The March 14 directive, signed by Attorney General Pam Bondi, uses an obscure 18th-century law — the Alien Enemies Act of 1798 — to give law enforcement nationwide the power to bypass basic constitutional protections.
According to the memo, agents can break into a home if getting a warrant is “impracticable,” and they don’t need a judge’s approval. Instead, immigration officers can sign their own administrative warrants. The bar for action is low — a “reasonable belief” that someone might be part of a Venezuelan gang is enough.
Well, constitutionally, they can’t for whatever that’s worth now.
That bold faced liar can go right to hell.
Looking forward to this being challenged in a state with Stand Your Ground laws where warrantless trespassing is legally the same as any other trespassing.
I’m personally opposed to lethal force being used to protect property in general, but there are places where that is essentially legal due to Stand Your Ground laws.
Your opposed to it, but now you also see the sole reason the 2nd exists. If ever the government does something like warrantless trespassing, it’s our civic duty to use our 2nd amendment rights to remind them we oppose tyranny. That said, never thought this would happen in our lifetimes. Worlds a changing.
There are very few people who would survive this tactic though.
Still seems like a stupid plan—2nd amendment or not (which is really not what the 2nd was about before courts made it anyway). At best you take one with you on the way out, if you’re ready when they break in. At this point I’d still rather be detained than dead.
At this point I’d still rather be detained than dead.
I’m well past that point. Especially with this fascist dictatorship. Being detained will likely get us tortured or thrown into a concentration camp. I’d rather die resisting these fuckers than die in some torture room.
I’ve never imagined I’d survive a fascist regime.
^ This, 100%
Some of us don’t have the luxury to keep our heads down and blend in when fascists want to target those who are “different.” That’s why I am outspoken about it - I can’t hide who I am, and even if I could, I’d refuse to live a lie.
I don’t have kids, I don’t have pets, the only person depending on my survival is me. If fascists come to take me, I’d rather go down and take them with me than go into the black hole (an entity from which nothing escapes) of a foreign prison/death camp.
To assume one will merely be “detained” and given due process in the United States is, sadly, a naïve take in 2025.
🫡
Fuck fascists
If everyone they illegally targeted managed to take one this problem would be quickly resolved
Any statement that begins with “If everyone one…” is going to be followed by something that would be great, but won’t happen. As much as we may both 100% believe it should.
Thus far these bozos have demonstrated a pattern of showing up without uniforms, with masks on, refusing to identify themselves, show badges, or produce warrants.
This is needless to say an incredibly stupid thing for them to do, especially if they plan to also go around kicking in people’s doors. I personally know an old man who got off the hook for shooting a state cop in my area who tried the same. I think the only hope the Dummkstaffel here has of making a charge stick against a homeowner who blows one of them away will be to somehow make it Federal, because otherwise I think the state courts – especially in blue areas – are not going to treat any warrantless door-kicking by nonuniformed armed men who refuse to identify themselves very kindly.
Edit to add: You’re also not protecting your “property” in such a case, you are protecting your person, which is a very different thing both legally and ethically. If the alternative is that you’re going to be whisked away without due process to a death camp in El Salvador, your only rational course of action is to stand and fight – especially in your own home.
Also, the person may go to jail, but dead is dead. The person shot will be gone, and may make others be more cautious, as hopelessly goulish as that thought is. I hope that things calm down and the rule of law returns before things escalate that far. I don’t recognize the country right now.
Well, that’s pretty much how the entire crime and punishment system is supposed to work. Do the crime, get got for it, others hoping to do the same thing will hopefully think twice before doing so in the future.
Therefore I think it’s completely fair that this script gets flipped on the fascists who are pretending to be “law” enforcement.
I think the only hope the Dummkstaffel here has of making a charge stick against a homeowner who blows one of them away will be to somehow make it Federal
It would be federal, because it would be a federal agent getting shot. Any murder of a federal officer–including postal carriers–is a federal crime, in addition to being a state crime. OTOH, remember that a large number of federal judges are not friendly to Herr Fuhrer.
Yes, and also aren’t hordes of these dipshits local cops that Trump is aiming to “deputize” to assist ICE? Those guys are not Federal agents no matter how hard they wish.
Well, the immigration official can sign the warrant themselves, so… still a warrant if I’m hearing right. But, a super fucked up warrant nonetheless.
Warrants from entities involved in enforcement aren’t warrants for the 4th amendment.
Doesn’t seem like it really matters if the courts rule against it. The judicial branch has no enforcement mechanism, and no one seems to be willing to escalate.
Yes they do. The US Marshall service is considered the judicial armed police force. Though at the moment they enforce immigration as one of their functions they would be the ones to arrest federal cops for doing unconstitutional (illegal) shit in theory.
Unfortunately wrong. The marshals work for Pam Bondi at the DOJ. Still under the control of the executive.
Sounds like something an illegal alien would say… /s
“Hiel Trump” is required when people meet in public or private. Any hesitation must be treated with aggressive concern and reported to all, immediately. This is the only way to keep America safe from (insert current list of threats).
And yet people keep telling me Democrats are just as bad.
Those GOSH DARN Democrats keep trying to feed and house immigrants with MY TAX DOLLARS.
Instead of putting them in cages and throwing them in prison. (AGAIN WITH TAX DOLLARS.)
Nobody says that. But you can pretend they do. The actual message is almost always something like the following.
The Democrats are in fact bad. Really bad. A bunch of pro corporate assholes who enabled the Republicans to get where they are today in ways that we all clearly predicted years and decades ago. And on immigration, they’re fucking horrible. The Republicans are worse.
Nobody says that. But you can pretend they do.
Can’t speak for anyone else, but it was quite literally word for word what my co-worker said the day after the election.
And yet that ignores reality.
In California remember you have Castle Doctrine. Protecting yourself, your home, and property from unwarranted unannounced invasions from ANYONE allows you to use deadly force if available
…Except cops. You do not have a legal right to resist illegal actions by police. The ONLY state where that’s a legal right is Indiana. Look, I get it, you should have that right everywhere, but if you shoot a cop that’s illegally breaking into your home, you will be arrested, charged, and convicted, IF you survive. And you probably won’t.
Should you shoot them anyways? Absolutely. Just understand what the result will be.
What makes a cop a cop? Could we establish a new town, which would of course have its own police department, and everyone in that town is part of the department.
Yes, it’s a bit of a facetious question. But we are entering very stupid times.
This article implies that you wouldn’t be breaking the law if you shot a cop entering your home unannounced and without a warrant:
It also says that the cops are allowed to kill you, so having followed the law and being innocent will be small comfort.
Well shit too bad Indiana hates my kind
I know, right? It’s the broken clock that’s so broken that it’s only gotten the time right once.
Wait. CA allows the Castle Doctrine?
A quick search shows it does. I’ll be damned.
I’ll be damned as well.
Worth noting for any Californians that it u-turns if the person stops being a threat. If you threaten and they run away, you’re now in the wrong if you shoot.
That’s true pretty much everywhere. Shooting someone in the back will almost always get you charged, unless you’re a cop.
Generally speaking–and I’m not a lawyer, I’m not your lawyer, and you should ask a criminal defense attorney in your state for specifics–you can use force, including lethal force, to protect your life if you have reasonable fear for your life or safety. Generally speaking, if someone is running away from you, they’re no longer a direct threat, and therefore you can’t use force. Similarly, if you are in a reasonable fear for your life, and you shoot someone, you can not kick them while they’re bleeding on the ground.
I believe all states have some form of Castle Doctrine. Some states have a duty to retreat if you aren’t in your home/car, e.g., you have to attempt to escape first. Some states require you to use proportionate force; if they have a baseball bat, you may not be allowed to use a firearm. Know the laws specific to your state.
That’s all fair enough. I’ve seen it listed as a gotcha on some very pro-gun sites for the specific case of a thief who’s taken something, jewelery for example, and is now running away. You can’t take the offensive to get it back. (At least not with your gun. I expect trackling them to the ground would be fine?)
That gets much, much more state specific. I can tell you that a lot of stores with loss-prevention officers aren’t keen on having them tackle shoplifters, since that can result in massive losses from lawsuits.
Wait…that’s not true everywhere?
If you pull out a firearm you better fucking use it not threaten with it. because life and death is when it comes out not before.
In some states you have a duty to retreat as well. Something to consider.
I thought the whole point of Castle Doctrine is that you don’t have to retreat because your home is the place of last retreat?
Guess I need to move to CA.
The memo and policy are not meant to survive Constitutional challenge. It facially and clearly violates it:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
No, this is meant to give the veneer of an arguably defensible policy, a temporary measure. And why would that be enough? Well, one possibility is that after a period of time it will not to matter anymore.
When wouldn’t it matter anymore? Oh, say - just throwing this out there - if it ties the issue up in courts long enough for Trump to secure permanent dictatorial power after harassing or disappearing political opponents and judges.
Something something illegal search and seizure blah blah blah, meaningless paper to the people who claim it to be the one all, be all document.
Remember when democrats got all heated about G Gordon Liddy saying “if the feds come to your door, shoot them in the head” (to account for body armor)?
I don’t know why that popped into my head just now.
Don’t do that.
Shoot them in the dick.
Seriously.
The lower abdomen is chock full o’ arteries, and a hit on the pelvis is going to instantly drop someone; you can’t walk with a pelvis that’s been shattered by a 9mm. It’s also generally an easier target.
This is both funny, and 100% accurate.
Buckshot to the belt buckle.
I would like to add, if they are in the process of breaking your door, and you have thin walls, shoot through the wall next to the door where they are likely waiting to start filing in.
A fair point, and head shots are notoriously difficult. Low center mass will hurt like fuck even if the armor goes down that far.
BRB. Going to invest in Kevlar cod pieces.
They already exist. When you look at some of the overt armor that was/is used by the military–particularly the BALCS armors–the full kit will have shoulder/upper arm coverage, a high collar, and a flap that covers your lower abdomen. While these are mostly to protect against fragmentation, they should stop all handgun threats as well. Outside of GWOT and some SWAT teams, that kind of armor isn’t common though, because it’s bulky and very restrictive.
Oh, and a hit directly to the balls is gonna rupture a testicle anyway because of backface deformation. :)
I like your ideas.
Leg meta
Can’t wait to see it clash when someone blows away an ICE agent in a castle state
Once upon a time, German authorities decided to raid the home, or rather estate, of the local Hell’s Angel boss. Police (SEK) came up to the door in civilian clothes and balaclavas, announced themselves as police. Boss inside panics, thinks it’s a rival gang trying to take him out, grabs a shotgun, shoots a police through the door. Ultimately gets apprehended.
Police file murder charges. State attorney downgrades that to manslaughter. Judge says “WTF that was self defence if police don’t want to get shot through the door they shouldn’t be running around ringing doorbells in civilian clothes and balaclavas anybody can shout ‘police open up!’”. Still got nailed for illegal possession of firearms on top of everything else he was wanted for, of course. Welcome to German law where you can legally stand your ground with a full auto but are not allowed to own one.
Better to be judged by 12, than carried by 6.
The person who would that, if they are somehow still alive, will be crucified by the state.
Yep
No way. The courts would set them free.
I wish I was that optimistic
We have precedent on this exact issue, actually. Down in Florida 5-10 years ago. Sometimes the courts do as you say. Not all the time, though. Details matter.
A lot depends on your race. Things like Stand Your Ground and Castle Doctrine tend to go better for white folks.
Like fuck they can.
I’m not fucking going to El Salvador.
a “reasonable belief” that someone might be part of a Venezuelan gang is enough.
Considering they’ve actively deported someone for having a tattoo that supports autism awareness as evidence of being a Venezuelan gang member, the fact I had a burrito for lunch today is probably an equally “reasonable belief” for them.
This is an alarming suspension of all of the protections of the Constitution if this is allowed to stand.
I have a temporary tattoo, one of the plant ink ones that last for up to 2 weeks. It’s a derpy black cat. Probably a Venezuelan gang symbol.
Straight to CECOT with you! /s
Probably a terrible idea … but … someone/people should hand out temporary MS13 tattoos at protests. Organize it so everyone can get one.
Hey, this guy had a burrito, let’s get him! Also, we may as well pick up his family at the same time, and his neighbors if they make a fuss!
Don’t forget to shoot my dog before you leave. /s
It’s really the most humane solution since you’d all be unavailable to feed it.
Having read the title and also the whole article… Let me say. The fuck no you can’t. Let’s get letigious or let’s get the vests. I’ve got over 200 years of jurisprecisence and the moral high road. We can skip the cultural perogative if you really want to. Or in this case you can endorse it. It doesn’t matter to me. as a cisgender white male and, and prolific gun owner, who is utterly tired of this already, let’s fuckin go. I’ve been waiting and i’ve finally got the perfect set up to tell you how many ways you can blow it out your ass.
Disgusting anti American anti constitutional blowhards all of them.
Love this energy. Get litigious first. The thugs like violence, but they cant win at court - at least not without their favourite judges.
This prescident isn’t giving time to be litigious first. They will be in your home before you can dial 911, whom is likely helping this happen.
Yeah. Be ready ofc
ownership is 9/10 of the law, especially when the subject in question is your life
Haha thanks. I’ll be honest. That post was made with a fair bit of unintentional inebriation, but I stand behind it. Don’t do social media and imbibe, kids. But the message maintains. I’ve got a whole lot of privilege that the world said I should be careful and mindful of. I’ve been polite and aware and I’ve sincerely tried to not abuse it. I know how my lot in life has been easier than most . But now I’m ready to take full advantage of that. Let’s fuckin go and let’s make them write more checks their asses can cash. Because collection day is very very close.
LOL “anti American”
It is the most american thing ever.While I’m on board, as a white cisgender male who can afford a lawyer, the problem comes when you add it to the other human rights violations of this administration. What are you going to do when guys in ski masks and overwhelming force break down your door and kidnap you out of the country. Then claim “it’s not possible to give everyone a hearing”, much less an appeal or any other due diligence? Nor can they send anyone back, even when they were wrong
It may only be for “those people” so far but we’ve arrived at gestapo midnight raids to fill concentration camps
Where are the 2A advocates when you need them.
SRA, strapped at all times. Can’t do much with small numbers
My MIL went from being an anti-gun democrat to going with my partner and I for shooting lessons this weekend. It’s never publicized, but if you keep your head up, you can see the winds change.
Edit, because I realized I was unclear: This administration woke her up to the dangers of disarming the workers. She’s moved farther left.
Yeah I’m seeing people at the range becoming a lot more diverse and I’m really glad they’re getting the practice in and not just the firearm.
Right fucking here. Notice they’re picking on people highly unlikely to fight back? Come for my brown, legal-migrant wife, see what happens.
You’re going to get into a firefight with federal cops with your wife around? Genuinely asking what the “find out” part is
What’s the alternative? Stay silent and let her disappear to the El Salvador death camp? Take a few of them with you.
Im willing to bet the odds she’ll die at the death camp are lower than in a close quarters gunfight with a bunch of dumbfucks firing away.
Feel free to go out in an unnecessary blaze of glory though. Very macho 👌
I’d do my best to make sure I could see my wife again
deleted by creator
disgusting low effort troll reply
I stand by the spirit of what I said but it was definitely more crass than intended. You probably wouldn’t snitch on her but you would just say you’d see if you could get visitation as they take her.
Have fun not seeing her no matter your best then.
Either die in a hail of gunfire or never see her again isn’t really the dilemma (yet). trump’s deportations are fucking horrific, but these prisons do not have a 100% death rate. I figure our odds are better fighting to get her out alive rather than a gunfight.
Y’all can keep the wild west fantasy. I’m being realistic ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Yes, I’m prepared to die. And that isn’t a knee-jerk macho reaction. I’ve put a great deal of thought into this.
Look, it’s easy for me to say, a middle-aged man who has lived life. Been a few times where I thought, “Shit, this may be it. Can’t say I have many regrets and this day is as fine as another other.” I understand that younger folks want to play out the odds, I would have felt the same in my 20s or 30s, maybe into my 40s.
But at some point you have to draw a moral line in the sand. Literally say, “I’ll die before I allow this.” I will not allow unidentified, warrantless, masked men into my home to kidnap my (legal alien) wife. I see no benefit in going quietly. After all, American cops have taught us by example, if they kick the door in, they are there to kill you. It’s the orge’s choice, die fast or slow. Begging and pleading only gets you killed slower.
I 100% understand what you mean and where you’re coming from. The idea that I could have a loved one ripped away from me by fascists and sent to a camp is horrifying. I understand wanting to die rather than let that happen.
I’m approaching this rationally, though. YOU may be prepared to die at a moment’s notice – but what about your wife? Has she consented to dying in a barrage of bullets when the gestapo comes a-knockin’? I think the last time I looked it up, something like 12 people have died at the El Salvadorian prison. This is ignoring the deplorable conditions and the disturbing abuses that happen of course. I think my/their odds are better there than bleeding out on the floor.
It seems to me that the option that would most allow me to see that loved one again would be to avoid dying in the first place or placing them in harm’s way.
if they kick the door in, they are there to kill you.
This isn’t quite true. You are in mortal danger absolutely, but that danger multiplies tenfold when you draw a weapon and fire. They are there for political purposes to deport people. There’s a monetary incentive in El Salvador to keep these political prisoners alive, too. If death squads begin roaming the streets, summarily executing people, then I will see the logic. Hell I’d take up arms.
I also think about the logistics of a firefight. Is your gun at the ready for when you hear a noise downstairs? Are you shooting into the dark? What if it’s the incompetent Sherriff’s office at the wrong house for a no-knock raid? What if they do knock? Where are you hiding? What happens after you’re shot? Let’s say you win the firefight – what then? Do you flee? If so, why not just flee in the first place to avoid the chance of death? What if you’re the only one that dies in the firefight and your wife is left alone? Is that better? What if just SHE dies? There is literally no way this goes down that works for me.
This is a scary time, and whatever plans I draw up will ensure the best chances of keeping my family alive. I hope you and yours are and stay safe.
Silently supporting this… After all the babies we sacrificed at school to keep their guns under threat of tyranny… Well it’s freaking here and where are they? Oh being the disingenuous bags a shit they have always been
Based on your instance, I’m going to have to assume you’re Canadian and thus not informed on the minuta of state level politics and how they vary state to state. Some of the 2a people love going balls deep on authoritarian cock not all of us.
We’re here.
Right here.
Shoot 'em in the dick.
Even if they have full-coverage soft armor, and not just a plate carrier, that’s gonna drop 'em instantly. Can’t walk with a 9mm through your pelvis, and there are a lot or arteries going through there.
Also, I’m a certified basic pistol instructor; if any of y’all are looking for non-chuds to get some basic training from, look up the Liberal Gun Club, the Socialist Rifle Association (altho competency varies a lot from chapter to chapter), or Operation Blazing Sword.
What lists do feds put you on for joining those
No clue, since it doesn’t seem to stop you from getting NFA items approved.
I FULLY Support this! If the Founders KNEW what the Future held they WOULDNT have written the Constitution the Way they Had!
-Pro Life Americans who FERVENTLY Defend School Shooters after they MURDER a School full of 6 Year Olds because the Founders could NEVER be Wrong!
The law nerd in me is intrigued by the idea of a Third Amendment issue arising in the wild.
The citizen in me is horrified that they’d even fucking try.
The 4th Amendment, against unreasonable search & siezure is the more appropriate one. The 3rd prohibits the government from forcing people to house soldiers. Its very rarely invoked, and SCOTUS has never ruled on it.
The 4th has been litigated often, and it REQUIRES probable cause, and a warrant signed by a judge. This nonsense is a blatant violation, and will not pass SCOTUS.
