• @[email protected]
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    242 years ago

    Android pretending to be Linux and not a whole OS running on a crappier version of the JVM.

      • @[email protected]
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        12 years ago

        Yeah but the underlying system is the Android Runtime (ARK) which is basically an (arguably) mobile optimized JVM.

        Kotlin is nice because it easily compiles to other targets as well. I’m just annoyed that ARK has really fallen behind in performance to the point where even Google apps get written in C++ to save on resources.

  • @[email protected]
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    122 years ago

    The second two are basically just policy, there’s no actual technical reason for them. The first one is because Windows is dumb.

    • @[email protected]
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      12 years ago

      The first one is also a policy. And as a cybersecurity guy, it’s a good one. No one wants a return to the massive botnets of the 2000s.

    • @[email protected]
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      22 years ago

      I was able to run the binary from a project I made in engineering school 10 years ago on a recent Ubuntu system, and all I had to do was make the freeglut library available.

    • @[email protected]
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      402 years ago

      Define old binary. The a.out and elf format haven’t changed in a very long time. If you mean something from an old system with unmet dependencies, it will run, but it will crash and warn you that some library isn’t found. It will still run up until that point tho.

      • @[email protected]
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        2 years ago

        I can’t personally run Kobo Desktop anymore on Linux because proprietary devs are so used to Windows. Running things for literal decades that; why update their software or maintain it for longer than the couple of years when it was released if even that?

        Like Linux is inherently constantly evolving and changing without any regards to how software developers feel. When using libraries that will change and break shit even with flatpaks, app images and snaps if they don’t maintain their software.

        So using this argument is completely missing the point entirely when so much shit is broken on Linux because of it. Despite said software being able to run up until they throw a library error at your ass.

        • @[email protected]
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          2 years ago

          I mean, there is nothing stopping you from installing whatever version of the library that is required in tandem with the latest version. You could even put it somewhere other then a standard library location and start executing your binary with

          LD=/my/old/library ./myoodbinary

          and have it dynamically loaded at runtime.

          The only time this doesn’t work is when it is something in the kernel that breaks the binary… But you can run an older kernel that has back ported fixed.

          I get where you are coming from with proprietary binarys that the devs have abandon. But to me that makes all the more reason not to run that software in the first place.

          Edit: also the kobo desktop Windows app runs under wine I think…

          • @[email protected]
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            22 years ago

            It… sorta runs. It’s a pretty badly designed program on its own (I think it runs some web stuff, but its not electron). It looks terrible on wine, some menus are broken, syncing doesn’t work, etc. In the end I just installed it on windows (which I have for VR) and then literally never used it again (calibre-web is great)

      • @[email protected]
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        432 years ago

        Anything 5-10 years old or older. Chances are, it won’t work unless it’s a static binary. Linux has long had a policy of “F backwards compatibility” in the userspace, so you need to dig up the 5-10 year old libraries it needs to run. And for anything 32-bit, you also need to install the 32-bit versions of all your system libraries.

        Acting like “old app won’t run” is exclusive to macOS is misleading.

        • @[email protected]
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          32 years ago

          I ran UT2k4 in 2016 or so, it was dynamically linked but brought its libraries, I had to replace some IIRC but afterwards, it ran.

          • AggressivelyPassive
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            72 years ago

            Dynamically linking libraries that ship with the executable is functionally identical to static linking in this case.

            • @[email protected]
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              Sure, but what is the point of the thread then? Of course a program will need the libraries it was linked against. The kernel has nothing to do with that really. The point was it is possible to run old binaries. Even a recent program will fail to run if its dependencies aren’t provided, that’s not an issue with older ones exclusively…

              • AggressivelyPassive
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                12 years ago

                The point is, that under Windows you can take a very old program, sometimes even from the DOS era, and the chances are good, that it will run just fine. UT99 for example runs perfectly under Windows 11 despite being over 20 years older than the OS. That’s mainly because Windows ensures a relatively high degree of backwards compatibility.

                Under Linux, running a five year old binary is almost impossible without 500 hacks. That is quite a different experience.

        • @[email protected]
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          282 years ago

          There’s a massive difference between saying “noooooo!!! That’s too old!!!” And saying “you don’t have the right libraries”

          Also because it’s a dependency issue, won’t flatpaks fix it?

        • @[email protected]
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          Yes but most people aren’t doing this unless they are insane and finding these libraries is borderline impossible and I personally in my search have found a bunch of dead links for them. So no Linux isn’t backwards compatible to me and never will be backwards compatible because it fundamentally can’t be because even libc and it’s changes have broken stuff in the past with some Steam Linux native games I was trying to run.

          • @[email protected]
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            22 years ago

            but most people aren’t doing this

            Does updating from a non-LTS version of a OS what is no longer supported, to the current LTS count?

            I didn’t realise it wasn’t LTS at the time, only when I wanted to update to the next LTS did I realise what I had done. Let me tell you, it wasn’t an easy fix, I had to write the StackOverflow answer myself.

    • @[email protected]
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      62 years ago

      Try running a new binary on Linux

      You’ll need a library that your distro doesn’t have up to date so you had to edit your apt list and then that library won’t load because it needs some other library that didn’t get updated to work with your architecture for some reason so you have to compile it yourself

      • @[email protected]
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        22 years ago

        The lack of binary compatibility is one of many things holding Linux back from mainstream adoption. Some say this is a good thing, but the reality is that not everything is open-source.

  • @[email protected]
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    72 years ago

    On a rooted Android, you can delete system apps, and even when not rooted, but that will only delete for the current user.

    • @[email protected]
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      102 years ago

      You can definitely dual boot but you will probably need to shrink your windows partition or install it on a separate drive. Linux can read and write in NTFS format but it shouldn’t be installed on it.

      Definitely through USB. I recommend checking out Ventoy for creating USB install media, you can just chuck a bunch of live ISO images of different distros on there to try them and find what you like.

      • @[email protected]
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        22 years ago

        So I should probably install it on a USB and then what, side-boot ig? Will I still have windows? Or are you talking about installing to the drive through USB

        • KubeRoot
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          32 years ago

          Somebody else already replied, but for clarity: Installing an OS is usually done without an OS already running. To this end, installation media comes on a disk image - in the past, you’d burn that on a CD, but these days you can flash it on a USB, and then reformat/reflash it if you want the stick “back”. You can also check out Ventoy, which basically lets you instead drop the .iso files on a stick instead of having to flash a specific one.

          Afterwards, you can boot up the installation media from your USB. This is probably another peculiarity, coming from windows, because Linux installation media often comes in the form of a live image - it’s basically just the distribution you’re installing, set to load itself into memory from the USB stick, alongside all the tools needed to install it onto permanent storage in your computer. This means you can just boot it off off a USB stick and try it out without installing. Performance might suffer and any changes won’t be saved (by default), but that’s what the other commenter is talking about.

          Anyways, once you’ve booted into the live image you can actually install it. This is where it gets more complicated, since the exact steps depend on distribution, especially when dealing with dual-booting. If you have two drives in your computer (SSD or HDD), I’d recommend installing Linux on a separate one from Windows, for simple reasons - it makes it harder to accidentally wipe your other system by mistake, and windows likes to overwrite the bootloader with its own one.

          Also, personal recommendation - if you use a Linux bootloader as your main one (that is, the one where you select whether you’re booting into Linux or Windows), I’d recommend rEFInd - it has a simple graphical interface and automatically detects boot options on launch, so it requires very little configuration. And if you actually install on the same drive, you might want to look up a way to add Linux as a boot option in Windows’s bootloader, since that helps avoid hassles with the bootloader being overwritten.

        • CasualGoalie
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          22 years ago

          There are live images where you can test and run Linux out of an USB, but most of those are not persistent (start from scratch once you reboot), the other option is called dual boot where you have Windows and Linux installed in parallel and you select which one to use during boot.

      • @[email protected]
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        2 years ago

        Fedora linux has dedicated media writer and it’s the easiest way I have ever installed linux, I’d recommend you to try it @Legendsofanus

        • KubeRoot
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          32 years ago

          I would definitely recommend trying Ventoy if you haven’t. Instead of flashing one image on your USB stick, it creates a small bootable EFI partition and a storage partition. You can then drop .iso images on the storage partition, and when booting Ventoy from the stick, it scans the isos and shows a simple interface to select which one you want to boot.

          This means you can keep multiple installation media and/or tools on the same stick, with management being as simple as adding/removing files, while also being able to use it as storage in a pinch.

  • Freeman
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    912 years ago

    Linux - “I can’t hotplug”

    Or

    Linux - “I can’t do fractional scaling”

    Or

    Linux - “ so you want secure boot, a graphics card and full disk encryption, well here’s a wiki based on the last version that might work, fuck tpm while we are at it”

    They all have their niche and strengths/weakensses

    • @[email protected]
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      162 years ago

      Linux - I hope you don’t need to print anything because CUPS works intermittently at best.

      • Freeman
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        192 years ago

        Yeah that depends on the printer to be sure. But the common denominator there is printers fucking suck. Trying printing across AD domains or having usable point and print in windows without just saying fuck it and removing the print nightmare mitigation via regkey.

      • @[email protected]
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        72 years ago

        Weird, I have literally never had any issues with CUPS, in environments where Windows completely failed due to the drivers being for an older version or unsigned or such

        • @[email protected]
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          22 years ago

          Yeah I ran cups from when the distros first started pushing for it hard and it always just worked at the office.

          Recently at home my wife’s been complaining about air print not working well, so I decided to throw CUPS into a docker and have her use that as the interface. I don’t know if it’s my Wi-Fi network my printer or what but I’ve been fighting it for a solid week it’ll work for a print or two maybe three and then nothing. Nope sorry that printer’s not reachable anymore. Meanwhile all the windows boxes print to it just fine.

        • @[email protected]
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          22 years ago

          But that is because they are printers, and printers are gremlins that make sure to keep you off your work whenever they can.

          Seriously, it is because printers need to convert analog to digital to analog, which is crazy difficult to get right.

          • @[email protected]
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            12 years ago

            It’s a little known fact, that Linux only got to where it is, fueled by the rage against printers that gave birth to the GPL.

    • KSP Atlas
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      172 years ago

      I have never had a problem with hotplugging or fractional scaling

        • @[email protected]
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          82 years ago

          Desktop Linux is well known for how compatible it is with proprietary graphics card drivers. I can only imagine the world of pain you’re going through with them being un/pluggable.

          • Freeman
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            62 years ago

            I mean. They kinda work. In that they don’t crash or freeze as often as they have. But leveraging them for workloads, including for things like video processing/encoding is no where near on par with windows versions of the same drivers.

      • Freeman
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        2 years ago

        My personal favorite

        Linux -“ batteries are made to be drained fast”

        • @[email protected]
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          22 years ago

          My laptop on battery lasts about 6 to 7 hours on Linux. It’s about an hour shorter than Windows but nowhere near “drained fast” territory.

          Now… if I use X11 that’s a whole other story! Somehow the battery life is cut in half because of higher GPU usage, and I still can’t figure out what causes it.

          • Freeman
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            32 years ago

            Haha. I have. It’s awesome. But systemd boot is a victim of lack of secure boot.

            On the one hand. The lack of grub fucking with the windows boot sector is awesome. But the lack of secure boot is kinda annoying. Especially if you dual boot.

      • NormalC
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        62 years ago

        Wow there! This user shared personal experiences with GNU/Linux that you refer to as facts and logic to propogate even more circlejerk!

    • TheOPtimal
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      42 years ago

      Fedora has literally all of this, out of the box. I mean so does Pop_OS!, but we don’t talk about Pop_OS!

    • paol
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      332 years ago

      Fractional scalling works fine for me. Am I doing something wrong? How do I break it?

      • Freeman
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        132 years ago

        It’s a global setting, not per monitor or per setup and also quite gimped. Also on Wayland, on my couple of setups. It’s sucks ass.

    • @[email protected]
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      Yeah I feel like I live in a different world because I’ve never had windows force an update on me. And that’s not because I did anything special I just flipped the option of “let me choose when to install updates”. But then I do run update once a month anyway because likely they would have worked out the main bugs with the update within a month of it and it’s probably a good idea to patch security vulnerabilities.

      • @[email protected]
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        12 years ago

        It was awfully forceful in early Win10 days and some people never realised it’s different in modern Win10/11.

  • @[email protected]
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    932 years ago

    We need about 300 ducks in this picture bashing each other because each one thinks it it superior.