You know what’s “funny”. Vegans DO fund not only alternatives but also meat subsidies with the taxes on vegan food. For meat to be as cheap as it is, a lot of tax money is going into the industry
Also, who says vegans don’t support these ventures and call people murderers at the same time. We can have both.
The screaming, raging, seething and antagonizing only serves to make people less receptive to such ventures.
Because staying quiet works way better.
Get out of here if your reason. Only pitchforks and mob violence allowed
It makes me think of that Stone Henge thing just recently. That was such a despicable shit show that people have been calling it a false flag to distance it from actual activism.
They used water soluble pigment. It’ll wash off when the rain comes. There’s no chemical reaction with the stone that could cause lasting damage. And given that it’s fucking England, I’m sure the rain has already come and washed it away. You’re getting mad over nothing.
They’re sending their most devoted, not their brightest
So you’re going to coal-roll now?
Yeah same can be said of the military industrial complex. Welcome to lemmy, most people here hate the government
This comment section gonna be spicy~
Tbh I kinda agree with you, calling someone a murderer or rapist for eating meat is overboard; however the biggest issue I have is the pretentious and self-righteous attitude that vegans have. Like, cool, you don’t eat meat, good for you! I agree that commercially raised farm animals are often abused, and that even animals raised by small, private farms don’t always get to lead their best lives.^1 At the same time though, you’re not making your cause look good.
Yes, I might honestly be a better person if I stop eating meat, dairy and buying any form of animal product; but I’m also gonna be associated with assholes with overinflated egos. I’m distanced enough from the slaughter that the overinflated ego is more of a turnoff than the slaughtering of animals.
Is that how it should be? No, but that’s how humans usually work. The object perceived to be closer is a higher priority than the object perceived to be further away. Animal slaughter is perceived as being further away than being associated with assholes, so the fear of being associated with assholes is a greater “threat” than the inhumane treatment of animals.
Be a vegan if you want, or don’t. You’re honestly probably a better, healthier person if you’re vegan (though you probably have your head up your ass about it), because your diet and spending habits are less likely to contribute to climate change, animal cruelty, and because you have to be conscious about what you eat, your food is likely healthier.
Just… Don’t be an ass about it, dude.
Instead of accusing people of being “carnists”, talk about a good (totally-not-vegan) dish you had recently. Instead of accusing people of murder, talk about the pros and cons of real leather vs faux leather.^2 Instead of telling people they’re animal rapists, talk about new sources of cow’s milk.
I swear I recently read about a technically vegan blue cheese that won and then got disqualified from a cheese competition because the milk it was made from was technically synthetic cow’s milk that had been derived from fungi or something. Talk about that shit. That is pretty fucking cool. Fungus milk that’s virtually identical to cow’s milk? That’s awesome!
Meat eating and the damage it causes is far off in most people’s rear-view mirrors, and many people don’t know or don’t have time to find ways of getting off the meat highway. They don’t know about alternatives or up-and-coming technologies related to meat substitutes. Being an ass is only going to turn people away; if you really care, then you’ll understand that you have to take people’s hands and take baby steps with them. And no, you can’t get angry when they mess up. You’re helping a baby to walk, if you get angry then they’ll just get angry, demoralized, frustrated with you or themselves, or something else, and you risk them giving up. If you actually care though, then you don’t want them to give up, and that means you have to grit your teeth and bear it when they complain about how something sucks or admit they have a “guilty pleasure” like dairy ice cream.
Some additional notes:
^1 imo meat should only be harvested from animals that have died from age-related causes. “But the meat will be too tough!” Yeah? Hispanic people figured out how to deal with that a long time ago. Make fajitas! I still eat meat anyway though, despite knowing they’re slaughtered and don’t die of old age.
^2 when it comes to leather, my experience is that natural leather lasts a lot longer than faux leather, and faux leather tends to use plastics. Additionally, I’ve heard that while “leather is a byproduct of the meat industry” is mostly a myth, it’s my understanding that there are “ethical” ways of getting leather, e.g. by taking cast-offs that’d normally be trashed, leather harvested from animals that have died from old age; you just have to be very conscious about where you’re buying leather from. I’d be curious if anyone knows about any non-petroleum-based faux or lab-grown leathers. I mean, it’s literally just skin, how hard can it really be to grow that in a lab?
I love being an annoying vegan because it was annoying vegans who made me go vegan. I was once like you, I knew the animal ag industry was fucked, but I still liked eating meat and dairy. Then eventually the cognitive dissonance caught up to me and I realised that enjoying meat and dairy wasn’t a good enough excuse to support a cruel industry that is quite literally destroying the planet.
At least you’re not in denial about what you’re supporting and you’re not spreading misinformation. I’m chill with that, but I think you’re wrong about what’s effective at converting people to veganism.
PS: people make pineapple and cactus leathers nowadays, I’ve heard of a mushroom based one, too. Not sure on how the durability and longevity compares just yet but it seems pretty tough so far. Also not sure on the processes involved and how ‘clean’ they are.
Lol, yeah, same. r/VCJ helped me go vegan too. My first time there was so confusing and anger inducing.
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How come you’re so opposed to the concept of, like, self-esteem that you think it’s worse than death? Like, someone having high self esteem is a worse thing in your emotions than something dying. Why is pride worse than death to you?
Can’t help but notice the sudden influx of downvotes for any comment that isn’t making the claim that all farmers fuck cows. It’s almost like some kind of brigade.
I already apologized to the mods here. I’ve been watching the vote counters fluctuate. I’m really sorry the nice people from shitpost are having to deal with this I just wanted a funny post.
Wait, you don’t fuck your cow?
Sorry, I can’t speak to that. I’m not a farmer.
do you think .world admins care?
Honestly no they are pretty lax but feel free to ask them
the post was in the top10 of “active” in /all, so everyone gets a vote, and it IS a topic where emotions tend to run high, regardless of stance to the topic, so thats to be expected
I’m honored, though tbh I expected this post to not be this controversial
The veganism movement is growing.
People will stop laughing at your animal abuse jokes.
It’s brigading when you don’t like their opinion.
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Whoever said that is probably a murderer and a rapist.
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Did you bother to read my comments in the relevant thread or are you speaking from a position of omnipotence?
I read the first in the list and got what’s continued in this thread to appear to be a perfectly accurate read.
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Says the same group of people who follow vegans to the ends of the earth to argue against their philosophy of treating others better
Bye! 💜
Meat eater felt threatened.
Shaking in my boots tail between my legs
https://www.lifelongvegan.org/2018/01/why-vegans-are-skinny-and-weak.html
Do not rape your meat
Stop me.
What a relevant username
I make my own ;)
Take a shower
only with you bb
I mean honestly, I think it’s way less cruel than letting it grow up in a feed lot and then forcing it through the slaughterhouse.
The best thing for a vegan to do is to keep being a vegan. Seriously, just keep on doing it.
It doesn’t mean evangelise, it doesn’t mean denigrate, it means just carry on doing what works for you.
If you’re insulting other folks, or trying to push a lifestyle, odds are folks don’t dislike you because you’re vegan.
You have no right to sacrifice victims for your life style for their body and their secretions
Your fist swinging stops the moment it touches the nose of an animal.
idk, I’m a meat eater and if it wasn’t for vegans evangelizing I really wouldn’t know how messed up meat production is. We allow some seriously cruel shit to fellow sentient beings, far beyond just killing them, and no one wants to think about it.
You definitely have a point; informing and evangelising are closer than we’d like to admit. Then again, the messenger is often as important as the message - in the case of the vegan debate too many folks choose the moral option rather than the pragmatic one.
As a species, we find it hard to empathise with the death of our own at massive scales, why would we be capable of doing it for organisms we were brought up to consider food?
However, almost all of us are on a massively reduced budget, it’d be a shame if folks shared delicious recipes that can be made cheaply and just so happen to be vegan right?
The next best thing for a non-vegan to do isn’t to switch right away, it’s to start finding vegan things you enjoy more than meat!
Eating a whole foods plant based diet is 30% cheaper
“Oxford University research has today revealed that, in countries such as the US, the UK, Australia and across Western Europe, adopting a vegan, vegetarian, or flexitarian diet could slash your food bill by up to one-third.”
“The study, which compared the cost of seven sustainable diets to the current typical diet in 150 countries, using food prices from the World Bank’s International Comparison Program, was published in The Lancet Planetary Health.”
Source: https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2021-11-11-sustainable-eating-cheaper-and-healthier-oxford-study
Sorry, best thing for a vegan to do in order to do what?
To enjoy life as a vegan?
Oh, that boat’s long since sailed, but I appreciate the thought
Sorry to hear that, I hope things start looking up in the future.
Happy trails!
Make the world a better place
This post reminded me why I had this community blocked for several months until recently.
Nooooo, because shame and insults are clearly the best ways to get people to switch over to your ideology. /s
It worked on me. I went vegan because I was ashamed of eating meat. If you’re not a vegan then I don’t think you have any perspective on what’s effective at getting people to go vegan.
so if i and enough other people think your a fool and deride you long enough because you got peer pressured and bullied into making your dietary decisions youll switch back to eating meat ?
No, you can’t make me feel guilty for not eating dead animal, it doesn’t work like that.
Ok. We’re on the prairie. There’s literally nothing here to eat but bison, though somehow you’ve got it into your head that you can eat grass. Fine, we’ll let you try for a bit until you come to your senses. Two weeks later your digestion is fucked, you’re lethargic, and we have to carry you.
You, MindTraveller, have just become a burden to the whole group, lowering all of our chances of survival, all over some so-called “principle”. I know of gods, I know of spirits, if your principles are anything like that then certainly they must be evil. Maybe shaming won’t help to drive them out, we can try other rites, but if nothing helps then we will have to leave you behind.
Why /s
/s
It worked for christianity, or any religion fir that matter. “You’re a filthy heathen and you’re not allowed the privileges of a normal human if you don’t pretend to believe in my particular set of fairytales”
Is that really what convinced people though?
Don’t imagine the folks with megaphones actually convert many folks.
By eating meat, I save vefan’s food from going extinct.
Yeah there were some animal rights people that ran out onto the field at a ballgame I was at. The fine for running onto the field is $5000. There were two of them, so that was $10,000.
TV broadcasts don’t show people that run out onto the field since they don’t want to encourage it. So the only people that saw their banner were people at the ballpark. Someone shouted “get off the field you hippies” and the whole section laughed.
They probably should’ve just donated the $10,000 to an animal shelter.
I consider myself a flexitarian, I adopt puppies, give them a good life till they’re about 2 years old, then humanely slaughter them and eat them. The stuff I don’t eat I backfeed to the next round of puppies.
I am so with this post, what I do is so much more sustainable and humane than anything that happens on a farm. Extremists harrassing me should fund lab grown meat instead. Really this is more ethical than eating beans because of crop deaths.
This is the stupidest thing I’ve ever read. It’s almost into not even wrong territory. I think you should contact a philosophy department and ask them why they haven’t considered this.
Your mistake here was saying “puppies” too early. You have to lead with a couple paragraphs of how you’re a flexitarian who has a farm and humanely raised animals like pets and then slaughters and feed them to your family.
Then list off the animals you exploit, cows, pigs, dogs, chickens, cats and ducks. Then their brain gets hit with the dissonance of “wait why did I support this and then stop the second they said ‘dog’?” That jarring experience can work for the intellectually honest type.
Saying it too early means they can categorize your post as satire easily and not engage with it at all mentally.
“wait why did I support this and then stop the second they said ‘dog’?
It’s a bad idea in general to eat predators because the higher up the food chain you go the higher the chance you’ll contract an illness. Humans are not alone at all among predators to practically only go after grazers, and not other predators. We leave the rest to carrion eaters who specialise to deal with all kinds of nasty stuff.
People thinking that this is some kind of grand ethical-philosophical argument or conundrum just shows how alienated they are from the ways of nature.
It goes to show how much we purposefully disregard the ways of nature, actually.
Moral decisions are not made on the grounds of “is this natural”? A lot of things are moral and unnatural, and a lot of things are immoral and natural. It should be incredibly easy for you to think of examples, but if you’re really struggling I can give some.
They’re orthogonal discussions.
Eh, mostly I’m just pointing out how stupid this is to anyone with half a brain in their head.
We have animal rights legislation and morals for reasons, and nobody who like protests whaling gets criticised for not growing fake whale meat. You might disagree on where the line should be but it’s just outing yourself as someone with underdeveloped theory of mind if you don’t understand why people might feel strongly about it being further down the tree of life.
Don’t farmers specifically not form bonds with the animals they intend to slaughter? Isn’t it socially acceptable to eat dogs and cats in some countries? Personally, raising your own meat and slaughtering it for consumption does indeed sound like the best way to go about it.
yes yes an yes.
Dogs have not been human food in the absurdly long time they’ve been around except for very rare occasions. This is just a stupid “point” in your stupid fucking vegan brain.
I.e, I don’t have dogs on my food list simply because they’re not a part of the normal human food ecosystem not because I have some moral objections
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It’s cool knowing this
I consider myself a flexitarian, I adopt puppies, give them a good life till they’re about 2 years old, then humanely slaughter them and eat them. The stuff I don’t eat I backfeed to the next round of puppies.
I do the puppy thing as well, but I don’t eat them (they’re nasty). I just like killing puppies.
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no one is raping cows
So you’re saying the cows in farms all consent to being impregnated by a farmer’s fist up their vagina? How? How do cows consent to handjobs?
no. I’m saying no animal has ever consented to any veterinary procedure, and that is ok. artificial insemination is not rape.
Except dairy farmers
no. no one .
Go on, chuck a few slices of bacon in the pan for me.
K
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Let me ask you this: where do you stand on shearing sheep?
EDIT: Since the user chose to ignore my question, I’ll just explain my reasoning. Many vegans consider the shearing of sheep and using of wool to be cruel, with some having ‘rape’ and ‘molestation’ narratives like those being addressed in this meme and active in this thread. Despite this, modern sheep require sheering for their health, and will become matted, heavy and overheated otherwise.
I didn’t choose to ignore anything. I just have a life outside of being an annoying vegan.
You already knew what I was going to say, though. I’m personally against wool products because they breed sheep specifically to grow unhealthy amounts of wool and once the few good coats they have in them are gone they send them off to be killed for food anyway.
Sheep can also be mistreated during the shearing process, and since shearers are often paid per sheep they’re incentivised to rush through them.
I’m not going to use the word rape here since I don’t think it applies.
Have I activated any trap cards?
There’s nothing wrong with shearing sheep if there’s no exploitation occurring. The problem is when you add a profit motive to keep breeding animals designed with their exploitation in mind.
However, I’m going to go out on limb here, and say there probably aren’t many sheep in the care of vegans except on animal sanctuaries. The important thing is to stop buying wool and funding animal exploitation.
Huh, I wonder if sheep used to grow less sool and humans just bred them for a lot of wool. Time to go research!
Edit: that is exactly what happened. Wild sheep do not grow a lot of wool.
Yes, they did. Either way, however, not shearing domestic sheep is harmful to them, and I’ve personally seen the molestation “argument” appear in response to such a statement in the past.
Someone who’s more informed might respond with something about the selective breeding. Plenty will still respond with the same energy already seen within this thread.
I think one should only be allowed to shear sheep if they’re either not breeding their sheep, or breeding them to produce more manageable coats like in the wild. Ideally our sheep population would be much lower and the animals would naturally be healthy. So people should only be allowed to extract labour value from their sheep if they’re working to reduce exploitation.
vegans are insufferable to animal abusers the way environmentalists are insufferable to climate change deniers
no one likes animal abuse
People who eat animal products support it tho
no one supports animal abuse
Except non-vegans
no. no one.
They might not like it but they sure do tolerate it happening to an animal they like the taste of and don’t actually have to see it themselves.
you tolerate it to the exact same degree. if you want to stop animal abuse, you need to go to where they are being abused and stop it.
Could have fooled me looking at this thread
I will. I plan on enjoying it. I hope you recognize that I’m doing this at your behest, equivalent to you eating the meat.
Also, have you ever considered that some people know where their meat comes from and know that it’s not being kept in horrible conditions? I don’t really care that it’s dying to feed me. Plants die to feed me too.
I’m not going to get into the environmental aspect as I know that veganism is better for the environment, but just shifting away from factory farmed red meat would be a huge positive change and then you don’t even piss off the majority of the population (that see you as a self-righteous shithead) :)
Obviously I’d prefer it if you didn’t eat animals but I’m actually chill with just being more mindful about what you support. If you’re going out of your way to try and minimise the harm you’re doing then that’s better than most people.
And at least you recognise the environmental harm. The only thing that really annoys me is people lying about these things.
There’s this great game on the internet called Half Earth Socialism. The idea is the earth has converted to a single socialist government, and you get to be president of Earth for life. Can you save the earth from climate change without losing popular support and being coup’ed?
A lot of people say they failed this game because it’s too hard. But I didn’t, I won on the first try. One of the biggest things I did in the game was make meat eating illegal. It was a really hard policy to push and I lost a lot of support with my constituents, I nearly got ousted. But then pollution started going down, temperature slowed its rise, extinction went down, biodiversity went up, and everyone was happier. Within a few years my approval rating was back up and then some. I also banned cars and it was the same effect.
What I’m saying is your meat should be illegal.
