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The whole internet seems happy about the “people” burning Teslas in protest. I am pretty sure they were all insured and given the terrible sales figures… please guess who is benefitting the most of that burning?
This comment has no logic… yes, maybe Tesla itself is not at a loss due to vandalism here but insurance companies would drop either Tesla (the company) as a client or deny insurance to people buying Swasticars which would make the sales slump into a sales halt
This is really bad for Tesla either way if you are willing to look 1 mm beyond
You are right, but there probably is a “safe” number of Teslas that can burn, before insurance companies drop Tesla (or increase insurance prices to make it unprofitable).
Insurance frauds, if not caught, tend to be profitable.
Edit: I just want to add that I do not have any personal experience with insurance frauds… It’s just my little conspiracy theory… I won’t respond anymore, must go and make my first tinfoil cap.
Insurance isn’t going to pay out it’s $700 billion market cap. If this keeps up, Tesla the company won’t exist any longer.
Insurance companies raised rates on teslas
It’s kinda dumb that people are burning EVs… vandalize them all you want but burning that gigantic battery can’t be good…
Insurance doesn’t usually cover “acts of terrorism” so it will be funny if that’s how it gets classified.
Probably they will blame it to “Battery quality/integrity”
If they did, wouldn’t that make the cars much more expensive to insure?
Insurance fraud is really hard to hide, that’s the first thing insurance companies investigate, particularly if the claimant is a car dealership. This has been a popular criminal activity for decades, my uncle used to pull this scam with his motorcycle club, they all got caught.
Having to make a ton of insurance claims is not a good thing.
Eventually you become uninsurable, which is a lot harder to overcome than a sales slump.
Insurance companies? You realize insurance isn’t free right?
I mean Tesla. Just imagine, you have a lot of unsold cars and no hope that people will rush to buy them. If you lower the price, you will admit to shareholders that it’s not going well and maybe your company is not worth more than the next eight biggest car manufacturers combined… So you can’t lower the price, at least not enough to sell all those cars, they all take space, need some maintenance, slowly rust and lose value… Or they can just burn, and you can claim that it was all because of those far left terr… Right, someone mentioned that insurance doesn’t cover terrorism, so it’s all because of those damn leftist hooligans. You would probably sold all of them, but they were destroyed. Pinky promise.
So you think the story “we can’t sell cars because half burn in the dealer and the other half won’t be touch by people in fear” is actually going to go well with shareholders?
Your car insurance doesn’t cover terrorism but I’d be surprised if a car dealership or Tesla have that same clause. You are very unlikely to be the victim of a terrorist but because Tesla is a big company their insurance provider probably covers intentional damages by a third-party.
And the quarterly policy renewal goes up… a lot.
I mean sure, he could run uninsured… but then he eats the loss now.
I don’t know what insurance rules look like when you are a billion dollar business, but I would assume they have a much better negotiating position.
I’m not saying that the renewal cost won’t go up, but I assume it won’t go up as fast and as steep as it would for us poor people.
They do, but it’s not infinite lmao, insurance companies will either charge out the ass, or drop them regardless.
I work at a very large company and you’d be surprised how many of the inconsequential or seemingly silly decisions made are rooted in insurance coverage.
You get better insurance rates as a large business because you have more collateral and have a larger contract. If it gets the insurance company more net money to give you a lower rate per item insured, they want that extra bit of income. Rather, the person signing the deal wants that extra bit of commission on a large contract.
If what you’re insuring costs more than the contract value, they’ll 100% hike rates to make up for it.
They’re in the business of betting that they’ll make a lot of profit while you bet they’ll only make a little profit. It doesn’t matter how much money you have, they’ll always arrange the numbers so that their worst case scenario is minimal profit.There’s no amount of money you can pay someone to lose money on a deal.
I will feel a lot better when their stock price goes much, much, much lower. Sure they are down 40+% in the past 3 months, but they were WAY too high prior to that.
Their P/E should be in the single digits if they were like most American companies. Until I see that, I’ll know that they are nothing but a fucking chud memestock.
They’re still up 25% year on year.
That was an insane rally and crash though.
What’s going to be really funny, is when it becomes worthless.
See, most of Elon’s money is in Tesla Stock, stock that he manipulated by telling tall tales of colonizing Mars.
In order to buy Twitter he had to take out a loan for the money and use his Tesla stock as collateral. Now, the thing about that is, the stock is only able to serve this purpose because it’s worth so much. If it wasn’t, then Elon basically defaults on the loan.
This means he will no longer own Twitter, his bank will.
He’ll be forced to sell SpaceX to cover the loans.
My wife and I are in the market for a 3rd car because our oldest is driving to community college most days, leaving us down to one car between us. She wants an EV, so we’ve been shopping the local used lots. They all have DOZENS of Teslas, and they’re very eager to sell them.
Has any other car manufacturer ever had a similar policy of not accepting their own vehicles as trade-ins?
What is that trade-in? You give your old car to get a discount for a new? How does it work? Why does it work? I do I understood this completely wrong?
Works just like that. Dealer takes your trade-in, usually paying you a decent amount less than you could get selling it yourself (this is a spot where you have rk make a time value for money decision). You apply that cash to your new car you’re buying from them.
The dealer (if they are good) cleans and fixes any issues with the trade-in and either sends it to auction or sells it on their own lot.
This process is so ingrained in the process here in the US that if you look up price estimates of used cars online, they will give you both a “dealer trade-in” value and a “private party” value.
I always sell my cars privately, and I’ve always gotten good value for them. But then, I never buy new cars. I’ll generally buy a low-mileage car that’s 3 or 4 years old.
Yep, really depends on your personal feelings around your money.
I am generally a used car kind of guy, but this is how trade-ins work. For some people, they’d rather just not have to deal with selling a car even if they could get a lot more for it. The dealerships provide them that service at a significant cost. 🤷♂️
That’s right. Where I am it’s a tax scam to support dealerships.
If you trade in a $10k car on a $20k one, you pay sales tax on $10k. If you sell your car to someone else for $10k and then buy the $20k car, you pay sales tax on $20k and the new owner of your car pays sales tax on $10k.
Why would car manufacturers want their old cars?
Because they can (usually) resell them for more than they give you for it.
Usually. They might have trouble with Teslas.
Because they lowball you
Not manufacturers, dealers. A legally required middleman in most of the US. They’ll take your $10k car for $7k and try to resell it for $12k. Even if it gets negotiated to a fair price, they still get the opportunity to upsell used car buyers into extended warranties and maintenance plans.
Tesla is a little different in that they do not have dealers, so they instead do no-negotiatiation sales on their used cars. It’s good for them because they can do the same buy low sell high deal. But when the model is not selling, they’ll have to buy it and sit on that asset for months or dump it at auction.
CPO cars print money.
Charge 3k more in order to give the car a once over and then offer a few years extra warranty that will probably never pay out that much in repairs (assuming there’s anything at all).
It usually doesn’t work quite like the example above. Using that example…the dealership will only give you $4k for your old car, even though it’s worth $10k. They then turn around and sell it for anywhere from $8-12k, netting themselves a tidy profit on the vehicle now for the second time.
The convenience makes this worthwhile for most car buyers, even if they could get another few thousand if they did everything themselves and paid full taxes. Dealership of course loves it and laughs all the way to the bank.
It’s what Game Stop (and a myriad of other “buy, sell, trade” stores) does with used games and consoles but with cars. eBay exists but most people don’t want to go to that much trouble.
Or they give you more on the trade-in and claw it back by offering you shit terms from their captive finance company.
Some carmakers don’t make a profit manufacturing and selling cars, they only make it on finance.
Good point, this is fairly common as well. I’d recommend avoiding financing entirely if at all possible because of this, simply not worth it for a car unless it’s the only way you can get one that’s in decent shape.
If you have to finance, often times you can get a much better rate from your local credit union instead. Use that to make the purchase, instead of the dealer’s financier.
Interesting, wonder how the economics work for the different players. Also, tangentially:
A decade or two ago, a lady working in dealer finance lamented how internet bank rate comparisons had really rained on their parade
“I want this rate”, she explained customers would say, pointing at a printout or their phone and expecting a match.
Imagine how fat those margins would’ve been when they knew a customer hadn’t yet called around researching rates!
What? Where is that legal? You should be paying tax on the full purchase price of the new vehicle. In every transaction I’ve done, the trade-in is simply treated as part of the down payment or the full payment if you aren’t financing.
https://www.motorenn.com/vehicle-trade-in-tax-benefits-by-state (not the biggest fan of this but can’t find one I like better)
The same thing applies to houses and many other large purchases. Also most states that offer a trade in discount also let you sell the car private party (or to another dealer) and claim it on your taxes. You just have to file more paperwork vs the dealer figuring that out for you.
Huh, TIL.
That’s exactly how it works, and the dealer usually gives you a decent deal on the trade in, to make a sale.
It saves a huge amount of hassle for the buyer.
Did you think people threw thier cars out when they bought a new one?
No. Dealerships might have said “we have too many EVs right now” to you if you came in with your Nissan Leaf when there was an over-supply. But the idea that the entire manufacturer is blanket not accepting their own car, that new.
No other major manufacturers sell directly to customers so no. Dealerships don’t care as long as you’re buying something. Many cars they take as trade wind up going straight to auction.
I mean do they care a bit. If it doesn’t sell at auction or goes for basically nothing they could lose whatever value they gave to you for trade in.
I have knowledge of how car salesweasels operate. There’s a thing called the Devil’s Triange: sale price, trade-in value, finance terms. If they give way on one of those vertices, they claw it back on one or both of the others. When the smarmy git goes out to talk to their manager, they’re showing them that they’re making their margin on the deal.
That’s also why it’s hard to negotiate with them if you disclose that you’re a cash buyer and don’t have a vehicle to trade in: you’ve removed two of their three degrees of freedom.
Plus they have their big book that shows current values and trends with used vehicles (like KBB on steroids) so just a cursory glance at your trade-in to ensure the transmission isn’t falling out and dragging on the ground should be a safe bet that they’ll be able to recoup most of the book value on the trade.
As a cash buyer, I went through my last dealership purchase and ordered a car with the $4k “warranty” scam plus accepted their scammy financing. Closed the deal and drove away with my car, then the next day I called and cancelled the warranty for a full refund and took my cash and paid off the loan in full.
It’s a hassle, but you have 3 days to cancel all that scammy junk with no recourse. That’s what it took to get the cash price I wanted.
I can’t imagine a court in the country seeing a problem with the call and cancel trick. Although,
permission to moralize?
personally, I want to get a great deal in a way I’ll feel good about… maybe have a story to share with fellow misers.
But I do put myself in the business’s shoes and I think it’s fair for everyone to walk out knowing how good of a deal they got and how much money they made.
And when you’re inside the building and they run their numbers and based on that they shake your hand, to go outside of the building and reach back to change the numbers–in a way that’d make them take back the handshake–it exceeds the level of cunning I’d want to be in a negotiation.
Also Lemmings, I promise I am not the parent commenter’s mother. Someone, take my soapbox before I make someone else want to log off! 😇
lol
lmfao even!
There was Dealership near me that had a bunch of their teslas keyed and damaged and smashed. Curious. Now that dealership can claim insurance money on the cars he can’t sell!
I wonder if the cybertruck will be the Delorian of the future.
More probably the Edsel or Yugo, but with the quality of a Lada.
Well, the production of the cybertruck certianly smashed the delorean.
Well no, it won’t because people actually like the Delorian due to it being redeemed by one of the greatest time travel movies ever made.
We can make it happen with the Cyber truck!
BACK TO THE FÜHRER starring Kid Rock as Marty and Musk as the Doc and the truck doesn’t make it.
Looper, right? /s
Here me out. What if they remaster back to the future and the plutonium guys at the beginning drive a cybertruck instead of the white truck?
Was the delorian hated? Why?
it wasn’t a good car, It just looked unique.
Mostly because it had a garbage engine. The one they used in the movies was modified with a much better engine.
Ah okay.
I have no idea about cars or engines
Yeah, the reason why they chose 55 mph in the movie is that was the max speed of the car (if i remember right)
Also the way the doors opened were pretty inconvenient
It was 88 mph, which is a speed that the original engine for the DeLorean was not capable of.
The flux capacitor is activated when it reaches 88mph. They had to add a digital speedometer because the Delorian’s only went to 85.
That was typical of cars made (for US market) in the early to mid 80s… Can’t remember for sure if it was part of the whole national 55mph speed limit, but I’d bet it was.
The fact that the real Delorean couldn’t do 88 miles per hour was part of the joke.
You misspelled Mandalorian
The suspension had to be raised to meet new pedestrian safety standards. This ruined the handling.
They couldn’t get the engine they really wanted (a Mazda rotary) and had to go with a GM piston engine instead. Then, new US emissions standards hit and it had to be downrated to meet those. EU models were better, though engine design in general was kinda in the shitter around this time.
People think it’s heavy because of the stainless steel, but those are thin panels over fiberglass. Its weight is in the same ballpark as what Ferrari was putting out at the time.
The first alternator they used did not have enough power for all the accessories to be on at once. People got stranded at night because of this, including Johnny Carson (who was an early investor). These were upgraded later.
Then there’s some manufacturing difficulties. The early models have creases embedded on each side of the hood. Forming the stainless steel that way often broke it at the factory. Later models have a completely flat hood.
As the company’s finances dwindled, DeLorean himself was caught in an FBI sting operation where he was accused of selling drugs to try to keep the company afloat. This ended up being a setup by the FBI–with Larry Flynt coming to the rescue, of all people–but it plunged the company’s reputation even more.
It was a shitty time to make a sports car. Lots of stuff happening at once that made them bad at what they are. Make it 5 years earlier or 5 years later and it’s an entirely different story. Even that might be generous; 1980s sports cars are known more for their angular looks than actual driving ability. It wouldn’t be until the 1990s that companies started to figure out how to work within the new regulations. Then you get legendary bangers again like the Supra MkIV.
It wasn’t hated. It just wasn’t a good car.
Probably not, the Delorean was pretty cool even when it was new, I believe.
Also, a Cybertruck is massively complex, so keeping an old one running would be difficult.
Pretty sure there’s probably a Killswitch built in so that it won’t run past a certain date without giving Tesla more money, so once the company tanks they’ll all be dead in the water.
Like an iconic vehicle they make movies about?
Well, it is iconic and will be used as a metaphor years from now when people start making movies of this era.
They won’t find a single one to film.
On the global scale the Cybertruck is an incredibly niche American thing.
It’s only ever sold 40 something thousand units since 2023. That’s ridiculously low.
For comparison, Toyota sells some 11 million vehicles a year globally. And just in the United States, Porsche yearly sells some 70k units. That 40k Cybertrucks is from three fiscal years
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Yeah but it is famous loke the pinto, anf easy to recognize loke the delorean, and easy to make a prop version of.
The fuck is a ‘loke’?
Like. I and o are next to each other on the keyboard
They can make replicas
Sure slapping a few pizza boxes together and painting it silver would make a convincing enough replica, but why would anyone bother?
To make a movie.
No no. Why would anyone bother to put one in their movies in 20 years?
That’s like saying they’d have people wearing Apple Vision Pro’s in 20 years. Why? Wasn’t a big product. Just an overhyped one which utterly failed.
Perhaps as a meme to how shit it is but it’s definitely not “iconic to the era”.
A colossal failure that’s only remembered as a joke.
Yes, let the hate flow through you, young Padawan.
The DeLorean was 95% of the way to a brilliant car. The last 5% killed it with a combination of bad market timing and a few questionable parts selections. Most of those issues had been worked out after the first 3000 units, but the company’s reputation was in the shitter by then.
The FBI sting was a complete hoax.
There is no saving the Cybertruck. It’s poorly built, ugly, and comes from a company run by a narcissist.
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If you were foolish enough to buy a Tesla, and too dumb to get rid of it already, make another poor decision and go to https://stealmytesla.com/ for the final solution to your problem.
What a time to be alive
I’m imagining situations like that episode of Seinfeld with the BO car. He couldn’t even get people to steal that thing.
So much crazy shit has happened this year that for an honest second, I was dead set in believing this was real. I feel like there are some people that are this desperate. But unfortunately I’m cursed with the power of reading for more than 10 seconds.
The site is well done. I wasn’t sure either until I saw the lady with a balaclava and a headset. 😂
Oh yeah that shit made me crack up and I knew it was fake, but it’s funny to imagine.
Imagine fire bombing Teslas and keying them just because you don’t like Musk. How sad and cult-like is that. Domestic terrorism must be worth the 20 year sentence just to hurt Musk indirectly but at the same time, most likely harming your fellow Democrats who drive the ELECTRIC VEHICLE. The man who helped popularize the EVs is now your enemy. The same EVs that Biden pushed a mandate for.
That is a cult. There can be 2 different cults, ya know. The one you’re in, and the one you despise.
I surprised you didn’t bring up trans athletes to defend your opinion
You’re gay but not in the fun way.
Cry more.
Imagine selling EV’s to a group of people then surprised Pikachu facing when you turn your back on them and tell them they are infected by empathy and a “woke mind virus.”
Imagine being so full of yourself that you Nazi salute away your entire international sales because guess what, the rest of the world doesn’t think it’s funny either.
Imagine.
Imagine being such a bootlicker billionaire fascist worshipper that you can’t understand what is happening.
e: Quick trip through your comment history shows this is all you do. Defend trump’s actions. Probably if I dug back far enough you’d be attacking the push for EV, but it’s amusing watching you defend them now. Blocked.
I’d be hurt if you actually knew what fascism is. Sucks that you’re not successful enough to be a billionaire but begrudge those who are.
No one is successfully a billionaire.
No one is successful enough to be a billionaire. Accumulating that amount of wealth is not a result of hard work, it’s a result of exploitation. Begrudge all billionaires
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Not everyone who opposes Trump and Musk is a Democrat, especially on Lemmy. Many of us are leftists who despise Democrats, just less than we despise MAGA fascists.
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Don’t think a lot of cybertrucks are being driven by those on the left, they weren’t released until well after Musk showed his true colors. Every cybertruck owner I’ve personally encountered has been solidly MAGA.
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Vehicles so shit even the manufacturer doesn’t want them
I saw one yesterday in the wild. It’s unusual for where I live, we’re not rich here, and being a blue state, we’re not stupid, either.
Surprisingly, it still had all of it’s body panels intact.
I want to hear a documentary, narrated by David Attenborough, about the wild Cybertrucks.
Unfortunately, you’ll need to settle for Whistlin Diesel for now.
Although, it was pretty entertaining in a Jackassian Park kind of way.
“As the Cybertruck sleeps, it is blissfully unaware of the approaching storm. If the thunder doesn’t wake it soon enough, it may succumb to its greatest existential threat: wetness. In the bushes, a Patriot rattles a paint can.”
Thanks. That’s brilliant!
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I’m not interested in a Mustang, but I am interested in doing an EV conversion at some point. I do appreciate that Ford is selling the Mustang EV transaxle as a crate engine.
ioniq 5, ive seen that alot.
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If I ever get an EV I’ll just get the Mustang.
That’s not a real Mustang, is it?
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Have they tried covering them in garlic?
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To cover the stench?
Definitely sucks for the people who thought they were doing the right thing by going electric and ended up driving Swasticars.
I know there’s an argument that those folks should have known what they were in for by the time the Cybertruck in 2023, but some people just don’t pay much attention to current events.
I drive a Subaru and couldn’t tell you who the CEO is, although in retrospect perhaps I should have done more research before buying. But even without looking I can guess that it’s some shitty billionaire who donated heavily to both the GOP and DNC. Subaru itself has a history that involves… Being a Japanese manufacturer during WW2.
You could also look at the Nazi Henry Ford and all of those gigantic pickup trucks clogging the US while also buying fossil fuels. It helps that Henry Ford is long dead, but are they really that much better than Cybertrucks?
I mean morally. Objectively, Cybertrucks are just badly designed and manufactured vehicles but that’s separate from my point. Although if I may also rant- we already know that he used the Boring company to purposely sabotage high-speed rail projects in the US. We know that he bought Twitter not to make it profitable, but to gain power over social media. When you look at Tesla- the QC issues, the labor relations issues, the missed deadlines, the proprietary charging connector, the complete mess of a car the Cybertruck is, and how he is now very actively supporting a president who seems to be trying to destroy EV’s and prop up fossil fuels… Was Elon EVER actually trying to push EV’s, or was he actively trying to sabotage them? I know this is borderline conspiratorial thinking, but a lot of his madness seems to make a lot more sense in that context.
You can’t participate in the capitalist system and have clean hands. It’s moral compromises all the way down.
Oh yes I see I got distracted and didn’t get to my conclusion: perhaps it is unwise to ostracize the creations of evil people and evil corporations.
The Cybertrucks are here. I don’t want to toss a bunch of EV’s (even bad ones) in a landfill prematurely just because the CEO is a fascist.
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While the Texas Plate ‘HAIT 88’ seems like it’s fake, I feel that is implied by driving a Cyber Truck. He didn’t need to go through the trouble paying extra for that.
Womp womp. Glued together piece of scrap plastic
