Over the last few years my family and I have binged all of Star Trek, then moved on to Star Trek adjacent shows like The Orville and Stargate. At the moment we’re not really watching anything sci-fi. I was wondering if anyone had recommendations for similar shows (or maybe some books) that fill the void left by Star Trek. In particular I really like the episodes that deal with interacting with other civilizations, diplomacy, and exploration more-so than say, an anomaly episode.
I don’t see Firefly mentioned yet. Also if you liked TOS, try the 70’s Buck Rogers.
Watched Firefly and loved it. Too bad it got canceled before it’s time.
This was probably something I should have said in the OP, but TOS is definitely my least favorite of the franchise. (outside of some of the new stuff.) We watched the first few episodes, bounced off the camp, went on to watch TNG and beyond, then eventually looped back around to it. This time we did finish it. It has it’s moments and I can appreciate what made it special for its time, but it just feels inferior to everything that came after it. To me, TNG is the thing of when I think of Star Trek more-so than the original.
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I’m gonna change my comment from Kryton to Kryten. Im not gonna look at confirm that it is correct, im just going to assume you are!
“War Of The Wingmen” and “Ensign Flandry” by Poul Anderson. Anderson was the master of creating new worlds and alien races.
Not quite what you wanted, but the Alien Nation TV series is pretty good, if you don’t mind a little buddy cop drama in your science fiction.
For All Mankind is the Star Trek prequel we should have had. Co-created by Ron Moore (Deep Space Nine, Battlestar Galactica), the show has a bunch of Trek alumni working behind the scenes. It features human drama (and sometimes melodrama), geopolitical diplomacy, sweeping cultural change and scientific adventure against the backdrop of a multi generational future history, starting with the first moon landing.
I’m going to tag on to this and say another more adult themed Sci-Fi trip you should take on Apple TV+ is Foundation. It is somewhere between GoT, The Expanse, and Star Trek. It is loosely based on the Foundation book series by Isaac Asimov. I highly recommend it.
If you have read the Foundation books, the series will piss you off. Not just because it has very little in common with the books but because it goes against what the books stood for. And the most interesting parts of the Foundation tv series are the emperor arcs, which are original and arent from the books.
It seems to me that the creator wanted to make a scifi series of his own but just used the Foundation name for branding, name dropping and some abstract story elements. And then try to marry all the elements with some inane movie alchemy bullshit.
Huh. Watched the TV show and haven’t read the books. It did feel a little odd in a way that was hard to put my finger on. Maybe it’s that? What’s the pitch on the books if they’re that different from what I see in the show?
Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent
- Salvor Hardin
I can’t think of a better way to explain the difference between the books and the show then that quote.
Can you imagine Salvor of the show ever saying that?
This is the most parroted comment on this topic. Please actually say something original.
No.
What would you say the show is about? And not just the starting premise. Having seen the whole thing, what’s at the center?
I found it to be a huge morass of sound and fury orbiting an empty center.
I think the show has some decent themes that connect together alright. There’s a bit of a free will vs determinism thing going on. A bit of what is a human/transporter problem with the robot, the emperor clones, and Harry’s mind copies.
But there’s also a lot of other noise that kinda makes the show too unfocused to properly explore those ideas. There’s some war on terror/fall of Rome imagery. There’s the weird religious stuff around the Church of Seldon. The mentalists wanting to put their leader into Gale’s body, etc.
Some of the books are small stories that take part throughout the ages and have different characters. In the series they decided to have the same protagonists, so they went through insanely convoluted plot devices to achieve that and to move them around the place and have them being related.
But my real issue is that they really changed not only Hari Seldon’s and “Demerzel”'s characters but what the series is about. They are kinda making it a religion and then say “oh it isnt a religion thing, it is just a tool, oh nvm, it is a religion, ha just kidding, not a religion or maybe it is”. The foundation series is pretty atheistic in nature. And while religion is used(as a tool against the outsiders), the tv series makes Seldon a televangelist.
The tv series is full of deus ex machina and not even good deus ex machina. Maybe they felt the initial stories would appear somewhat simplistic and tried to modernize them and make them “edgy”. Generally, 90% of the plot isnt from the books.
“Demerzel” is a couple characters combined from the books but ultimately she is the most important character of the show(well i assume so, because she isnt a 1:1 character from the books). And she cannot be religious.
Most of these issues could be solved by simply renaming the series and some story editing to make it tighter and less convoluted. You dont need to have the same characters be everywhere, at every period and be related to each other, it is silly and cringe, just like Rey
PalpatineSkywalker.I will still watch future seasons and the show has many stories and scenes that are great(most of the Empire stuff, which are original). But even without knowledge of the books, i feel those artificial story arcs that try to connect characters are bad.
TLDR : If the books are Star Trek TNG, the series is Star Trek Discovery
I read the books and ultimately didn’t like them very much. I recognize their value but they just weren’t for me. I don’t remember a lot about them, enough, say, to get upset about how they changed this or that character.
And I found that show to be an utter mess. Just a mess. It’s a mess absolutely chock full of stuff. It’s a very beautiful mess. It’s a mess with amazing production values. But it’s still a hot mess. Forget adapting the books… what in the world is it about at all?? Ultimately it seemed to just get stuck on its emperor character and invented various struggles to take him down. Totally empty in the end.
Man, FAMK was dragging its feet for me. Too slow, i could only force myself to watch the second episode before i stopped completely. Foundation however was damn good. Almost like Raised by Wolves but a different dimension.
Thanks. Downloading it now.
Nice to see For All Mankind getting some love. Absolutely fantastic show, and definitely feels true to Roddenberry’s vision.
Yeah, I just signed up for Apple TV primarily for this show! Haven’t started it yet npbut that may be my weekend
I’m curious about The Foundation as well, since that was one of my favorite book series, but I just don’t see that working on TV
As others have pointed out, Foundation isn’t a particularly faithful adaptation of Asimov’s stories, but there good things in it. It might be more accurately titled Foundation and Empire IMO, because it focuses as much on the Empire side of the story as the Foundation. The first season was lopsided. The Empire plotline was compelling, the Foundation ones were… not. Haven’t watched the second season yet, but apparently it’s more consistent.
Thanks. It is still on my list to check out, but I’m giving it three months to decide whether to keep that streaming service. So far, I’ve watched some fantastic shows and movies, but do get annoyed at the lack of separation between what I’ve paid for and what they want to sell me.
I’m still trying to figure out how to browse: all too often I’m guided toward things that cost extra instead of the things I’ve paid for. At least as importantly, after watching something, why do I see so many potentially I terestng choices that I can never seem to find by browsing? It seems like the Home Screen only lets you browse a limited selection, half at extra cost, and you can only see the rest if you happen to watch some5ing they think is related
It’s not exactly like Star Trek to be sure, but it’s possible you might enjoy continuum. Definitely deals with moral issues, but it’s not space based, or as futuristic
Good suggestion. I forgot about this show. It has a good ending.
Very good, but it’s rough
You’re right it was. But still good I think.
civilizations, diplomacy, and exploration
Babylon 5 - It has a bit of a slow start with the first season (just the 1990’s Trek shows), but it picks up about midway through season 1 and gets progressively better (higher stakes) until season 4. Season 5 is okay, and then there are series of movies, and recently even an animated show in the universe.
To add to this, they have been talking about remaking the show.
So what you’re saying is, I should watch it now so I can complain when the remake isn’t as good. /s
Black mirror, especially the early seasons
The obvious answers are outside TV media.
Mass Effect 1, the video game, was originally conceived as a Star Trek game, but they couldn’t secure the IP rights, so ended up pivoting to a new universe that feels Star Trek like. Play it on story mode.
In print, there are literally a hundred reasonable options, some more or less like different elements of Trek. A good choice (in my opinion) is The Spiral Wars – rogue ship and crew, diplomacy, great combat, alien civilizations that are non-monolithic… Or CJ Cherryh’s Alliance Union universe (a good entry point is Downbelow Station, a good overview of the universe) – many different scenarios and topics and a lot of ethical dilemmas that would make Trek proud.
Of course, if TV is your thing, try out Babylon 5, Stargate, or Farscape. They all sort of start slow.
If you’re not into games I can recommend the excellent playthroughs by NitaZera. There’s no player commentary, just pure game. It’s like watching a TV show. Of course you miss out on making your own choices but the author has made sure to pick interesting ones. There is continuity because the events of each game (and the choices) build on each other.
The way you describe it reminds me of Primitive Technologies.
Thanks for your post even though it wasnt for meant for me!
I played through ME1-3. I didn’t know it was inspired by Star Trek but I could see it. I will say to anyone else that reads this, ME 1 feels really old and janky at this point. I got through it and enjoyed the story, but the gameplay was an unpleasant experience. ME 2 and 3 do a lot better in that regard, but then you have to get disappointed by the end of 3… so…
Or CJ Cherryh’s Alliance Union universe (a good entry point is Downbelow Station, a good overview of the universe)
I didn’t see this before posting my own comment about The Faded Sun trilogy by her. It’s in the same universe
I don’t know if you gave Stargate Atlantis a try. It doesn’t reach the heights of SG1, but it has it’s moments and is enjoyable overall.
We watched Atlantis then some of the movies. When we looked into SGU it was on a different streaming service and we read it wasn’t great and got canceled early. Still worth seeing the little that’s there? Does it feel like it got to end on its own terms or is the cutoff jarring?
I personally couldn’t get into SGU. I don’t know how it ends because I never finished it. It felt like it was trying too hard to be like the Battlestar Galactica reboot.
Yeah, SG1 was outstanding, SG:Atlantis had its moments but was annoying, SGU was just bad.
Stargate Universe was awesome. I will die on this hill.
Season 1 has some rough episodes, but the second season was great.
Babylon 5 and Farscape are great.
Babylon 5 is more like Trek with diplomacy and semi-realisitic plots, while Farscape leans a bit more toward Star Wars; fun, campy, weird at times but well-written.
You may also like Red Dwarf which is like the IT crowd, but in space.
This comment includes all the shows I would also recommend.
Babylon 5 came out about the same time as Star Trek DS9. The first season is sometimes hard to get through, but well worth it. The character development and storylines are mostly excellent as they grow and intersect throughout the show. Season 5 can take or leave.
Farscape is another one where some people are turned off by the Jim Henson puppetesque characters. Another older show but has some great storylines and character development.
Red Dwarf, older British Humor, silly.
Highly recommend giving Farscape and Bab5 a try.
Your last line has sold me on red dwarf 😂
Start with series 3, that’s where it was up to speed and you don’t miss much
You do miss out on how the show got better over time. It’s painful but its worth it for the overall enjoyment of the show.
Not trying to convince you though, just expressing a counter perspective for otthers on why it might be worth not skipping
Its very old, be prepared for some content that is not appropriate today.
Also if you do watch it. Kryten’s way of speaking is based on Robert Llewewllyns visit to vancouver canada and how he felt people in vancouver spoke, or at least thats the story i remember. Doesnt really factor into the show, i just thought it was an interesting choice given the distinct way Kryten speaks
Kryten enunciates so precisely. His accent is easy to understand and a pleasure to listen to. British English has so many different accents that it is sometimes difficult to follow without subtitles.
Haha cheers for the heads up!
Farscape gets… weird
Yass red dwarf!! Grew up watching the series on public television.
I found Farscape impossible to watch because of the main character. The show suffers because of the classic misogynistic writing where all the female characters are tripping over themselves to get noticed by the bland, aggressive, stupid, and overly cocky “average Joe” that was thrust into an unusual situation. It’s extremely dated writing and as a woman, it really irritates me.
The rest of the show is great! But the main character just ruins it for me completely. Unfortunately that kind of writing is everywhere in older sci-fi. I started and gave up on Stargate: Atlantis for the same reason. I wish someone would release an edit with the more obnoxious parts removed because I can tell that I’m missing out on some great sci-fi but it’s just unwatchable to me.
On the other hand you’ve got shows like ST:TNG, ST:DS9, Battlestar Galactica, even Lexx, where either women are treated with respect and not overly sexualized, or if they are sexualized then so are the men, and the men are kind, intelligent, and curteous, or if they’re not then they’re probably a villain.
Mmm, I know exactly what you mean. I’m tired of limp lead characters who just tick the boxes of a target demographic to self-insert into.
The Expanse suffered a bit from that (the main guy had all the magnetism of limp celery) but was saved because every single other character was genuinely interesting. Farscape had a much smaller cast, so there was no escape!
I always thought Farscape could be amazing if they rewrote it and got some good actors. The plot of good and the character development could be magnificent. It is such a great concept.
That could be said of a lot of things … a great concept let down by lazy writing and poor casting. Yet these things get money thrown at them - great effects, lighting, locations, makeup, etc etc
If you want something that’s in the vein of episodic sci fi and is family friendly, try find Seaquest DSV.
In that same vein again, i would recommend Andromeda as it was created by Gene Roddenberry but the lead was Kevin Sorbo who had gone full maga mode, so maybe pirate that one 😁
Edit: did you also watch all of Stargate Atlantis & Universe?
Watched Atlantis but not Universe. It was on another streaming service and we read it got canceled relatively quickly. Still worth a try?
I enjoyed it. It’s a different vibe to the others but still enjoyable. A lot of human drama and tensions
I would advise not watching Andromeda.
Why? It was a good show, and very much in line with what was asked. I may not be a fan of what the lead actor has turned into now, but I still enjoy some of the shows he acted in.
Because I don’t think it’s a good or particularly interesting show.
To each their own :)
I’ve mention a couple of shows in some replies but thought of some others so ill but them all here for both of our convenience
Based on this part of what you were asking fyi.
I really like the episodes that deal with interacting with other civilizations, diplomacy, and exploration more-so than say, an anomaly episode.
Space oriented
Firefly
Farscape
Lexx (maybe i didnt watch it, just caught some episodes here and there memory is foggy)
If you like the idea of a show about just the startrek episodes where they go back in time to various points in earth history and especially alternate earth history then i have the perfect show for you Its very similar to stargate in set up but not at all the same show
Sliders (this one and firefly are my top 2 picks for episodic style shows)
Honorable mentions
for just good space sci fi but more drama driven
Space: Above and Beyond
Battlestar Galactica (I never saw the original so cant recommend it)
Babylon 5
Maybe even Doctor Who? And Torchwood (these might be getting a bit off topic now)
For novels, i would recommend
Battletech books¹
¹read in chronological order. The universe of battletech has a big time scale all the collected stories take place over. You do get some spoilers here and there but i think not knowing what events took place ready when the authors wrote their book adds some good flavour to the overall experience
Twilight Zone
The Outer Limits
In particular I really like the episodes that deal with interacting with other civilizations, diplomacy, and exploration more-so than say, an anomaly episode.
In light of this, and since you were able to work through the not-so-stellar episodes of ST, I’d strongly argue that Babylon 5 should be your next stop.
It has a slow start, some more mixed episodes, dated special effects and both main characters (they switched after season 1) are plain “heroic American leader” types, but virtually everything else is top tier even today. An excellent political plot, humor, great characters with genuine growth.
Just be aware that it is different from DS9 (personally, I like both).
Battlestar Galactica (the new one) and The Expanse are probably worth pointing out, too. To me, they’re the best high-production-value sci-fi shows that didn’t sacrifice their plot. Nevertheless, both are far more grim than the shows you’ve mentioned and overall “feel” different.
BSG (the 2003 remake) was amazing. So much better than the original version. And it really ushered in a new era of more gritty, darker science fiction on television. My only complaint with it was that they largely botched the ending (especially the whole Starbuck thing. But I won’t elaborate on that as it is spoiler-heavy).
Was going to say Babylon 5, but yeah it’s very 90s at this point. I do love it very much
