Summary

Historians suggest Democrats might have fared better against Donald Trump by embracing the economic issues championed by Senator Bernie Sanders, who has long pushed for a focus on “bread-and-butter” concerns for working-class voters.

Despite Kamala Harris’s progressive policies, polls showed Trump was favored on economic issues, particularly among working-class and Hispanic voters.

Historian Leah Wright Rigueur argued that Sanders’ messaging on economic struggles could be key for future Democratic strategies.

Sanders himself criticized the party for “abandoning” the working class, which he said has led to a loss of support across racial lines.

  • @Grandwolf319@sh.itjust.works
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    28 months ago

    You guys need to think of the DNC as more of a for profit business.

    From that perspective, they were super successful in making so much money.

    Remember, there can be more money made when you intentionally lose, similar to butch in pulp fiction.

    • Bakkoda
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      18 months ago

      Every single text i got had donate in the first sentence. The DNC had a very singular message this cycle and it was donate. It shows the flaws in the system and it shows the flaws in the party. Until i start seeing serious conversations about serious fuckin issues like repealing Citizens United, universal healthcare and proper privacy laws I can no longer consider the DNC a serious organization.

  • @Boddhisatva@lemmy.world
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    28 months ago

    It is absolutely clear now. The DNC is a private company whose main function is to fund raise, period. If they also win an election then that’s great, but if it comes to a choice between winning and raising money, they will choose raising money. They will never move to the left to win voters if it will cost them fund raising opportunities from the center and right.

      • @Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
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        08 months ago

        That never stopped you before. Just scream that they’re a trumper like you did when you were wrong about genocide and didn’t want to admit it.

    • @undergroundoverground@lemmy.world
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      8 months ago

      Imo, you’ve got all the prices. However, I would put them in a different order.

      Short answer: Republican or Democrat, the candidate that spends the most wins. Therefore, fund raising is winning.

      There’s a small group of king-makers in the US and the candidate who offers them the most becomes president. Recently, the people who decide who gets to be president has started to include social media companies and amazon, who hosts half the Internet. Trump also cozied up to the American owner of the company the owns tiktok. Thats how he won. Trumps also great for social media engagement and news channel views.

      Even candidates who happen to be better than the republican candidate, no democratic hopeful worth being of “the left” will ever be given enough money to become the president of America. Even if they started from a position that would appeal to them, they would have to compromise on everything that made them that in order to be allowed anywhere near the Whitehouse by the American ultra wealthy.

      What you’re seeing isn’t the failure of the Democrats to correctly triangulate but the strength of the American ultra wealthy consent manufacturing machine.

      • @shadowfax13@lemmy.ml
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        8 months ago

        Republican or Democrat, the candidate that spends the most wins. Therefore, fund raising is winning.

        you do know that in all last 3 elections dnc outspent gop by more than 50% ? last time we raised less than gop was with bush in 2004. harris raised more than 1.6 billion while trump raised about a billion. 600 million extra money they get is for not having a candidate with anti-rich anti-establishment anti-israel policies. hillary was similar story yet we barely saw her campaigning compared to trump. where does all this money go ?

        compare that to jill stein who raised 2 million. dnc probably spent 10 times that money on just smearing her.

    • @OpenPassageways@lemmy.zip
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      18 months ago

      I’m not thrilled with the DNC either, but I’m not buying this whole idea that they are shooting themselves in the foot on purpose. The DNC does better when they win elections.

      In previous elections, the candidate that raised the most money was more likely to win. Also, a moderate Democrat won the last election. They made the decisions they made in this election cycle because they thought it was their best chance of winning.

      I don’t have access to the data that they have to determine whether the leftist that Lemmy wants on the ticket could actually win the general.

      I’d certainly like to believe that it’s just that simple and all the DNC needs to do is put up a pro-Palestine Democratic Socialist and the election is in the bag… I just don’t know if that’s the reality on the ground. If that is not the reality on the ground, are the leftists that stayed home still committed to their protest? Or is there a point at which they would admit that we haven’t had a true leftist on the ticket because a true leftist is not viable?

      I hope someone can put together some clear data to answer that question soon… I’m afraid that a pro-Palestine Socialist will get crushed by AIPAC funded attack ads about Marxism and supporting terrorism that will really stick with moderates, and that no matter how energized the base is it wouldn’t be enough to win the general.

    • @TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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      18 months ago

      This honestly makes so much more sense than anything else. I think you nailed it. Republicans are motivated by money and exerting social control so they write up manifestos (p2025), take over the courts, work hard to disenfranchise voters, lie, cheat, anything is on the table. The DNC does indeed seem fairly comfortable with losing by comparison, despite the fact that the leftist ideals they supposedly dabble in create a moral imperative to never lose. I wonder if Republicans fucking pay the DNC money to run these candidates we all know aren’t the best. They’re just good enough to get votes against mother fucking Trump. But not always good enough to win, barely good enough when they are, typically.

  • bquintb
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    8 months ago

    I usually vote along with the democrats, but neoliberals are so freaking elitist and clueless. As much as it pisses me off that I’m going to have to deal with whatever fascist bs Trump has in store, it’s really quite nice seeing them get their asses handed to them by a populist… It’s just too bad it wasn’t a left-wing populist.

    • Eugene V. Debs' Ghost
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      18 months ago

      I vote for Democrats because I kinda half to, not because I want to.

      I wanted to vote for Sanders. I voted for Biden and Harris.

  • @vga@sopuli.xyz
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    8 months ago

    It seems to me that a lot of people are confused about what “supporting the working class” would actually mean.

    It wouldn’t mean that the working class would start thinking like Democrats. It will mean that Democrats will start thinking like the working class. Think about the implications, they’re not all what you want them to be.

    Probably worth it, though.

    • @Landsharkgun@midwest.social
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      18 months ago

      Like the other out-of-touch libs, when you say ‘working class’ what you mean is ‘racist white rural people’.

      Half my coworkers were either born outside the US or are second-gen. My national just voted to affirm and support trans rights. Turns out, people who work for money are working class. That includes, well, everybody.

      This misunderstanding is why the Dems ‘moved to the right’ this election. They still think it’s 1950. Moving to the right doesn’t make you appealing to the working class, it makes you appealing to bigots.

      Literally just make life easier for the working poor. That is all you need to do.

    • @inv3r510n@lemmy.world
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      18 months ago

      The implications, like supporting a higher minimum wage, universal healthcare, labor protections, unionization, and ending the forever wars?

      • @vga@sopuli.xyz
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        8 months ago

        Not sure about how they think about universal healthcare and unionization. It’s hard to believe those are core issue for them if they’re willing to vote republican like this.

        And I can add to that list not caring about immigrants or minorities more than the bare minimum. Or about helping students financially.

        • @inv3r510n@lemmy.world
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          18 months ago

          Why should I give a fuck about immigrants who directly drive down my wages? I’m talking legal immigrants. I work for a ski area - they can’t function without J1s and H2Bs or they’d have to pay double the wages for it to make sense for American citizens. I’m in a well tipped position so it doesn’t matter for me but my non tipped coworkers can barely make rent, meanwhile as a condition of employment J1s and H2Bs have to be provided housing (that they pay $500 a month for deducted in their paychecks) by the resort.

          Please note how minorities abandoned the democrats because democrats abandoned them.

  • @CharlesDarwin@lemmy.world
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    18 months ago

    I don’t really know how the Democratic Party is expected to steer out of the center-right ditch, though. With all the dark money calling the shots, I mean. Bernie is the exception that proves the rule.

    The electorate is actually far more progressive on the issues than the corporate media lets on. But the minute the Democratic Party were to embrace Bernie-style positions? You can bet that not only the “liberal media” would declare this sO vErY eXtReMe, but all the big money would be spending against them, and spending against them hard. Think it’s bad now where crypto, Elon, and the Washington Post are tilting against the Democrats? Imagine they actually embraced progressives…

    Not saying I love it, I just don’t know what the answer is.

    • @wellheh@lemmy.sdf.org
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      08 months ago

      At this point maybe the democrats just need to embrace these hard positions and normalize them. The gop doesn’t appear to care how radical their stances are and they get votes regardless of the racism. Trump’s whole shtick has been normalizing bad behavior and gaslighting the other party into thinking any wrong they do is a gotcha- they’re operating on two very different rulesets.

    • Kichae
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      18 months ago

      The thing is, we’ve seen what the working class wants: Not concrete policy that will help them, but to have their feelings of struggle, outrage, and anger acknowledged and reflected back to them.

      The Democrats could have radical pro-worker, pro-working-class reforms in their policy platform, but if what they’re broadcasting is “things are great” energy, or “there are bigger fish to fry” energy, then they’re going to get ignored.

      The Democrat’s talking points have focused on the health of American institutions. That’s the thing they’ve repeatedly signalled is most important to them.

      It’s not what’s most important to most households. It’s actually pretty far removed from the top of their lists of concerns.

  • aberrate_junior_beatnik (he/him)
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    08 months ago

    This assumes Democratic leadership thinks winning is more important than bringing the left to heel. Given their behavior that’s not a great assumption to make.

  • m-p{3}
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    28 months ago

    In hindsight it seems obvious, but to be honest I really thought Kamala would have fared better.

    • @Grandwolf319@sh.itjust.works
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      08 months ago

      It was also copium. After the infamous debate we all knew Biden wouldn’t win and had made a mistake.

      The fact that he actually backed down just gave a lot of enthusiasm to what could come next. It was historic and made us all stop focusing on the fact that he should have never ran for 2024 in the first place.

      • @Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
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        18 months ago

        The fact that he actually backed down just gave a lot of enthusiasm to what could come next.

        The fact that the party listened just fucking once was what generated the enthusiasm. That died when it became crystal clear that no further listening would happen.

    • jackeryjoo
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      8 months ago

      We all did, you’re not wrong.

      It’s a sad reality we all woke up to on Wednesday. Learning that the majority of Americans are ignorant, racist, misogynistic, selfish assholes.

      • @Resonosity@lemmy.world
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        18 months ago

        When you mean “all”, I wonder who you group in that conception.

        Not all of us believed Kamala would win. A good group of people were calling out Kamala’s shit since the DNC, and everything since. With the direction of the campaign, you had a good chance to predict Kamala’s underperformance.

        Let’s not kid ourselves here.

      • @wildbus8979@sh.itjust.works
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        08 months ago

        We all did

        No, we did not “all” think so, a lot of us have been saying this for quite a while. In fact since at least the 2016 election cycle started in 2015.

    • @krashmo@lemmy.world
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      18 months ago

      This is what many said in 2016 after Clinton lost but we still did it again in 2020 and yet again in 2024. If I were a betting man I’d say that if there’s sill an election worth having in 2028 we’ll see another, even further right leaning, centrist Democrat win the nomination.

      • the post of tom joad
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        8 months ago

        Yoyo look, this guy’s fucking nostradamus up in here, right? It’s gonna happen just like this.

        I’m thinking newsome is the “perfect” candidate for 28.

        Whoever it is, I bet you, just like me can’t wait to be told how stupid i am and actually great they are by credulous online political minds who call parroting the pundits talking points word-for-word fucking theory

    • @Eatspancakes84@lemmy.world
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      28 months ago

      To me the main takeaway is that I live in a completely separate reality from most voters. I would have voted on a dead dog over Trump. He is mean, narcissistic and never shows any empathy. On top of that he is clearly losing his wits. If a majority of voters prefers a candidate like this, is even enthusiastic to vote for him, what can you do?

      I also know that Lemmy skews left, but I think we have to face the fact that most voters have no ability to empathise with those worse off. There is no left wing politics without empathy and solidarity. What most of us here want is dead.

        • @cmbabul@lemmy.world
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          18 months ago

          This is true to an extent. Social media made it much easier to spread misinformation that allowed for the total shattering of consensus reality. Which had been under intense duress for the better part of a century anyways

  • @blazera@lemmy.world
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    08 months ago

    They did listen to him, he endorsed Kamala.

    Progressive policies were on the ballot, they just werent endorsed by Bernie.

  • bruhbeans
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    08 months ago

    The screams of “Dems need to move right” (not from Bernie, obv) are fucking clown shoes and hilarious. She was running around with Liz and Dick Motherfucking Cheney. There’s no more right to move to without literally just embracing Trump.

    But here’s the thing: libs keep cutting their noses off. Why would the actual left give the DNC the fucking time of day? They raise a billion fucking dollars, light it all on fire and go out to brunch. They co-opt movements like the Floyd uprising and metoo but leave everyone else to do the actual work. When we need bodies in the streets, when we need material support, when we fucking TELL THEM WHAT POLICIES WILL WORK FOR US, they spout some 1950s realpolitik bullshit and have some more wine.

    Biden: you’re immune. Have some fun with it. Show us you have skin I the game. $100 says he keeps up this “when they go low we go high” bullshit and does somewhere between nothing and the bare minimum.

    • @givesomefucks@lemmy.world
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      18 months ago

      Biden: you’re immune. Have some fun with it. Show us you have skin I the game

      You may not remember, but it’s only been a few months since Biden said he “wouldn’t really care if trump won as long as he tried his best”.

      He literally doesn’t have any skin in the game, the party leaders don’t really give a fuck.

    • @timbuck2themoon@sh.itjust.works
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      8 months ago

      I mean, why would the DNC give he left the time of day?

      Passed biggest climate bill, forgave most student loans in history, rescheduled weed, etc. And yet? It’s never good enough nor enough to give them a chance to do more.

      All with a threadbare Senate majority with two “independent” dems and only two years of a house majority.

      • @Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
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        8 months ago

        rescheduled weed

        They did not reschedule weed. It’s still Schedule I. Crime Bill Biden ran out the clock like he always intended to.

        EDIT: Downvoting it doesn’t magically pull cannabis out of Schedule I.

        • Eugene V. Debs' Ghost
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          18 months ago

          They literally didn’t, I don’t know why you’re being downvoted.

          …I mean I know why, but its wild.

          • @Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
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            28 months ago

            Centrists see that Trump has a cult of morons who will believe any lie they’re told, and get mad at anyone who demonstrates that they don’t have that too.

            • Eugene V. Debs' Ghost
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              28 months ago

              It’s why they courted Republicans, they wanted that same “they’ll do anything we say” energy.

              • @Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
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                28 months ago

                And worse, they assumed they already had it and were fiercely hostile to anyone who pointed out that they didn’t.

    • HubertManne
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      08 months ago

      The real proof in the pudding is the way the greens took such a large percentage of the elecetoral college vote so obviously to recapture all that the dems need to move left. The people have shown their power.