No wonder they’re more worried about climate change /s
Oh boy… cue up all the “Grrrrr America bad!” comments.
Lets see if we can play Lemmy Anti-America Bingo…
They’ll be comments that American homes are supposedly worse quality than European ones by people that don’t understand construction or economics.
Americans are wasteful.
Someone will mention European windows.
Post from people who misunderstanding thermal mass.
Lots of people forgetting what humidity is.
All the kneejerk “America is bad” people from reddit are here
Are you suggesting that the things you mention are not true? There’s probably a reason why people keep mentioning them, no?
No matter what, we are all in the climate crisis together, and everyone, including Americans, must do everything we can to make better choices when it comes to climate.
There’s probably a reason why people keep mentioning them, no?
Shouldn’t you be mentioning them to the Germans and the Swedes, since the former uses the same drywall Americans do and the latter builds with wood? We get bitched at but never them, so it’s not actually about the materials.
You guys have never seen a window screen before and politely assume there’s no real-world reason they’re needed here. The answer is bugs. LOTS of bugs. Diseased bugs. Putrid bugs that breed like hell. Bugs who spray you with little drops of acid. Those don’t exist where you live, so you have neat windows.
I agree that we’re supposed to be in this shit together. It’s fucking maddening that every time a disaster happens in Europe, it feels like the majority of us empathize with you guys, but the second half an opportunity arises here, Europeans point and laugh. Often about things they don’t fully get or that were their fault to begin with.
What? I live in Germany, I have window screens and the neat windows. Do you think you can’t but bug screens on a European window?
I live in the States. Well aware of the bugs. There are bugs in Europe, too. Just FYI.
But that’s not the point. Americans still have to do a lot more. A mindset change is needed when it comes to climate.
Have you ever been in a typical, modern European house?
Sadly (for the US), on average every single point on your list is true.
Just look at the places in the US hit by catastrophes. Basically, nothing but maybe foundations remain. If there is a fire, they usually add their mass to the fire instead of resisting. If a fire actually reaches a European town the damage is quite lower than what can be regularly seen of in the US.
And yes, Americans are wasteful. In so many regards, it is not funny. Living in suburbia and driving gas guzzling trucks where a normal car would more than suffice are just two examples.
European windows (and the general thermal isolation of houses in Europe) are way better at keeping cold and heat separated than even the better insulated cardboard boxes Americans call “houses”.
Do you understand Q = Cth Δ T?
And most Europeans deal better with humidity (and heat) because they are used to it.
No you’ve got your bingo card full, go home and whine.
As someone who struggled to sleep in sweat soaked sheets in a small hotel in France can they at least give you a fan?
Too dangerous. Could cause fan death
Korea has entered the chat
You could use a fan, sleep without a blanket or sleep hugging a water-filled water bottle. The latter two is what I generally do on warm days (or use a really thin sheet if it is not too warm). Also keep the windows open at night so the house can cool down before the sun rises and starts irradiating your walls and roof.
They don’t need it. Saves energy
Yeah, until recently we didn’t need it.
hotter weather literally everywhere more often says you are a purposefully obtuse buffoon
That’s how they keep Americans away
Man, when you’re in the high 90s, with humidity in the same numbers, it doesn’t matter how high your ceilings are, how much airflow you have under the house and through the attic, it sucks. And by sucks, I mean it can kill people sometimes.
Growing up here in the south, we didn’t have AC until somewhere in the late eighties, and that was a big window unit. Most days during the summer, you had no ability to do much of anything without suffering. After the window unit, we could at least eat dinner without being nauseous from heat.
This house didn’t have central air until 2003, when I put it in after I made a small bundle selling a book. I will never fucking go back to not having it. We keep it set fairly warm unless my wife is having trouble (MS fucks your ability to thermoregulate, and getting overheated can cause problems that can last weeks), but it simply isn’t realistic to do without it.
I have no clue what Europe is like in terms of summer weather patterns. But the south has these old houses like ours that are built to make the weather as livable as possible, and they don’t really succeed any more.
If I had the money, I’d likely switch to a heat pump, but I don’t, so oh well.
And that’s not even going into the extra expenses that come without AC of some kind. You get the heat and humidity going, and mold becomes a guarantee rather than a possibility. Wood warps, and stuff like plaster or drywall don’t exactly enjoy the humidity either.
Plenty of AC in Greece, per room split units not central.
Splits with heat pumps are more efficient anyway. The fancy ones with ceiling cassettes seem easier to install and maintain too, with zonal temp controls for even better efficiency.
Sure but most of them do not have heat pumps here.
You sure, because I’m pretty sure like 90% of AC in Europe is probably heat pumps because it doesn’t make sense for them not to be. It doesn’t change the cost at all, it functions the same like if you just used cooling.
I know at least that every AC I checked here in Croatia was a heat pump.
I was probably thinking of ground heat pumps.
Everyone has AC(often more than one), but noone has any money to pay for the electricity to use the AC. So many people dont use them or only use them for a couple of hours.
This is the main reason according to my European friends. The electricity cost is the issue.
In the last years the max temps during the summer months in southern Germany have significantly risen - often over 30 C. I just moved into a new house here that fulfills the latest energy efficiency standards (kfw55) and am surprised how well it also insulates against heat. With a recuperating air ventilation system it’s pretty bearable without active cooling.
I look after holiday properties in Europe, all new and highly insulated. I tell every guest to open their windows at night, then close everything they can during the day when they’re out. It’s how the locals have been doing it for centuries and it’s now far more effective. It’ll keep the cool air in the house as well as it keeps the heat in in winter
Tell this to 80% of guests, they have a lovely holiday
Tell it to Brits or yanks, they phone up 3 days later screeching like fuckin infants because their chalet is a boiling cauldron of flies because of course they knew better than some pesky local
Brits don’t know how to handle heat at all. We open all our windows during the day and let all the hot air in, and then complain about the house being too hot at night. We also like to open the windows on air conditioned trains and buses so we can complain about the air con not working.
It’s purely down the not understanding and not having to understand how to manage heat and that our houses are terribly insulated. We’re an island of clouds and rain.
Usually the people who live in good quality new-builds get it (Probably also cos they’re mortgaged up to the fuckin eyeballs and can’t afford to switch on the air con at home) 😂
Where i am right now it the middle of the night and 30c . not exactly letting a lot cool air in in those conditions
It’s almost as though different areas have different climates
I’m in the UK and I am currently buying a house, I looked at hundreds and the one I am buying is the only one with built in AirCon, Only to 1 room though. It really is rare here, I have a portable unit but it isn’t that good, I think these are what many people have but actual built in air conditioning is in my experience very rare.
It’s expensive to add and the cost is per room… plus portable isn’t that bad for the couple of weeks of actual warm weather.
I can’t even have portable as I have no opening windows in the main room… would have to fix that first. Luckily insulation works both ways and it doesn’t really get that hot in here yet.
What is the average age for a house there? I’m guessing the cost of central air installation (duct work) vs sticking a window unit in is the issue. Then there is the cost of electricity so just cooling one room at a time will be cheaper.
They are often quite old… http://www.historicdoors.co.uk/blog/englands-building-age-infographic/
The older ones (Like the one I am selling) are built like big heat sinks, The intention is that you always have the coal fire burning in the day I think and the whole building stays warm over night. However in the very warm weather we get now these houses are not so great.
It wouldn’t surprise me if that changes over the next few years.
Two different climates too. USA is centred closer to the equater then all of Europe, which means more people live in year round heat, and want A/C to cool off.
Right? People forget this all the time and say “just open a window you baby” bitch it’s been 100+ (37c) every day for three months here, %50 humidity minimum. Our overnight lows are your daytime temps.
Even water temps in bays in FL have been pushing to 100F
Gulf Stream
Gulf stream, more water around countries which evens out temperature changes, more insulation which prevents heat from getting in, more massive construction generally which also helps moderate temperature changes, and we probably have better building codes in general so stuff like ventilation doesn’t make things worse by letting the cold out.
Aren’t heat pumps a cleaner, better alternative to traditional AC?
A heat pump is just an air conditioner that works both ways (it can pump heat into or out of your house).
In the US, most people just buy air conditioners because natural gas furnaces cost less to operate than heat pumps.
The move to renewables and rooftop solar is making heat pumps more attractive than the conventional AC + furnace, but nothing about a heat pump is more efficient than an AC in the summer because they are fundamentally the same thing.
Where heat pumps are a big efficiency win is in places without natural gas. Assuming your winter weather doesn’t get too cold, pumping outside heat into your house uses substantially less electricity than resistive heating.
Yes. And many homes in Europe have them. US term for them are split AC systems.
Heat pumps ARE AC. Also your fridge.
And (multi-)split wall mounted ACs are among the most efficient heat pumps as well with SCOPs above 4.5. It’s frustratingly little-known or talked about (in central Europe anyway), because these devices would also be a much cheaper and more efficient heat-pump upgrade for older buildings that don’t have low temp supply-water heating and would normally need to be completely gutted to install floor heating or large radiators.
While being the cheapest, AC is also the type of heating with the least amount of comfort, while the most expensive solution, underfloor or wall heating is the best comfort. Radiant heat is much less intrusive than blowing air around violently.
You can install heat exchange unit. It will work as AC to cool you down and it will also heat your water and underfloor system. More advanced units can also be supplemented by gas/electricity when heat pump part is not effective (usually on very cold days).
That being said I think it also has its perks like the forced convection heats up a cold room much quicker and in a bathroom it assists drying surfaces or clothing on a drying rack (to stick with European customs). Meanwhile floor heating is extremely slow with some annoying side effects like it basically doesn’t react to noon sun shining into a room and heating it up or stuff like that.
But I’m not going to argue that comfort wise floor heating is far superior.
I agree. One thing I’d like to add: There are also low thermal mass floor heating systems available nowadays (usually dry, built on top of a layer of Insulation). These aren’t that slow to react. But of course, these bring not only advantages but also drawbacks.
Air Heat pumps are AC.
There are different types which uses earth or water body heat and are even more efficient but expensive.
Technology wise they are AC though
The technology behind them works exactly the same, only that usually the direction of heat transport is reversed. So at least the “cleaner” part depends largely on the chemicals used, not whether it’s an AC unit or a central heat pump.
Thanks everybody for your input 😉 Now I know the differences!
I just sweat and let it get up to 87⁰F+ in here. I’m doing my part.
Meanwhile my friend runs her ac and then sits under a blanket in her apartment.
Jeez. I can do 83, but 87 is way to warm.
Most people’s bodies will adapt with time. 87F is where I start to noticing it being warm, where 6 months ago that would have been like 80F
deleted by creator
Been getting 87/88F in my apartment during the day. Run the AC at night tho.
It may actually be better to set your AC to a highish temp like 81-82 so that it keeps it at that level without running non stop. If the house is 89-90 it takes a very long time and uses a great deal of energy to cool the air down. Maintaining a tolerable temperature can actually help conserve energy in many cases. Obviously you do you and all systems are different but could be worth trying!
The exchange of heat is proportional to the temperature difference. It will always take more energy to keep that gap wider between inside and out. The most energy efficient thing you can do is to deal with the outside temp as much as you can bear it and keep that inside/outside differential as low as possible
There you go, said better/more clearly.
I don’t think wwwbdd is agreeing with you. You’re suggesting keeping a huge temperature gap all day. I’m just turning on my AC when the temperature outside has already dropped, so I maintain a relatively constant gap. Using the AC only at night uses a lot less electricity (at the cost of it being warming until that point). If you keep it cool during the day, more heat gets in, which means more energy waste to cool it.
Closest thing I can find to a reputable source (not a random blog post, most of which say turning it off during the day saves power):
Jennifer Thorne Amann, MES, buildings program director for the American Council for an Energy-Efficient Economy (ACEEE). While it may seem like your unit has to work hard to cool a space down from 80 to 75 degrees, “air-conditioning systems run most efficiently when they’re running at full speed,” rather than running for shorter periods at a less
I know the same is true for car engines. They’re least efficient when warming up and running at low effort. They’re more efficient when working hard.
I’ve been running my mobile unit (in Germany) yesterday just to dry the air. It didn’t cool, the living room was even a bit warmer than the rest of the apartment, but it was so much better.
Climate change has joined the chat
Huh. I’m in the 12% of something
