For example workplace harrasment by women towards males like touching or groping being ignored because the victim is male but if it where to happen to a woman by a male the male would be fired
In favor of men: when we get angry, people listen. When women get angry, people stop listening.
Against men: men being around children is seen as suspect. Women being around children is seen as healthy.
Dude. I was at an MLB baseball game about a year ago. It was the 6th inning. I walked into the bathroom while play is still going on. I specifically picked that time because it was the other team at bat, and not their best hitters. My logic was “nobody will be in the bathroom, but nothing will happen in the game either! I’m so smart for going to pee now!”
I walk into the bathroom. First thing I see is a row of about 20 urinals, and deadset in the middle is a 5 year old boy with his pants around his ankles. Bare ass on display. No parent in sight.
I walked in, saw that, walked right back out. Like Aberaham Simpson when he walked into the strip club and saw Bart.
I was like noooooooope. I am NOT going to be in that room when the dad comes in. Even if I’m 10 urinals away. I can wait to pee in the 7th inning, and totally abandon my amazing pee stratagy.
Last thing I need is a protective parent walking in, and asking why I’m in the room with a bare assed 5 year old. Even if nothing happened. I’ll just wait an inning.
I would ask where the dad is but if its like butters dad hes likely losing a wrestling match somewhere.
Y’all imagine crazy stories. That shit happenes all the time and nobody cares.
Fucking bizarre
Your country is bizarre 😅 in europe: who the hell cares? Everyone pees.
No, it’s the same way here. People invent these imaginary fears. Same with OC about children in general. Nobody gives a shit or is looking at dads.
Like sure, maybe you hit the jackpot and find the crazy but the vast majority of parents so not give a shit in the states.
The consequences in the US are so severe it’s not worth the risk. Just an accusation can ruin someone’s life.
🙄👌👍
Said as someone who has never had to deal with it
Because it doesn’t happen lol
if?
I had a girlfriend once and i was absolutely mad at her for reasons i don’t remember. She said she would go home. I knew her for about 2 years and she herself said she never even heard me getting loud or angry with anyone. Anyway, after she left for 15 minutes she came back in and started arguing again. I asked her if she could please just leave. But she kept going. I really didn’t know what to do, because i didn’t just want to grab her and throw her out or anything, so i kept telling her to leave. I went to the toilet and hoped that she would be gone by the time i was done peeing. But she didn’t, she came into the bathroom to keep arguing. That’s where i totally flipped and grabbed her arm and threw her out and told her to go home.
I can’t even imagine doing that to a woman. Like just refusing to leave after i yelled at her for 30 minutes and all she said was: just please leave. Following her into the bathroom to keep yelling at her. I would go straight to jail, while she didn’t even really understood that something went wrong.
This happens a lot more than society is willing to admit.
Camera phones are changing this slowly similar with the police and karen issues.
It is now subgenre on youtube. It was weird realizing that some women will just act that way because “wtf is u gonnd do about it, pussy, call the police? Try me!!!”
Domestic violence against men is usually ignored or blamed on the victim.
If you’re a dude and your older female boss forces you to have sex with her under threat of losing your job, everyone just says “that’s awesome what’s the problem?”.
I had a professor do this to me. Was an adult going to night school, in my last year. She was about ten years older than me and we hit it off in a way I assumed was a professional student/teacher relationship. Had this with other professors as well.
She told me to meet her at a hotel once, thought she was joking and when I didn’t show was furious. Told her it just seemed odd, and she told me she is getting another one this weekend and not to worry about it, but if I didn’t show there would be consequences.
Through a lot of double speak she let me know if it didn’t happen, there would be no graduation for me. Not knowing what to do, bought a pack of condoms and showed up to the hotel. “No, we aren’t using those”. And that was several of my weekends until graduation. There was zero possibility of saying no, and no one to complain to. I can tell the story online and that’s about it.
Wait what? You can’t be serious! You did this instead of reporting her to the school?
Yes, I bitched on the internet. It was something that happened almost ten years ago, but it’s not like the school would have ever done anything. Let’s be honest about how this stuff plays out.
I’d have went to the police if the school didn’t do shit or threaten with lawyers. I’d escalate all my options since this shit is not going down with me
Holy shit dude. Sorry about the rape. Like, for real. I hope you’re doing ok.
didn’t family guy cover this lol
Being held culpable for the brutality some powerful men wield against women because of the “patriarchy”. But also being at fault when women with power exploit or abuse men.
The problem is dominance hierarchy, which expresses itself as patriarchy most of the time.
But not always, and places on this earth exist where a matriarchic hierarchy is similarly asserted.
Obligatorily, no war but class war.
I find it hilarious when people get upset about “no war but class war” as if the sexist and racist systems we experience aren’t just symptoms of a heavily stratified society
Basically everything women cry about men doing to them. If it is done to a man by women it is ignored or considered not real or never happened or okay and normalized as you put it.
I’m earning 1.2-1.3x what women in my job are earning, but when we go out to lunch, they want to split the bill according to what each person ordered. That makes me feel guilty, which is very unfair.
That is an intretresting view.
I understand, and respect the sentiment. However, in a co-worker dynamic, it makes sense everyone pays for what they order. I think they would feel guilty if you were buying them lunch. If my co-worker payed for my lunch, I’d want to buy for them next time. Putting a bunch of colleagues in an “I owe you” situation (intentional or not) probably isn’t the best idea.
I think you could offer to cover tip for the table and be within reason.
If they were making more money than yourself, would you expect them to cover part of your bill? I think most men would say no, you pay for what you eat.
For a birthday or something, go ahead and push it a little more, but don’t refuse when they return the favor (assuming they are decent people).
The fact they want to split the check is a big step from the steryotype of women expecting the man to cover the bill. You’re not their wallet, and if they treat you like it, run.
This is a troll
Thanks very much for the good advice. I think I will pay the tip in addition to my portion going forward. That should even the score.
No problem
If they insist of covering their tip; you can sleep knowing you tried, and they can sleep knowing they can pay for their own food.
it makes sense everyone pays for what they order
In my experience, the only time a single person will cover most of or all of the bill is when they are celebrating something, like getting a promotion or moving to a new team.
that or if they have the company card
(and are allowed to use it for meals every now and them)
In that case, they’re probably your boss.
pay grade aside, do you mean that it fills that you as a man must pay the full bill
i am leaving this comments since your getting higher down vote ratio without an explanation for why
I’m kind of prude before I get to know someone. I can recall at least 5 times my friends tried to push a girl from the bar into my cab because they thought it was funny I didn’t want to take them home.
Just imagine the reverse situation. It’s the same as women calling other women sluts. Sometimes it’s the most vocal men that make the stereotypes worse.
It’s fairly broadly believed that strong male influences benefit a child greatly, but males are looked at with huge skepticism if they attempt to enter most forms of childcare as a profession.
Some good examples:
-
Fat acceptance and body positivity. Obesity is glorified (even fetishized) when it’s a woman, whereas obese men are shunned. Have you noticed that nobody in the fat acceptance movement is vouching for the 300lb basement dwellers?
-
Older ladies who date younger guys are called cougars, whereas if you flip the gender roles, an older man dating a younger lady half his age is going to be labelled a pedophile, even if she’s of-age. Just look at at the anger surrounding Tobey Maguire (48 years old) dating a 20 year old actress. There are people who legitimately think men like him should be hunted for sport.
-
The amount of effort you have to put into your dating profile. Women have the opposite problem of being inundated with matches even with minimal effort.
The amount of effort you have to put into your dating profile. Women have the opposite problem of being inundated with matches even with minimal effort.
Dating apps have fuckloads of problems that work against non-top paying users, but for men the main issue is demographic: 80% of users are men. There just aren’t enough women on them.
I am in the dating scene at the moment. I definitely agree that men and women suffer the opposite problem on those apps. I think the apps are generally not designed to be successful and take advantage of choice fatigue. I don’t know if it’s a double standard per-se but I do think there’s a drastic difference in amount of effort applied.
Of course there’s no requirement but I do think that the minimum general expectation people have is that there is going to be effort applied to find a partner (aka, communication). That doesn’t always seem to be the case, especially from my anecdotal experience, that getting anything more than a 1-3 word reply is considered a success.
On the age thing, TBH anyone under 25 or so should not be dating anyone more than 10 years older than them. It’s still a very formative time both physically (brain development) and psychologically/sociologically. It can cause serious power dynamic issues that risk them being unable to end the relationship or deny consent for certain things. That said gender doesn’t make a difference in those scenarios beyond the fact that women are at a disadvantage and less likely to be wealthy and use that to control the younger.
But outside of issues where the older person holds power over the younger, I don’t think age should even be that big of a thing. Yes, people of different generations are less likely to have things in common and other conflicts can occur that are age related, but that’s for them to decide.
The body positivity one really upsets me. A few years ago Target rearranged the clothing area. The men’s area shrank and the women’s is like three times are big. The women’s area has all manner of plus sized models and mannequins. Nothing of the sort in the men’s.
It’s like, I’ve always known body positivity (when it comes to corporations doing it) is extremely one sided and they’re only chasing profits but I’d never seen it so literally before. Target was one of my favorite places to shop for clothes.
Body positivity almost doesn’t exist for men. As soon as some asshole guy does something, its jokes about their body. Ive seen jokes about being short and no one cares as long as your talking about Putin or Tory Lanes, fat and small dick jokes constantly thrown at Trump. All of these are body shaming that will never be seen by the people they’re directed at but will be seen by pleny of others with those features.
I think I get what you’re saying but let’s be honest in that a larger guy half the time will just need an XL T-shirt. The sizes of these areas for merchandise are relative to consumer demands and consumer volume by sex. As someone who worked at Target for a couple of years back in the day, yes, far more women shop there. And the style of dressing for women has always been more diverse.
With respect to the mannequins, there seems to be a difference in the perception of average body types in reflection based on the gender. Perhaps this is more a trait of conservative men, but no matter how much of a beer belly they have, they seem to want to be perceived like they’re macho manly six-pack men. Marketing plays to that. On the flip-side, it has become trendy to give comfort to women who – by far – receive far more bullying over being large both online and offline. No doubt as a white male I feel fucking privileged by contrast of what my sisters or wife have gone through at times in their lives.
I think I get what you’re saying but let’s be honest in that a larger guy half the time will just need an XL T-shirt.
I’m being honest when I tell you that I need 2X.
-
deleted by creator
Oh no, instead she has step-children so was referred to as a “Childless cat lady” by checks notes the running mate of the opposing party.
The only place to the conservative crowd for a woman to be in is in a single relationship with her own kids. Though I’m sure they’d have a way to gripe about it too.
This is going to be my new way to antagonize conservatives I know:
ME: Did you know Harris has had 5 kids with 3 different partners?!
MORON: I don’t doubt it. She’s a whore!
ME: Oh sorry, I meant Trump.
Yeah, he’s a good looking stud, what do you expect.
downvoters did not pick up on sarcasm?
Absolutely not. Satire of Trump supporters and Trump supporters are indistinguishable. The ear bandages, the diaper wearing. The complete and utter nonsense they swallow and spout. Being proud of “grab 'em by the pussy” and openly supporting KKK and walking the streets with actual swastikas. There’s nothing too extreme to be even remotely too absurd to be true from MAGA. So no, unless you’re putting a /s on your fake utterly stupid moronic take Republican opinion, I absolutely can’t tell that you’re ridiculing them instead of just being that stupid.
So one thing I noticed is that women betraying their partner has become extremely normalized
- Every “ethical non monogamous” relationship I’ve seen IRL is just a woman pressuring their long term monogamous partner into a situation where she has multiple partners and she’s struggling
- “Monkey Branching”, where a woman starts dropping hints at one guy while still seeing another in hopes of making a seamless transition, is pretty accepted. Emotional affairs are only a thing for men apparently
- While it’s always been acceptable to leave a guy if he can’t “provide” for you, it’s really fucking stupid in the context of modern feminism
- Women who use OLD are often encouraged to have a “roster” of men, who they form a well beyond casual connection to.
- There’s a large number of 30+ year old women breaking up with their long term partners to “find themselves”. I put that in quotations because this usually just involves a ton of casual sex. It’s basically the modern day equivalent of a guy leaving his wife for the secretary
- There are a million different love triangles on TV. They are almost all two guys and a woman who is disrespectful of both. The guys get mad at each other and the women’s behavior is not portrayed as toxic.
- Like 80 percent of holiday movies involve a woman leaving her fiance for a man she just met. This is always seen as romantic, instead of psychotic.
In addition to all that, women are extremely reluctant to criticize other women. This stands even when another woman is behaving in an almost objectively toxic way. I moved post covid. The first year I witnessed a fuckton of toxic behavior, but when I tried to point it out I would get dirty glances from women. The second year there I ended up getting close to other women in those conversations who took it upon themselves to tell me in a smaller setting that they actually agreed with me, but they didn’t want to appear unsupportive.
Whatever the intention there, the mentality enabled a subset of women to be shitty and probably convinced a lot of men that such behavior was something most women were okay with.
It sounds like you haven’t seen any healthy ethnically non-monogamous relationships. That’s a shame. As a part of one, I’ve seen several others as well. It can work, if it’s done for the right reasons and if all partners respect each other.
I know it’s a typo but I’m cracking up at
ethnically non-monogamous
You know it’s funny. I hear a million different accounts of ethnically monogamous relationships that work, but only on the internet where it’s impossible to get the full context.
Hi, ethical non monogamous person here. My wife did not pressure me into this. The only other couple I know IRL that does this it was also the husband who prompted it.
“women are extremely reluctant to criticize other women”
You should listen to women talk more, they’re extremely enthusiastic to talk shit about each other.
I actually do agree with some of your points though, but on that point, I’ve rarely seen a woman reluctant to talk trash about another woman when given a chance (maybe more in he said/she said situations is what you’re referring to).
I’m 30 years old, and even when I was 15 I wasn’t really friends with the super mean girl gossip types. Throughout my life, I’ve been friends with women who largely identify as feminist and sort of reject those stereotypes.
The problem is that post #metoo it became normalized to take the whole “support women” thing to such an extreme that it enabled toxic behavior. While there were women who tried to pull the whole “it’s sexist to criticize me for making poor life choices” crap, other women would get super offended for them attempting to use feminism in that way.
It’s extremely frustrating that the 19 and 20 year old women I knew in college had better moral compasses than the 25 to 40 year old women I know now. That’s really not supposed to be how it works.
Every single experience you mentioned I cannot relate to at all. It’s really weird to read.
I almost never meet women like this so maybe it depends on your area. I’d love to be in a woman’s roster but they all want monogamous relationships.
I’m had 2 women tell me they had this and saw one on OLD. Of them the 2 got so fed up of men and their bullshit. Started having activity buddies with benefits. One was my cousin so I knew the back story of her asshole husband. Other was a neighbour of a good friend.
Oh this is another thing. I know some women who are perpetually single despite heavy usage of OLD. I used to have a lot of sympathy, but at this point I’ve met many women in relationships via OLD, and the entire process took them six weeks. The second category of women weren’t “higher value” or whatever, they just had more realistic expectations and were less shallow.
Trust me, you don’t. These women will often want the full emotional availability of a romantic partner from you, with a fraction of both the emotional and physical availability of a partner from them. They generally want a monogamous relationship, just from an emotionally unavailable guy who is very physically attractive. Above all else, they will not be honest about your “ranking”.
Almost any woman who is halfway sane and willing to use online dating tends to get into a relationship in like three months tops. There’s also a decent number of women who are either not looking for a relationship, or would like a relationship but think the apps are super toxic.
However around 10 to 15 percent of the women I meet are very much architects of their own misery. These women are extremely vocal, generally shitty to their potential partners, and can always find more partners due to the nature of OLD. The frustrating part is I haven’t met a single woman who calls out this behavior, and a significant amount that actually reassure these people.
My GF insists that most women are just trying to be supportive, and that they don’t actually approve of the toxic behavior in question. My conversations with closer female friends backs this up. However in my eyes all this does is enable and normalize said behavior. It is also especially frustrating because I’m 100 percent expected to speak out if another guy does something remotely problematic.
That’s about you being able to enforce your own boundaries, bro
Okay so what do you suggest I do. Cut out every single female friend in my life? Convince my single male friends, as a man in a relationship, to boycott online dating apps?
The only behavior uncommon enough to actually get away from are ethically non monogamous relationships and straight up cheating. That’s 100 percent a red line for me at this point. Everything else is so ubiquitous that I’m basically forced to put up with it if I want to be social.
You just have to worry about being happy in the relationship you’re actually in and not project these feelings of disrespectful non-monogamy on to others.
It’s completely reasonable not to want to live in a society where infidelity or betrayal is normalized.
You’re projecting your own feelings of betrayal onto others. This is a you problem.
These women will often want the full emotional availability of a romantic partner from you, with a fraction of both the emotional and physical availability of a partner from them.
That’s a whole separate issue from women having a roster of men.
Idk about emotional availability. I just want a fuck buddy. If she can’t provide that, she’s gone.
doing oppositely gendered activities.
my girlfriend can change the oil in her car and lifts weights?
cool. healthy.
i can sew my own clothes and bake?
Weird. Creepy.
I sew and bake and no one ever says anything negative about it. It’s usually a topic of conversation. And back in the day when I had been called gay for enjoying baking by some insecure guy or weirdo girl I just laughed it off. Because it was usually after they finished eating a delicious treat I made and brought into the office or something.
i can sew my own clothes and bake?
Weird. Creepy.
Hard disagree. I wish I knew how (and had the time to) make my own clothes. And, who doesn’t love baked goods? These both sound awesome.
even just knowing enough to not consider clothes ruined when a button pops out or a tear forms would be nice
“Girly” things are ok as a career, but not a hobby.
If you’re a professional Tailor, it’s a respectable job that people seek you out for, but if you just like to sew…
Chefs are predominantly male, but if you’re a guy that just likes to cook, “what are you, a housewife?”
I guess it’s cultural, or regional, or just who you spend time around. Among my male friends, most of whom are straight and married with children, I don’t think any of them would even blink an eye at either of these things.
I do have colleagues from other cultures and US regions (US Italian, Central America, rust belt) who I’d bet would act the way you describe. I’m not jealous of that aspect of those cultures.
You can find a used machine to practice with and start by fixing and altering.
Local indy sewing shops that I’ve encountered have been happy to advise and some have open sewing days.
I fix my outdoors gear and clothes routinely, often with hand-stitching, just takes practice.
Thankfully, I’m not completely void of any sewing skill. I can hem pants, or repair some outdoor gear, as you mentioned. But, I don’t think I could make a complete shirt that didn’t look homemade.
I have a massive wingspan:weight ratio, so I always have to choose between sleeves being long enough on a shirt that’s 4x too big, or sleeves that end 3 inches short on a shirt that mostly fits. If I could make my own shirts and hoodies from scratch, it would be great. I just have too many other hobbies, and not enough time to dedicate to learning a new one right now.
I have a massive wingspan:weight ratio, so I always have to choose between sleeves being long enough on a shirt that’s 4x too big, or sleeves that end 3 inches short on a shirt that mostly fits.
So you look like you just sauntered out of Auschwitz?
<rant>
You’re the reason why most shirts don’t fit me. I hate “slim fit” shirts, and anything fashionable is so slim fit you would have trouble fitting it over a skeleton or a 1,000-year-old Sahara-desiccated corpse. Why is your kind so common that the marketplace gets flooded with clothing that can only fit a famine victim?
And I’m not obese in the least. I just have a 50-inch chest with a 36-inch waist. I have pecs, not some wafer-thin slabs of barely-there muscle that would have trouble bench-pressing an onion scape.
About the only thing that fits me are 2XL tops that are regular or relaxed fit. Even jackets have gotten into the “reverse-vanity-sizing” madness that has recently beset Canada, with many “size 50” suit jackets really being a size 46 or even a 44.
</rant>
.
For sure, and I appreciate that.
They’re great skills, and if you watch a couple YouTube videos on making your own clothes, you’ll be shocked at how simple it is and how little time it takes.
I feel very comfortable sewing and baking, this is just the best answers I have for the question.
OK there are some “feminine activities” where people would bat an eye but sewing and baking? Lmao I don’t think anyone would care.
Except if you fuck up making cookies, like me last week 😭
haha, woo! those are some hockey pucks!
i get eyes a-fluttering anytime either is brought up, but it’s good you have faith in your community.
No one thinks it’s creepy for a guy to sew and bake.
no one you know.
that’s nice, really.
Anyone who would think that would not be worth my time. I would never give them that power over me.
You’d be surprised how hard it is to get on in life if you’re surrounded by people like this, you can’t just ignore half the people around you all the time, especially if you’re forced to interact with them.
that’s good, they’re not.
and you shouldn’t.
Yeah, I was in Costco buying new cookie sheets and an old lady said it was so nice that I was helping out. Lady, they’re for me, I’m the baker here.
It took decades before Hasbro Easy Bake Ovens were marketed in the US in Yellow and Black rather than Mattel Barbie™️ Fuchsia Pink (💕) which is still the standard in US department stores. Curiously gender neutral colors started from demand in Sweden and expanded outward.
In the nineties, Barbie was built like only a select few Playboy Bunnies (Jessica Rabbit’s dimensions are physiologically impossible. A robot, maybe) and Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader action figures were ripped like He-Man (or soon-to-be Governor of California Arnold Schwarzenegger).
Gender roles are (to me) extremely weird.
Eh, if she’s old that’s excusable. Expectations were different back then
I don’t think that’s exactly true. As a woman I’ve had situations where I was questioned even when I knew exactly what I was talking about just because it was a traditionally male activity.
Yes, I know what type of battery I want for my car. Yes, I know it’s uncommon, I checked if you had it in your website before I came here. Yes, I know how to install it and I don’t want to pay you to do it. Shut up and take my money so I can leave.
I have several stories like this. In home renovation stores men that work there are always super opinionated on the problem that I’m trying to solve. I’m just looking for the supplies I want, I didn’t ask for opinions.
It doesn’t help that I’m small and look young, but still they should mind their own business.
No, it is. I had women joke and say “what are you, gay?”, then laugh when they find out I can sew. Have stitched up many a stuffed animal. The guys ask me where did I learn that?
“The army”
Oh, that’s cool.
I agree that men also get flack for doing activities associated with women, my answer to the original comment is disagreeing with the double standard part. I think it’s bad both ways and therefore not a double standard
Are you sure those home renovation workers weren’t trying to make conversation, might even being bragging about their own project attempts and you being a women had nothing to do with how they interact with any other customer?
I can never be sure, I’m not inside their heads, but I don’t remember ever seeing this behavior directed at my husband or dad when tagging along with them in similar situations.
Probably mostly to do with being a woman, though even if a nerdy looking dude came in they’d probably get similar treatment. Partially just how they expect someone who “knows what they’re doing” to look like (mechanics knowledge = man in jeans)
Also, it’s not just targeted at people perceived as “other” in many of these traditionally masculine realms.
Often, it seems like so many of these men see patronizing and second guessing as the only ways to establish and defend their own credibility on their given subject. It’s not just the “oh it’s a woman/someone who doesn’t look the part…I bet they don’t know what they’re doing” factor, it’s also that they’re a product of the culture that tells them that the most important thing is that they’re perceived as more knowledgeable than anyone else, and that the only way to establish that is to have their own opinions and views on every subject in the field, and then aggressively defend and promote those views while dismissing, undermining, and discouraging any views that conflict with theirs…or the people who hold those views.
And it’s not just big picture “world view” type stuff. It’s crap like, “which brand makes the best widget in your hobby?”. If they’re a “brand red” guy, they feel the need to not only let everyone know that they like brand red…they have to let everyone know that brand red is the best, and that it’s objective, and that if you prefer brand blue, you’re just a clueless newbie who hasn’t learned yet. If you like brand green, well you’ve just been taken in by their marketing. And if you’re one of those brand orange people, well you know what they say about those people…
Disagree but upvoting because I’m sure this is true for some.
As a man, I have never gotten any shit for sewing. But I do give plenty of people shit for not sewing.
Fix your clothes people, a needle and thread are not that freaking complicated. You don’t need to learn how to use it, just push the needle through the fabric, you’ll figure it out.
Sure, with practice you can make it prettier, but whatever.
People who think that are creepy and weird.
They are also the majority.
I lift and I sew. Fuck that noise, you do you.
You gotta learn to sew when you’re constantly ripping your shirt with each flex.
ITT about male victims of sexism-based double-standard, we see
- stories of female victims
- downvoting stories of male victims
- the top-voted post about how men can’t speak up for fear of being shouted down
Wow, Lemmy. Be better than Reddit.
This thread and ones like it just prove the point
I’m aghast at the comments in here lol
Like… I’m speechless.
That is exactly why I’m downvoting many of the comments here. Not personal stories, but all the “men have it so much worse” comments, which are ultimately just toxic against women.
Because holy fuck, that was exactly Reddit, and I do not want this place to end up the same. We already have a massive imbalance between the genders and if we men start discrediting women, they’re most fucking definitely not going to show up here.
I do want men to be able to speak about abuse stories. That is where our patriarchical society kills men, in that it does not allow us to show weakness. But it cannot fucking devolve into a us vs. them discussion, which this whole question is locked and loaded towards. That is not helpful to anyone.
Clothes in general, I could borrow my husband’s shirt and nobody would bat an eye but I’d he borrowed mine (he can’t because I’m smaller, but assuming we were the same size-ish) would look strange.
I don’t think groping is gonna be ignored in any workplace, in any direction.
Huh? Groping is ignored much of the time if done by a woman to a man
In some workplaces it’s even ignored in both directions. At last, true gender equality! /s
Many (basically all) companies will completely ignore an issue until they’re absolutely forced to act on it, it’s pretty par for the course.
I’ve read enough accounts from both men and women to know that sexual harassment is not taken seriously at many places.
Groping is very much ignored in both directions at work
Men are often expected to swallow their emotions and just “function”, while women are allowed and even encouraged to display them openly
I would counter this and say any woman with a career can absolutely not show emotion. They’re expected to behave like men, which are in turn not supposed to show emotion in the workplace. It’s less of a double standard and more of a toxic standard.
Commenter didn’t say work. It’s true in all circumstances.
You recognizing it as true in the work place by understanding women are expected to be like men in the work place. Because men are not expected to show emotions.
Your counter is actually an example.
Men are often expected to swallow
😏
their emotions
😔
It’s not that women are “allowed,” it’s more so that women are expected to be emotional because they’re oh such emotional creatures and of course she’s crying.
Women absolutely are penalized for showing emotion. Socially between friends there is a lot better support, and that is probably what you are thinking of. In a workplace environment though, there can be serious consequences for expressing anything other than congeniality. If you’re socially withdrawn you’re an ice queen, if you get angry (no matter how justifiable) you’re a bitch or a dragon lady. If you’re stressed and not perfectly composed you’re weak “unable to handle the pressure”. I get that men are subject to the same kind of judgments but there seems to be more leeway.
That’s a funny one because men are celebrated for suppressing emotions and women are penalisd for showing them.
Its sort of crazy how there’s no real effort to help people develop their emotional intelligence as a kid or beyond. It should be like no later than grade 1 or 2 where people learn about their feelings and setting limits with people.
So many parents gasp at the idea of their child actually having boundaries that are to be respected because muh dominion or they never learned about it themselves and aren’t open to everyone simply being more observant and respectful of them
One reason we chose the school my kids go to is because they do teach about emotions and friendship and so on.
Yeah, it is one of the things I love about the district we are in. They are big on EQ and also very inclusive (my kids are on the spectrum, so I like that they actively teach about inclusion).
Thats awesome! Super important stuff for being well and a good person to have around for others
This is called Social Emotional Learning and is a big thing in the school I teach in, but has big pushback from many conservatives because it talks about respecting people for their differences, even if they are gay or trans or a poc.
There’s a huge discrepancy in how people understand the word respect.
The “blindly follow what I say and override all your reactions to the pain it will probably cost” and hold your tongue/bottle your emotions shit needs to die in a fire. That is blind control, it is very different and it means much more work and negative outcomes for all involved.
Love this, thanks for giving such shape to the form I was getting at
Np. It’s not mine of course, but unfortunately I don’t know what the source is.
Unless that emotion is anger. That’s the one exception.
Yes! 100%.
Yeah the patriarchy is really just the ruling class using us to suppress each other.
Which is also funny because that leads directly to a lot of mental problems for these men.
I see a change is this trend, but a lot of damage has already been done and it will take quite a while to recover from this.
Hmmm, I think Kyle Rittenhouse and Gus Walz might have a different perspective. One displayed remorse through blubbering “tears” to play-act out of murder charges and one displayed genuine emotion for a successful family member. Both were pilloried for displaying emotion, fake or real.
Magic Eight Ball says: Concentrate and ask again
