Is this the Nintendo redemption arc?
Nope, just your regularly scheduled Nintendo technology lag.
They can’t automate the legal team yet.
Nintendo can’t even do games on a technical standard higher than 2012, how should they use AI? And their hardware is way to weak as well BTW.
They’re just lucky that the current AI Models are crap, otherwise this would be the next standard they’re missing in their “more of the same since 1980” games.
They should use more energy and money for developing innovative games than suing every fart on the planet.
They’re just lucky that the current AI Models are crap, otherwise this would be the next standard they’re missing in their “more of the same since 1980” games.
So you are complaining they are not adopting something you admit is currently crap?!
I’m going to complain about billionaire taxes then, I mean I have no billions but I’ll complain anyway
No, I’m saying, that Nintendo wouldnt benefit at all from AI, so why should they use it in the first place? And the reasons for that are:
-AI in it’s current state can only support in certain areas -Nintendo’s games aren’t massive enough to profit from the things AI can do atm
An example: AI can do Text to Speech, but Nintendo doesn’t make games like TES. Nintendo needs to optimise their games highly to run on a switch, which AI can’t do.
He is just stating the obvious, like saying the sun is hot.
He is just stating the obvious, like saying the sun is hot.
But he could say they are engineering to catch up to the trend, right? the question is not if they are to implement AI features in their current 8 year old console. The question is if AI is in their development path in the future
And the answer is no, Nintendo does not seem to see value there. I for one agree, the stuff you mentioned about AI in other comments in the thread go from “meh” to “I actively do not want that in my games”. This is just my opinion as a casual gamer but I see logic in Nintendo’s stance here.
I’ll never understand how these always get downvoted. I understand Nintendo people love their zelda and mario games, but their console is less powerful than most mobile phones. I bought disco elysium on the switch that i only have for my nephew. It has a lot of trouble running DISCO ELYSIUM!
If you only judge games based on graphics, I understand your point of view.
But I think it can be argued that Nintendo’s gameplay/design is pretty often up to date, if not ahead of it’s time. And tbh to me that matters the most.
Ex: Mario Wonder, Odyssey, BOTW, TOTK, Metroid Dread, Animal Crossing, etc
Putting the whole judging games based on graphics out there feels dishonest. I personally don’t give a rip how games look on the switch or can at the very least get over it pretty quick as long as they aren’t plgsued with performance issues . We shouldn’t be in a spot where playing modern console games on emulator is often a better experience than the real thing.
The switch architecture is very dated and the only ones who really know their way around to hack things together and make it kinda work is Nintendo. Still amazed that TOTK is playable on Switch with everything going on, but for a third-party dev to do the same would probably take an insane amount of effort. Its not worth it. Just update the standard and everyone will benefit.
What about any of those are ahead of their time?
How are they ahead of their time? AC is just grinding and grinding and grinding. Mario ist jumping jumping and jumping. They do good lvl design but that’s it. No story, no characters, no innovative gameplay, nearly always just more of the same. Imagine Sony still releasing God of War games with gameplay like the PS2 and PS3 games, they would get hated into oblivion.
Everyone is free to like the games they want and I’m not saying that Nintendo games aren’t fun, but they’re overhyped. Nintendo is a lazy ass company, they innovate only when it is necessary. Without their IPs they would have already gone bankrupt or developer only. They had more than one crappy console, that nearly ruined the company (newest esample: Wii U). Another example are the Pokémon games, where is the innovation? It needs more than five types of garbage can Pokemon’s to call it innovation. And instead of doing good games they keep suing other indie companies that are capable of making better games than Nintendo itself after developing that ip for over 2 decades.
I play on Switch and Pc, different games on each. The attraction to games on the switch for me isn’t graphics or power or performance… at all…
It’s gameplay and form factor.
I totally get your point and agree with it. I still play on my Vita, GB and PSP to this day.
What I’m criticising here is Nintendo as a company and the article itself. Is obvious that they don’t want AI because they can’t handle it and they don’t need it. AI atm can replace artists and actors but Nintendo games have nearly nothing to synchronise and the models for the games aren’t that difficult to make. So why should Nintendo care for AI anyway? Just take a look at Google and the other companies spending billions every year just to train their AIs.
AI atm can replace artists and actors
Another things no consumer wants
Because even though everyone knows Nintendo’s consoles are under powered, they still usually deliver a ton of gameplay fun.
In this particular case, very few people want more “AI” in their stuff… and as even OP admits, current “AI” is crap. So why would I want to pay extra $$$ for hardware that can run “AI” when my gaming experience is likely not going to improve one bit?
Nintendo n…
Wait they did a good thing? huh, that’s… new
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I mean morally good, if Disney didn’t suck total dogshit now, I’d call Nintendo the Disney of Gaming
That’s cool now could you tell your lawyers to go in a different direction with respect to mods and fan games?
Pokemon effectively makes them all the money they need and all they need to do is sick one of the rabid lawyers they keep in the basement on anyone even remotely infringing upon what they think they own.
They’re like a litigation equivalent to McDonald’s land ownership twist to company financial equivalency.
Nintendo noticed ai exists just now and thus dodged the hype cycle
Massive massive W for once
Maybe the ‘what the customer wants’ route would have been more successful?
If Nintendo weren’t such pricks about their IP, they would be a perfect company. They don’t chase short-lived trends, they don’t make live-service slop or loot boxes, their DLC is usually great (without feeling necessary), they constantly experiment and innovate, and most of their hardware is incredibly durable and reliable (joycon drift being the big exception). But if you make a fan game or host a tournament using one of their games, even if it’s been out of print for 20 years, even if you’re not monetizing it, they will come after you. It’s the one thing I really hate about them.
If Nintendo weren’t such pricks about their IP, they would be a perfect company
They also have some atrocious work culture. Managers screaming at people. Developers routinely overworked to burnout. Leads can be egomaniacal in their pursuit of a particular vision.
The IP attitude is deeply rooted in a company culture of strict control and authoritarian attitudes.
That said, they produce some incredible art and style. So it’s hard to argue with the results.
Wish people would be more comfortable simply feeling inspired by Nintendo and doing their own things, rather than trying to harvest Nintendo IP and fight them for control. Would make everyone happier over the long term.
I mean that’s literally exactly what PocketPair did with Palworld and look what’s going on with that.
I honestly feel like Nintendo simply can’t let people do what they do, better. They can’t allow it for whatever bullshit company-wide egotistical reason.
I honestly feel like Nintendo simply can’t let people do what they do, better.
Palworld was very explicitly cribbing from Nintendo IP. Down to the lead developers caught on record demanding that certain existing Pokemon be used as models for their content.
Also, the game was a bit of a flash in the pan. Idk if I’d conclude they “did it better” so much as they capitalized on a couple of popular trends to catch a surge of early adoption. Pokemon’s been chugging along since 1996. Lets see if Palworld can survive a full three years, nevermind the next 30.
How were they stealing from Nintendo? And even if there is a record of some Palworld devs saying they want to use Pokemon in the game 1:1, that’s not what ended up happening at all. The only ones who actually think PocketPair used 1:1 Pokemon designs are actually blind Nintendo fanboys.
The Palworld suit is not an IP suit because whether or not Palworld was “cribbing” from Pokemon they were well within the bounds of the law. They don’t even have to claim parody - their designs are their designs, despite the clear inspiration.
The lawsuit is over software patents, most likely the patents that Nintendo has for throwing a ball in a virtual space to capture a creature and riding on a virtual creature, aka absolute specious bullshit.
Oh, I’m sure sure their culture is terrible, but that’s also about what I expect from any game developer in 2024. At least they’re not like Microsoft, buying up small studios, working them to death, and then shutting them down for short-term profit. But you’re absolutely right, that is a shitty thing about their company that I completely glossed over.
Also, to he fair, Palword tried to do something cool inspired by Pokémon, and The Pokémon Company and Nintendo are suing them on what seems like a bullshit patent-troll claim. I actually think some of their character designs do seem like blatant rip-offs, but the idea that those games are too mechanically similar is nonsense.
Arguing with the results is the reason we had WW2. Slaves built pyramids, but I wouldn’t like going bavk to that way of work.
Slaves built pyramids
Skilled craftsmen built the pyramids, slaves were mostly relegated to less prestigious work like farming.
Wish people would be more comfortable simply feeling inspired by Nintendo and doing their own things
The PalWorld devs did that. Nintendo sued them anyway.
I believe the Palworld devs got caught plagiarizing in their own internal messaging.
That’s more of a Japanese company thing than something specific to Nintendo.
Not that it makes it OK, but this is a country that looked at how workers are treated in America and decided the problem was not going hard enough.
Just out of curiosity, do you have a source for your claims that Nintendo has a bad work environment?
I’d love to learn more about it and verify this claim.
They seem to have really high employee retention:
Nintendo’s employee retention rate is 98.9%, surpassing the national average of 70% thanks to factors like brand strength and a strong employee welfare program.
That said, it’s a Japanese company, and Japanese work culture is very different from western work culture (read: a lot more stressful), but they seem to be doing reasonably well vs their peers.
I was trying to look more into game dev crunch at Nintendo and the most recent articles I could find were about Mario 64, Ocarina of Time, Majora’s Mask (all for the Nintendo 64) and Metroid Prime (for the GameCube). From what I can tell all of their recent games have been delayed instead of forcing crunch.
That being said the difference in work culture means they probably still have longer hours but they aren’t giving their developers actual PTSD like EA and Activision. It is really sad that the bar for AAA game devs is not having devs hospitalized from overworking. Hopefully more game dev and software dev companies can meaningfully unionize to combat that.
I seen a video yesterday about how people in Japan hire people to quit their jobs. The girl said she spent a lot of time being grilled and felt like she owed the boss an apology.
Not Nintendo, still, I found it interesting.
At least from their games
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/nintendo-now-apparently-uses-ai-“lawyers”-to-dmca-sites….1671298/
The different direction;
No more original IP, and 99% of profits come from litigating against end users.
(It’s the same direction as before, just not including AI yet)
I mean, that direction is extremely lucrative, whereas AI is extremely expensive and totally unproven to be profitable.
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They want AI to get to a point where they can sue it.
Huh. Time to buy some stock.
If the “different direction” to sue everyone who liked them before?!
It’s too early. In 10 years Nintendo will, it’s the Nintendo rhythm.
You don’t have to shove AI into everything but it allows for a lot of amazing and crazy things. Gameplay first and I don’t think we need AI for this, but a lot of side elements can be handled by AI. Be it sounds, dialogues, voices, randomness in monster or level design etc. In general, AI could be good with filling games with content without it being generic. It will help to elevate content past obviously identifiable “random” content. Same way an AI image doesn’t look AI if it’s well made. However, we’ll get a lot of shovelware stuff of lazy companies, no one needs those.
I know it was funky in its initial release, but I miss when openAI had free api access so a bunch of games temporarily had chat with NPCs. It was really cool.
Spacebourne 2 had an AI ship computer you could ask questions or whatever. Craftopia had all NPCs and monsters with chat capabilities which was kinda hilarious because a goblin that’s attacking you would tell you it’s peaceful and would never hurt anyone lol
It’s one thing I’ve wanted forever to be in a video game, the ability to communicate what I want to communicate and to get dynamic responses, not just some dialogue wheel or whatever
There is already a lot of work in generative game design that doesn’t involve AI, including a lot of procedurally generated items. There is also a lot of bad generated designs as the inputs allowed to be changed are not sufficient enough to create enough variance.
I mean, look at No Man’s Sky. It’s not Ai but some algorithm creating the world and it looks really generic and the same everywhere.
I hope using AI can make worlds like that feel actually different.
Yeah that semi randomness of NMS is what I had in mind. AI could improve that a lot.
