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More power to the open source community
really looking forward to how these multi-billion dollar AI datacenter investments will work out for big tech companies
that said I’m pretty sure most of that capacity is reserved for the surveillance state anyway
I’m excited for the used hardware dump
Good riddance. We never asked for it, and we didn’t deserve it forced on us.
I cancelled a 20$ subscription I started because it was arguably useful for me and served exactly one use-case. Now I don’t need it anymore.
Of course, they had a form asking feedback/why. I chose “ChatGapT is nott advanced enough” as that was one of the alternatives. Hopefully it will lead to them putting more resources into development and burn through investor money faster.
“Trust me bro, just 200m dollars more”
- Sam Altman, probably
OpenAI burns through 200M$ in less than a week
Just one more datacenter bro, just one more (that consumes the same power as Belgium.)
So people are really believing Altman would publish these damning statements without ulterior motives? Are we seriously this gullible? Holy shit, we reached a critical mass of acephalous humans, no turning back now.
If they are losing money on $200/month, that does not necessarily mean they lose money on the $20/month.
One is unlimited, the other is not. You only have to use the $200 subscription more than 10 times the amount the $20 subscription allows for OpenAI to earn less on that subscription.
We already know they’re losing money on everything
By “Sam Altman said” in a “series of posts”, this article means these two tweets from 10 hours ago: https://twitter.com/sama/status/1876104580070813976.
This is a screenshot of a tweet talking about an article written about two tweets by Sam Altman. Is this really the world we’re living in, now?According to the Lemmy comment I read about it that is exactly what people are wondering
I’ve seen more written on one post. People will eat up ‘news’ if presented in the right way. There is a reason the stupid websites and advertisers use the click-bait titles.
Yeah, and I think you’re pretending it’s more ridiculous than it is
Welcome to the wonderful XXI century where our innovations in communication technology and financial instruments allow a hyperoptimised economy where two tweets are more than enough to cause billion-dollar shifts on the market. Completely organic and based on solid fundamentals I am assured by the same people that assured me of this in 2000 and 2008.
Much like uber and netflix, all of these ai chatbots that are available for free right now will become expensive, slow, and dumb once the investor money runs out and these companies have to figure out a business model. We’re in the golden age of LLMs right now, all we can do is enjoy the free service while it lasts and try not to make it too much a part of our workflow, because inevitably it will be cut off. Unless you’re one of those people with a self-hosted LLM I guess.
This. AI Hype beasts keep saying “This is the worst AI will ever be” and “It’ll just get better” but really it’s just going to get worse as they actually try to turn the bubble into a profit
Once they are cut off self hosted focus will explode and will see huge improvements in terms of ability and ease of use.
your Tech Friend is giving you bad advice, stop listening to them
What advice?
That they will not fight self hosted methods tooth and nail
oh, I guess then you must be the Tech Friend
either way you probably want to stfu
Until their legislated into illegality.
Is it gonna be “to protect the children”, “to stop criminals”, or “to save the environment”? Place your bets!
“We’re not running AI on these servers, officer! Just good old-fashioned crypto hashes.”
will become expensive, slow, and dumb
Wouldn’t they have to become smart first?
Not LLM but there Google Assistant has gotten much more stupid over the past several years. They realized that it was too expensive and had to lobotomize it.
IMHO, Google Now > Google Assistant
Agreed - bring back the golden age where the Google Now app existed and could actually do useful things
I believe that coincided with the Sonos debacle.
Can’t even set a timer with it anymore which was pretty much all I used it for. That and navigation with Android Auto
Huh? I set a timer with a voice command just two days ago. I’m not using “Gemini” though, does opting into that literally remove functionality?
Just tried it again, and it worked but for whatever reason, did not use my actual timer app on the phone, and used Google Assistant. For whatever reason the timer was muted by default, so that’s why I thought it didn’t work at the last time I used it.
I was about to say, a selfhosted LLM means I’m not competing with every market analysis tool, customer service replacement, and 10 y/o kid bombarding the service with junk. It doesn’t need to be ultra fast if I’m the only one using the hardware.
and who’ll supply the model and training and updates and data curation, dom? is it as manna from heaven? do you merely step upon the path and receive the divine wisdom of fresh llm updates?
fucking hell
Base open source model.
Topic expert models.
Community lora.
Program extensions.Look what comfy UI + Stable Diffusion can achieve.
Base open source model just means some company commanding a great deal of capital and compute made the weights public to fuck with LLMaaS providers it can’t directly compete with yet, it’s not some guy in a garage training and RLFH them for months on end just to hand the result over to you to fine tune for writing caiaphas cain fanfiction.
Honestly, the data used to create these models was ripped from the public and I think that they are owed back to the public. OpenAI started as a non profit, and I think it should stay that way.
The FOSS model works well enough for other projects and I think that corporate AI will be exactly the same as the industrial revolution, progress at the cost of humanity. This isn’t a problem to solve, it’s a solution looking for problems.
And with the pruned llama models, it runs really quickly on a 2070.
Wonder what their financials are actually, usually with cloud capital ventures like these they usually still magically keep raking it in even though they’re “losing money”.
For instance, Amazon during the pandemic paid zero corporate tax even though they had record sales because they “didn’t make any profit”, Tesla too who didn’t make profit during 2020 yet their share price went 10x and they had plenty of shares to sell if they wanted.
Wonder what their financials are actually
If they have a publicly traded part (iirc openai ownership was weird, but dont think they have a publicly traded part (yet)) they should do financial statements, before that doubt anybody can really tell.
Not that those statements are easy to read.
The trick is to spend all the money you earn.
Spend all the money you earn on fees to a shell company that you own in a country with less or no corporate tax rate.*
so when was youtube profitable?
An ad before and after every single question you ask chatgpt? Worth a shot, I guess !
Youtube wasn’t burning billions per year and it’s also pretty much the primary entity for video for the whole world which has other benefits for google. Finally Youtube can be monetized through adverts, since storage and bandwidth costs are relatively low. Whereas GenAI’s compute costs aren’t.
Can’t they put ads into the responses?
If they could, they would have already.
x doubt
I don’t think Youtube was ever profitable, to be honest.
Never offer unlimited on a utility model without guardrails. That’s just business 101.
Good. Burn that thing to the ground.
Likely they’ll try to sell it to governments, and with Elon Musk proposing goVeRNmeNt eFfIciEnCy, at least xAI can become somewhat profitable.
Can someone explain the Pale Horse reference?
In the Bible’s book of revelations, John (the author) is witnessing the end of the world and sees four horsemen being unleashed upon the world to spread a curse/trial/whatever wherever they ride. Each horseman brings with them something different- famine, disease, war (or strife), and death. Death is the last, IIRC, and rides upon a pale horse. I think that’s what they’re referencing. This person is saying that openAI is going to die soon.
it won’t. its backed by microsoft. they can literally afford to burn the cash on this while it becomes profitable, and it will AI has so many low hanging fruits to optimize its insane.
So many low-hanging fruits. Unbelievable fruits. You wouldn’t believe how low they’re hanging.
They are tremendous fruits. Many people are saying this. Fruits.
and we have concepts for even lower hanging fruits. beautiful concepts.
Okay, explain. What kinds of low hanging fruit?
quants are pretty basic. switching from floats to ints (faster instruction sets) are the well known issues. both those are related to information theory, but there are other things I legally can’t mention. shrug. suffice to say the model sizes are going to be decreasing dramatically.
edit: the first two points require reworking the base infrastructure to support which is why they havent hit widespread adoption. but the research showing that 3 bits is as good as 64 is intuitive once you tie the original inspiration for some of the AI designs. that reduction alone means you can get 21x reduction in model size is pretty solid.
both those are related to information theory, but there are other things I legally can’t mention. shrug.
hahahaha fuck off with this. no, the horseshit you’re fetishizing doesn’t fix LLMs. here’s what quantization gets you:
- the LLM runs on shittier hardware
- the LLM works worse too
- that last one’s kinda bad when the technology already works like shit
anyway speaking of basic information theory:
but the research showing that 3 bits is as good as 64 is intuitive once you tie the original inspiration for some of the AI designs.
lol
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decimal is a severely underappreciated library
Honestly, the research showing that a schlong that’s 3mm wide is just as satisfying as one that’s 64 is intuitive once you tie the original inspiration for some of the sex positions.
I have seen these 3 bit ai papers on hacker news a few times. And the takeaway apparently is: the current models are being pretty shitty at what we want them to do, and we can reach a similar (but slightly worse) level of shittyness with 3 bits.
But that doesn’t say anything about how both technologies could progress in the future. I guess you can compensate for having only three bits to pass between nodes by just having more nodes. But that doesn’t really seem helpful, neither for storage nor compute.
Anyways yeah it always strikes me as a kind of trend that maybe has an application in a very specific niche but is likely bullshit if applied to the general case
Far as I can tell, the only real benefit here is significant energy savings, which would take LLMs from “useless waste of a shitload of power” to “useless waste of power”.
If anything that sounds like an indictment? Like, the current models are so incredibly fucking bad that we could achieve the same with three bits and a ham sandwich
the fruit can’t be rotten, you must be picking it wrong
“look, Mme Karen, this is definitely not a rotten tomato. it can’t be a rotten tomato, we don’t sell rotten tomatoes. you can see here on the menu that we don’t have rotten tomatoes on offer. and see here, on your receipt, where it says quinoa salad? absolutely not rotten tomatoes!” explains the manager fervently, avoiding a tableward glance at the pungent red blob with as much will as they can muster
They will only pay as long as it benefits them.
this is correct as to the background of the term itself, the reason ed uses it here is because it is the term that he selected some months ago when he listed “some likely pale horses that signal the bubble popping”
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“I personally chose the price”
Is that how well-run companies operate? The CEO unilaterally decides the price rather than delegating that out to the numbers people they employ?
A real ceo does everything. Delegation is for losers who can’t cope. Can’t move fast enough and break enough things if you’re constantly waiting for your lackeys to catch up.
If those numbers people were cleverer than the ceo, they’d be the ones in charge, and they aren’t. Checkmate. Do you even read Ayn Rand, bro?
Is that what Ayn Rand is about? All I really remember is that having a name you chose yourself is self-fulfilling.
Ayn Rand is about spending your whole life moralizing a social philosophy based on the impossibility of altruism, perfect meritocratic achievement perfectly distributing wealth, and hatred of government taxation, regulation, and social welfare programs…
… and then dying alone, almost totally broke, living off of social security and financial charity from your former secretary.
Oh boy I got a fun video for you: https://youtu.be/GmJI6qIqURA @26:50
Atlas Shrugged is so bad that if you didn’t know anything about the author, it could be read as a decent satire.
A monologue that last SIXTY PAGES of dry exposition. Barely credible characterization from the protagonist and villains and extremely poor world building.
Anthem is her better book because it keeps to a simple short story format - but still has a very dull plot that shoehorns ideology throughout. There’s far better philosophical fiction writers out there like Camus, Vonnegut, or Koestler. Skip Rand altogether imo
I’m guessing that means a team or someone presented their pricing analysis to him, and suggested a price range. And this is his way of taking responsibility for making the final judgment call.
(He’d get blamed either way, anyways)
$20/mo sounds like a reasonable subscription-ish price, so he picked that. That OpenAI loses money on every query, well, let’s build up volume!
While the words themselves near an apology, I didn’t read it as taking responsibility. I read it as:
Anyone could have made this same mistake. In fact, dumber people than I would surely have done worse.
In tech? Kinda yeah. When a subscription is 14.99 $£€/month it’s a clear “we just think it’s what people think is a fair price for SaaS”.
The trick is that tech usually works on really weird economics where the fixed costs (R&D) are astonishingly high and the marginal costs (servers etc) are virtually nil. That’s how successful tech companies are so profitable, even more than oil companies, because once the R&D is paid off every additional user is free money. And this means that companies don’t have to be profitable any time in particular as long as they promise sufficient projected growth to make up for being a money pit until then. You can get away with anything when your investors believe you’ll eventually have a billion users.
… Of course that doesn’t work when every customer interaction actually costs a buck or two in GPU compute, but I’m sure after a lot of handwaving they were able to explain to their investors how this is totally fine and totally sustainable and they’ll totally make their money back a thousandfold.
It works for ice tea and hotdogs, why not AI? (I jest)
Should have asked chatgpt to play the role of a CEO.
This answer would be much funnier if that wasn’t his fucking plan.
jesus fuck how did i never see this before
Worth the watch just to hear the genuine laughter
This is my first experience listening to this guy, and I’ll be darned, it’s a another idiot billionaire.
I’d like to think there are intelligent billionaires but honestly folks, if you win that big and haven’t cashed out to do something more meaningful with you’re life, you’re an idiot.
far, far, far, far, far, far, far fewer business people than you’d expect/guess are data-driven decision makers
and then there’s the whole bayfucker ceo dynamic which adds a whole bunch of extra dumb shit
it’d be funnier if it weren’t for the tunguska-like effect it’s having on human society both at present and in the coming decades to follow :|
There’s a reason so many companies fail
there is, but this isn’t (the primary) it tbh
I endorse this as a data professional. It’s maddening.
I think I remember Jeff Bezos in “The Everything Store” book seeing a price they charged for AWS and went even lower for growth. So there could be some rationale for that? However, I think switching AI providers is easier than Cloud Providers? Not sure though.
I can imagine the highest users of this being scam artists and stuff though.
I want this AI hype train to die.
