• metaStatic
    link
    fedilink
    813 months ago

    making it difficult to vote is a feature not a bug.

    The question isn’t why are they not doing anything but why didn’t they do anything when they had the chance.

    • Caffeinated_Sloth
      link
      fedilink
      713 months ago

      Obama had the house and senate his first term and all we got was shitty healthcare and drone bombing wedding receptions. We need a new opposition party.

      • @PunnyName@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        26
        edit-2
        3 months ago

        He had a filibuster-proof majority for a handful of weeks, and we got better healthcare than what was already on the table. While it’s not great healthcare, it’s still better than before.

        That included some staunchly conservative Democrats, by the by. Many of whom were ultra “pro-life”, which means abortion rights weren’t gonna happen.

        Additionally, people who mention drone strikes fail to a) recognize the tech was relatively new, but not so new that it was actually affordable to the DOD, and b) each president after has had more drone strikes.

        But let’s not let facts get in the way of our outage or anything.

        • @ProvableGecko@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          143 months ago

          Get rid of filibuster. Pack the supreme court. Do whatever you have to do to do what is in the benefit of the public. It ain’t that hard, it is very popular but the democratic party is just not interested in working for the people.

          • I’m not sure I agree with that. Before suggesting someone wield that kind of power, consider how you’d feel about it if the opposition parties did that too.

            At this point, I think the USA is better off just reforming its constitution. And possibly splitting the union into 5-10 separate smaller countries. The country is clearly not an effective union anymore, and to be honest, hasn’t been for a very long time. This isn’t the first time there’s been a north-south divide and it certainly won’t be the last, so why prolong the suffering? Just break it up and be done with it. Everyone will probably be much happier that way.

      • @LovingHippieCat@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        66
        edit-2
        3 months ago

        Oh and the Dodd-Frank act regulating Wallstreet. And saving the economy from the massive financial crash with the Recovery Act. And an act that extended how long after being fired someone can file for unemployment. And new tax legislation that had tax increases to help pay for the investment in the economy with the recovery act. And around 50 other pieces of legislation.

        Plus the “shitty health care” you mentioned mandated insurance companies have to cover people with pre-existing conditions giving insurance to tens of millions of people. And extended Medicaid to tens of millions of people providing relatively cheap medical care by comparison to before. Free? No. But many went from having bills of multiple hundreds a month to just 50. Again, perfect? No. But a massive fucking improvement.

        All that in the 2 years he had both houses. Not his entire first term. Much of it was incredibly influential even if not perfect. To say we got nothing out of it is misrepresenting both what we got and what we had before.

        Edit: and increasing the minimum wage.

          • @PunnyName@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            283 months ago

            So stop blaming Democrats who have been actively trying to improve things, and blame the Republicans who have been, and actively are RIGHT NOW, destroying things.

              • @PunnyName@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                21
                edit-2
                3 months ago

                That includes the fucking voters, you know.

                Try to backpedal with your self sabotage now, motherfuckers.

                • Boomer Humor Doomergod
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  223 months ago

                  The DNC lit a billion dollars on fire to lose to a racist rapist again. The “adults in the room” couldn’t beat a semi-literate buffoon. AGAIN.

                  Voters should have voted, yeah, but in more civilized cultures the folks at the DNC would have fallen on their swords.

          • @LovingHippieCat@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            20
            edit-2
            3 months ago

            Well a major influence on that is because people keep voting for Republicans even when Democrats have progressive policies on their platforms. Republicans winning the House in 2010 kneecapped every single thing the Democrats had been striving for. 2010 had the lowest turn out for a midterm in decades. Often because of people on the left blaming Obama for not fixing everything right away, or because there is a depressingly large population of the country that don’t even know midterms exist.

            Republicans fuck everything over, and people keep voting for them. Democrats don’t fix everything right away, and people refuse to vote for them. Such is the stupidity of the American public.

            • Boomer Humor Doomergod
              link
              fedilink
              English
              18
              edit-2
              3 months ago

              Democrats are also completely unprepared when they do have power. Where’s their project 2027? Why do they dilly dally and prevaricate when they know they have zero time to do anything?

              And why do they constantly insist on playing nice? Republicans have been assholes my entire life and Democrats refuse to acknowledge this.

              A political party that can only get power for four months out of forty years is broken and should be berated out of existence.

              • @LovingHippieCat@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                113 months ago

                Are they unprepared though? Because every time they get full power they get shit done. Not as much as would be ideal but they still do stuff. And they also would have passed multiple more things in 21-22 if they had been given more seats in the Senate, having a 50-50 Senate made it only possible to get some things done not everything, they could have played dirty and gotten more done. For instance they weren’t able to pass their Voting reform bill that had passed the House and would drastically have changed and improved how we vote. But it’s still BS to say they don’t get anything done. That’s literally far right propaganda that has become so pervasive it convinces people on both sides that the Democrats are useless and never do anything.

                That said, about Project 2025. It was put together by the Heritage Foundation. A think tank that does its work and puts it out for free. They’re backed by right wing billionaires. So the Republican party didn’t make it, despite it being their platform. Also wouldn’t it be Project 2029 for theirs since 2027 is a midterm and the whole point for that is to obstruct and do oversight on trump and his administration by having any power again. That said again. They don’t have the massive far right billionaires driving the equivalent of a Project 2025 and democratic voters also frequently argue against Billionaires driving something like that. Project 2025 is successful because all the work was done by Heritage.

                Also also, I 100% agree that it’s insane they keep playing nice. They have to play dirty and that means breaking some rules which they seem unwilling to do.

                But they are put into power by the Voters and then punished by the Voters despite doing significant legislation and improving the country when they get full power. So them not being able to take power for as much time as republicans has to do with the voters and the Republicans cheating with gerrymandering and voter suppression. And general Republican propaganda destroying the system.

                But even this last Election Harris wanted to increase the minimum wage, wanted to put caps on rent increases, wanted to give first time home buyers 25,000 down payment assistance, wanted to legalize weed, wanted to introduce an Unrealized gains tax on people who have stock portfolios bigger than 100 million, increasing the corporate tax rate, talking about actually trying to punish companies who engage in shrinkflation. She had progressive policies on her platform, but instead of Democrats going out and voting and the progressive legislation driving people to the polls, everyone summarized her as only ever being not-Tump and them being the same and some saying she even had no policies. Democrats have things they campaign on, but the Voters say no. Mainly because the left doesn’t vote, or split their vote, and the right ALWAYS votes.

                Personally, I’m not saying the Democrats can’t or shouldn’t be better, I think the party needs to be drastically reformed and we need to primary and kick out the older generation and we need more progressives who can talk more like real people. But I’m also trying to be fair about how things actually happen when they are in power.

            • @JcbAzPx@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              6
              edit-2
              3 months ago

              I.E. the literal bare minimum. They even managed to argue themselves out of the public option while still getting zero votes from Republicans.

              On a bill originally derived from a conservative think tank.

  • @skaarl@feddit.nl
    link
    fedilink
    English
    73 months ago

    Is the Democrat master plan to have a one party system? Everyone always and only vote Democrat, because if the other party of a two party system ever gets in to power we are screwed! It doesn’t sound like a good plan.

    You guys had a good idea with Ross Perot in 1992. Look into that (especially how he got 0 electoral college votes) and maybe you’ll have a better idea of what you should be doing, instead of blaming each other.

  • @ImWaitingForRetcons@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    203 months ago

    While some people don’t vote out of apathy, others are a target of indirect disenfranchisement that prevents the working poor from voting.

    • nickwitha_k (he/him)
      link
      fedilink
      53 months ago

      Others still do it because of religious dedication to the accelerationist belief that making the human experience worse will magically cause the working class to gain class consciousness and revolt. You know. Like has never occurred in recorded history…

      • @Spacehooks@reddthat.com
        link
        fedilink
        English
        43 months ago

        Well least you voted. If only 30 mill more decided to vote even third party it would have shook things up. They didn’t even care enough about country to do that.

    • @UltraGiGaGigantic@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      English
      5
      edit-2
      3 months ago

      I gotta start saving this exact same comment every time I see it. Still pushing for electoral reform and a dissolution of the two party system on a daily basis. This is the right time to do so right? Now you can’t cry “Oh it’s to close to the election!”

      Well, have you pushed to replace First past the post voting in your state so people can be free to vote how they want? Will you be complaining about 3rd party mid term voters after a year and a half of doing nothing to change the mathematically flawed voting system in your state?

      • @A_Very_Big_Fan@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        53 months ago

        I didn’t have to roll out the red carpet for Donald “Israel needs to win and win fast” Trump to push for voting reform.

        Every terrible thing we told you would happen is currently happening, so I hope you’re happy for queer Americans and about the fate of Palestine. You got exactly what we told you we would get. I hope you’re comfy on your soapbox, because it’s not comfy for trans people right now. Thanks a lot.

  • @BigBenis@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    663 months ago

    The modern Democratic party fights harder against its own “base” than they do against the opposing party. People still came out in droves to vote for them despite that but their dedication to complacency in a system that is failing everybody but the rich left enough people behind to tip the scales. The Dems have enabled this and anybody who expects them to save us from it is delusional.

  • @pjwestin@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    243 months ago

    The number of excuses people are willing to make for Democrats is astounding. I’ve been watching the Republicans obstruct the Democrats for the last sixteen years. Meanwhile, Trump has been in power for a month, and Democrats are fast-tracking his appointments, even when it’s a conspiracy theorist to lead the FBI or an anti-vaxer to head HHS. They’ve given unanimous consent to Trump’s agenda 345 times so far. You should be calling them every day and demanding they act like an actual opposition party, not justifying their collaboration with the fascists. Who knows, maybe if they show voters that they’re actually willing to stand up and fight for something, they might actually win a fucking election.

    • @Katana314@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      63 months ago

      Why the lies?

      Democrats used every second of their allotted talking time to block Gaetz’s confirmation as much as they could while holding a minority. You genuinely need to look up the meaning of the word “unanimous”.

      Republicans obstructed democrats for so long by preventing a majority. The American people enabled that by voting them in.

      • @pjwestin@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        19
        edit-2
        3 months ago

        Everything you just said is factually incorrect. Gaetz didn’t even have a confirmation. He gave up the nomination before confirmation hearings could start.

        Also, you genuinely need to look up, “unanimous consent.” It’s a procedural method the Senate uses to speed up votes; if just one Democrat refuses to give unanimous consent to a vote, the Senate is forced to take a roll call vote and open the floor up to debate. It’s one of the many procedural hurdles Democrats could be using to block Trump’s agenda if they had the willpower.

        • @Katana314@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          33 months ago

          I’ll walk that back - I think at some point I mixed up the hearings on RFK and Gaetz, so I gave the wrong name there. I apologize for that.

          But even then, for RFK I read articles specifically highlighting the Democrat initiative to hold the floor; and the final vote came out along party lines (excepting some R senators that rebelled). So it sounds like the unanimous consent topic you’re referring to is on regular Senate work, not the confirmation. You specifically said they’ve “fast tracked his appointments” and I’m trying to understand that claim. To me, I’m more convinced that Democrats have political experience telling them that Indivisible’s plan is too easy to backfire, too easy for media to twist against them, and get them forcibly removed from office; especially since their efforts at filibustering have shown they’re not beyond putting in effort.

          Given there’s clearly a differing view on what we’re talking about, I’ll apologize for calling you a liar, but it still doesn’t seem like a claim that makes sense to me.

  • Comtief
    link
    fedilink
    193 months ago

    How do you vote to get rid of the dumb voting system in USA?

  • balderdash
    link
    fedilink
    2
    edit-2
    3 months ago

    Voting is the least we can do BUT… do not expect systematic change (that helps the working class) to come from the top down. Both parties agree on legal bribery, insider trading, “good billionaires”, the voting system, and the two party system. Meaningful change is going to require more effort: i.e., grass roots organizing from the bottom up. Start in your own community and the change will grow organically.

  • Majorllama
    link
    fedilink
    343 months ago

    Democrats do anything but take accountability for their mistakes any% Speedrun challenge (impossible).

    Jokes aside at what point do you stop pointing the finger at everyone else and recognize that you just fucked up? Political parties aren’t owed votes. They have to earn votes.

    The Democrats failed to earn enough votes against Trump TWICE.

    I don’t even wanna hear some shit about it being a rigged election or anything. The right was screaming about 2020 being rigged for 4 years and y’all kept telling them it was ridiculous and they just need to suck it up because they lost.

    The Democrats will lose again in 2028 if they do not make serious changes up and down their party.

    • @Genius@lemmy.zip
      link
      fedilink
      113 months ago

      Jokes aside at what point do you stop pointing the finger at everyone else and recognize that you just fucked up?

      Indeed. The democrats should recognise their mistakes, and so should the voters. Either one could have stopped this, but they both chose stubbornness.

      • @SwingingTheLamp@midwest.social
        link
        fedilink
        English
        53 months ago

        As out-of-touch as George H.W. Bush looked marveling at the checkout scanner at a supermarket, that’s nothing compared to the people who think American voters by and of large sat down and thoughtfully compared the policy positions of all the candidates, gamed out the implications, and voted accordingly.

        How can you say this after the news about the people who didn’t know Biden dropped out until election day? That had never heard of Project 2025? That didn’t know what tariffs are?

    • @lmmarsano@lemmynsfw.com
      link
      fedilink
      English
      53 months ago

      I don’t think so. That was our future on the line. Though they may have run a more effective social media campaign spinning their fake, populist bullshit stimulating Trump cultists out in Trump country, none of that should have mattered. Regardless of a weak opposing campaign & inflation, we fucked up by not recognizing an existential threat & voting against it anyway. That’s just downright stupid of us.

    • @PugJesus@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      153 months ago

      Jokes aside at what point do you stop pointing the finger at everyone else and recognize that you just fucked up? Political parties aren’t owed votes. They have to earn votes.

      Thanks, I love hearing that my existence has to be earned.

      • Majorllama
        link
        fedilink
        183 months ago

        Your existence? The fuck are you talking about?

        I’m talking about the stupid meme and Democrats once again pointing fingers everywhere else instead of looking in a fuckin mirror.

        If you (the Democrats) want to win a political race you have earn the votes from the people. They have failed to do so now multiple times.

        At some point you can’t keep pointing the finger elsewhere and you have to accept that you didn’t convince enough people that you were the better option.

        They need to take some responsibility instead of playing professional victims all the damn time. I’m sick of it.

        • @lmmarsano@lemmynsfw.com
          link
          fedilink
          English
          6
          edit-2
          3 months ago

          I’m talking about the stupid meme and Democrats once again pointing fingers everywhere else instead of looking in a fuckin mirror.

          If you (the Democrats) want to win a political race you have earn the votes from the people.

          Fuck that shit. With the stakes that high and threat to society that clear, even a bag of shit should have won against Trump. A bag of shit in the oval office wouldn’t do this, and that—not a flashy campaign—is all anyone would need to know to make a clear decision.

          We fucked up. Fuck people. We got the government & leadership we deserve.

          • @lemminator@lemmy.today
            link
            fedilink
            English
            43 months ago

            You are right, a bag of shit should have won against Trump. But somehow the Democratic leadership was still able to mess that up. Next time, they should bring their A team to the table instead of the D team.

            • @lmmarsano@lemmynsfw.com
              link
              fedilink
              English
              23 months ago

              Blaming the democrats doesn’t absolve the people of responsibility. Contrary to what some may think, eligible voters can think & understand their choices. We’d seen his gimmick before & how he operates. Those who voted for him & those who didn’t vote against him did so regardless of the consequences while having every reason to know what that would mean. They’re as responsible as anyone.

              • @Wakmrow@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                13 months ago

                No, I am not. But you can keep saying so if it makes you feel better to blame me instead of your leaders.

                • @lmmarsano@lemmynsfw.com
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  2
                  edit-2
                  3 months ago

                  So, you’re not responsible for your choices? Are you a child or incapable to predict the consequences of your decisions?

        • @PugJesus@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          10
          edit-2
          3 months ago

          Your existence? The fuck are you talking about?

          You miss the whole fascist shebang that got setup this past month or so? We’re looking at starving the poor and Healing-Through-‘Labor’ camps for the mentally ill. Our LGBT brothers and sisters are in even more danger.

          If you (the Democrats) want to win a political race you have earn the votes from the people. They have failed to do so now multiple times.

          Yeah, if our thinking is just that this is team sports, or a popularity contest, that’s valid.

          It’s not.

          Talking about how it’s the Dem party’s fault for not ‘earning’ votes ignores that elections are matters in which the people decide their own governance. “The Dems aren’t flashy enough, I’m going to let minorities get murdered” is a choice made by every eligible voter who protest-voted or didn’t vote - and, of course, every fascist bootlicker who voted GOP. And those are the only votes which were available to be ‘earned’.

          The Dems lost. The Dems are also immensely incompetent, and most of the party’s leaders at this point should probably be sent to the career-equivalent of a guillotine. But the core reason the Dems lost is because the American electorate consists of a supermajority of fascists, and fascist supporters.

          You can try to excuse the electorate by accusing the Dems of pointing the finger at ‘everyone else’, but ‘everyone else’ literally is culpable in this fucking disaster as well.

          They need to take some responsibility instead of playing professional victims all the damn time. I’m sick of it.

          Deeply ironic.

          • Majorllama
            link
            fedilink
            143 months ago

            The Dems lost. The Dems are also immensely incompetent, and most of the party’s leaders at this point should probably be sent to the career-equivalent of a guillotine. But the core reason the Dems lost is because the American electorate consists of a supermajority of fascists, and fascist supporters.

            You were so close to getting the point and then you went and fucked it up right at the end.

            I hate to break it to you but the “supermajority” of Americans are not fascists. They are simply sick of the Democrats bullshit.

            • @PugJesus@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              93 months ago

              I hate to break it to you but the “supermajority” of Americans are not fascists. They are simply sick of the Democrats bullshit.

              “We’re sick of gutless politicians proposing moderate policy in-line with what their base continually elects in the primaries, so we’re going to give fascists the go-ahead to kill minorities.”

              Very responsible citizenship. Very moral behavior. Not fascist at all. Thanks bunches.

              • @Wakmrow@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                33 months ago

                Well if listening to “the base” voting for moderate politics loses elections maybe they should stop doing that lol

                • @PugJesus@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  23 months ago

                  Well if listening to “the base” voting for moderate politics loses elections maybe they should stop doing that lol

                  “Stop having primaries” is an interesting take.

              • Majorllama
                link
                fedilink
                113 months ago

                Hey I didn’t vote for the Cheeto either. I’m just not sitting here bitching about why the Dems lost by blaming everything else except the Democratic party themselves.

                • @PugJesus@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  73 months ago

                  Hey I didn’t vote for the Cheeto either.

                  I hope by that you mean that you voted for the only other viable option, because otherwise, that’s a vote for fascism in our system.

                  I’m just not sitting here bitching about why the Dems lost by blaming everything else except the Democratic party themselves.

                  Man, all up and down Lemmy the Dems have been blamed, both before and after the election results. The election happened. It’s over. The results are in. That means we have to square with the fact that, whatever the strengths or weaknesses, or the sins or stupidity, of the Dem Party, the result of the election was that a supermajority of the US population gave the green light to murder as many minorities as possible, and save as few as possible.

                  The Dems didn’t fumble a football. The Dems didn’t miss a layup shot. This wasn’t a game we ‘gave’ to the Democrats, our aristocratic overlords, to play on our behalf. It was an election, in which we, the electorate, cast our votes. The electorate, en masse - over 2/3s - said “The Dems haven’t earned my vote, so marginalized demographics can go get fucked.”

                  That’s what I said from the start, and you objected to.

                  The electorate doesn’t care about fascism - if the blue-colored circus isn’t entertaining enough, if the blue circus doesn’t ‘earn’ my existence, the electorate says I die. If the blue circus isn’t entertaining enough, the electorate says they don’t mind seeing fascism murder a few minorities. Maybe it’ll convince the blue circus to be more entertaining next time.

                  My existence has to be earned.

              • @Genius@lemmy.zip
                link
                fedilink
                33 months ago

                I don’t always agree with your views on trans people, Pug, but sometimes you make a great point. Keep on fighting the good fight.

  • As an old leftist i find that the young American left is hyper focused on punishing politicians based on things that should be, not based on how things are.

    Yes it would be nice if the world was like you want it, but it isn’t. Voting the lesser of two evils is just how most of us around the world do it.

    But an example is the whole car free/anti car thing, Yes that would work if cities had adequate transit and service, but they don’t, and they won’t in my lifetime. It would be nice but it’s not going to happen, ever. So I may as well just vote for the candidates who fund transit instead of trying to find a candidate who is yelling about being anti car