Sen. John Fetterman, D-Pa., has drawn fire from progressives over his fierce support for Israel and broken with immigration advocates with his support for curtailing migration.
Progressive is often used as a blanket term that basically means that you are farther left than the Democratic party. Not that he doesn’t like progress, just that he is not pursuing the end of capitalism or something in that direction if even slightly.
I always understood it otherwise, that progressive was more to the left, outside that neoliberal democrat stance. But these things change over time and I may have always just misunderstood.
It’s all just labels, it’s not really the etemology of the word that people care about, but the ideas it represents. The opposite of progressive is conservative. I think if you were to ask anyone in particular, they would say that they’d like to progress some things and conserve others. It’s just the label for who tends to do more of each. So it’s less about saying your not “for progress” and more about showing what ideas you align with. And many conservatives wouldn’t call progressive ideas “progress” if they were implemented; they think it’d be bad for society. So it’s all just words at the end of the day to signify what ideas you align with
He didn’t say that. He said he is willing to have a discussion about immigration policy with republicans.
Whoever wrote the article is trying to speak on behalf of an entire political group called “Progressives” by claiming everyone in the group came to a unanimous decision to not discuss immigration (this isn’t true).
So the writer of the article is claiming Fetterman isn’t a part of the group of Progressives because Fetterman is willing to do his job by being diplomatic.
“I’m not a progressive,” Fetterman told NBC News. “I just think I’m a Democrat that is very committed to choice and other things. But with Israel, I’m going to be on the right side of that. And immigration is something near and dear to me, and I think we do have to effectively address it as well.”
He said he is willing to have a discussion about immigration policy with republicans.
“Let’s hear the literal fascists who compare even legal immigrants to vermin and invading armies out. I’m sure they’ll be willing to reach a reasonable compromise” 🙄
Who said anything about a temper tantrum? Could you please try and refrain from using ridiculous pro-capitulation strawmen?
Calmly refusing to negotiate with fascists about one of their favorite “if we give an inch, we’re traitors” issues because you know nothing good will come from it isn’t having a temper tantrum. It’s being realistic.
I don’t think politicians should grandstand for cheap points about good faith negotiations with domestic terrorists whose re-election depends on negotiating in bad faith or not negotiating at all.
I wouldn’t brag about negotiating with cats about them going vegan either, and that would have a BETTER chance of bearing fruit.
This isn’t a let’s hash out an immigration deal where both sides get a little of what they want regarding immigration reform, it’s submitting to hostage takers for an entirely unrelated issue that shouldn’t really be partisan.
“Progressive” is a faction of Democrats. They aren’t the only people that support progress.
I don’t consider myself a progressive, because I disagree with about 30% (in very ballpark terms) of current progressive policy choices. It’s not hard to imagine Fetterman feels similarly.
I absolutely disagree with Fetterman that immigration should be curtailed at all - Democrats are not a monolith. Most Democrat representatives disagree with some policy or other.
Exactly I don’t consider myself a progressive either for similar reasons and I don’t agree with the notion of progress they seem to believe in. I’m a materialist and believe progress is contingent on economic and material conditions and that people’s notions of progress are relative to that. “Progress” begs the question progress to what and for them it’s often progress in a capitalist individualist sense, where more of the best people get the best stuff. Progress to them would be like more minorities represented in executive level careers but progress to me would mean the system that creates these disparities doesn’t exist. Progressives think capitalism can be redeemed by appealing to its own morality basically.
ugh… and he was doing so well…
I’m not american, but isn’t calling yourself not progressive kinda… Shit? Why would you ever say that you don’t like progress?
Progressive is often used as a blanket term that basically means that you are farther left than the Democratic party. Not that he doesn’t like progress, just that he is not pursuing the end of capitalism or something in that direction if even slightly.
To be fair, Fetterman is eager to progress genocide.
Progressives are basically the left wing of the neoliberal consensus but not “left” if we’re talking like actual left ideologies ie socialism.
I always understood it otherwise, that progressive was more to the left, outside that neoliberal democrat stance. But these things change over time and I may have always just misunderstood.
Leftists generally call themselves leftists. Progressives are usually Social Democrats, ie Scandinavian Capitalism.
It’s all just labels, it’s not really the etemology of the word that people care about, but the ideas it represents. The opposite of progressive is conservative. I think if you were to ask anyone in particular, they would say that they’d like to progress some things and conserve others. It’s just the label for who tends to do more of each. So it’s less about saying your not “for progress” and more about showing what ideas you align with. And many conservatives wouldn’t call progressive ideas “progress” if they were implemented; they think it’d be bad for society. So it’s all just words at the end of the day to signify what ideas you align with
He didn’t say that. He said he is willing to have a discussion about immigration policy with republicans.
Whoever wrote the article is trying to speak on behalf of an entire political group called “Progressives” by claiming everyone in the group came to a unanimous decision to not discuss immigration (this isn’t true).
So the writer of the article is claiming Fetterman isn’t a part of the group of Progressives because Fetterman is willing to do his job by being diplomatic.
The piece literally quotes Fetterman saying that he is not a progressive. Not sure what you’re talking about.
Then you didn’t read the article because he never said “I don’t like progress”
What you think I’m saying: ‘he didn’t say “I’m not a progressive”’
What BruceTwarzan said: “Why would you ever say that you don’t like progress?”
I said: “he didn’t say that” (he didn’t say “I don’t like progress”)
“Let’s hear the literal fascists who compare even legal immigrants to vermin and invading armies out. I’m sure they’ll be willing to reach a reasonable compromise” 🙄
You can’t just throw a temper tantrum and expect to get your way. Diplomacy is required to actually get things done.
Who said anything about a temper tantrum? Could you please try and refrain from using ridiculous pro-capitulation strawmen?
Calmly refusing to negotiate with fascists about one of their favorite “if we give an inch, we’re traitors” issues because you know nothing good will come from it isn’t having a temper tantrum. It’s being realistic.
So you don’t think our politicians should ever be diplomatic or just when on the subject of immigration reform?
I don’t think politicians should grandstand for cheap points about good faith negotiations with domestic terrorists whose re-election depends on negotiating in bad faith or not negotiating at all.
I wouldn’t brag about negotiating with cats about them going vegan either, and that would have a BETTER chance of bearing fruit.
So regardless of the subject you want our government in gridlock and our politicians to not get anything done. Got it.
This isn’t a let’s hash out an immigration deal where both sides get a little of what they want regarding immigration reform, it’s submitting to hostage takers for an entirely unrelated issue that shouldn’t really be partisan.
Let me know when you see Republicans try any. I haven’t seen it during my lifetime, but hey, there’s always this time 🙄
“Progressive” is a faction of Democrats. They aren’t the only people that support progress.
I don’t consider myself a progressive, because I disagree with about 30% (in very ballpark terms) of current progressive policy choices. It’s not hard to imagine Fetterman feels similarly.
I absolutely disagree with Fetterman that immigration should be curtailed at all - Democrats are not a monolith. Most Democrat representatives disagree with some policy or other.
Exactly I don’t consider myself a progressive either for similar reasons and I don’t agree with the notion of progress they seem to believe in. I’m a materialist and believe progress is contingent on economic and material conditions and that people’s notions of progress are relative to that. “Progress” begs the question progress to what and for them it’s often progress in a capitalist individualist sense, where more of the best people get the best stuff. Progress to them would be like more minorities represented in executive level careers but progress to me would mean the system that creates these disparities doesn’t exist. Progressives think capitalism can be redeemed by appealing to its own morality basically.
https://youtu.be/kOk05dKl8-c?si=gXlco_tfUU9fmiPm
Yeah, there are people to their left.
There are also people to their, uh, whichever direction the anti-authoritarian axis is.
It is a label that is applied to a small group of democrats only, as far as I understand.