I’ve mostly left reddit and switched to beehaw, but I posted on somewhat of a niche tech-related subreddit today since there really isn’t a community for that here yet. And wow, I got instantly downvoted twice and the first comment response was rude and hostile. All I posted was a feature suggestion for software that I thought would be useful and that a good amount of people would like based on other feedback I’ve heard. This is not the sort of topic that should be controversial or aggravating, and it wasn’t like I made an ignorant post suggesting a feature that already existed or otherwise wasn’t well researched.
This type of instantly hostile response has happened numerous times on reddit for various different topics, but I just haven’t posted for a while, so I forgot just how shitty it can feel. It makes me really appreciate how friendly and respectful the community is here on Beehaw and on Mastodon. People seem to have good faith in one another similar to how the internet used to be in the old days.
Have you had similar experiences with Reddit and similarly opposite experiences here on Beehaw/Lemmy?
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The hostility was exhausting and constant, but equally so was knowing I would have to bake in a bunch of qualifiers into my post to try to head off common bad faith arguments at the pass. When you’re doing this for the very real problems you’re having just existing in society as a minority, it’s absolutely soul-sucking. Even if you know it’s by design, you’re still just one person dealing with a lot of weighty garbage in real life who then has to deal with redditor JAQing/name calling/strawmanning the minute you try to talk about it to try to offset even a fraction of the emotional burden.
I am pretty happy to watch reddit die. Less happy when I think about how this can further distill the abuse within a lot of current discourse.
I’ve seen that countless times on tech based subs when I was on that site. Very weird to see a feature suggestion bring up so much hostility from people.
I’ve receiced a reddit cares message just because I supported a male idol group. I definitely don’t miss that part of reddit. My experience browsing lemmy/beehaw/kbin is much nicer since people aren’t willing to tolerate vitriol and want that part of reddit to stay at reddit. Everyone’s tired of always being angry at a faceless mob.
It’s not a matter of being overly respectful really - it’s the culture of being shit scared to say anything which someone might find offensive. Sometimes you want to be comfortable enough to just be friendly with strangers, and hope that they will take things in the spirit they were intended…
Reddit is one of two sites (the other being a private tracker, the ‘cappers’ of which are a very very touchy breed - if you even suggest that it wouldn’t be difficult for them to name their files in a logical manner they throw hissy fits and threaten to quit… so that everyone simply SIMPS over them and worships the ground they walk on.
The difference being that if you upset someone on Reddit you get cut off for a few days. It’s a painful addiction - it’s like a 20 per day smoker being forced to go cold turkey for 3 days, and then being allowed to smoke again until the next cold turkey.
I guess I’m waiting to see if I actually encounter the toxic behaviour I heard people have seen in the Fediverse - I’m sure it’s out there, but really I’m mostly happy that it isn’t any longer part of the second most evil organization on earth…
Google being the first, and Reddit being the second… I’m hoping to see alternative search engines catch up ASAP (I used SearXNG to get a ‘blend’ for a year already) but there are many other issues which need sorting out.
Fediverse is a nice start.
Indeed I do. Reddit is specifically crafted to drive continuous engagement. Beehaw, Lemmy, Tildes, etc. are not. My understanding is that the engagement is driven through emotional manipulation. That just doesn’t seem to be here and I think it makes people not be so mean.
It’s improved my outlook on the world and on people.
Do you perhaps have a source on this? (I’m really interested, not a sarcastic question)
I thought that Reddit’s only major problem was the fake internet point thing, before the venture capital craziness started that is.
https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2024292118
https://www.frac.tl/work/marketing-research/emotional-content-drive-engagement-social-media/
The long and the short of it is engagement of any kind drives dollars. This is always been the case. The more emotionally invested a person is the more engaged they will be and I don’t remember exactly where the research was that I saw but anger drives the most engagement. I believe cuteness was rated as second best but again this is a foggy memory. This is why cats are popular on the internet, puppies are popular on the internet, there’s an r/aww etc.
If you don’t have emotional engagement, you literally don’t care so why would you post, why would you read and why would you reply?
More specifically not just anger but outrage drives the most engagement because you fight against what you are outraged by: https://www.techdetoxbox.com/weapons-of-digital-manipulation/how-attention-economy-profits-from-outrage/
So if you’re pro-life and you see pro-choice winning out and that disrupts your view of the world that would cause you outrage right?
If you’re pro-choice and you see how roe versus Wade just got overturned that would cause you outrage right?
In both cases, you want to learn more, you want to read about it, you want to fight against the thing that is threatening your identity, or your beliefs, or generally even just your view of the world.
There’s also a larger conversation to be had about how this type of conflict is used to distract us from more important conversations like inflation, global warming, and more generally class struggle. All of those, generally being driven by profit motives.
The most disappointing thing for me is that’s probably just a perverse incentive. They probably don’t even actually care whether people are angry or happy or sad just that the ad revenue just keeps pouring in.
It kind of makes me wonder what it would take to make improving the world become highly profitable. Hmm.
Default hostility, being snarky and trying not to answer when you need help. And ‘oh that will fail in two months’ when americans look at a normal roof window. That’s about what I remember from reddit. Stuff like this warps you, being abused and gaslit and molested in any single interaction really makes you act in a different way, you can’t be honest or open in that kind of environment.
I was amazed how many times on Reddit I had hostile comments in response, repeatedly to a comment that was days old. It’s like there were people just trolling around looking for a comment to attack, and once they did it was relentless. I’m so glad I was able to quit Reddit entirely. It was a toxic environment.
This is something I’ve noticed about the decentralized platforms in general. Mastodon is way less toxic and hyperbolic than Twitter. There’s no main character. If someone has a terrible opinion, they’re mostly ignored instead of dogpiled upon.
Lemmy and Kbin are the same way. If people disagree, they’re respectful in their disagreements and are by and large open minded and willing to learn something new. It’s honestly refreshing and positive.
I’m not sure if it’s the decentralized platforms giving each community a niche or that the ‘herd’ hasn’t made its way to the fediverse due to complexity but both lemmy and mastodon conversations are a breath of fresh air - it’s almost like the internet used to be on usenet and IRC.
I can’t wait for polite flame wars to start 😀
🧐 I beg to differ. What a preposterous suggestion!
Here’s a question though, do we still need an /s ?
I’ve always gone back and forth on the /s honestly. Sometimes, depending on the writer’s style it’s really easy to pick up in text but some text really needs the extra cues you’d get from facial expression and speaking tone to get it. It also depends on the receiver and the context of the conversation. My feeling is it’s here to stay.
I got told I was “larping” on Reddit once about operating a hiking group. A huge number of my posts were about hiking, and I think I even named my group a few times.
Also continuously got told by Americans that our anti gun laws weren’t actually working. In fact, anything suggesting they did was a instant downvote
So happy I deleted my primary account a few months ago. Much better environment here
Honestly I’ve deleted a great majority of the threads I’ve ever made within minutes, and immediately regretted a huge amount of the comments. It’s almost like people are being paid to be shitty on Reddit sometimes.
I agree with you, I gradually became more lurky because the interaction with others was terrible. I hated talking to people.
So far on beehaw it’s been overwhelmingly positive, and my dumb questions didn’t receive snarky remarks or vitriol. Sometimes, people just want to ask a question and create a discussion. That’s mostly me, I’m sure I can find a lot of answers myself, and usually do, but every so often I just want to talk about something with someone, so I’ll repeat a question which was asked 2 years ago.
Besides, asking the same question again could lead to a different discussion anyway. It’s terrible to tell people to “just Google it”. Yeah, they could do that, but its such a negative response. Could easily just say “Hey I found this link on Google, here you go. Try looking into x, y or z and include that in your future searches, let me know if you have any other questions”
I ask forums AFTER I’ve Googled, I don’t want the first answer on your search results either, didn’t you read my post? I already tried that:-(
Not to mention, the “just google it” comment is also terrible even if it was made in good faith considering how bad Google seems to have gotten at providing actual useful search results. Hence, why so many people add “Reddit” to the end of their search query, just making everything full circle. You’re providing the content people are googling by making your post.
I find it interesting that while I don’t yet have many posts/comments on beehaw yet, I find myself significantly more motivated to interact with the community than I ever did on reddit. I think it’s that the community tends to legitimately want to have a conversation rather than seeking validation or wanted to feel superior to others.
It’s terrible to tell people to “just Google it”. Yeah, they could do that, but its such a negative response. Could easily just say “Hey I found this link on Google, here you go. Try looking into x, y or z and include that in your future searches, let me know if you have any other questions”
I felt that to the core. I’m a mid-level software engineer (and by no means do I claim to be an expert on anything) and I sometimes find myself getting frustrated with some of the newer developers when they seem to continue asking the same question to me. That being said, I don’t think I’ve ever been deliberately mean to any of them, maybe just short with them if I’m under a lot of stress (which is something I’ve been working a lot the past year or two).
Telling someone to “just Google it” is very deliberately being mean or rude just to be mean or rude. I’d rather have an empty thread that no one replies to over being talked to like that. No matter how green or nieve someone may be, they still deserve some level of respect.
It got so bad on reddit that I would hope my posts wouldn’t hit the front page of a sub, and often when I’d comment I’d immediately disable inbox replies.
Someone in another community linked an archived reddit thread, and the unnecessary hostility and toxicity were readily apparent since I hadn’t been on reddit for a while.
What’s scary is how I started to feel numb to it and even feel like I started to become like that myself.
Oh man, that’s intense. I know what you mean about that kind of hostility fostering more hostility even within yourself. It’s not a good environment for anyone.
yeah, it’s a lot nicer here
This is the biggest reason I left reddit. It made me never want to post anything, and reading the comments section most of the time just made me angry. People are much nicer here!
I didn’t realize how afraid I was to comment or post until being on here. Almost low-key traumatized. Really has been making me question what social media can ‘bee’ and how many people resort to lurking when perhaps they’d rather engage
I totally get it. When you get that kind of reaction to just trying to contribute or you read a toxic comments section, it makes you wonder why you should contribute or be there at all!
Also more willing to engage from what I’ve seen
Right? I’d see a couple of notifications pop up in my browser and my first thought would be “Oh, fuck, what did I say that pissed everyone off this time?”
It’s actually be kind of hard to turn off “reddit mode” when I comment here; I honestly didn’t notice how I’d started to enter every comment thread with defensiveness and verbal aggression/threat displays right off the bat, as an anticipatory maneuver. There’ve been a couple of times where I re-read something I commented here and said “Oh, that was an unnecessarily aggressive way to phrase that. I hope nobody sees it before this edit goes through.”
Have you had similar experiences with Reddit…
Countless. It’s one of the reasons that I am devoted to Beehaw.
one of us
