Tiktok is literally brainwashing people into supporting Palestine and brainrot liberal policies. I’m glad it’s finally being banned
The kids don’t care, they will just use CoCo Fun (most are using both apps anyway).
The only difference is that with Coco Fun, its America spying on your kids.
I don’t know why people think spying is the issue. It’s the potential control. For example, when this bill was proposed, TikTok sent a notification to users to contact their representatives. That’s not horribly harmful, but it does show a willingness to weaponize their user base (and their base’s willingness to listen).
If this bill wasn’t going to pass before, it sure as well would after that happened. You have to consider what else that could potentially be used for. Could they possibly use it to influence an election if a candidate was against their interests?
Most companies will let customers know about legislation like that. It’s hardly nefarious.
Exactly. I remember this being a thing with Net Neutrality banners everywhere, so this isn’t new.
Yeah, except if a foreign owned company activates their user base to attack you, as a representative, it has to look threatening, and it should be seen as a threat. It was more than just a comment when opening the app. It was a notification pushed to the device, or that’s my impression at least.
As I said, this case isn’t that bad, but it does make the potential threat obvious. There’s a reason western apps are banned in China. Why should a Chinese company not expect action in the west?
My local dispensary had “write your congressman to support legal weed.” Is that a threat? Or is it just encouraging people who use your app to participate in politics? It’s not like they’re encouraging their users to march on Washington or commit violence. They’re just telling folks to do what every civics teacher has told them: Write your congressman about things you care about.
If Congress takes that as a threat that says a lot more about Congress than it does about Tik Tok.
There’s a reason western apps are banned in China. Why should a Chinese company not expect action in the west?
I thought that reason was because we post about events that didn’t happen and countries that don’t exist, not that it was a threat to China’s government. We didn’t ban apps here because we’re the free good guys, and they’re the authoritarians.
But I guess both countries are dickweeds now. So it goes…
Eh, all international (and even intranational to a large degree) politics is about power and always has been. We aren’t the “free good guys,” though China is absolutely authoritarian and controlling. Looking at it through a moral lense leads to the wrong ideas though. Morality has never come into play. If there’s a potential threat to power (even if imagined), it’ll be defended against. It doesn’t matter what country we’re referring to, nor is that unreasonable action to take.
Totally agree. Which is why I truly despise nation-states and the people who make me pretend to believe in them.
There is a whole class of “influencers” that get paid to shill for everything from liquor to policy on every platform. Tiktok, a foreign company, owns the algorithm, so they can promote whatever they want.
This all seems sketchy, but then I recall citizens united and the fact that billions are spent directly purchasing influence in the actual government. They just don’t like some other entity putting their finger on the scale.
I’d much prefer systematic reform where money can’t buy influence and companies (US or otherwise) can’t spy on their users, yet that will never be on the table because of the money and power Facebook and others have.
I get you, but asking people to participate in democracy is not “weaponization”, and I’m 100% okay with popular figures, even from other countries, telling people how to vote, because who doesn’t tell people how to vote these days?
You’re OK with paid actors interfering in your elections?
Jesus fucking christ.
That’s pretty much par for the course. We saw the same thing with big tech companies around Net Neutrality, this is largely the same thing, no?
I get where you’re coming from but oh my god is that a wack ass take
Using a weapon can be done for good. If they’re using it to attack something for their interest, it’s weaponization. However, they didn’t do it for “good.” They did it for self-interest. US representatives got bombarded with phone calls and messages telling them not to block a foreign company’s app after the company told them to do so. What would that look like to them? It looks like a weapon that has been turned on them.
We shouldn’t just accept foreign agents interfering with our election just because “who doesn’t these days.” That is totally the wrong response. If that’s all you see in this you need to re-evaluate your position.
If they ban one they should ban them all. Cambridge analytica used Facebook on behalf of LeaveEU and Trump.
I don’t totally disagree, but a foreign owned company playing with our politics is just a little different than a company in the US doing so. Sure, they’re all dangerous, but you don’t let foreign governments have power that can potentially control your nation. It’s why in China nearly all western services are banned. China sees the risks. Why would anyone expect a Chinese company to be ignored?
US Congress will grant the government any power except enforcing privacy rights.
APRA is coming
I don’t really use TikTok but I really hope this gets tossed by the courts. I don’t care if ByteDance is owned by cthulus and draculas, it’s a terrible precedent to have the government ban a media company. If we don’t like China having access to data, ban apps from collecting it in the first place. Require algorithm audits. There are so many better ways to handle this than singling out TikTok.
Everybody talks about Facebook like they’re owned by the American government. They’re not. I’m sure the US government gets massive amounts of data from them, but they can’t control Facebook in the way China can control Tik Tok. And much of their surveillance is public with warrants whereas China does not need to follow any of that.
I get it. But it’s night and day different than the actual government owning the company.
If you think the Chinese government doesn’t have its hand directly up in Tik Tok, you’re absolutely fooling yourself. China has much more direct control over companies, well beyond what the US government has.
So this bill is not going to do anything but require ByteDance to sell the tiny small insignificant minuscule 1% that the Chinese government owns and in no way uses to influence how the company is run.
Sounds like it’s no big deal!
it’s a terrible precedent to have the government ban a media company
Good thing TikTok’s not actually being banned then isn’t it? It’s just being forcibly sold, which is quite different.
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Don’t forget, control the sale of data too. Audits etc to make sure they comply with privacy safeguards, and so on.
This is just pandering as well as, I suspect, to give a corporate donor a profit-making business.
The precedent was already set back in 2020 when the US government forced Kunlun to sell Grindr
My $1 bid is ready to submit to ByteDance once grandpa signs that bill.
Get in line buddy, I’m entering this race with $1.01!!
How are you raising that kind of capital in this environment!? I can only dream of it!
Selling off old memes that were appraised at [email protected]
Sell to who is what I’m wondering. I would be surprised if whoever wants to acquire TikTok is not lobbying hard for this.
Introducing… FaceTok
Exclusively available on Meta Quest 3
Being the guy who signed the bill that threatens the existence of a platform that is super popular with young people whose vote he desperately needs during an election year. Masterful gambit, sir!
There’s a reason why the bill doesn’t go into effect until after the election.
We’re not stupid.
This person does not speak for me
Literally my first thought… Way to go Biden, nothing like getting hundreds of thousands of “influencers” mad at you right at an important election…
But who are we kidding, I can guarantee that maybe 5% of Congress even understood what they were doing.
Data harvesting is half of the problem. I have a feeling that congress could give two shits about the data harvesting as it’s almost literally everywhere in modern society and not in the interests of donors or the nationality security apparatus to remove.
The other half is the platform and its potential (hypothetical and actual) for use in information operations. TikTok has direct access to something like 160 million American devices. That rivals other social media giants like Meta who have some government liaisons and relationships embedded in their security teams. ByteDance to my knowledge does not have these relationships. This problem could just as easily apply to any other foreign platform if any were large enough to pose threats of this scale.
My guess is they’re more concerned about propaganda. They’re concerned about it being Fox News, but for the CCP.
Starts off innocent enough, then slowly starts pushing disinformation that’s in service of a political entity.
Sure, you gotta limit the propaganda to American companies…
I’m no fan of TikTok and I think it’s actively harmful for a whole host of reasons, but freedom of speech is Constitutionally protected, and I can see an argument that “algorithms” should be included in that protection. That’s probably why this doesn’t target the “algorithms” TikTok uses, but instead targets the nation of origin.
The propaganda issue is not resolved by this legislation, it merely attacks one potential source and gives the President tools to address other similar sources w/o passing new legislation. It’s probably fine (and way better than previous, related proposals), but it doesn’t do much to solve propaganda.
I’d much rather see more focus on transparency, privacy, and consent, instead of just banning stuff because it seems dangerous.
Propaganda is effective. It’s at times silly, blatant, jingoistic, and offensive, but it has historically worked to influence public opinions.
I think you’re right, but saying the quiet part out loud. People don’t like to think they’re susceptible to scams and propaganda because they’re not that dumb or gullible. People still click on phishing emails…
The question is, do enough people do it to impact elections?
You mean exactly like Facebook, right, because there are a lot of parallels but I never heard American politicians want to ban Facebook.
Let’s not fool ourselves!
Difference being, Facebook is just greedy, and will promote toxic disinformation because it gets high engagement numbers. If factual civics videos got high engagement, Facebook would gladly promote that. They want to promote whatever is going to sell more ads.
With the CCP, the motivation is the message, not the money. With Facebook, the motivation is the money and whatever message makes the most of it.
So I suppose put it like this: what if the way for Facebook to make the most money is all their current operations + pushing the rightwing agenda? (or leftwing depending on what team you’re on).
How is that any less meddling than tik tok? Sure Facebook is based in america, but has clearly shown it cares much more about its own interests than any country.
It just feels like trusting a tank of gas cause you just saw someone get lit on fire by a tank of diesel
On one hand I can see your gas tank analogy being correct but I may be saying this out of habit of how we have been disarming disinformation that originates from random sources the whole time we have had social media but disarming disinformation that is backed and distributed by a authoritarian regimes that have a military force and possibly assassins and other means to physically shut people up it’s a bit harder especially when you’re going against them on a platform that they control and own
Based take. Seemed we learned nothing from Trump and What-aboutism. Just because Facebook does it and doesn’t get in trouble doesn’t mean Facebook is in the right. It means you should get mad and demand change from them too.
Also I might have missed this, but didn’t everyone get mad at tiktok last or a couple of years ago for circumventing Android and Apple app policies and collecting data they shouldn’t? I though Facebook and Twitter obeyed those policies, they just had other means to collect that data.
TikTok has been known to exploit 0-days to evade the Android permissions system and escape OS sandboxing, especially on rooted and/or unlocked phones. This is one of the primary reasons it was banned from government-issued devices in the USA.
Yes, this is almost certainly it. They used the app to send a notification to users to contact their representatives about this bill. They are obviously willing to use it for political means, and their users are willing to listen. What else might they use that power to do?
Are there whataboutism arguments? Yes, many.
Has Chinese intelligence lost access to a treasure trove of US data? Yes.
Are US kids’ already dwindling attention spans going to be saved from exposure to the TikTok algorithm? Yes.
I fail to see how this is a bad thing.
Are US kids’ already dwindling attention spans going to be saved from exposure to the TikTok algorithm? Yes.
You’re pinning the blame on tiktok when this also applies to YouTube (shorts and not), Instagram (Reels), Twitter. If we wanted an actual solution here we would implement actual children screen time laws, ironically similar to the under 18 gaming laws that have been implemented in China.
Tiktok is the only platform I’ve seen legitimate progressive movement on various issues and discussions centering on what that means and takes, in a way that actually fosters a great democratic progressive movement in the US.
From all I’ve read on this issue, not a single person has provided me with any insight into what or who this benefits that does not also apply to every other social media other than an entirely fabricated myth that they’re controlling the algorithms to spread anti US sentiment. Anti-US sentiment definitely exists, but it exists as a discussion around what the US is currently doing. I.e. funding Israel, and as a counterargument to that I am also fed state department interviews on my FYP.
80% of contant on tik tok is pro Palestine compared to 20% pro Isreal. They cannot have the young generation be made aware of the world’s injustices. Thats why it was the fastest bill to pass.
You’re saying all content on TikTok is about Palestine or Israel. Math doesn’t add up.
Dude think for a moment its not hard to understand. Obviously the percentage describes the contant ratio between the two political fronts.
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This is my point when people say “it’s just getting sold, don’t worry”. Yeah I am sure after Google, FB or Steven Mnuchin’s investor group buys it I will still see all the pro Palestine stuff in my feed…
It’s the new red scare basically.
Actually, you’re right.
If we consider this normal, it would totally be acceptable for Europe to demand a ban or sale of American
spying and propaganda toolssocial media and streaming platforms. Either way, it would reduce the harm they could do - and in the case of a sale, they’d actually have to adhere to consumer friendly laws.They probably should. FB and all those other apps suck just as much.
Fucken do it.
I wish we would, but on the other hand, not being a totalitarian regime is kind of the reason why it’s better here. Damned if you you, damned if you don’t.
Protecting citizens’ interests is not totalitarian.
If it was about protecting citizens interests, PRISM would have been declared illegal and disbanded, not hushed and expanded.
PRISM is European?
I mean, they really should. Facebook, Instagram, Twitter… These are all trash.
saved from exposure to the TikTok algorithm?
I don’t understand. It will just be bought. It won’t go anywhere.
You’re the type of person to hate on China for the way they control the internet then root for the same thing to happen here.
Apples to Oranges. This isn’t about preventing TikTok users from seeing content the US deems harmful, it’s the delivery mechanism for that content is such a gaping hole of security it doesn’t even qualify as a backdoor espionage. It’s going straight through the front door to gather data illicitly for reasons unknown. Adversarial nations are marked such for good reason and not a title lightly given.
TikTok isn’t the only social media that should be banned here but I’m honestly struggling to understand why people are fighting so hard to defend it, it’s a massive data leaking engine that harvests so much more information that it needs for people to share funny fortnite dances and cat videos. That and siix months from now if the ban goes through some other app is going to pop up to fill the void while existing apps and social media platforms have already been trying to cater to the short video sharing for a long time now.
Do you have any proof of this? Or just repeating propaganda.
https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/08/tech/tiktok-data-china/index.html
CCP used tiktok data to identify and track pro-democracy protestors in Hong Kong in 2018.
That doesn’t prove a single thing you claimed. Every country does this with every social media app. I didn’t know watching peoples Tik Toks meant they owned the company.
The Red Army has had an intelligence office located directly in ByteDance headquarters, it goes without saying they’re doing more than just watching someone’s videos.
Do you think people are as uneducated as you are? Just because you eat up American propaganda doesn’t mean everyone is as dumb as you and will fall for the same lies.
Let’s declare any successful foreign country as enemy and either ban, or better, steal their products. True market.
China would certainly know a lot about stealing intellectual property from successful countries.
Right?! As well as banning social media. China has banned basically every American social media long before this.
I fail to see how this is a bad thing.
I agree with the chinese intelligence part but other than that, this is basically the government telling you how to live your life rather than letting you choose yourself. In my opinion we should be allowed to make bad choices. What’s next? Ban on sugar and mandatory excercise for everyone? Obviously I’m being hyperbolic but this is a step in exactly that direction.
What’s next? Ban on sugar and mandatory excercise for everyone?
Maybe a wall-mounted screen that would, of course, help you exercise.
Agree that the hyperbolic situations would be problematic but luckily tiktok is only one of the many social media options out there. I’d also consider that content like tiktok can be targeted at kids who arent developed enough to make the right choices yet. Taking freedom away is bad but getting hooked on tiktok is hardly a passive choice when it’s the platforms goal to keep you swiping and social influence makes it near impossible to avoid. I’d see it as a grey area when taking choices away. Like removing a lot of extra sugar from school lunches I think was already a goal, as is taking physical fitness in school. There are choices to avoid those options so it’s not a blanket ban on that opportunity, but I definitely don’t see it as a slippery slope.
There will be something new that pops up. Or the US companies out there might just buy tiktok anyways.
Good. Honestly, great! The EU should do the same. Fuck the CCP and their propaganda machine that brainwashes people all over the world!
At the moment brainwashing the youths to support Gaza, but not for long…
It’s Thursday night here has he signed yet ?
Yup. It’s signed.
Who is gonna buy it though?
No one. China already said it won’t let Bytedance sell the algorithm or code. So even if someone buys the name we’ll just get YouTube shorts under a different name.
I read a while back that Bobby Kotick was trying to drum up investors for it.
Gross.
Welp, there goes any chance of getting the zoomers to vote this year
Biden wants to ban Chinese ownership of TikTok, but Trump’s been banning raw dog fuck’n.
Choice isn’t even close.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
WASHINGTON (AP) — The Senate passed legislation Tuesday that would force TikTok’s China-based parent company to sell the social media platform under the threat of a ban, a contentious move by U.S. lawmakers that’s expected to face legal challenges and disrupt the lives of content creators who rely on the short-form video app for income.
For years, lawmakers and administration officials have expressed concerns that Chinese authorities could force ByteDance to hand over U.S. user data, or influence Americans by suppressing or promoting certain content on TikTok.
Sen. Ron Wyden, a Democrat who voted for the legislation, said he has concerns about TikTok, but he’s also worried the bill could have negative effects on free speech, doesn’t do enough to protect consumer privacy and could potentially be abused by a future administration to violate First Amendment rights.
“At the stage that the bill is signed, we will move to the courts for a legal challenge,” Michael Beckerman, TikTok’s head of public policy for the Americas, wrote in a memo sent to employees on Saturday and obtained by The Associated Press.
Since then, TikTok has been in negotiations about its future with the secretive Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States, a little-known government agency tasked with investigating corporate deals for national security concerns.
“As I started to reflect some months ago on the stresses of the last few years and the new generation of challenges that lie ahead, I decided that the time was right to pass the baton to a new leader,” Andersen wrote in an internal memo that was obtained by the AP.
The original article contains 1,165 words, the summary contains 266 words. Saved 77%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
The “wrong government is stealing your data” bill.
