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Just once I would like to open one of these threads and not see a bunch of lemmites embarrassing themselves by deliberately misinterpreting something.
Depends on the bear
If I mer another man in the woods I would say hi and walk by. Bears are fucking dangerous. I really dont understand why all of you are so afraid of other people.
Maybe it’s because i’m a man, but this trend saddens me. I don’t often see what the other gender thinks of us, but the fact that a big part of us are a bother that all off us should be seen as more dangerous than a bear. Damn…
Men in real life (in my experience) are mostly lovely folks. Men in places like Lemmy and Reddit can be pretty decent too, depending on the thread. But honestly, at what point has it been ‘safe’ to self identify as a woman on the wider Internet? Like to have a female voice in a game chat? Or in a random chat room? Between a lot of online harassment (which only needs a small slice of men participating in to be felt much more broadly) and the political and cultural attempts to strip women of power, I get this kind of outlook happening. It just really fucking sucks.
Please keep in mind that this is one columnist writing clickbait, not the entirety of women.
The majority of my friends also stupidly said bear
They’re all single though lol
It’s sad how many women respond to it though.
Female Andrew Tates. Just gross.
You’re seriously drawing a parallel between women who try to avoid danger and a man who perpetuates it?
That this thought crossed your mind is a manifestation of privilege.
Yeah. Misandry, misogyny. Both are disgusting.
This is like saying a buddy who doesn’t want to hang out with you is the same as one who shoots and kills you. Neither activity is great, but there isn’t really a similarity.
They’re identical ideologies, in your analogy the only difference is that one has a gun and the other doesn’t. Both are happy to shoot, one just doesn’t have to power to.
Both are disgusting and I want no part of either.
If you think they are identical ideologies, you have much bigger issues than avoiding people who don’t like you.
It’s because casual misandry is socially acceptable.
Not entirely. It’s also because men have historically been bad about telling creepy and misogynistic men to back off and shut the fuck up.
I would sooner see men step up and call out the bad actors – and I say that as a man who’s done so. Don’t teach your daughters that they need to be wary about what they wear, teach your sons to respect and not rape women.
I would sooner see men step up and call out the bad actors
And I would be happy to join you in doing this, but this is not the company I keep. In my life I can barely count the number of times I have, or could have, on one hand. Meanwhile, when talking to women about this sort of thing, everyone has awful stories but they all involve people that simply are not a part of their social sphere (and by extension mine) anymore.
I fear that we, as a society, have done such a good job of pushing bad actors out to the margins that we no longer have eyes on the problem.
It’s not even just that they’re at the margins, it’s also a math problem. One bad actor can sexually harass hundreds, perhaps even thousands of women over the course of many years. Now make that thousands of men, and see how it’s very reasonable that 1 in 2 women or whatever it is have been sexually harassed or assaulted - and that can still be less than 1% of the male population doing it. Anyone who doubts women get harassed or even assaulted often needs to have their head examined. There is a guy in my neighborhood currently who has not been caught who is following women while in his car. The neighborhood listservs are awash with women who have noticed this guy. There was another guy who was groping women on the trail who affected multiple women before they caught him.
And this is not just sex crimes. Recently, they arrested a group of car thieves/car jackers in my area. The four of them were responsible for over two hundred car thefts, and possibly up to three hundred additional unaccounted for crimes. And that’s for a very visible crime like stealing a car - imagine the numbers for something like groping someone on a crowded train or bus.
This is why people who say stuff like, “just teach men not to rape” are as insane as saying “just teach minorities not to steal cars”. It is a tiny portion of the population having an outsized influence because they can harm multiple people. When you start blaming a group for the actions of a tiny portion of that group, you’re just lost.
I mean sure, call out crime in general when you see it, but I have seen this type of harassment probably a dozen times in my life. And it happens all around, dozens of times a day.
You know I didn’t think about it like this. It does make sense though. I think as well it’s good to point out that the main recipients of violence and murder are other men, not women. Therefore I am suspicious when women talk about these things and being afraid but men don’t. It seems like a double standard.
Your neighborhood has a listserv? I haven’t seen one in ages.
This is also the same kind of unintuitive math that makes it likely that your friends will be more popular than you… because popular friends are more likely to know you than unpopular friends.
That’s a really good point. The men who could call out this behavior are usually in exclusive circles from the bad actors.
As I think about it, I really haven’t had many opportunities either. There’s only one that really stands out to me, and it’s when I was out with some friends drinking and we were getting some food to end the night. A stranger was moving to grope a friend of mine, and I shut that down quickly.
But that’s it. This is actually a bit of a difficult question. How exactly do we chastise the bad actors? Maybe the best we can do is teach the next generation, and just call it out when we do see it.
Part of the problem is that men are simply not on alert for bad behavior. They have the luxury of being unaware. When my friend’s dad groped me at a party, I was in a conversation circle with him and 3 of my male friends. None of them noticed him doing it, none of them noticed me going stiff and pale. None of them questioned why I suddenly felt sick and immediately called an Uber to leave.
The dad felt totally comfortable to do that literally less than 2 feet from three other men because you guys aren’t looking out for it in a way that women are. Alternatively, I’ve had stranger women come up to me in public to ask me if I’m uncomfortable because a guy at a gas station is talking to me while I pump my gas. We’re looking out for each other.
“We all a society” have absolutely not pushed out bad actors. If anything, women have closed ranks, but in my experience the men have not, without explicit instruction, called out bad behavior.
Thank you for this insight. We all really need more of this kind of dialogue to build awareness around what to look for.
Men expect you to communicate if you have an issue, that is how we communicate. We’re busy looking for the next tough guy, suckerpuncher, or knife-wielding psycho because those are the kinds of scars we bear. We’re not going to be looking at subtle changes in the color of your skin in a dark bar.
This is not the good thing you think it is. Women shouldn’t be hyper-alert about all men, and should use words when being made uncomfortable (or literally sexually assaulted).
If I see a woman go pale and then leave a party, I will assume “oof, must have really had to poop”. I refuse to assume every facial tick on a woman is a sign of sexual assault. That’s a toxic, paranoid way to live.
I agree that women shouldn’t have to be hyper alert, but with our culture the way it is, we have to be to keep ourselves safe.
How about instead of saying I should have spoken up about a man groping me, you say, “he shouldn’t have groped you.” There’s no reason my friend’s old married father should have thought I would be comfortable with his hands on me in a bathing suit area.
I’m saying men with opinions like yours put the entire onus of safety solely on women’s shoulders forcing us to live that toxic paranoid way, as you put it. If you guys would start doing your part to police one another, women wouldn’t have to be so scared all the time.
What makes you think me speaking up would have stopped that man? He clearly had no respect for my personal space, my autonomy, or my comfort. He has already proven he is willing to break social rules and norms. The safest thing for me to do was get away, because confronting a person who does not respect or care about you, who is not bound by the social contract will more likely lead to them hurting you.
How about instead of saying I should have spoken up about a man groping me, you say, “he shouldn’t have groped you.”
How about both? It’s infantilizing for you to suggest I don’t understand a basic principle like “assault is bad”. Of course he shouldn’t have groped you. That was bad. That’s just a baseline, floor-level understanding that we should both agree on.
If you guys would start doing your part to police one another
Well, for one thing, we don’t know which guys are doing this. Even if, as you suggest, the burden should fall solely on men to stop other men (a bit of a problematic viewpoint in itself), we can’t stop it if we don’t know it’s happening. Guys don’t brag to each other about sexual assault. We just don’t talk about sex in general. “Locker room talk” is and always has been a myth. Women talk with each other. Men don’t.
We cannot read your mind and know that any particular guy has done anything bad to you. You have to say something. And if you don’t, the only other option is for everyone to constantly be asking every woman if they’re being assaulted. Like that old Verizon commercial: “are you being assaulted now? Are you being assaulted now?” which is just toxic and awful and paranoid and massively damaging to everyone’s mental health.
I can 100% understand just not wanting to deal with it. Running away and then never speaking about it, and avoiding that guy for the rest of your life is much easier than opening a can of worms.
But if you do that, you have to take responsibility for doing that. Don’t pretend “not my problem, Men should be fixing everything”.
Well no, the real root cause is a lot of women are afraid of creepy men. Your point is tertiary at best is people are actually picking the bear.
perfectly balanced, as all things should be, which is a really fucking weird statement, considering that most thing should not be balanced, but then again, maybe the state of non balance is the equivalent to balanced. Which would then equate everything to be perfectly balanced at all times on account of the self balancing dichotomy.
(for those wondering, the comment im replying to has 5 upvotes, and 5 downvotes, and same for the one reply to this comment, at the time of writing at least.)
You’re missing the definition of root cause-why are women afraid of creepy men?
But that wasn’t the question.
disclaimer - i haven’t read the article/opinion. anyway, if someone said this to me, i think i would understand what is really being communicated, which is something like “i don’t trust men i don’t know, men i don’t know feel very unsafe to me.” i don’t think i would get hung up taking the statement literally. my thinking would be something like, “why do men seem so unsafe to you?” (knowing the answer is likely based in experience or observation of some kind), rather than “what kind of bear?”
I’d generally pick a bear too, most of the time you could just walk away. A human might try to talk to me or something.
My first thought would be “maybe we can be friends”
With the bear, obviously
I just want to know how many bears she knows on a a personal level to make it possible for there to be a “strange bear”.
How are you a bot?
you can choose to be one in your profile settings
But you shouldn’t if you aren’t a bot. People filter them out.
I had no idea this was set in my profile! - I’ll have a look
Here’s the setting in Jerboa for reference. ♥️ If anyone has “show bot accounts” off they won’t see you.
No idea how I ticked it or why - explains why I could never up-vote anything.
Thanks, TIL
I wanna see the strange bear, and I don’t wanna see a strange man, so the choice is fairly easy
I don’t agree that this kind of article is useful overall, but I propose rewriting the question a little bit to understand the response better:
“Humans, would you rather be stuck in the woods with a strange human that was most likely physically bigger and stronger than you or with a strange bear that was most likely physically stronger than you?”
The original question plays with subconscious bias and fears a little too much relating to men, and doesn’t address the true nature of humans in general.
If the question was instead:
“Humans, would you rather be stuck in the woods with a strange human or a strange bear”
My answer would still be a bear. I believe I could take care of myself for a few days and don’t want some other person there that I have to discussions with, compromise with, help survive or be scared of. Humans are too fucking random.
This entire conversation is ridiculous from start to finish.
imo for pedants like myself, it needs to be made clear if the bear is LIKELY to harm you
If its a black bear, red panda, or the like that is not even fair, EVERYONE would rather be with a bear that doesnt want to be near you rather than some potentially dangerous rando
it’s strange tho. could it be strangely rabid?
That is probably their point though.
Too many humans act like dangerous randos (men and women alike, but men are usually more physical), so being near a bear that for the most time just fucks off and mind their own business is more preferred.
Yes, but you encounter at least 1000 people a year, assuming you leave the house. Most people never encounter a wild bear.
If a bear doesn’t kill you 99.9% of the time, and a man doesn’t kill you 99.999% of the time. Which would you rather have 1000 encounters with?
The “point” is that men are dangerous, it’s just being poorly made and is clear rage bait.
This feels a lot like a certain image board talking about FBI crime statistics
From what I’ve read, unless you’re doing something like going between a mother and her cubs, if it’s not a grizzly or polar bear, it’s likely more scared of you than you are of it.
red panda
I don’t think that’s a concern, because pandas (red or otherwise) aren’t technically part of the Ursidae family and wouldn’t qualify.
I’ll spot you that polar bears and brown bears would likely be more of a problem in person. I believe the other kind of bear could conceivably be more of a threat online, but only because they tend to have sharper wits and tongues than the heterosexuals in their genus.
Pandas are ursidae, but not ursinae
Here’s the thing. You said a “red pandas are ursidae.” Are they in the same order? Yes. No one’s arguing that. As someone who is a scientist who studies red pandas, I am telling you, specifically, in science, no one calls red pandas bears. If you want to be “specific” like you said, then you shouldn’t either. They’re not the same thing. If you’re saying “bear family” you’re referring to the taxonomic grouping of ursidae, which includes things from short-faced bears to dog bears to giant pandas. So your reasoning for calling a red panda a bear is because random people “call the cuddly ones bears?” Let’s get raccoons and koalas in there, then, too. Also, calling someone a human or an ape? It’s not one or the other, that’s not how taxonomy works. They’re both. A red panda is a red panda and a member of the ailuridae family. But that’s not what you said. You said red pandas are ursidae, which is not true unless you’re okay with calling all members of the carnivora order bears, which means you’d call cats, dogs, and other mammals bears, too. Which you said you don’t. It’s okay to just admit you’re wrong, you know?
(I said pandas are ursidae, not red pandas, but I liked your passion!)
Edit: I forgot about jackdaws
Red Pandas are Ailuridae. So even farther away.
Some men feel the need to prove their masculinity to this woman who’s obviously rage baiting, the rest of us are thanking the bear for taking one for the team.
To be fair, usually women don’t have to be rage baiting at all and still get the same toxic responses. We still have a loooong way to go for real equality. But we’ve also come a fair ways, so keep up the good work! ❤️
I don’t see why you think the author is rage-baiting, rather than stating a simple truth.
“no bears have written in”
I don’t feel any rage about that. Not even a hint of any possibility of anger, regardless of mood or whatever. I don’t think it is rage-baiting. The point isn’t to induce rage. The point is just that men are dangerous and often don’t acknowledge it.
If any man reads that and has rage in their hearts over it and they’re exactly the kind of people you aren’t safe in the woods with.
For one, her title is a question. She’s also writing an opinion column. So no, not stating a simple truth.
Maybe it’s just a few of us, but it does seem pretty obvious to me that such an article is chumming the waters and the outcome of seeing a few sharka is wholly unsurprising.
I suppose it depends on how you define rage-baiting. I think she’s definitely trying to make a point, but I don’t know that she’s trying to make people angry so much as trying to get people to engage. Engagement is not inherently about anger and hatred, and depending on the actual content of the article (I noticed you didn’t mention anything about it so I assume, like me, you didn’t feel like googling it) it could be more about talking about her own experiences and why she might be more comfortable with a wild animal rather than a random strange man.
Your own response seems to be exactly why she’d write the article. Rather than being interested in engaging on the topic, you’ve already made up your mind based on the barest possible metrics.
Why would you ever entertain clickbait? Do you click on videos with red arrows and circles just to be sure it’s not just a stupid clickbait and actually has some merit?
is it a black bear or a grizzly bear? very important question. A similar logic applies to men except the criterion is probably much harder to gauge by eye.
I mean, do I know if the bear is hungry? What type of bear? I’d take a well fed black bear over a random person, they ain’t gonna fuck with you. Pretty much any other scenario and I ain’t messing with the bear.
Though honestly same could be said about the man in question, is he nice or hostile, can he control his urges or not, is he stable or a complete psycho. This question really goes both ways
The same could be said by both the man and the bear about Kate. So this question goes three ways.
Yeah but a well fed black bear isn’t going to try to make small talk
Neither will a socialy anxious person… Or a mute
A spectacled bear that has eaten his fill of marmalade sandwiches.
Gummy bear. It’s not hungry, but you are.
Water bear. Ravenously hungry.
Awh. Cute lil guy
removed by mod
