I can’t use them because I can’t convince anybody to switch with me. I talk to most people on discord and I’d rather move to using Matrix, but I can’t convince any of my friends or family or anyone I know to use anything else.
I use XMPP whenever possible. Requires many fewer resources to run on just about any hardware & I can hand out accounts if needed.
I don’t care for the centralized or de facto centralized alternatives. I regret along with my uncle convincing family onto Signal several years ago.
Why do you regret convincing your family to use signal? Is it because you wish you got them to use xmpp instead?
I would like to lose the Android phone soon. Signal will not work without an Android/iOS primary device.
But also… Signal requires a phone number for signup where a lot of countries require a passport to get a SIM (unique identifier that is easy to track you). The service is centralized so there is no sort of self-hosting option. There really aren’t alternative clients (not counting mere forks) you can rely on (this helps with the double ratchet encryption of clients with XMPP & Matrix losing keys) unless you go the gateway/bridge route—where the Electron desktop client is pure ass cheeks. Historically they have a big gap in commit history—we can assume there was some sort of CIA/FBI plant. They refuse to use a self-hostable MQTT/XMPP/UnifiedPush option for notifications meaning that the notification data timestamps always flow thru Google & Apple servers. And I am still salty the mobile clients removed SMS support which made it so easy to recommend to family in the first place.
I won’t use anything other popular other than signal. There are some other cool apps like simplex behind for but I keep that for my enthusiasts out there.
People who don’t want to keep in touch and still use WhatsApp despite WhatsApp using the signal protocol make me wonder how much they want to keep in touch with me and how much they understand their tools and devices.
I also wonder what other bullshit apps they use as well but won’t install signal.
Luckily I have friends and family who indeed do want to stay in touch and who also recognize the implications of using questionable software. I keep them close.
I got my family to switch to Signal a while ago after a high profile data harvesting scandal with WhatsApp. Some were looking at telegram and I showed them how that had dogshit security by just finding another high profile case.
People like to be able to send documents, bank numbers, etc. with ease. Remind them that’s not really possible with SMS or WhatsApp or whatever. (Technically Signal still is centralized and is vulnerable to shenanigans, but the fact that it’s open source and truly E2EE mitigate that. And has the least friction of all the options.)
Most of my communications with friends used to be on Instagram and discord. Discord was easy to get rid of because I kept having issues with notifications on it and told my friends that and eventually they got the message when I just didn’t receive/reply to anything that they sent me.
Instagram was a lot harder to get rid of. It’s a lot easier to pressure people in person than online. I deleted Instagram and told my friends that they could get in touch with me on signal. Initially they were contacting me on SMS, but I used social pressure with my converted friends to get the others on it by making a group chat on signal and constantly referencing conversations on there. Fear of missing out is a big motivator to get people to switch.
Another thing that I did was empathize the features of signal over SMS. I talked about things like being able to see when people are typing, read receipts, profile pictures, stickers, etc. Obviously my main motivation is for security, but a lot of people automatically bristle and have the usual “i don’t have anything to hide” talking points so it’s been easier to use those other approaches. With the results of the recent US election it’s been easier to convince people to make the switch, though.
It’s libre software. We control it. Always link back to this. Then, you’ll get them off other apps much faster.
You become impossible to text without it. This only works once, so choose well. We do WIRE, have for years.
The issue is FBM is something you can find just about everyone on. Pulling people off that is difficult. So you’ll need to incognito to yank them off.
My best friends and I switched from WhatsApp to Signal after the period that Facebook agreed not to make changes to WhatsApp went up. Other people were just sheer annoyance
I just told everybody that I only reply on Threema and don’t use anything else.
My thought process was - if they can’t be arsed to use another app (which is an extremely effortless task to do) then they are probably not worth staying in contact with.
The 3 people that were most important in my life at that point got the app immediately.
After over a decade with threema I now have over 40 contacts there, mostly friends, some colleagues, multiple hobby centric groups etc.
I guess just start and don’t compromise and be patient
This is pretty much exactly what I did. I said I will be using signal, and if you want to stay in contact with me, that’s how you will do it, because I will not reply to anything else.
Same. Works perfectly with family
Me too. My Fam is on Signal now.
I just told everybody that I only reply on Threema
if they can’t be arsed to use another app (which is an extremely effortless task to do) then they are probably not worth staying in contact with
So if someone said you have to use their messagee of choice - Signal, Whatsapp, Matrix, FB Messager, Discord - you’d have no problem meeting them there because it’s effortless, yeah?
You left out two important real world aspects from your thought experiment.
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one person cares about a specific aspect of the messenger - privacy - and the other doesn’t care, they are just on whatever their peers told them to be on. So if their messenger happens to have the aspect I care about I’ll do it. Since they don’t have any such criteria I expect them to do it as well.
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If that person is important enough for me and doesn’t budge I’ll call or E-Mail them. Which is less private than an e2ee messenger, but more private than data harvesting companies.
Exactly this. I use Signal for people close to me and SMS or Email for those who don’t use signal, who I don’t have coversations with often anyways. Dispite it’s many, many flaws, I will use SMS before I use a Meta messenger.
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Its hard to move people from discord a lot of the matrix uis arent good enough yet.
Wirg signal i simply dont respond on other services for 2 days but respond instantly on signal. And make sure everyone knows it. I also have a weekly bbq and the invite goes in the signal group chat and the signal group chat alone.
Once u get enough people everyone else moves cos of fomo.
As much as I expect the down votes… But this is why I like beeper. It’s a good catch all for unsavvy folk. Easier login with having other major chatting apps. (Self hosting is available and self hosted bridges are on dock this year…)
it takes some time but people get on signal when you explain it’s advantages over whatsApp.
i had only one contact on signal when i started using it. Now almost all my contacts are on it.
it helps if people care about you and rather die than write an email 🙃
I only have a few privacy-focused friends on Signal and Matrix and I talk to them that way. I have a few friends who use my personal Nextcloud and just use Nextcloud Talk to chat with me. For all others, I still use the mainstream platforms and just take care to not post any info that I don’t want public and I make sure the apps have limited info and app permissions.
I think it is tough to convince others to switch until they themselves see the need, at which point they’ll start asking you for advice on what to do.
With new contacts, I’ll usually ask if they have Signal first and if they don’t then I don’t really push it. I think just getting the name out there every once in a while is the most you can do.
Don’t try convincing anyone. Make yourself visibly more available in one place over another.
deleted by creator
- https://lemmy.world/post/21620691
- https://lemmy.world/post/20950542
- Never say privacy, say (anti-)libre software.
- Never tell anyone anything, make them ask you.
- Make others really want to talk with you!
What does libre mean?
Libre software? Libre software means we control it.
Did you search it? Literally the first result:
Free software, libre software, … is computer software distributed under terms that allow users to run the software for any purpose as well as to study, change, and distribute it and any adapted versions.[3][4][5][6] Free software is a matter of liberty, not price; all users are legally free to do what they want with their copies of a free software (including profiting from them) regardless of how much is paid to obtain the program.[7][2] Computer programs are deemed “free” if they give end-users (not just the developer) ultimate control over the software and, subsequently, over their devices.[5][8]
How is anti-libre any better lol, that’s more obscure
…What?
If your way works so well, I’m not stopping you.
Your comments make no sense. The term anti-libre is relatively unknown and thus less helpful than privacy. Idk what you’re talking about
How’s that working out for you?
We use it at work, or rather I use it to text people at work I like.
Working with info sec people helps. But I explained it and had them read about it and we all got on board.
All you really can do is explain that text (sms) isn’t secure and that Signal is. And let people know you want to use it. But yes I wouldn’t try and force it that generally just annoys people.
You have to negotiate.
They: Do you have whatsapp?
You: No i hate that app but we can use Rehnijobuboba, heard of that?
They: No and there’s no way I’m installing something I can’t even speak.
You: Ok, you dont want to install that and I don’t want whatsapp, lets meet halfway and use Signal together!
They: Fine.
I bought everyone in my family a drink to get them to use Signal. Worked great and we’re still on it.
Don’t bother trying to sell people on privacy etc, for the most part. Show them Giphy integration, stickers, Stories, etc and show them that it’s fun. Signal has done great work there, in making it “noob-friendly”
I wish it had tenor instead. Giphy seems to really lack content, I never find what I’m searching for
The number of times my family complains about signal not having polls…
Seems like a lot of people want that too, so hopefully they’ll add it soon
I mean, you can make an ersatz poll by using emoji reactions
Yeah that’s what we do but it pales in comparison to FB Messenger’s polling system, apparently.
