Relevant post: https://slrpnk.net/post/1480928
Also I ask that y’all refrain from downvoting opposing opinions in this thread. In this case, I think dialogue is more useful than downvotes.
In my opinion only condoms are necesarry, plus they never affect your health and prevent STDs. Even if I were a women, i wouldn’t want to use contraceptive pills.
As comfortable as I’d be with a woman taking contraceptives. None are completely safe and there haven’t been nearly enough studies on their effects (particularly the mental health implications).
Just because there hasn’t been enough study on men’s birth control, doesn’t mean we put the burden of contraceptives on women alone.
I just want to add to the conversation that part of the reason why male contraceptives haven’t been approved yet isn’t all because men are shying away from the burden of side effects from contraceptives. It’s because of how risk evaluations for medications in development work. The risk of pregnancy is severe pain, permanent scarring, death, and a myriad of post partum conditions that can become chronic. When women take contraceptives, they are averting themselves of this risk. When men take contraceptives, they are generally not averting themselves of any direct health risks (not including the consequences of fatherhood). It’s also easier to prevent the release of one egg with certainty than stopping millions of sperm.
This is not to say that it’s a good reason to let women suffer from side effects alone and deny men the option to take on the burden. This is just one of many systemic barriers in modern medicine that have been detrimental to women.
I appreciate the discussion and absolutely agree with your points.
A male contraceptive medication would have to work through a fundamentally different mechanism than female birth control, requiring changes to sperm or sperm production. I myself would be extremely skeptical until it had been on the market for a long period of time. This is less a skepticism of science and more of a skepticism of the pharmaceutical industry (particularly in the states).
Edit: After looking into the mechanisms of the up and coming methods (primarily hormonal) that have been in the news I think my conclusion was a little hasty. I think long term risks are likely very low or at least comparable to women’s birth control.
There are other means besides hormonal ones. One of the methods currently being tested uses some kind of gel to block the vas deferens, the ducts that transport sperm away from the testicles. It’s reversible too. And then there are temperature based methods. I’ll add, to answer another poster, that condoms are really not a great method of contraception, because it relies so much on good practices on the user part every time you have sex. Were I a woman, I wouldn’t trust a condom and use a another form of contraception anyway, though obviously it has other benefits, notably protecting from STIs. Personnally, I will certainly use male contraceptives once they become available. There’s no reason this burden should rest on women’s shoulders alone. Altough again, were I a woman, I’d need to really trust the man i’m having sex with before relying solely on his contraception to do the job, considering that i’d be the pregnant one if things go wrong.
I use to inhale tobacco and ingest alcohol and eat at McDonalds. How much worse can those chemicals be.
Absolutely. It goes without saying that women’s bc pills come with a myriad of side effects. They often have to try different options to find what works for them. I’d personally enter the market as soon as its available, but I’d prefer for several options to be approved so we can pivot if one particular pill doesn’t agree with you. Until then, a good old fashioned condom is my best friend.
Vasalgel sure looks like the ideal contraceptive - no side effects, long lasting, cheap, the surgery is as easy as taking a blood sample, and better that the hormonal pill in every way.
It’s only problem is that it’s still in the trials for 13 years and counting.
Dudes who refuse the idea of male contraceptive because it will harm their idea of masculinity are those you don’t want to have children with anyway.
Can we distinguish men who don’t consent to using contraception with men who basically worship tate and chauvinism?
I don’t use them because I don’t want them, and I don’t owe anybody an explanation.
I think there’s alot of men like me that don’t wanna be lumped up with Andrew Tate.
Probably not, I’d likely stick with condoms. Any male contraceptive medication would be too new to have any clear idea of whether it was safe. Even for women’s contraceptives that have been around for decades, there are a ton of potential side effects and risks.
most definitely.
but then again, I’ve had a vasectomy, so that already sort of indicates how far I’d go to avoid procreating.
Absolutely. I’d much rather take this medication than use a conform. Assuming of course neither my sexual partner nor I had carried an STI.
I think calling it male contraception would make it weird for me because i am not male/a man. Still, I would have definitely used in the past, but know i dont need it any more.
Why is that?
As the word male most commonly refers to those who produce motile gametes, which is what such a product seeks to impede in some way, semantically it is quite aptly named.
I take that, given that you mention it would have been useful in the past, that your gamete production facilities have been damaged in some way and you are still coming to terms with that?
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They can steal part of my dick when I’m a baby but we still don’t have ball valves? Just give me ball valves.
This is the based mindset. The double standard is real.
Yes men all feel mocked when women are flashing their Fallopian tube valves.
Personally no
I like the trustworthyness of a condom
When it has an issue of effectiveness you usually can tell pretty quick
Whereas medication (at least in my experience) can suddenly stop being as effective due to your body building a tolerance, something you are, an allergy forming that wasn’t there before, etc.
Short answer but absolutely, I’d jump at the chance.
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That’s a valid choice to make. But I just want to highlight the misconception that female birth control is labeled as ‘safe’ in a vacuum. Relative to the risk of pregnancy, which can lead to death and other permanent conditions, anything but getting pregnant would be considered safe in this context. This is part of why male birth control hasn’t been developed yet, because there is no counterpoint, from a medical perspective, to being an infertile man since biological men don’t get pregnant.
Some severe side effects of oral birth control are the increased risk of blood clots (deep vein thrombosis), high blood pressure, heart attack and stroke, liver disorders. Women who take oral birth control are often not well informed about this. And among the ‘less severe’ side effects are migraines, headaches, nausea, bloating, mood swings, and breast pain. Just imagine yourself living with these ‘acceptable side effects’. That is the state of modern medicine for women.
If your partner decides to take on the burden of birth control, just know that it’s not a walk in the park. There are real life changing consequences to taking birth control for many women.
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Rule 3. Be the men’s issues conversation you want to see in the world. Here is some context to what you quoted.
I feel that there is some degree of unnecessary gate keeping here. I think your pride in never engaging in conversation in female spaces is misplaced. To me, that speaks more to a lack of interest in opening up a dialogue about women’s issues.
What’s worrying about this community is how much self-blame is in some conversations. Some people have a tendency to conflate the patriarchy with men, systemic with individual issues, awareness with taking on fault, fault with responsibility, temperament with social conditioning, etc. I often see people fault ‘men’ and by extension, themselves, for something that is not any one man’s fault.
For example, in the comment thread that you quoted, the general sentiment was that many women are choosing to remain single because it’s men’s fault for not being good enough. I don’t entirely agree that the phenomenon of women becoming increasingly single is purely due to men’s behavior, because I think that it is primarily the product of feminism attributing women with personhood and being happily single. Feminism has yet to do that for effectively for men. Hence what I meant by “Feminism has taught many women, but not enough men, how to live a fulfilling life beyond patriarchal norms.”
In the comment above in this post men were said to have ‘put the burden of contraceptives on women’, but there is more nuance to that because of the nature of medication risk analysis makes it much harder to justify birth control side effects for men.
Sometimes, rebuttals like these are dismissed as ‘anti-feminist’ because it seems to be taboo around here for men to say ‘it’s not men’s fault’ to systemic inequalities. There is a lack of separation between fault and responsibility here that I’m hoping that I can sort out by saying ‘it’s not men’s fault’.
Also, I want to clear misconceptions around topics like female birth control because I’ve had bad experiences with it and I’m pretty sensitive about it when it’s deemed as something easy.
Above all, I want to understand men’s issues because I find that to be lacking in many feminist spaces. My partner and several friends are all facing mental health issues, but don’t often talk about it. I don’t want to push them, so I’ll try and learn what I can from this community and try to understand and empathize when they feel ready.
