Even gamers nexus’ Steve today said that they’re about to start doing Linux games performance testing soon. It’s happening, y’all, the year of the Linux desktop is upon us. ᕕ(ᐛ)ᕗ
Edit: just wanted to clarify that Steve from GN didn’t precisely say they’re starting to test soon, he said they will start WHEN the steam OS releases and is adopted. Sorry about that.
Powered by Steamos and Stamos are not to be mixed up
Every game I bought on Steam under Windows runs great on Steam in Linux Mint. The few games I didn’t buy on Steam (Deus Ex, Giants: Citizen Kabuto) run great on Wine, using the default settings.
Adopting Proton was the smartest thing Valve ever did. They’re going to get about 90% of gamers migrating from Windows to Linux, who don’t want to fiddle with configuration settings.
The only bastion left is anticheat. Everything else are just (bad) old habits fueled by marketing.
…and VR. VR is already finicky on its own, gaming on Linux can be finicky in different ways, and the issues multiply if you have two things like that.
Tends to depend on the headset you own, some work perfectly. Also, Valve is very likely releasing a headset based on SteamOS, which should help.
I work in VR, I play in VR, including Windows games, all on Linux. No specific problem for me on that front.
Anti-cheat systems already have to make changes, since Microsoft have plans to significantly restrict kernel mode access after the major Crowdstrike issues earlier in the year. Kernel mode code is very invasive, difficult to get correct, and can result in major security holes or stability issues if not written correctly.
A bug in userland code may crash that one app. A bug in kernel mode code can (and often does) cause bluescreens, that people blame Microsoft for. I’m sure they’re tired of being blamed for buggy code written by other companies.
Running the anti cheat code in userland will (in theory) make it easier to run on other OSes too.
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Thanks Steve
This could lead to some sort of controlling mechanism that will check if your OS is actually SteamOS, otherwise some kind of DRM would prevent you from playing online for example. I’m wary.
Also people are forgetting that gaming isn’t the only thing people use their computers for. They are convenience devices. They want to game on the PC they also use for other things. They will not switch for gaming only. Companies who sell software will see this and start piling on their controlling mechanisms, tracking, … More proprietary things will come, I mean games already are, and they are not in the spirit of Linux.
I’m bad at expressing my thoughts, but I hope you understand what I’m trying to say.
You meant “wary”. Weary means tired. Wary means suspicious.
It didn’t feel right when I wrote it, but English isn’t my first language. Thanks!
No problem; it’s a common English mistake, even for native speakers.
Not really. The “control mechanism” is already in place for games that rely on Steam’s infrastructure for their online functionality.
Yes, but that’s not what i mean, i mean other non steam software. Software developers will follow wherever users will go. And they will bring their mechanisms to protect their proprietary software.
I don’t understand this tbh. It’s here already. SteamOS will likely be just like the deck - immutable arch running the existing steam package.
You can totally do this today and it works great. Don’t want to mess with arch and that confusing command line? Use something easier like mint and install the flatpak - then you don’t even have to futz with nvidia drivers. Or use bazzite?
What does steamOS offer that we don’t already have? (Serious question)
these people need permission from a massive corporation calling it something other than Linux so they can dodge the cognitive dissonance of hating Linux
Or rather, there’s someone who isn’t going away anytime soon and someone who you can go to if their shit screws up, someone with an actual address and support number, and it’s not just a Github issue tracker page that hasn’t been seen by the owner in months.
Some people want that peace of mind. Some people aren’t built to scour the internet for hours to maybe find solutions to their problems.
I’m confused, do you think Canonical, RedHat or SUSE are going away in the near future? Or that they don’t have support?
Or that they don’t have support?
Not specifically the whole Linux/Proton/Game stack. That’s Valve’s bread and butter, not Canonical or Redhat.
Go ahead, call Redhat and tell them you can’t get Skyrim to run, see how far that gets you.
Are you trying to imply having an “official SteamOS” means you will be able to call Valve to have them troubleshoot your game? Because you can’t do that with the current official SteamOS on the Steam Deck. I don’t think you thought this through.
https://help.steampowered.com/en/wizard/HelpWithSteamDeck. There is a live agent option too for customized help.
I wouldn’t buy a $500 device where the manufacturer guarantees certain games to work but then doesn’t help me get them working if I need them.
Welp, good thing I didn’t have dinner because I have to eat my words now.
…do people really do that with Microsoft, or do they just throw the errant device in a closet and get a new one at best buy?
They do, yes. /srs
You’re thinking of Mac users. /j
I think it’s mostly a matter of having it preinstalled.
The perception is that if it’s pre installed, then it is designed for the device.
A few things:
- It gives manufacturers a blueprint for their devices. You will see a lot of handhelds running SteamOS from different manufacturers. You will also see a lot of small “gaming boxes” with SteamOS to plug in your TV. That’s great!
- Game Developers will have one distribution to test their games on. One of the bigger problems linux had before SteamOS was the big clusterfuck of different distros. Great for users, but a big headache if you’re developing for it. Now you can say “it runs on SteamOS”, test on SteamOS and you don’t have to deal with bug reports from people running RedStarOS
- It’s Valve. It’s a company. They are the biggest store selling games and they are building their moat to protect themselves against Microsoft, Apple, Epic & Co. That not exactly great for users, but also explains why Valve is doing this linux push. To prevent Microsoft from abusing their Windows monopoly to crush them
I don’t agree with number 2. Ubuntu had always been the ““default”” when Linux was the target. They must be scrambling at Canonical right now.
New to the Linux community here; why is a valve owned Linux OS better than any other massive company OS. Like if Microsoft released their own Linux OS, would it be good suddenly?
At the end of the day, we don’t want our OS’s big company owned right?
Because valve is a private company. They don’t have to answer to shareholders. That means, they don’t go through enshitifaction, they care about their product and their customers. Are they perfect? Absolutely not, are they good? Better than every single company out there that tries to be like them. Period.
I’m glad people bring this up.
Private companies are not intrinsically better than public ones, but at least they have the capacity to be.
Valve is one of the very few examples of a company that sees the value in working with customers, not against them. This would be impossible if Valve were publicly-traded.
Exactly. They’re (as far as I know) the only company that emailed me to tell me that I can take to court directly without an arbitration. Not that I’ll ever be able to afford it, but seeing how confident and pro-consumer (I fucking hate the word consumer lol) they are is amazing.
To be fair, that was in their own financial best interest. Since arbitrations are charged a fee per customer someone figured out that you can do an effective “class action” against valve by having many people submit the same arbitration claim against valve and costing them so much through the arbitration fees that it it was almost impossible for them to cone out on top regardless of the outcome of the arbitration (iirc).
They changed to allowing lawsuits because they can request those to be merged, and therefore its cost-effective for them to fight them.
Since arbitrations are charged a fee per customer someone figured out that you can do an effective “class action” against valve by having many people submit the same arbitration claim against valve and costing them so much through the arbitration fees that it it was almost impossible for them to cone out on top regardless of the outcome of the arbitration (iirc).
It’s not even that they’d have to pay for it; usually the filing party has to pay. Valve tried to be the good guys and while they did push for arbitration they said that they’d pay your arbitration fee for you, basically allowing you to file a legal complaint against them at their expense.
And then some fucking legal company figured out it’s a neat loophole on how to bleed them through arbitration where the point isn’t really the result but the costly process. Guess that’ll teach Valve to try to be better than others. :|
It’s way easier to move from one Linux distro to another if Valve starts enshittifying SteamOS (which would really suck) than it is to move from Windows to Linux. Either way this is a good stepping stone that’s well supported.
SteamOS is better than, for example, macOS and Windows because of licenses.
Since you’re new (welcome!), I should let you in on a little secret: pretty much the entire free software movement is built around licensing. I know, it’s boring and seems insignificant. But the outcomes are profound.
Because SteamOS is built to function within the free software ecosystem, it means users are never beholden to the decisions of one centralized entity (usually the company that owns the software patents.)
If Valve ever decides to, say, include candy crush ads in SteamOS’ start menu (they’d have to make their own start menu, since right now SteamOS uses one that’s already made by the free software community), then users can choose to remove that part of the menu or replace the menu altogether without having to start from scratch.
For wealthy people who can always pay the “proprietary tax,” this might seem like a non-issue. Practically speaking, these people only want their software to work without hassle. They don’t care about the true cost of that software, such as only one entity being able to modify/distribute the software. It’s not until, say, photoshop starts charging a subscription (which they can always increase the price of) that people start to see the value in free software and the importance of licensing.
Valve dosnt really “own” SteamOS. They maintain and update SteamOS, but SteamOS is free and open source
Plus just about everbody who knows anything about valve would tell you they are probably the most consumer friendly billion dollar company ever, and have been for decades. So yes even if they owned it like microsoft owns windows it would still be better
Like IBM and Red Hat!
And you saw how that turned out for them…😂
Because it’s open source and based on the Linux kernel. It’s owned by them but you can do what you want with it. You can’t with Windows.
So if a game works on the Steam OS, it works on pretty much any distro
I game with Steam on Linux, but I’m not using Steam OS
Also, that means that every effort made by Valve to improve compatibility is beneficial to everyone.
Edit: Also, even if it were closed source, I think it would still be good as it gives us alternatives to Windows. But
I am not gonna use SteamOS. But if a bunch of regular folk do, then it might convince peripheral and game makers it’d be worth putting in a modicum of effort to support linux. That’s why I’m excited for SteamOS.
Like if Microsoft released their own Linux OS, would it be good suddenly?
It’s worth noting that steamOS, like any Linux distro has its issues and a bit of a learning curve. Especially if you want to go off the beaten track, it’s pretty much just using a stock arch distro.
As for if MS switched to Linux, no it wouldn’t be good because the issues with Win11 overwhelmingly aren’t a matter of incompetence or anything inherent to the code, but of conscious anti-consumer business decisions. There’s nothing about Linux that would actively stop MS from cramming telemetry, bloat, etc. In their distro.
Not answering your comment directly, and I don’t even use Linux, BUT…
One reason a lot of us don’t use Linux even if we really want to us because it’s biggest strength is also one of its biggest weaknesses, that being it’s modularity.
There isn’t a single packaging system, window manager, file system, shell, etc etc.
This makes it hard for companies (and devs in general) to target Linux for releases. For example you want to release something for Windows, you build a single exe, apple is a dmg (I think) etc so you just build for one single platform with a consistent API.
When you want to build for Linux there can’t be just one build/package. This has actively been cited as reasons why some commercial software doesn’t support Linux, as it takes far more effort to support all major permutations of platform and package management.
So back to your question, why is Valve’s Steam OS going to help? Because it’s going to be a single platform with a single way of doing things. You can always go and replace the bits like any Linux distro but out the box it will be easy enough for vendors to support, it will hopefully also get more adoption because it has commercial support.
Look at Android as an example (I know it’s not entirely the same), but that is just a customised version of Linux, but as it’s consistent and has a single way to manage packages it’s widely adopted.
I am pretty sure Linus himself said how one of the reasons why Linux desktop doesn’t have mass adoption is because no one can agree on how things should be done, so we have hundreds of libs all doing the same thing in a different way. Valve will pick what they think is best (even if it isn’t technically the best) and through that we all have a singular point of effort and adoption to centralise on.
The source is always free so you could fork it if you disagree with them. Also it means broader support for Linux gaming
Microsoft is deeply entrenched and has undergone decades of enshittification. SteamOS is at only the beginning of this cycle. And since SteamOS is linux-based, it’s likely to have ramifications for the whole GNU/Linux ecosystem. Furthermore, if there are two vastly different OSes that developers and graphics card manufacturers need to seriously target, they’re more likely to write more platform-agnostic software that everyone can benefit from.
If it’s like the steam deck version, it’ll be based on Arch with a bunch of steam-specific patches/configs to make games run more easily (with the added bonus of making non-steam games run pretty well too). Steam exists to sell games, and if they want to make it easier for me to play games, that’s fine by me.
Not sure what a Microsoft distro would look like, but if they make a distro that’ll run Xbox games with gamepass, I’d give it a shot.
Another nice bonus for either/both of those situations is that it wouldn’t be too hard to incorporate those changes into other distros. That way people who want more of an “install and go” experience would have their official distros, people who like to tinker could work on importing the official code into their unofficial setup, and people who use arch btw can install it from the AUR.
the biggest wall imo is still getting companies with anticheat games on board.
I’d rather kick them off the boat.
It’s true that a big slice of gamers play games with anti-cheat solutions that don’t work on linux. That said most of those aren’t even on steam, which is the biggest pc game marketplace, so I’m not sure it’s that big of a dealbreaker for that many people.
you don’t have to onsider off platform titles on its own. just take proton DBs list and sort by playercount and youll have your handful of misses on some of the top currently played titles. that already filters the non steam games already, and it still has its small handful of titles not on board yet.
i have faith this will be resolved eventually/they will have to admit kernel anticheat isn’t even meaningfully more effective and give up on it. anyway loads of people don’t play multiplayer AAA so it’s a no brainer already for them. as the mass of people migrating continues to grow devs/publishers hopefully will have to catch up. 2% of the steam hardware survey is linux now, it could be 5% within the decade. that’s my optimistic outlook, i know i shouldn’t underestimate how out of touch the epic games suits etc. are though
It will be the opposite. Even Microsoft hates kernel-level anti-cheat.
“Cant have those TenCent CCP botnets sniffing the same customers WE’RE sniffing! Get outta here!”
–M$, prolly lol
I wonder why they dont like people fucking around with the kernel
I’m sure it starts with C and ends with “Strike”.
Oohh, counter strike.
Uhhhh, sure, I guess.
Let’s be honest here, they only care because when someone inevitably fucks up, people will think the fault is with windows.
It kind of is Windows’ fault for letting them fuck about in kernel space though, right?
They’ll come around when the userbase increases. We live in a capitalist world, and these fuckers will always follow the money. They have zero principles, they just want the money.
That will be more likely as more people start using SteamOS.
If SteamOS can get enough users, then not supporting it will start to hurt the game developers profits.IMO, no one should be playing games with kernel level anticheat. There is no way I would let any big gaming company have that level of control over my PC. It’s a security nightmare.
sadly theres a line between shouldn’t and how the market responds to it. Regardless of the fact, it is a hurdle, and the reason why not all of the top games on the concurrent player list on steam is playable on SteamOS, whether one likes it or not.
If gamers were buying in their best interest nintendo would be bankrupt, there is what gamers should do and there is the real world. The sad reality is that only the low end gamers care about vanguard and they aren’t paying the bills in riot
I wouldn’t say it has anything to do with the financial affluence of the gamer, but I agree with you that the vast vast majority of gamers simply do not care. Like with a lot of things, that same majority would be better off if they did.
I wonder if Valve will eventually offer their own system of checks similar to Google Play Integrity? I don’t think I’d care for it since it’s an invasion of personal choice on a device that you own, but for people who want to play competitive games with cheating problems, running a partition with integrity checking seems a fair trade.
Yeah you can do most of that server side but they don’t want to pay for it. Why pay when your players let you coop their machine for free or even better yet pay you for the privilege. Also player run dedicated servers would fix all of this. Don’t like the cheaters movement servers. Own the server ban them. We had this working just fine in the 90s.
I would imagine it wasn’t that large scale back then. I wasn’t in the 90s so I wouldn’t know. But some games with player servers are filled with extremely triggering names and env, if you know what I mean. I’d rather prefer the current matchmaking.
The tick was to find your sever. With Quake 2 and Team Fortress Classic. You would find a server that meshed with the community that fit you and you would go to that server. You got to know the players that would come back over and over. It was a micro community in the larger community of the game. You became a regular sometimes were even giving mod rights very much like a lemmy community. Yeah there were asshats just like there is on here but you just don’t engage with them.
Hell back when quake 2 was in heat.net we would just hang out and chat in the lobby. When playing mechwarrior 2 they had clan websites and we would battle other clans in brackets. I started in that clan by just random showing up in that lobby and someone was nice and taught me how to account for lag when targeting other mechs.
It takes a little more work to find or create your community but once you do it’s so much better than the company directed dull experience. Stuff like surf servers in counterstrike or bombing run basketball servers in unreal tournament would not exist without player controlled dedicated servers.
Also scale didn’t mater since it was decentralized like lemmy is. The company didn’t have that much control of what players did with their severs. That’s what this is what this is all about control. They want to make sure you see what they want you to see to buy that cosmetic to feel fomo. To play how they want you to play. So emergent gameplay almost never happens anymore.
If it’s an immutable system, it should be easier to ensure system integrity IMO.
After that huge “Salt Typhoon” hack against major telecoms, you’d think people would take “security nightmare” a little more seriously!
Truth is though, your average Valorant/League/Whatever player probably isn’t even aware of it running when they smash through ok -> ok -> agree -> yep -> accept -> accept -> ok -> play.
Any kernel-level anything connected to major corporate servers should be scary and taboo, but except for the alarm-raisers who know what they’re talking about, most people don’t even understand the implications.
I’m glad Steam is at least marking a big “This game requires kernel level anti cheat” on store pages now. It looks ugly, possibly scary, so maybe that’ll raise some awareness and make developers not want to go with it.
The reason why I can’t try Marvel Rivals with friends.
Fuck kernel-level software from commercial companies, though!
? rivals works fine on my machine on Nobara. it has a Linux compatible anti-cheat.
Hm? It wasn’t very click-and-play on Bazzite before, and areweanticheatyet.com listed it as broken.
I see it’s updated to Running (though not Supported)
I’ll have to try this weekend, it seemed fun!
protonDB is my go-to and most people on there seem to be having a pretty smooth experience with it! it is fun!
It does often feel like as soon as a significant hurdle is overcome, the industry just makes another one.
Hopefully SteamOS/Steam on Linux gets enough traction to force publishers to reconsider.
And with every step it’s getting better. 10 years ago almost no games were natively supported and you needed to fuck around a lot to start anything with wine and most didn’t work anyway. Nowadays everything just works, and the only category of games that doesn’t is that slop with kernel level anticheat.
The improvement was monumental.
Or getting players & friends to stop playing those types of games when there are so many compatible games to choose from.
To anyone reading this thinking “once SteamOS comes out, I’ll switch”, you should know:
Gaming on Linux is already here. Pick a distro and game. You can take advantage of Proton right now. You don’t need to wait for one specific distro.
I’ve personally been gaming on Linux exclusively for about 3 years. Windows games, not Linux games.
Edit: based on other commenters’ suggestions, I’ll give you some.
I have gamed for those three years on PopOS. It is a distro based on Debian, ultimately, which means it’s also related to Ubuntu and Mint. Realistically, you can pick any of those 4 and you should have a nice experience.
Arch is popular with the übergeeks, and I do use it on my laptop, BTW, but you shouldn’t use it as a first distro.
The concept of “distro” doesn’t really exist for Windows, because you pretty much get one monolithic product. But basically, it is a specific mix of software that works together and relies on the Linux kernel. Imagine it as a “version” of Windows with specific goals, some of which are overlapping (e.g. Mint and Ubuntu tend to cater to the same audience).
If you get far enough into it, the freedom that Linux allows means that you can turn any distro into any other distro.
“Pick a distro” is why they’re waiting for steamos, presumably.
This is fair. I should have given my own suggestions.
Mint is probably the choice at the moment for new folks. Also, this will be controversial, but feel free with Ubuntu. It will get you started, and that’s great.
Edit: I added some (open-ended) suggestions to my original comment.
I actually think mint is a terrible choice for beginners because it’s not kde, which is by far the best for windows people, and it isn’t immutable, which is a gamechanger for not having to maintain your system
I see the point about KDE, though I don’t think the learning curve on Cinnamon is hefty. I also think that KDE being so configurable can seem overwhelming to new folks.
As someone who gives kde to new folks all the time, most of them never configure anything and this isn’t a real problem any of them face. I mostly give this to the elderly and tech illiterate.
I think that is perfectly valid and I’ll happily recommend steamos to newcomers. I’m only a little worried about it being locked to flatpaks by default though. Hopefully that will change, but for most users it will be a good start.
Locked to flatpaks? aren’t they worried about the disk space?
The marginal extra disk spaces used by flatpak really isn’t a concern for most users, much less valve. If you do everything in flatpak and your apps only use current runtime versions, the additional space used by flatpak is in the megabytes, since libraries like libc are going to be on your host no matter what.
One flatpak uses a lot of extra disk space, but for each additional flatpak you add to a system the disk space difference is much smaller because they share dependencies. When it’s system-wide for all user-installed packages, the difference is quite small.
I was under the impression the didn’t shared dependencies thus eating space.
They don’t share dependencies with the base system, but they do share dependencies with each other, so long as those dependencies are at the same version, which most of them are because flatpaks generally stay quite up to date.
locked to flatpaks by default makes sense long-term, I think.
Might be a little difficult in the beginning though.
I wouldn’t say SteamOS for new folks, tbh. Flatpaks are very different from the typical Linux flow.
The typical linux flow is not important to learn for most and flatpak is easier for the vast majority of people to understand and deal with
furthermore flatpak is rapidly becoming the typical linux flow
Some game developers (AGS) won’t turn on EAC for their games (Lost Ark).
Sons is mostly playing Valorant right now on Windows 11. I’m an old dude familiar with FreeBSD, and Debian. No clue about running games and stuff though. Would he be able to switch?
edit: thanks for the insight. Sounds like a no-go for now until anti-cheat stuff is supported outside windows.
Some Competitive Multiplayer games that generally “just work” and perform well under Linux/Proton: Insurgency Sandstorm, Hunt Showdown, Hell Let Loose, Dead by Daylight, Battlebit
Yes, anti-cheat specifically is a problem. That’s you fighting against the corpos, to be clear. Not really an issue with gaming on Linux itself.
Edit: not only against the corpos, but more generally against the idea of “kernel-level anti-cheat”. If you’re giving any corporation kernel-level access to your machine, you basically no longer control your machine. That’s true of Windows too.
It’s a big issue and the lack of support on Linux is a bit of a feature, not really a bug.
It’s the only category of games that doesn’t work, they use kernel windows modules for anti-cheat and they don’t have any plans to support
To be 100% honest, probably not, and you may need to confirm with someone who knows Valorant. The big issue is anti-cheat, the detectors in use for major multiplayer games tend to lose their minds when they see Linux as they’re typically only built for Windows. Other than anti-cheat, it wouldn’t surprise me if it played better on Linux. Some of the low level magic has improved a lot in recent years, but official support is mandatory for multiplayer.
No riot game works on linux
Given their rivalry with Valve (I’m sure Riot see it as a rivalry at least, Valve probably don’t) I wouldn’t put it past Riot to want to avoid SteamOS and Linux by extension until significant market share is available.
Tbh the vast majority of people who say “ill switch to (insert Linux distro here) when (insert accomplishment here)” will most likley never switch
Fair enough. I tend to agree, but I like to give people the benefit of the doubt, because, you know, FOSS and freedom.
Hell yeah.
I’ll switch when 10 finally dies, they state Oct 2025 but if even less people go to 11 they won’t really have a choice but to keep 10 up and running. Make 10 the last Windows OS ever. Never go to 11.
But… Why not now? I can’t think of a single reason.
Personally, my last holdout on my desktop is VR, and I’d rather not dual boot.
My laptop has been running Linux for years now, although I’ve been having some issues with it lately, possibly due to repeated in-place upgrades, so I’ve been thinking of switching away from mint to a rolling release distro. Although, I have to say, NixOS’s philosophy is really compelling.
I have a friend that regularly games in VR in Linux. Admittedly, he’s always faffing around with it to make it work. But he’s also a bit of a chaotic person that runs Arch, so that could just be him and not a failing of the current level of support.
Out of sheer curiosity is he using a fancy Steam VR kit like an HTC Vive or something?
I’ve fully switched over to OpenSUSE Tumbleweed at this point but I’m so bummed out my Samsung Odyssey is relying on heroic support from Monaco dev(s?) to even have a hope of it running.
But Windows is killing WMR too and they don’t care, so OS really isn’t an issue here. I’m keeping my Win10 partition there getting dusty though, because it still has WMR on it. =\
Samsung Odyssey w/ GTX 2060.
He’s using Monando built with Envision without the steamvr-monado Plugin because “it slows everything down”.
Whaaat that’s crazy interesting! Thanks for replying!
I know there’s been a lot of progress made with Monado on these units but the controllers are still no-go from my understanding. Is he using the controllers or just the HMD? :O
I might just have to spend a weekend figuring out how to build Monado hahaha.
Time & effort. Everything that you do means something else doesn’t get done. Whether that be gaming with friends or an item off your project/chore list.
We know that gaming centric distros are great for getting up & running, but it’s still a time sink, and will require effort. Not everybody has a backup drive with their games and will have to re-download everything too. There’s also a risk their favorite game isn’t compatible with Linux
Windows 10 also works just fine. I still have it on 2 of my 4 computers (2/5 if you count my Deck), and haven’t switched those over yet because I’m being lazy on one and the other is a perfect candidate for the SteamOS UX experience since it’s a HTPC. However, I have done some looking around at other HTPC experiences and just haven’t pulled the trigger. Which will be awesome, since Windows did away with their HTPC UX years ago.
I’m hoping that steamos will make Linux much more popular so that devs take notice. Whilst wine/proton are amazing anticheat still exists. If enough people move to steamos they will have to make sure they’re not excluded
For all the not super technically inclined people out there, I would recommend Linux mint with cinnamon, you’ll feel right at home and won’t face any real issues so long as you don’t want to play LoL, a few other big multiplayer games have anti cheat systems that don’t like Linux.
Make sure your hardware is compatible. Otherwise you have to deal with kernel upgrades to get latest drivers, which is advanced linux stuff. My gpu (B580) is compatible with 6.12 and newer kernel. And I wasn’t able to install newer kernel on linux Mint 22. Ended up installing Windows. And… It’s not that bad. I haven’t seen it for a while. Everything works better in my case. And you can uninstall all you don’t need including edge. But I will go back when kernel I need will be shipped with distro.
This is generally true, but I’d also caution that the B580 is a brand new card with (somewhat lacking) Linux support.
In general, if you aren’t using bleeding edge hardware, you won’t have such issues. This is especially true of AMD hardware, which tends to be extremely Linux friendly.
It’s actually surprising how easy it is to use.
My wife was playing Baldur’s Gate 3 on her windows laptop (GOG version, DRM free) and I just wanted to see if I can run it on my Linux laptop.
Just copied the game folder from her laptop to my external SSD, plugged it into my laptop, ran through proton. Everything works without any issues. Simple as that.
I was pleasantly surprised. We could even join via LAN and had some co-op fun. After trying it out I think I’m buying the game.
I haven’t used Windows for more than a decade, and I am genuinely surprised reading your post that the game works in this manner even if with proton/wine layer.
I can’t help but think that this is an exception, and would attribute this behaviour to how the game is made. I wonder what other software function this way.
I don’t even check ProtonDB anymore before buying a game. It just works the vast majority of the time, even without additional configuration.
In my experience pretty much everything works this easily. Steam games are a click away, Linux support or not. For things outside of steam you can either copy the install folder from a Windows install or just run the installer through Proton.
Exactly this. Many people have a lot of apprehension until they actually try it.
ran through proton
See, this is after where most gaming folks hop off.
In all fairness, if you just run Lutris (pre-installed on Bazzite), log into GOG from there and install and run the game through their wizard, it also “just works”.
That might be easier for most.What you just said is so much more difficult than running games through proton isn’t it??
For me, yes. But this is all using hands-holding Windows-like UIs, please realise that the recent-ish influx of Linux gamers understand this much, much better than terminals.
Although, I’m not sure how to install Proton as a CLI package on Mint, for instance.
aptdoesn’t list it, but Steam and Lutris do install it internally…You just go to steam settings > compat > enable for all games and then it just works for all games on steam
I’m not sure if you’re reading my messages but I’m saying I’m not sure how to do Proton outside of Lutris and Steam. And that CLI outside of a launcher sounds more convenient, but gave Lutris instructions for someone running a game not from Steam.
okay, that is different, sorry.
for that
step 1. install wine-tkg
step 2. right click a .exe > properties, set wine-tkg as the default
left click on .exe’s to open
done
Probably true, it depends. There are Steam folks and then there are GOG folks.
I prefer GOG tbh because it’s DRM free, but for some games I still need Steam, unfortunately.
I have about 7-9 months to decide what to do with my PC. I don’t want to move to windows 11. Because I will have to basically fresh-install my entire system that has 4 drives and god knows how many antiquated programs on it from the XP, Vista and 7 era that I still use. and Im just not ready for it. Im too busy
headache
Try Win10 LTSC if you don’t want to make the switch to Linux.
Yes! Did the same, I really like it. This is what a Windows should be like. Also, long support. I just ask myself why I didn’t switch to it earlier.
Nobara (Fedora based Distro with tweaks for gaming) is also a nice choice, but I still don’t want to fully switch to it for gaming because of Anti Cheat.
I’ve went from 7 to LTSC. I didn’t realize how cool LTSC was until I had to use a W10 machine at work. There’s a good chance I’ll go full Linux when the support ends but I’ll have enough time to consider it.
Sounds like a nightmare. I got sick thinking about it. Lol
Its just gonna be a question of how unsecure Win10 gets , and how fast.
My pc is from 2019, although I’ve upgraded the hardware several times. But I’ve basically reached a ceiling of practicality, its no longer practical to upgrade anything. Im on an outdated chipset (AM4) and jumping from a 3080 to a 4080 isn’t really going to fix the problem of games just being unoptimized. It makes more sense to build a new PC than it does to just change OS on this.
but right now, it just doesnt make sense to build a new PC either… I dont lift a finger on anything unless im going to be able to see at minimum 20% performance increase, I just dont see that without emptying my savings account…
Not a good advice. A friend of mine is still on win7 and it still works and got security updates time to time. But some programs actually stopped working or only older lts versions remain workings. Win10 is probably still ok for a year or two.
Absolutely not. Windows 7 may still function, but it is a target for unpatched vulnerabilities. Attackers are actively seeking windows 7 hosts for remote code exploits, lateral movement, and privilege escalation.
Do not run Windows 7. Stop running Windows 10 after the end of life date next year.
It makes more sense to build a new PC than it does to just change OS on this.
I haven’t made comparisons with gaming, tho I know there is somewhat, but there’s been a big performance boost on desktop and regular applications running Bazzite over Win10.
Im on an outdated chipset (AM4)
Bruh, why do you have to say that? 😂. I just built my PC a couple of months ago and I bought an AM4 and I thought I had some kickass specs.
Realistically the AM4 is still more than enough for now. but its technically end of life. the AM5 isn’t worth the jump until theres no other option.
Oh yeah, it is doing all I want it to do. Plus, on Linux I’ve learnt that having a bit older hardware is always better since the software for it is mature and works no problem in most cases. Absolutely zero complaints for what I paid for it. $500 for a whole PC is unbeatable
They did still release a few ones recently for them. But am5 is the main one right now. It’s not incredibly old, just no new ones will probably be produced. (I think the last am4 were a surprise already) Just for curiosity, why did you go with am4?
The honest answer(s), money and I didn’t know any better, especially in the AMD side. I hadn’t learnt their numbering schemes and I saw Ryzen 7 and thought “hell yeah”, but it turned out it’s a 5700G and the newest is the 7000 series. lol. Still powerful as hell. I bought the whole thing from microcenter and I had the salesperson pick the parts for me. I restricted him to $500 and that’s all we were able to get with that money. I have no issues with it whatsoever. I can play all of my games on 4k mid to low settings. Not much fps, but I’m a guy who’s ok with a game if it runs at 30 fps.
might have been a deal. some retailers are dumb and think lower number means worse, so discount justified. lol
100% nailed it. I bought all parts for $500. Works great. The processor is a Ryzen 7 5700G and it comes with an iGPU, so I didn’t get a dGPU at the time, a friend of mine had an RX 580 laying around and gave it to me. Gamed on it for about a year or less, worked fine. Later on, I got an RX 6600 from Facebook for $100.
They are end of life now and have ceased production, but if you can manage to find a 5800X3D , that CPU is the definition of sleeper. I had a 5700X I think it was, and the performance boost was f***ing unreal, I expected meagre gains, I saw 20 to 50% performance increase on many games. if you’re into that kind of thing. if you see one for sale, seriously think about grabbing it.
its the whole reason aside from the OS issue, Im not even remotely worried about the next few years, it can compete with the high end stuff of the AM5 generation still. unreal.
No worries about that, it was a bad wording. The company has stopped producing it, and that’s it. Your cpu is fine, compatible with current software, and can serve you well for still a long time.
Corporations were so successful in promoting consumerism, that they already messed with us on a psychological level.
Oh it’s totally fine, my friend. I just thought it was very funny. No hard feelings towards the commenter at all. I even actually laughed out loud. I’m that guy who never buys a brand new car, always used and has to be a great deal. Shit works, why spend the extra money? When you are
bronborn and raised in a poor 3rd world country, you learn to be very careful with your money when you have it.When you are bron and raised in a poor 3rd world country, you learn to be very careful with your money when you have it.
Oh, I totally feel you there. Nice to see a fellow third worlder around!
Hey 👋🏽
I bought one when I upgraded my truenas, solid performance paired with good nvmes and motherboard, no issues.
110%. Mine is serving me very well. I play video games in 4k, be it not 736648 FPS/Hz/refresh rate or whatever those imaginary numbers are, but I’m having fun.
I thought this had already happened?
I remember seeing ads on Steam for SteamOS years ago—wasn’t there a point at which you could download and run it on your own computer? What happened?
I think modern steamos is based on a different distro then it was then. Also proton is good enough now to justify switching for a lot of people
Yeah, choosing Arch as the base of something that’s supposed to be newbie-friendly and stable is wild, but it seems to have been working so far.
From what I recall, it wasn’t something you could easily use like a normal distro, and that version was based on Debian (so stable but outdated software). It only worked on some hardware, and you had to do a full system wipe.
More likely, this is them officially partnering with handheld or gaming laptop makers, using their latest Arch-based distro and allowing them to use Valve/Steam branding as a selling point.
If I recall correctly, this has never happened the way it’s happening now. It was a matter of “hey, you can fork it on GitHub and make your own iso thing”, hence why there was a “holoiso” or something like that that (I keep forgetting the name) where people used if they wanted to install steamOS on a device. This one is straight supported by valve. Like “hey, here is our official steam OS that we use on our steam deck. Use it and we will support you”.
Iirc the original steamOS was Debian based and you really had to be an experienced Linux user to use and enjoy it.
With the new steamOS (arch based?) it’s a much more streamlined experience and opens up the user base because of it
My understanding is the big change here is that they’re specifically making it available to other handheld manufacturers, which is huge, because windows handhelds have not been great because of how much the bloat of Windows steals performance and battery life. They’re making steps to make SteamOS (I.e. Linux in general) the default OS for handhelds and non-console dedicated gaming machines in general.
If it works, it will put tremendous pressure on publishers to support linux, which is great.
A close friend of mine hates Linux with a passion. He always sends me meme about how terrible Linux is. He has the ROG Ally, he texted me the other day to tell me he had to put Bazzite OS on it because it was dogshit on windows. He loves it now. Lmao.
Oh, how the turn tables…
Old steam os was an Ubuntu derived OS. Ubuntu has issues relating to the organization that runs it. New steam os is basically a coat of paint on top of Arch which is community based. The old os is deprecated.
The version on steam deck is fantastic, but they have been polishing it for desktop use for a while now. I can’t wait to have it available.
Ah, ok—was it also immutable like the new one is?
I believe so, but I never used it and didn’t read too much on it at the time. It was designed for the steam machine concept they were trying to push at the time. So it would be weird if it wasn’t.
I recently switched to fedora and I didn’t think it would be difficult, but it was even easier than I expected. Every game I’ve tried to play has worked perfectly.
Fedora was my first distro. But i hat issues with Hardware in my framework laptop, which should have good Linux support. But what was even more annyoing was that Video and audio codec die not work right away because it does not support proprietary which made life horrible difficult for a noob. What are your thoghts on that?
Different person here but I’ve been using Fedora for many, many years. This discussion comes up all the time and though RPMFusion is a checkbox in the software store GUI people obviously would like to have Nvidia proprietary drivers and proprietary codecs as an easy install like from a button click on install.
The problem is that Fedora has had a FOSS only core value since the beginning and I’m sure a big part of that is to keep Redhat out of legal troubles but it also resonates with a lot of the actual Fedora volunteers (those folks on the SIGs that do all the work).
I don’t think it’ll change anytime soon. Normally the response to this is “then new users will go elsewhere” or “If Linux wants to (something number of users or something market share)”. The thing is the Fedora project doesn’t ‘care’ about that and why should they?
I get that and I would obviously prefer an completely open source linux. But on the other hand I want stuff to work. I like that for example linux mint and ububtu ask during the installation if you would like to install prorietary stuff as well, which i always click. And who would not?
Sure but Red Hat is a US company and Canonical is not, while Mint is basically just a bunch of volinteers. I assume Canonical does not have the same legal vulnerabilities as Red Hat does and certainly doesn’t have the same export control and IP restrictions.
At the heart of it though even if Red Hat didn’t exist in the Fedora Project anymore, you’d have to convince them to drop one of their top tenants. You could try right now by submitting a proposal to include Nvidia drivers or various codecs or you could just use one of the Fedora Remixes that already do.
Fedora itself doesn’t really aim for market share, to sell itself as a commercial product and it’s really all about the people that make up the Fedora Project and what they want. Sure Red Hat holds a lot of sway and provide a lot of resources but there hasn’t been a fork and major migration either. So in that way some Fedora contributors that and run RPMFusion is a good enough compromise for the Fedora Project as a whole.
Though who is the source of these problems to begin with? I’d say codec/patent owners and Nvidia itself are the source to the problems caused by their unwillingness to support FOSS.
In particular Nvidia has had criticism for years over this and still haven’t really changed. Even their drivers aren’t great in Linux even if you don’t account for the proprietary part. They have the resources and the ability to change everything without hurting their company, yet they do not. You could argue Linux market share is why but Nvidia makes enough profit to barely scratch the bottom line to just support Linux similarly to AMD. They certainly support slicing vGPUs for hypervisors in Linux, provided you pay for the privilege, so it isn’t like this is a technical challenge but it is obviously a pure business objective for them. You can and I guess do respect it but that’s on you not anyone else.
I’m curious, do you recall what hardware issue you had? I’ve been using Fedora-based Aurora on my 13 and 16.
I think there was something with the screen, trackpad and fingerprint reader? But its long ago, so idk
This is the fifth person I see misinterpreting what Steve said about doing Linux performance testing, they aren’t going to start doing this soon, they will only start doing it WHEN SteamOS is released for desktops! It was very clear on the video FFS
I’m also really fucking excited for that tho, I recently switched to mint and helldivers 2 actually feels smoother than on windows, it has been such a good experience!! I cannot imagine how much better things will get with more people jumping to Linux and thus game makers actually pay attention to us
My apologies. Fixed it in the main post with an edit
Thanks you! And sorry if I was too aggressive, reading it again it sounded way more aggressive than I expected, I just wanted to sound energetic instead, my bad
Of course, and no worries. We are all good :)
I’m excited, but I wish gpu manufacturers would jump on board with physically compatible cards with ffs or smaller form factor business machines. HP, Dell, et al like to limit space for traditional GPUs in those machines. If there was a half height mid/low grade gpu with components on the reverse side that would be a great couch gaming machine.
If I recall Intel’s GPUs are a little slimmer right? But I’ve heard middling results with compatibility and such.
I have the sparkle brand intel low profile single slot in an hp sff PC and it barely fits and leaves about 3/8" space between the power supply. It has all the room in the world in the backside. One slot over is a 1x pcie slot if only hp had switched the two or the video card had straight through and out of the case cooling.
I’ve been daily driving Linux since 2017, I started with Ubuntu and it’s been great. I recently got a Lenovo T14 Gen 1 and put Linux Mint 22 on it, and I’ve been playing some games on it and it’s been pretty nice for such a portable laptop.
As long as they can keep it rolling stable, which is possible even with arch, I can see this pickup up a bit, especially for new users.
Plenty of users are sick of windows 11.
