it would be impossible to support more than a few users at one time on a cell tower.
“They sell more than they can support”
At that point is where mine and your opinion diverge. In what sustainable business does one sell more of anything than they can maintain responsibility over?
Of course, there are many examples, but why?
Greed is why. Don’t sell something you cannot sustain, or you have misled your customer.
I hope the user finds a way around this and burns all of the data they rightfully purchased. Plan says unlimited. Rename the plan if its a lie.
Finally, and not directed at the user to which I am replying, what concerns me the most is that this quote I took from your post would be glossed over by most because it is what we’ve come to expect from fucky corps. We don’t have to take it, change your expectations, question the system.
At that point is where mine and your opinion diverge. In what sustainable business does one sell more of anything than they can maintain responsibility over?
What they’re talking about is the mobile provider overselling service. Because they know that for the vast majority of the time, everyone isn’t going to be demanding huge amounts of bandwidth all at the same time. Cable/GPON fiber ISPs do the same thing.
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Good addition, I guess I am making a moral argument. I was coming at it from an ethics POV but yeah. Also good sandwich analogy.
Problem is that shared infrastructure shouldn’t be operated for profit. But American conservatives seem to think that’s the way to go. If infrastructure is shared, then there’s every incentive for a business to sell even if the infrastructure can’t handle it.
That being said, it’s a required thing. This is why we have society in the first place. If every customer had to have their own cell infrastructure, it would be a mess and a waste. I mean you are sold unlimited bandwidth at let’s say 1Gbps on 5G. There are about 1 cell tower node for every 1000 people in the US across the country. If we build enough infrastructure for everyone to use it at full speed each tower node would then need to be able to handle 1,000Gbps. That’s just not possible with current technology. So should we build one tower node per person plus all of the cabling and routers to handle that much traffic? Does everyone really need to be able to download a gigabit of data every second of every day? What would you do with that data?
What internet infrastructure is designed for is peaks of up to that speed for short bursts. Not sustained speeds. And then sharing that infrastructure. Just like if everyone were to turn on their water at the same time, no one would get more than a drip, but does that ever actually happen in real usage?
The difference is that water infrastructure is owned collectively, so it is more equitably developed to make it available to all as equally as possible, rather than just to those who pay more for it.
Oops
Oops!
You also have a ventilation pad for your phone to keep it cool while it’s serving that data traffic?
Lol, surprisingly my Xiaomi doesn’t heat much even when I have my mobile hotspot turned on.
When I’m downloading a big game off Steam, mine gets pretty warm. I bricked the WiFi module of an older phone through that. Better safe than sorry.
Were you downloading more ram or was that all BaNano faucet
Downloading games from Steam and binging through a few TV shows because I had a free trial of Apple TV+.
I don’t play online games, so I don’t care for low ping and the speed is usually fine.
I’d have a lot of fun trying to get around it. For example, if the phone and the computer were on the same non-Internet-connected wifi network, and you set up an SSH server to send outbound requests through the 4G modem, would they be able to find out you’re using the hotspot?
There are a ton of methods carriers use to detect hotspot traffic, from the device itself handling the categorization, to TTL values attached to requests, to other very clever network sniffing strategies.
Every method I’ve encountered in the past was thwarted by a good ole VPN. This was all on unlocked or rooted phones though so YMMV work carrier phones.
I’d just try to disguise the traffic as coming from something else. Someone further down says just switching to an OS that doesn’t actively snitch does the trick, but if you really wanted you could make your requests look like just about anything, given added volume is free.
Get EasyTether for your phone ($10) and you can USB tether to any PC that has the companion app installed (free).
Even a Raspberry Pi works. I have a Pi configured to broadcast as a WiFi AP, so I just plug in my phone via USB and I have instant WiFi for all of my devices. Takes a fair amount of configuration to do that, but there are tutorials online. Much easier just plugging your phone into a laptop for internet on just that laptop.
Or maybe a laptop can act as a WiFi AP, too. I do know Windows can share internet out a free Ethernet port very easily.
I use a VPN so my wireless provider doesn’t see Windows update or Stream downloads, etc.
What is the difference between cellular data being used on my phone and cellular data being used on my notebook?
The difference is the cellular company’s profits amount.
I think this is also an archaic model from before smart phones and the early days of smart phones. In the early days of apps, most attempted to limit data usage because most network providers charged a premium for data and the networks were much slower and smaller.
While you could tether in these early days, even before smart phones, the computer was capable of much higher data usage than the phone. These limits were put in place to protect a network that wasn’t really built for this level of load.
Old rules with good purpose turned into a way to charge more money.
Fair enough. That describes the past, but not the present, or the future.
They had this restriction in the UK where the networks would prevent hotspots from actually working. You had to buy a special additional package.
Restriction has now vanished and there are no such limits on usage. Not sure if the Regulator intervened but it was most certainly a cash grab.
These days they still manage to rip us off by annual contract increases of RPI+3.9%. That applies even during a 2 year contract.
Not sure if the Regulator intervened
It was an EU thing before…well you know what you did
I didn’t ask for this. 😭
