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He is wrong here sadly. Its the voters fault for picking fascism by not voting
May I remind you that Trump also won the popular vote? 70+ millions people voted for Fascism, out of 260 millions adults in the US.
Roughly 1 out of 4 person voted for Fascism. There is a problem right there.
Yeah, the problem is that the Republicans are the only ones acknowledging the hurt people are feeling right now, and providing any answers for it, even if their questions and answers are complete bullshit. The Democrats are completely derelict of their duty to counter that bullshit with real answers, so the bullshit goes completely unchallenged and people vote for the guy with answers.
The average voter doesn’t believe fascism can happen right here, right now. It’s unpleasant to think about so they don’t, and the media they consume doesn’t provoke that sort of thought. It’s ignorance, not malice. You can’t expect the entire country to be as terminally online as we are.
Whether it’s ignorance or hate, 70+ millions people voted for Fascism.
If you are an adult, see what Trump is saying about persons of color or by the person they attracted to, and you are okay with that, it doesn’t matter if it’s from ignorance or hate.
My view switched on the US (and Canada at the same time) after this election. Republicans are irrevocably racists, sexist and homophobic. The US got the government they deserve, and we will too.
It sucks because it will impact the world negatively, but at this point nothing I do about that will make any difference. I am just angry because Trump’s victory will bolster Poilievre and the CPC and we will suffer the same dumb shit here.
How can this man be so based. The world simply didn’t deserve him.
I lean left, but I have never been able to get behind Bernie.
Bernie is center-left at most. If he’s too left, you don’t lean left at all. If he’s not left enough, that makes sense.
Bernie is against corporate corruption and wants to expand social programs. He doesn’t want to flip the table of capitalism. Just improve the lives that have to live within it.
So fucking what? I’m sure lots of guys have had half naked women sitting on their lap at one point during their life.
https://lemmy.world/comment/13227686
This you? You are a neoliberal at best. You don’t lean left in any way, shape, or from. You lean right.
Anybody got the actual press release for this? I can’t find it. Only the X post with screenshot.
https://x.com/BernieSanders/status/1854271157135941698
Can’t find them here.
I’m tired of being told how awesome the economy is. It’s great for the rich, but the cost of necessities like housing, food, and healthcare has outpaced the CPI, so we all feel worse. A cheaper big screen tv doesn’t help much if you can’t afford the basics.
Aggregate economic data only says so much. Lots of INDIVIDUAL people are suffering. While the CPI is one basket of products, everyone has their own, and this everyone has their own rate of inflation. So saying wages have kept up with inflation is a fallacy on 2 fronts. Some saw income outpace the CPI, others it did not and they’ve lost income. But even among the former group, everyone had a personal rate of inflation that may well be higher than the CPI.
Instead, the wealthy and politicians look at averages and medians and assume it’s just negative feelings. But we were alive in the 90s. We were alive in the early 2000s. We know about the 50s and 60s. We know the economy used to be better for working people. We want better.
Trump, of course, will not deliver that. But Harris didn’t inspire confidence she would, either.
We don’t really have to worry about what Trump offered, he got less votes than last time on the same tired platform. The problem was Democrats through and through not being left at all. Losing millions of votes that way. Some people can play the lesser of two evils game, but as we just saw there are not enough people who can vote while holding their noses.
I held my nose, but the numbers clearly show it was a Democrat failure to communicate, empathize, and/or initiate with voters.
I held my nose, but the numbers clearly show it was a Democrat failure to communicate, empathize, and/or initiate with voters.
But they got Dick Cheney on board!
My wife is a teacher, so we use her healthcare, but I still peek in at the healthcare at my job when enrollment comes along, just to be diligent.
It went up 20% this year, from $600 to $720. If you make $30K a year and got a 3% cost of living adjustment, you make less this year than last year from healthcare alone.
Food, gas, rent, cars, childcare, utilities, everything is up. I guess it’s cool that US steel or something might be doing well, and the stock market is up, but that minimally affects the day to day of most people.
And yet every newscast has a stock ticker. Even NPR gives the stock index ratings several times a day.
Even Trump loved ranting about his stock market.
Stock markets are just one measure though. Just like you don’t know the weather by just looking at a thermometer, you don’t know the economy by just looking at the stock market.
My raises, baring promotion, are 2% a year. I did the math. I’ve lost $10,000 a year to inflation at this point. In aggregate it’s around $22,000 at this point.
Too late Bernie, there was a need to speak way before this election started. yet you preferred to side with Biden when everyone could see that he was cooked, and preferred to blindly endorse kamala, her policies and her campaign through out the few pas months, you didn’t even negotiate a damn thing for your endorsement even when knowing you have a sizable following.
He made it clear where he differed from Biden and Harris, but encouraged his supporters to vote for them. Are you proposing that he should have encouraged his supporters to ditch Harris, giving Trump an even more sizable lead?
He shouldn’t have endorsed them without getting anything in returns for his people. a tangible and meaningful policy, he is known for advocating for universal healthcare, but I saw no push from him on the party for that. if that’s a big ask, choose another impactful policy, find other progressives, form a group and advocate together. what did the progressives do against the party for a few elections now? nothing, they let themselves get run over by the Democratic party apparatus times and again. I don’t want to be mean but at this point I don’t see them to be different to other careerist politicians.
This is what politics is about. not only him, but this goes for the squad as well. mark my words : AOC will end up becoming just another Pelosi.
I feel like threatening to withhold your endorsement just equates to holding the country hostage. He absolutely has been trying to push the Democrats to adopt more progressive policies and block military shipments to Israel, which is why it’s so frustrating to see them disregard him and lose because of it.
The country is already held hostage to the two party system and the ruling class that is benefiting from this no matter which way the election swings.
A democrat’s favorite pass time is ignoring a fuming Bernie Sanders.
Seeing Bernie speak truth to power is incredibly refreshing, especially since he points the finger not at the voting public, but at his own team mates, who absolutely did drop the ball multiple times.
I hope people actually take his words on board.
Blaming the voting public does nothing other than to help us feel better about ourselves. “It’s not our fault, the people are just stupid and naive. They were always going to vote for Trump, there’s nothing else we could have done”. It’s what we’ve been doing the past three election cycles and it isn’t working.
We can’t make them change. Change only comes from within. We can’t keep telling them they’re better off with us. We need to pass legislation so that the average, uniformed voter can see it for themselves.
A lot of my in-laws are Trump supporters, but do you know who they support more than Trump? Bernie. They want a lot of the same things that progressives do. Obviously there are Trump supporters that are racists and fascists, but I’d bet the majority just want a better deal for the working class, and they fell for Trump’s promise that he’s the one to do it.
That’s quite interesting that there is a lot of cross over between Trump and Bernie, but Trump does at least pretend to care about the working class.
The average voter is living paycheck to paycheck, just trying to make ends meet. They see executives making billions while the US government is spending trillions on military equipment, and meanwhile, they’re seeing the prices of basic necessities skyrocket and just trying to figure out how to live.
This person may vote for Trump, or just sit out the election because they don’t think either candidate cares about them. It’s not about whether you’re progressive enough or centrist enough, it’s about speaking to the biggest problem: wealth inequality.
Will the Democrats figure this out? I guess we’ll see in 3 years.
Given that the only person I’ve seen blaming anyone but the voters has been Bernie, I doubt it.
That’s one thing that I like about grandpa style lefties and don’t like about Lemmy: blaming trumpists for wanting a change in the political system. Lemmy and MAGA crowd share common fears about the future and have absolutely different solutions.
Why the fuck one wants to highlight the difference and not the thing that’s in common. People achieve unimaginable results when working together.
The Democratic party has failed us. We need an actual workers party and we have about 3 years to build it.
Join PSL if you have not already
I have my first PSL meeting on Sunday, I’m really anxious (hello social anxiety) but I’m bringing my husband. Organize or die is what I’m thinking! I’m sorry your post brought out miserable people
Capitalism does not need to go. Croneyism needs to go. Our government has for decades been catering to the corporations that run America, from Amazon to the Railroad. They helped these massive corporations consolidate their markets by regulating small and new players out of existence. They take their money and make sure they don’t lose their spots on top.
You guys don’t deserve it. This election proved to me that you’re leftists can be every bit as hateful as your right
The DNC isn’t entitled to Americans votes. They lost us and lost folks to the Republicans because they promised to fix the economy and are actually talking to people directly. The DNC is fucking dead to me.
I voted Kamala but I knew she didn’t stand a chance. I knew we were cooked when it was Biden/Kamala
Thank you for choosing Kamala even though you didn’t want to. We’re in this mess because too many people were the cartoon character somebody posted above.
No, two people were cartoon characters. you failed to realize one of them was harris.
Yeah the people advocating for the end of a genocide and social healthcare are the hateful ones 💀
They’re not hateful, just too stupid to face the reality that one of the two viable choices they had was clearly much better than the other.
When they want to end it with bloodshed, yes. Yes they are.
Welcome to reality
Why do liberals have to get in the way and make enemies of us? We’ll have to go through you all then.
Leftism isn’t a stranger to being attacked on all sides and being pushed to the margins, but we’re still here generation after generation even as the most rich and powerful nations organize their militaries and media against us.
Because here the person talks about their frustration and you’re blaming them. Don’t be like that. Empathize!
I think you need to reread the thread, where did the blame begin? I’m getting tired of the high road.
Sure, kiddo
Keep chasing that center as your country descends into fascism. It’s easier than thinking for yourself
psst you don’t need to remind them they’re assholes that explicitly. they know. they’re happy to discuss the shades of supporting a genocide and why its okay to shove the few under the bus to save the many. Never mind that saving the few would have saved more of the many in the long run.
You’re from El Salvador. Should I suggest that El Salvadorians deserve MS-13 because you’re stupid brown people who can’t get away from drugs?
No, you bigoted piece of shit.
That suggestion would only be as bigoted as calling criticism from an El Salvadoran bigoted. I’m a white male American and I say America is full of idiots. That was how Trump got into the White House to begin with, and it’s why he’s going back. It’s not either party’s fault, it’s that the majority of Americans are just stupid.
You are giving way too much of a pass to a lot of evil people and their propaganda by blaming it only on the voters.
I’m not completely disagreeing with you though. I’m a white dude in America too and the ignorance and gullibility of many of our citizens is astounding.
Am I saying that criticism from the outside world is a bad thing? No. What I’m saying is that I could very easily point at bad things about any country - it solves absolutely nothing.
Lets say you have a neighbor and every time you invite them over for tea they shit on your carpet.
Do you continue inviting them over? if your answer is no, well now you understand why a large portion of the american electorate didn’t show up to vote again. the democrats need to stop shitting on our carpet. for the record we don’t invite the republicans over either. they shit everywhere.
You havent sent signals strong enough to demonstrate you wouldn’t shit on the carpet again. Trump, well, when he gets close to burning the house down again we’ll probably show up with the firetrucks. probably. depends on how much hes threatening our local communities. if hes smart he wont
It’s easy to paint a huge group of people with a broad brush, but that’s exactly the mindset that got us here.
That’s rich from a group calling everyone a Nazi in the last few months unless they fully agree with you on Gaza, and I’m a leftist and one that’s been at this a while, and you Americans are toxic as fuck. You don’t perceive that we around the world who are actually leftists are aghast at the stupidity of your country.
The right was always toxic, but the left really went with it this election too. Nobody was good enough for anyone and nobody was leftist enough for everyone. And if you saw someone you thought was less left, you shouted “Nazi” at them. Not just at the right wingers, but your own allies on the left.
Nobody was good enough for anyone and nobody was leftist enough for everyone
Very true. Everybody is concerned about how right they are through highlighting how wrong whoever else is. This era of profilicity will exterminate left thought
what’s a little genocide for a seasoned leftist? cultures come and go. it’s just genocide.
If you really actually cared about Palestine, you wouldn’t have stood off to the side and let the racist fascist through. Cause now Palestine is done.
You guys are mad cause neither candidate agreed with you on one issue? Are you new to politics and elections? Last two elections I’ve had to vote for shitty neo liberals, cause I knew the other option was much much worse. Sometimes you have to eat shit and like it
You have every right to be frustrated and angry, and if it helps you to direct that anger at me, then go for it. I want you to know that even though it feels like there are so many people against you, there are people around the world you’ve never met that are pulling for you. I sincerely wish you the best, and I hope that you’re able to find happiness.
Nailed it. The Dems didn’t fail the voters, the voters failed themselves. Some fell in love with a con man and some sat on their purity pedestals and refused to help. America is full of all kinds of idiots.
Just recently Israel said they will not allow Palestinians to return to northern Gaza. That’s ethnic cleansing at best. Biden is still in charge.
Are we expecting perfect? Is stopping a genocide perfect? It’s the bare fucking minimum you clowns. Stop giving Netenyahu a blank cheque
The Dems definitely failed us friend. They ran a shit campaign and everyone knows it
oh so sanctimonious “purity pedestals” like, Stop abetting an exterminationist campaign
It was only broadly popular with most of the country and polled well in swing states; thank goodness party leadership had the stones to stick to their values and loose on this issue. Nobody to blame here but people who didn’t make campaign choices and do not have access to the levers of power!
That’s a solid take.
Far left and far right are just “far”.
Far from truth, reality or the burden of existing in a social system with people they don’t agree with.
This makes them mad and they traded their honor and honesty to pwn the libs.
The only difference between tankies and the magats is a red hat made in a Chinese sweatshop.
Running to the mythical center-right just failed spectacularly.
Democrats’ only tactic failed.
What failed was millions of people deciding that walking across broken glass barefoot was better than wearing shoes they didn’t like.
This country is full of fucking idiots.
Leftists can definitely be as stupid as rightists, and we’re seeing it in full technicolor in this thread. “Waaaahhh, there weren’t any good options. I should be able to click on something perfect!”
I think you’re confused. we said ‘not genocidal.’ if that makes a candidate perfect dear fucking god how low the bar has fallen.
And if they really cared about what Bernie has to say they would have listened to him and voted Harris
Bernie is not a leftist
Oh so he’s a right winger?
Yes, all capitalists are
You realize all of you are capitalists right? Unless you live in the woods without a job or SIN and away from money, you’re part of the capitalist system. You may wish to be a green army jacket wearing commies but you’re not. Americans no longer have a sense of reality.
“All capitalists are right wingers!” You guys became what you criticized, every bit as reactionary, hateful and living in a black and white world as the trumpers. I personally have never experienced the level of racism and intolerance from the left that I saw this election. I’m native who has always been anti fascist, I never hung out with or been friends with right wing weirdos, yet I’ve been called a Nazi cause I don’t agree with everything you guys say. White kids calling people of color Nazis, that’s where the American left is at.
news flash: he, like many other leftists are welcome to say whatever they want. doesnt mean we give a shit what he says. we often agree with him on things and support them. but ‘bernie says blah’ only gets your foot in the door for about 3 seconds until we look into what he said. if the reasoning behind it is wanting we reject it.
If you think bernie represents the left, hell if you think anyone represents the left you’re sorely mistaken.
that being said: many leftists told you exactly what you needed to hear the entire year you needed to hear it.
- the genocide is not okay.
- it will impact our votes.
- a few of us have literally been screaming it for the last 2 months in the public sphere as you’re all aware.
if you think we needed to shift our position. you were very sadly mistaken. both morally and strategically. as you’re now witnessing. We didn’t go out and pressure our friends for harris, why? because harris didn’t budge and you spent more time telling us how your grand ‘lesser evil’ strategy was the optimal behavior, even more than tell harris to fuck off on genocide!
guess it wasnt so optimal since you know, people tuned you out and you lost. oops. You see the thing is a lot of leftists are actually very quiet. they spend their time with their friends enjoying life and as a network we signal to each other when its important to vote. we did that in 2020 for biden and we conditioned it on him having a single term.
Biden, as we expected, went counter to his promises on a number of factors. so we didn’t quietly send our signals to our group. My roommate and I for example were talking last week about the election and they were like ‘looks like another 4 years of trump, and I was like ‘yup, gonna suck’’. we both still voted. but we didn’t do what we often would do and be like ‘yeah harris is worth getting the gang together and disrupting our shit to get our networks of apathetic voting friend out’
why? hand waves the last 4 years and the last 6 months in particular. genocide is not a stance you shift on.
News flash, no candidate will ever court your vote since you are a fringe lunatic who doesn’t understand how anything works. Congrats, you and your fellow “leftists” enabled Trump. Spin it however you want, but the bullshit caring about Palestine is just that… bullshit. By pushing 3rd party votes, or not voting at all, you directly helped the Trump campaign.
Congrats comrade, you got what you wanted.
Congrats your candidate lost shrug. Whats the definition of insanity again?
This would sit a lot better if he didnt sell out for a beach house from Hillary.
I want Bernie for president and I’m not even American.
We tried. And almost got him. But then the DNC Services Corp rigged the game against us to stop him.
I’ve said this before but the DNC is actually just another wing of the Oligarchy. They exist to provide a fabricated conflict so that people think it’s a divide based on ideals, not on class divide it truly is. Look at the wealth of all of the leaders in the DNC. It’s pretty much the same circles and wealth as the RNC.
People keep saying they list due to reaching out to moderate republicans. No, they ARE the moderate republicans. They won’t do anything that will upset their wealthy donors.
I don’t think it is quite that simple. It is more like part of each party is controlled by that interest but there are also people who genuinely try to achieve something matching their own world view, some of those good, some bad.
I think the term you’re looking for is “controlled opposition.”
TWICE!
Is there a chance for him to win vs Trump if he was chosen as the primary?
For once I disagree with Bernie.
You can blame the DNC for being useless and out of touch but they always have been, nothing changed there. You can blame them for their shitty messaging and not listening to the concerns of working people … ditto.
What changed in this election is that millions of people, who know Trump is a a liar, a criminal, a rapist, a narcissist … I could go on and on. Well, they decided to vote for him because none of those negative traits were sufficiently off-putting.
This was a test of the collective character and morality of the nation and the United States failed that test miserably. Put it down to a poor standard of public education, Russian/Iranian/Chinese propaganda, accelerationism, racism, misogyny, whatever mix of reasons you’re comfortable with. Could the DNC have done better? Absolutely. Would the DNC doing better have won the election for Harris? Probably not, given the margin of victory.
Trump’s vote was largely static. He didn’t add significant support in any way. We already knew a third of the country was filled with regressive assholes. The reason he won was that over 15 million people who voted for Biden in 2020 sat this one out. This was 100% a messaging failure and the DNC deserves all the blame. Sanders is absolutely right here. We wanted to hear about unions and job protection and taxing billionaires, not see Harris try to court right wingers while paling around with that fucking ghoul Liz Cheney and her war criminal father. They fucked up, they lost.
Trump’s vote was largely static. He didn’t add significant support in any way.
That’s my point. Trump is a known quantity now and he didn’t lose support. That’s a failure of the US electorate.
Ask yourself why Harris had to run a near perfect campaign to even stand a chance of winning while Trump ran a campaign that should’ve seen him lose badly, in a more informed and moral country, and still won.
Because she’s party of the administration in power and people aren’t happy right now, so they blame whoever is in power even if it’s not quite their fault. They don’t care that the rate of inflation slowed to basically normal, they care that things are still expensive because their wages haven’t risen to match the raised inflation and their savings are lower. It used to be easier for incumbents, but as the conditions in the US continue to degrade from late stage capitalism and 60 years of neoliberal policies, I have a feeling it will continue to be the opposite.
Holding the line won’t work with people getting poorer every year (and if your wage doesn’t match inflation or the rising costs of housing or transportation, that’s what happening, you’re getting poorer).
Bro if you call that campaign “near perfect,” have I got a bridge to sell you.
That’s not what I said, not even close.
She wasn’t even the candidate for most of it… she was only the candidate because the other guy had to be replaced for having egg salad for brains
Gerrymandering.
That doesn’t apply to Senate and Presidential races though.
I’ve been wondering about exactly this, do you have any statistics you can point me to? No hard feelings if it was a thing you saw but didn’t save.
Nah, you’re wrong to blame the voters.
It’s time to take an honest look at DNC leadership and ask some difficult questions - why aren’t they interested in doing more to actually win votes? Will they ever learn that pandering to corporations for bribe money is a losing strategy?
Besides, Trump actually got fewer votes this time around than 2020. So your premise is flawed there too. It’s just that Harris and the DNC got way less. Dems lost this one and if you ask me it’s because of their Israel First policy and fierce commitment to ongoing genocide and denial of reality. Couple that with insane inflation directly and negatively impacting people’s material conditions, and somehow Trump was able to pose as the change candidate. Politically, that’s all that matters when the people are miserable.
The people who voted for Trump do deserve the blame. In some sense, they deserve the biggest share of the blame. After all, they voted for him.
The Democratic Party failed us all, though. They also deserve a significant slice of blame.
He’s spot-on. I’m pissed and do want change.
Both sides do.
It’s just a shame that was the only real option on the ballot.
This is exactly what happened - not that there weren’t any real options on the ballot, but that people are fucking idiots. You don’t even get that this comic is about you.
It’s really not and you’ve missed their point. Tbqh it’s more about you than about them.
removed by mod
buried deep in your comment is a reasonable criticism of his actions, but it’s difficult to want to engage with that because of how smug and condescending your comment is.
What way have you found in the last 4 years to stop trump and what sucess did you have?
Stop giving bombs for genocide and stop telling people that the economy is already great so they should not ask for more and instead give popular policy positions that help people more than a week before the election/after early voting.
How sucessfull have you been with that?
And what did the working class do this election?
They gave the keys to the kingdom to the con men, and that includes the twitter and amazon assholes.
That’ll fix things! That’ll show 'em!Yeah because democrats abandonned the working class entirely.
America needs more people like Bernie, too bad Republicans and Democrats are hopeless and don’t get it
