I find the quality and variety of discussions on the fediverse to be lower than what I had on reddit. Lemmings have strong preconceived notions and little interest in changing viewpoints from new information. I think I’ll be switching back.
I think I’ll be switching back.
Not possible. The reddit that you’re longing for died a very long time ago. Subreddits are entrenched into their positions and will only berate you and bash you if you go against that grain.
What you’re describing here isn’t lemmy. It’s the internet in general.
Edit: Ohhhhhhhhhhh. This explains why you don’t want to be here. It’s not that this place is an echo chamber. It’s that you’re petrified of logic and fact.
OP must have just noped out of government and economics in high school.
You just described most Americans, sadly…
He probably just hasn’t gotten to that year in high school yet
My first thought reading the title was “Better check his posting history, probably alt right.”
They are certainly outnumbered on lemmy and face factual rebuttals without insulation of echo-chamers.
Slapping the rails like this is exactly the lack of nuance that lemmy has. You’re either with us or against us. That’s not how people look at issues. What matters is how people are treated. I’m not going to vote for someone who harms people. Being pragmatic to avoid a bad scenario? Don’t even bother.
Ignoring everything else, Reddit also lacks nuance. Both of these forums live in a black and white world, and I agree that you’re either on their side or you’re against them.
I don’t agree with other things you’re saying but I really only wanted to comment on that one issue. There is no nuance.
Being pragmatic to avoid a bad scenario?
You’re not being pragmatic. Being pragmatic is to take the lesser of two evils. You’re taking a different option entirely. Inaction. That is why you aren’t respected for your political opinions.
“Let not any one pacify his conscience by the delusion that he can do no harm if he takes no part, and forms no opinion. Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing. He is not a good man who, without a protest, allows wrong to be committed in his name, and with the means which he helps to supply, because he will not trouble himself to use his mind on the subject.” - John Stuart Mill (A quote butchered and falsely attributed to Edmund Burke)
How is contacting politicians and alerting people to key issues (that will cost the election) inaction? Inaction is plugging your ears and saying “nothing can be done to change the status quo”.
I don’t plan to vote
Contacting your elected officials and trying to get them to do something? Awesome! Allowing the entire country to fall into the hands of a fascist, dooming millions of people to starvation, debt and medical problems until they die, ruining a democracy, and fucking over one of the worlds largest economies because the president won’t simply say a thing you don’t like? Pathetic and also inaction.
You have exactly one bargaining chit with politicians each election. First you need to make it very clear what is required in exchange for it, then you need to follow through. If you fail to do either then you’ll just get more of the same or worse.
If you fail to do either then you’ll just get more of the same or worse.
I know! I’ll stand in front of an A-10C and get the pilot to pull the trigger so that way someone can’t shoot me in the toe with a Daisy Air Rifle! I’m a fucking genius.
Receipts! Kapow!
Being pragmatic is to take the lesser of two evils. You’re taking a different option entirely. Inaction.
I will admit I fell into this during the first election cycle in which I could vote, which was 2016. I couldn’t stomach voting for Hillary after the Debbie Wasserman Schultz/DNC corruption with Bernie.
I dispised trump, but refused to vote for the lesser of two evils. Never again… I’m not a big fan of Biden, but I voted for him and I will eagerly do so again.
And that attitude is why they will never change.
Why change when people will always bend the knee?
The solution isn’t just voting. Vote for the better of 2 shitty candidates, AND get involved at the local level to fight for change. Sometimes that can look like getting involved in local politics to push the democratic party left from the ground up. Other times it looks like mutual aid and community organizing.
I get it. I don’t think anyone expected Trump to be as truly horrific as he was. A bad president? Yes. But a nigh dictator? What a lot of us feared but never thought it’d actually happen. But at this point it literally is the option between a mediocre president who could do a lot better and the death of the republic. Glad you see that. Wish a lot of people like OP would too.
I personally didn’t think he had a chance to be elected… I thought Hillary was going to win and didn’t want to cast a vote for her because I disliked her as a candidate. But I would definitely go back vote for her if I could.
Anyone that knew his track record did. He’s always been a petulant child. He’s also had criminal connections since the '80s at least. He’s had ties to Russia since the mid '90s. He bankrupted a casino, maybe two. He’s only had one successful business in his life, and that was his “reality TV” show. I saw his face when he won, he was expecting to lose, and nobody in that room was happy when it was announced that he won. They all realized that all their dirty laundry was gonna come out with the level of scrutiny that the POTUS is normally under.
What did he do that was being a dictator? Pulling out of Syria?
Your entire account is dedicated to making inflammatory and trolling comments. I’ll pass on this discussion, thanks.
Good fucking god, you’re a moron. How did Reddit ever let you leave?
Get 'im, Stamets!
So lemmy is somewhat an echo chamber sure, but I feel if you word it nicely and approach with an open mind you can have really good conversations if you don’t agree with a topic and want to understand more. Whereas on Reddit I find it extremely difficult to have actual conversations
Also sorry for the huge run on sentence
You can’t approach Nazi and tankie incels with an open mind.
Fair, but who even would want to?
Agreed, but(t) fuck Spez.
The main problem with it is that there isn’t enough users
I think there are enough, they’re just the wrong users.
I think this comment says a lot, maybe it’s you who is the " wrong user"
My comment history is free to audit. That’s a lot of work though and jumping to conclusions at any sign of a diverging thought feels better. Definitely not an echo chamber.
deleted by creator
I don’t care about your comment history what do you want? People who pat you on the back for your shitty opinions?
Well, I did go through your comment history and after a few pages there are only two things I really noticed.
First is the comment thread you had in my community, /c/TenForward. You don’t like the Picard show, which is fine. A lot of people don’t. Personally I think the first two seasons were some of the worst television I’d seen in a long time. But you went out of your way to say that it wasn’t Star Trek at all. Not that you didn’t like it. That it categorically wasn’t something that it clearly was because you didn’t like it. You also outright called it abominations and dismissed it entirely as if you were the custodian of all things Trek. Hint, you’re not.
Then look at another comment of you in /c/Me_irl talking about how America has gone for the past three years without a “strong man president”. Well, he wasn’t really a strong man. He was a felon, a rapist, a draft dodger, he stoked a violent insurrection that ended with people dead, is a horrible bigot of a thousand different flavors, and is the most hated President in living memory. So yeah. You’re probably going to get downvoted for even remotely suggesting that he was good in any way or that he was “strong”. On top of that, you’ve made other comments suggesting that because Biden won’t say that housing is unaffordable, that the entire country should burn and voting doesn’t matter which you got downvoted for. But none of those did you get active pushback for. Just downvotes. One of them you clarified something and you even got upvoted for that clarification.
That’s it. That’s literally the only stuff in your comment history that goes “against the grain” and that you got any pushback over. If any echo chamber exists, you are actively adding to it overall with the exception of those two things I mentioned. Both of which you got pretty harsh pushback over because the first is just unbridled arrogance and the second is actively dangerous. I realize why you don’t like this place. It isn’t that it’s an echo chamber. You just have opinions that people don’t agree with because they’re shitty opinions. This comment section is a good example. To you, anyone who doesn’t agree with you is “the wrong users” which immediately demonstrates that you are the one who is coming into situations hot and hostile.
You’re the problem here bubba, not Lemmy. The reason you like reddit over here isn’t because reddit isn’t an echo chamber. It is. It’s just one you can tolerate because it’s one that’s steeped in active aggression.
You are assuming that downvotes are some metric I optimize for. They’re meaningless beyond the value that others put in them and reach a dogpile effect on discussion at some point. Most of my issue is not on topics I comment on or how they’re received, but the topics posted on lemmy and how they are engaged. It’s the comments I haven’t made.
You are assuming that downvotes are some metric I optimize for.
No, I’m not. I’m assuming that you’re using downvotes for what they are. A representation of a communities likes or dislikes of specific content and their agreement with it. The fact that you call it “meaningless” really demonstrates a lot about you and this whole echo chamber thing you keep complaining about. You don’t want an echo chamber where everyones going to agree with you, but you ignore everything that you don’t agree with? Riiiiiiight.
Most of my issue is not on topics I comment on or how they’re received, but the topics posted on lemmy and how they are engaged. It’s the comments I haven’t made.
Your entire complaint has been that Lemmy is an echo chamber but now you admit that you aren’t making comments or making posts about your views and topics that you feel strongly about. Now you say that “it’s the comments I haven’t made.” So then you are the problem you’re complaining about. You aren’t bothering to put any effort in to demonstrate your views and then are shrugging and saying that it’s an echo chamber. Clearly you aren’t worried about downvotes because you just said they’re worthless and you don’t care, so that isn’t the reason why you aren’t putting in any effort or even trying. And you clearly have no issue in making comments because you do that frequently.
Thanks to that, the only possible conclusion one can reach now is that you don’t care about it being “an echo chamber”. You’re just a troll. We’ve ruled out it being afraid of downvotes and you not wanting to put in effort. There isn’t any other possible conclusion to reach when you keep painting yourself into the corner.
Have fun with that.
This is some next level mental gymnastics. Connect dots in whatever convincing fashion you want in lieu of attempting to understand someone’s viewpoint.
Unpopular opinion: I hate this argument. At what point is there ever going to be “enough users”? I think that’s just an easy cop out used to avoid actually addressing whatever debate you’re having. And I mean this with respect.
There definitely is a critical mass needed for social media. Reddit hit critical mass around 2012 when digg imploded. When I joined reddit in like 2010, it felt very much like Lemmy currently does.
I think that’s a major problem with Lemmy, because it’s so disjointed it’s hard to hit the critical mass needed to keep conversations interesting and fresh.
I think what Lemmy has going for it, that reddit lost long ago, is the lack of bots and automation (e.g., automod) that brought the quality of content down; not to mention, the lack of reposts – I’m sure that’ll change over time. If that’s the “major problem with Lemmy”, then personally I don’t want to fix it. Bots are cutesy, and being able to do what they do is a technical fascination, but they degrade an experience that is meant for people [to interact with each other]. THough, I do admit that I am a simple casual and not a power user, so I am open to the idea that my experience is going to be more tame than some others.
Not everyone is here for debate and proselytizing. You want to have debates then go scream at people in the streets with your face visible and within arms length of whomever you’re offending. I’m here for fine art, painted miniatures, and owl pictures. Those are procured with civility not dumpster fire opinions.
What about Star Trek memes?
I’m not personally a fan anymore, but I’m not really a fan of television or movies at this point in my life. I used to watch a lot of NG and DS9 back in the day.
I do realize that Lemmy does run on Star Trek memes and its absence would be like removing the coal out of a steam engine.
To answer your question they’re not for me, but I do respect the impact ST memes are having.
Saying that “Lemmy” is an echo chamber is a bit ignorant. Lemmy is a platform; it can he used to spin up an instance with whatever values you like. The fediverse is the same. So saying Lemmy is an echo chamber is a bit like boycotting wood because a politician you dislike stood on a stage to speak.
Having said that, there are instances with heavy political biases. You can block those from your instance and you can block them from you feed.
… e switching back
Do you have a few minutes to talk about our Lord and Saviour, Linus Torvalds?
Wayland is the worst, in this 4 hour video essay I will …
People who hate Wayland are the worst. In this five hour video essay I will…
Will you kids get your bloody GUIs off my lawn!
Also nobody should ever own a car ever. Everything should be some form of bike. Firetrucks? Nope, Bike. The trucks that deliver groceries to the store? Bike. People who live in Northern Minnesota who live a 2 hour drive from that grocery store? I don’t care if it’s minus 8 out get those little bitch legs peddling.
Oh hi, I live in Minnesota. Assuming you called out the state because you live here too, I’m sure you’re also aware of how bizarre this winter has been. That’s because of climate change. We can make the state far more walkable, and we’ll need to so we can get control on climate change.
The anti-car movement is better described as “car transport should be heavily reduced and replaced by public transit and alternative transit”. When it’s intensely cold, people should be able to use mass transit like light rail and busses too. If they live in a very rural area, then yes a car will be necessary. But the point is to focus on human-scale infrastructure, not car-scale infrastructure.
I live one state to the east. Just the first cold place I could think of while being dramatic lol. I get the idea, I support the idea. I’d love to use my car as little as possible. But some of those c/fuckcars people have a very narrow idealist vision of the word they want to live in with little regard to how things need to work outside of their own bubble to keep that world working. The whole “electric cars aren’t to save the planet they’re to save the auto industry” sentiment is absurd. We have to make progress on this shit somehow. It’s like the idea that the whole world can be powered solely by wind and solar. That is absurd. Sure we can completely phase out fossil but jfc diversity is a necessity and putting ALL the eggs in the wind and solar basket is not a great idea.
Lol fair enough. Even with this crazy winter, we did see temps dive from the mid 40s to -3 a couple weeks ago. I miss my snowy winters, at least then it wouldn’t look so miserable outside.
I think those communities are a lightning rod for venting frustrations in a like-minded community more than anything. Systemic change is hard, and sometimes it’s cathartic to belt out a slogan before returning to praxis.
And then they dont get why we should have tariffs. Tariffs means more domestic manufacturering, which means less cargo ships belching bunker fuel across the Pacific.
I dont give a shit if my puny F-150 isnt great for cities or the enviroment when we have that shit going on.
I use Arch btw. /s
your mom’s vagina is a bigger echo chamber with more traffic than reddit or lemmy… crawl back inside, maybe you’ll be safe there…
rule 2
rule 2 hates the truth… it’s running from reality…
Yay! So glad you’re leaving.
Bye!
deleted by creator
Don’t let the door hit ya, where the good lord split ya!
So you’re not a lefty. Lemmy says: fuck the fuck off you fucking fuck we fucking hate you. Source: left but not left enough.
This depends heavily on the instance. I have consistently received this attitude with users of a couple of specific instances. I now just ignore or instantly block those instance users whenever I see them.
That said. You come to a platform inspired from, designed on, and developed by left progressive ideals. You complain about the left. I can picture the pikachu face you’re making right now.
I get that. It’s just amusing that people think open source means free or there is a place where you won’t be silenced for dissent. We’re human and we will self select for positive feedback. Lemmy is no less a bubble than reddit or xtwitter.
Lemmy isn’t an echo chamber. It can’t be because it doesn’t have an algorithmic feed so it’s not artificially boosting viewpoints based on engagement. There is simply more people who are more left-leaning than Reddit/twitter. The political posts aren’t self-reinforcing just really prevalent
Lemmy most certainly is less of an echo-chamer. There’s often good discussions and less toxic responses and blanket downvoting (not that it doesn’t happen).
Typically, heavily downvoted users are trolls, hateful comments, or categorically false claims/propoganda (which is why conservatives don’t like it). But there is still toxic bandwagon voting that suppresses dissenting opinions.
But to claim it’s on the same level as reddit is laughable. You can claim that lemmy is a “leftist” echo-chamer, but the important distinction is that the “right” do not hold themselves or their news sources to any standard or basis is reality.
Lemmy may be more leftist, but that doesn’t mean it’s an echo-chamer in the way reddit/conservative forums/subreddits are echo-chamers. And it sure as hell doesn’t mean the news/discussion is biased/false in the way it is among conservatives.
Not to mention, there are stark differences in the way extremism manifests and the propensity for violence between the right and left.
Look, your definition of toxic troll and propaganda is going to fall into a different window because you (and I) are leftist. Failure to recognise your own bias is just frustrating. I can’t be bothered most of the time. Lemmy is a massive echo chamber for the left, just ask anyone who says Israel is allowed to exist.
I’m not discounting my bias; I’m acknowledging the bias exists, but that it’s far more aligned with reality and objectivity than the mainstream right, which complain about the leftist bias of lemmy.
And your Isreal example is totally out of touch. The vast majority of discussion on lemmy condemns both the terrorism of Hamas as well as the genocide being committed by Isreal.
The devs are communists. Theyre no better than Nazis imo.
deleted by creator
The niche topics are expanding on the fediverse but it’s not quite there yet.
The general topics on Reddit are full of uninteresting posts and comments. Quality community members have definitely left.
I can’t tell if you think it’s an echo chamber because there are too many like-minded people here, or if your opinions generally fall apart under scrutiny. You may want to evaluate this.
haha never, here you can breath a fresh air of people and freedom, in reddit-twitter you have the freedom that a company “gives” to you. I am in both, but I am more proud to be here than to be on bruhddit.
I disagree. I feel that on Reddit, the type of users and discussions were mostly toxic and based on popularity. Lemmy is far from perfect, and there are aspects about it that I feel certainly are lacking, but to suggest that it’s a bigger echo chamber than reddit, I find hard to believe. But, if you can provide me with some examples that highlight your point of view, I would be interested.
I love how much more international and diverse lemmy is. I’m American, but I am happier with the fact that lemmy isn’t 85%+ Americans like on reddit (not a real statistic). I enjoy seeing more content from different perspectives and nationalities.
Interesting, as an American why did you choose feddit.de?
Makes sense!
You can literally predict the comments on reddit these days before looking. It’s the same articles, same top comments, over and over again. You try to be original there and you get down voted. Got to stick to the template and karma can be yours :/
I always hated that about Reddit; the lack of authenticity. I tried to be my genuine self, and always was downvoted for it. It started to feel like maybe somebody took offense and wrote a bot to follow and downvote everything I posted. Yes, I’m paranoid. :)
One problem I have is that the core design problem of Reddit is the use of user upvotes/downvotes to sort (and either highlight or hide) based on the number. But not only does an opinion unpopular not mean that it’s wrong, it’s vitally important for any democratic society that we are regularly exposed to viewpoints that differ from our own.
Lemmy doesn’t challenge that, and I wish it did.
Tbh I suppose I just want old-school vBulletin forum boards back, but I don’t know any general-purpose ones…
Density of toxic rhetoric is through the roof on lemmy. It rivals what you’d find on bad private forums of yore.
Please provide me examples, because as far as I’m concerned, I’m just not seeing the same level of toxicity you are apparently.
What subs are you in? I can think of a few that are terrible, so I blocked them, and many more where I don’t think I have ever seen more than critical opinion.
I’m only subbed to freefolk.
toxic
This you?
Uh, I see the stuff with the politics stuff but… how is their opinion without explanation of Star Trek toxic?
They’re not Trek
They’re not the arbiter of Trek. They have no input on what is and is not real Trek. They can like it and not like it all they want, thats opinion. But it’s pretty toxic and shitty to try and claim that because it doesn’t fit with your personal views that it isn’t real Star Trek.
It is indeed toxic but frankly it’s more pathetic piss baby behavior than anything else.
It’s a rhetorical expression that says that the subject goes against the spirit of the franchise. There’s no claim of authority in there, and I don’t see why you think so.
If it ain’t Tomino it ain’t Gundam.
If it ain’t Lucas it ain’t Star Wars.
If it ain’t Roddenberry it ain’t Trek.
Importantly if you think Kurtzman is making Trek then you misunderstand the series. Star Trek is about a future where humanity lifts itself fully out of its worst aspects. It shows us what we should aspire to be. Kurtzman just wants to make Starship Troppers without the satire.
Nice toxic gatekeeping rhetoric there.
This you? 🙂
Is it gatekeeping to say fan fiction is not canon? Kurtzman’s Trek is bad fanfiction with legal cover. I could write some nonsense and slap Star Trek on it and I wouldn’t be able to force you to consider it Star Trek. If I had a billion dollars and bought the rights to the name would that change your mind?
deleted by creator
Why are you so upset? I’m not old or racist. You did look through my comments and cherry picked examples to try to smear me. I’m very liberal, but admitting that would be a big backpedal. You disagree with my opinions, so I must be evil. It’s a bad sign with someone of your disposition is in a position of authority. If you wear the uniform you should strive to be worthy of it.
deleted by creator
This whole post just reeks of attention seeking. If they’re going to go, they should just GTFO…
Hey, at least it legitimately actually is an unpopular opinion.
Still baffles me how people struggle with the concept that an unpopular opinion discussion board is intended to and often does include actual unpopular opinions.
It probably has more to do with the fact that lemmy doesn’t default to your curated “home” when logged in. People might not see the community it’s from and just think it’s a random person complaining about lemmy
