The Food and Drug Administration on Tuesday announced it will begin the process of pulling prescription fluoride drops and tablets for children off the market. The supplements are usually given to kids at high risk for cavities.
The federal government and some state legislatures are increasingly drawing attention to what they claim are the risks associated with fluoride, a mineral that’s been used for decades in community water systems, toothpastes and mouth rinses to prevent tooth decay.
Dentists fiercely contest the notion that the harms of fluoride outweigh the benefits.
So - this started as a John Bircher thing right?
I’ve just been befuddled at the purpose and the point of this conspiracy theory. I guess Alex Jones’s dad is a dentist (and a Bircher) but I doubt that dentists conspire for us to have bad teeth.
Just generic “I don’t like the gubmit”? Was it a Jewish person who suggested that we improve dental health on a population level? What’s the initial bit of skin or hair that this stupid booger coalesced around?
I guess these weirdos have always been around. We just didn’t put them in charge of health.
I doubt that dentists conspire for us to have bad teeth.
People with bad teeth is literally their main revenue stream?! I wouldn’t put it past them.
So much for parents doing research and deciding if it’s right for them. Yet another bad faith argument.
Next up: vitamin c tablets. We won’t stop until scurvy is in full come back!
Someone here recently said RFK is literally just Pestilence incarnate, and I don’t think they are wrong. The dude is the Randall Flagg of diseases. Just waiting for his actual bugchaser arc. Then he’ll plan a mass gathering and dissolve like Gravemind into deadly spores.
I bet C will stay forever because some successful marketing campaign convinced people it’s a natural remedy against all types of colds and flu, despite being worthless for that cause. Science ain’t got nothing on a good commercial.
if you have basically any access to fresh food you don’t need to take vitamin C, even half a small potato will give you an entire days worth of of vitamin C and anything more than that will be peed out anyway. Unless you ban all fresh food people will be getting enough vitamin C, this isn’t a 1600s pirate ship, no one needs to supplement it, the supplements are a pure cash grab
I don’t know. You can’t overdose on Vitamin C. Rubes don’t like a cure-all unless it’s really bad for you. Vitamin A is the new panacea.
You can overdose on Vitamin C, it just takes way more than for fat soluble vitamins and minerals (also not usually fatal). Two 500mg tablets per day has shown a strong increase in long term kidney stone formation. One whole bottle (10g) in a day is “almost certain severe diarrhea within hours; transient hyper-oxaluria, especially risky for people with renal issues. “
Thanks! I did not know that.
I am gonna be so pissed if that worm-infested moron effects my skin care regimen. Vit C and Vit A are very big for me.
Also I don’t wanna pay more for it because people started to freakin EAT skin serums…
Vitamin C supplements are mostly bullshit anyway. Almost nobody needs them.
Let’s go all out and replace them with meth. Instead of protecting teeth, we’ll eliminate them. Who needs a dentist when you have no teeth? Think of the savings!
Lisa needs braces.
Nice try, Big Soup! Paying a lot for medical treatment is the American Dream!
Haha! I’m actually from Big Stew, you fool. And I run a side gig with Big Applesauce.
You can’t eat stew without teeth!
When I said we should restrict children’s tablets this is not what I meant, worm.
Cool, then regulate sugar in industrial food and beverage.
Regulations?! In trump’s America?! No way. It costs too much for shareholders
Funny. We’re soon going to see how much shareholders like an environment without regulation… like a working SEC.
Regulate it harshly these fuckers need to be sent to the gulag
RFK Jr. strikes again. I’ll never understand why people like him can’t grasp the idea that the difference between medicine and poison is often dosage.
The amount of fluoride in these tablets is nowhere near unsafe levels. It’s not even close.
Dude took his grandkids swimming in a sewage infested waterway… I mean, you expect someone like that to have even the loosest grasp of anything resembling nuance?
I really hope an amoeba finishes what the worm started.
Water isn’t warm enough for them yet
That poor worm clearly starved to death
Because understanding that would mean his heroin addiction was his own fault, not the heroin’s fault.
He literally doesn’t believe in germ theory.
And I don’t mean ‘literally’ as in ‘figuratively’. He genuinely doesn’t believe in the most basic element of modern health and medicine.
You can’t expect him to then grasp something as nuanced as dosage.
Time to stock up on fluoride I guess….
Is there actually a need to? Does ingested fluoride do anything that toothpaste fluoride doesn’t do?
I beat the rush and stocked up in December, and I hate that that purchase is already feeling justified. One option to keep in mind as well is that tea is relatively good natural source of fluoride. So if things get bad enough, becoming an unsweetened tea-drinker might help.
Its weird hearing americans have to specify ‘un-sweetened’ tea as if its not the norm
Yeah, I agree it’s weird. As an American who grew up in an area where sweetened tea wasn’t the norm, I hate having to specify. But I also don’t have any faith left in my fellow countrymen, and feel like I have to make it clear for them.
I don’t order tea often, but we would also have to specify if we want it hot. I guess I always thought of the options as sweet/unsweet iced tea, or probably nothing because I’d be surprised if they have some earl grey back there.
They try to make Americans weak, sick, and dead on all fronts. As of the US government was under control of a hostile country.
If Trump is a Russian sabatour he’s doing a fantastic job.
Don’t forget stupider
Oh, cute.
I commented before that one can get 5 gallon bottled fluoridated water, and would like to again point that out. The fluoride may not be as concentrated as in these prescription-level things, but it’s available. Can throw it on a water cooler.
Brick-and-mortar pickup:
https://www.arrowheadwater.com/products/where-to-buy
Delivery:
It looks like there are also some other brands, like Ozarka, but Arrowhead’s what I’ve used.
Why do that when you can get prescription-strength fluoride toothpaste from your dentist if you are concerned about your teeth? Your dentist will be able to tell if you need it or not. You could also look into varnishes and having custom trays made for your teeth that you leave in overnight to remineralize.
Even regular OTC toothpaste is sufficient with proper application, a proper oral care regiment, and regular interventions from the dentist (e.g. cleanings every 6 months).
Fluoride’s remineralization benefits are topical. Brush, spit excess, and leave toothpaste on 30 minutes before rinsing. Do not drink or eat anything during that period.
Brush as directed, but at least two times a day. Proper flossing is critical as well. Do not leave acids on your teeth without rinsing with water and do not let plaque develop and stay on your teeth for extended periods, otherwise it hardens into tartar and can’t be removed at home.
Obviously certain foods are better for your teeth than others. Grazing/snacking habits can potentially harm your teeth as well. Xylitol mints are a good thing to have during periods where you can’t brush. I suggest rinsing with water after consuming food, and especially rinsing after consuming acidic or sugary drinks, no matter where you are.
Because children have teeth that aren’t exposed to topical fluoride.
Their future adult teeth, growing under their gums, in their jaws.
The only way to build them strong is from the inside out, by getting fluoride into the children’s systems.
Calcium makes teeth strong. Fluoride prevents cavities.
…by strengthening the enamel. Which is a part of the tooth.
The human body is able to produce strong teeth and enamel unassisted, our diets and habits do the damage. The body is unable to repair the damaged enamel without topical solutions.
If you have a young child where topical fluoride is unadvised, consider nano-hydroxyapatite toothpaste, especially if they know how to spit out. I like Fygg’s brand, it’s made by dentists and the studies are promising. nano-HAp remineralization is less resistant to acid, so please consider fluoride as soon as possible.
As always, consult with a dentist and get their advice before doing anything with your children’s teeth — including having regular check-ups with them.
Maintaining systemic fluoride during development does seem attractive to develop tooth structure that is more resistant to acid throughout. However, I believe establishing and maintaining consistent care with dentists and developing solid oral health routines and diet practices, as early in life as possible, are all necessary steps to take and are more than sufficient.
Enamel damage and tooth decay doesn’t magically happen, and education lasts for a lifetime.
Obviously education about brushing and flossing and a healthy diet help more, if the family is able to afford the food and toothbrushes and regular dental care. But in areas where (natural or added) fluoride levels in the water are higher (within a limit of 1.5 ppm, twice what is set for when fluoride is added), there is observed to be less tooth decay and better overall dental health even when controlling the data for the elements you cited.
I am merely trying to drive home the point that all tooth decay is preventable. It’s not some magic genetic defect or simply because fluoride isn’t at the right concentration in water. If your children’s teeth or your own are rotting out, it’s a multifaceted issue, but not outside your own personal responsibility.
We can all do better for ourselves and our children. I am sure I informed people about the proper application of fluoride because no dentist I’ve ever had taught me. They never taught me to monitor for plaque or rinse acid off.
Our diets are literal trash and regulators refuse to regulate for children and adults alike. High fructose corn syrup used to be in most bread and sugar is still added, sugar (HFCS or otherwise) is added to children’s snacks in vast quantities, common dry snacks on shelves (e.g. oreos, cookies) are terrible for our teeth, candy is made to appeal to children, cereal is awful and appeals to children — literally anything you look at that isn’t a whole food, meat, and certain grains is generally ultra-processed and loaded with sugars and potentially acids that rot our teeth.
Rice, pasta, beans, some meat, unsweetened yogurts, and certain vegetables/fruits are all cheap and accessible to everyone. Not all bread is created equal, but it’s also accessible.
Dental care is inaccessible, and that’s the real reason why enamel damage is allowed to progress to decay. Dentists (and schooling for children) do not adequately explain proper dental home care (and what to do after consuming certain problematic foods).
Common toothpastes and dental products trash our oral microbiome as well. I don’t care what the ADA says about these companies, common products suck. When I use typical products, immediately acid-creating bacteria grow in my mouth, no matter how thorough (and comprehensive) my routine is, how often I go to the dentist, how clean my diet is, and how much water I drink. They can do better — and fuck them for the plastic microbeads they added to toothpastes I used growing up.
Hope you understand my reasoning for response.
This is false. Fluoride is not absorbed in the body and transported to the teeth. It only works on contact with dental surfaces. You do not need fluoride to develop “strong” teeth. It only works on the exposed enamel. Growing teeth would only be impaired if the child had some other disease or deficiency, like calcium. Fluoride does nothing for developing future adult teeth.
The existence of fluorosis, caused by an excess of fluoride being absorbed during tooth formation, before they begin to erupt, shows you’re wrong.
That is a cosmetic defect with no benefit. You do not need fluoride during tooth development. 40% of all cases of fluorosis are caused by public water fluoridation. Just another reason to end it.
The percentage depends a lot of the ppm of fluoride in the water, which is why it’s now set at 0.7 instead of as high as 1.5 in decades past.
But my point still stands that it enters the enamel before any topical application is possible. Which makes me take everything else you say with a large helping of salt
Because young children have teeth that aren’t exposed to topical fluoride.
Their future adult teeth, growing under their gums, in their jaws.
The only way to build them strong is from the inside out, by getting fluoride into the children’s systems.
if you visit any of the reviews of FLOURIDE-free toothpaste, you can tell at least some of them have reported cavaties.
I once tried brushing my teeth with baking soda instead of toothpaste for a few weeks. From what I understand, they have about the same level of abrasiveness, so they should be about as good at scrubbing the gunk out of your teeth. The key difference is that toothpaste has fluoride in it. After a while I started having pain/irritation in my mouth and gums. It went away when I went back to toothpaste. So if anyone was looking for anecdotal evidence of fluoride being good for your teeth, there you go.
BAKING soda is pretty abrasive, according to the dental sub, the grain size is usually coarse, so it wears down yuor enamel. i used some whitening toothpaste that uses a combination of baking soda, hydrated silica, and hydrogen peroxide, i stopped after it i learned it damages the teeth, but also it was causing severe gum irritation and ulcers, and gave me angular chelitis.
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This comment was removed incorrectly. What exactly is the “disinformation” here? This guy was literally just giving his interpretation of what happened to me, not making any assertions about fluoride and its efficacy in general. They even affirmed that it’s ANECDOTAL evidence right in their reply! Stop reading conspiracies into everything!
i used toothpaste with potassium nitrate and flouride thats useful for sensitivity, just gotta find the right one.
I brush with Nano-hydroxyapitite for like 3 weeks and then do flouride for a couple weeks. I don’t think results happen that quickly.
which ones do you use? i originally had the OG nudge 10% but it causes chelitis so i stopped, i bought a different brand, i havnt used it yet. all 10%, and there were reports on some of these nHA have very sketchy concentration of nHa IN THEM. I MOSTLY use the ones with potassium nitrate, it helps with sensitivity.
X-Pur Remin. Its expensive but at least its tested and not sketchy. You have to be careful they are using a medical grade because the rod shaped stuff is apparently not tested for safety and is likely harmful when ingested.
I would’ve been so cooked. This will also just harm any neurodivergent kid with executive disfunction. That plus the autism registry shows a clear attack on neurodivergents.
They’re weeding out the “untermensch.” The non-hetero, the mentally and physically disabled, the undesireable ethnicities, the criminals.
Same! We moved to a place with well water when I was ~5 and my parents made me use the fluoride rinse
I hated it bc it was like an extra step, but I was literally the only kid in my school to never have cavities even though I would try to skip brushing all the time. And yeah you called it with the executive dysfunction, but didn’t find out I had ADHD until I was an adult
I grew up on well water. I still have well water as an adult. Finally swapping to a prescription grade flouride toothpaste is the only thing that has gotten my cavities in check. It’s been a struggle my entire life.
Brushing twice a day did not matter. No sweets did not matter. I have basically no candy or sweet drink habits at all.
I can directly attribute my lifetime of cavity problems to non flourinated water. My dentist agrees.
This is going to wreck America’s health.
This is even more nuts than removing fluoride from municipal water systems. At least with that, parents who believe the science that their kids’ teeth will be better off with targeted fluoride treatment can buy the drops and tablets, and those who are afraid for some reason can choose to just not use it.
This is just trying to ban access to fluoride entirely, despite research showing its benefits and the distinct lack of significant harm. Madness.
What next, are they going to criminalize sending fluoride drops/pills through the mail, like mifepristone?
Calgary, AB Canada removed fluoride and a decade later added it back after seeing the effects of its absence.
You could make a great movie about the fluoride prohibition of the 2020s.
[Opening shot: A dark, rain-slicked cityscape. Neon signs flicker. A child’s toothbrush lies abandoned in a puddle.]
Narrator (gravelly voice): In a world where fluoride is forbidden…
[Cut to a sleek black SUV speeding through a checkpoint. Inside, a woman in a lab coat loads a capsule into a hidden compartment behind a false toothpaste tube.]
Narrator: …one syndicate dares to keep the smiles alive.
[Cue dramatic music. A warehouse door slams open. Inside: crates of fluoride tablets, glowing faintly blue. Armed guards in dental scrubs patrol the perimeter.]
Agent Plaque (sternly): “They’re dosing kids in back-alley clinics. We need to shut them down—permanently.”
[Montage: high-speed chases through suburban cul-de-sacs, a drone crashing into a jungle gym, a slow-motion shot of a fluoride pill flying through the air and landing in a glass of water.]
The Molar (smirking): “You can take the fluoride out of the pharmacies… but you can’t take the sparkle out of the people.”
[Cue epic music drop. Explosions. A toothbrush sword fight. A child grinning with unnaturally white teeth.]
Narrator: This summer… the fight for dental freedom begins.
FLUORIDE WARS: THE SPARKLE SYNDICATE
Coming soon to a theater near you. Brush responsibly.
You could make a great movie about the fluoride prohibition
We already have one: Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb.
This is just trying to ban access to fluoride entirely
Well yeah. These are extremists, absolutists, radicals. Their dogma must be simple and without exceptions. If they admit even one scenario where fluoride has more benefits than deficits, their whole ideology and worldview crumbles. Nuance is an existential threat.
Narcissism as a fascist dictatorship of a whole country.
The mechanisms of narcissism and of cults are remarkably similar.
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Explain to me the science of how swallowing fluoride protects teeth.
Easy, you don’t swallow them.
They’re chewables.
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Yeah, I was prescribed them when I was younger (The wonders of living in a state that still doesn’t fluoridate the water supply). They were small little red pills that you had to chew on and then rub the “paste” on your teeth with your tongue.
Imagine basically dehydrated toothpaste, had a chalky texture, not the greatest.
Hey everyone. It’s bad faith. Like, really bad faith. Watch OP say some stupid shit:
A reasonable user mentions an obstacle to childhood toothbrushing:
I see you haven’t interacted with many kids with special needs. Not everything in life can be easily “enforced” for everyone.
OP:
Sure. Niche cases exist. Prescriptions are still fine.
Also OP, later in that same thread:
It’s not hard to stick a toothbrush into a toddlers mouth. You don’t need a prescription.
See how that works? Remember what this article is about?
It’s bad faith conspiracy shit. Moderators? Anyone? (Edit: Thanks Mods!)
I do not assert that merely swallowing water with fluoride offers any benefit to do with dental health.
It should be obvious that the act of directly swallowing water containing fluoride would give the water little to no opportunity to interact with one’s teeth, which would be required for the intended preventative effect.
This is very similar to the decision by most nations to put low base levels of iodine in table salt. Given peoples’ daily habits and diet, it was determined to be a safe and reliable way of ensuring exposure to a needed substance for general health. Not everyone has or will have the discipline to apply fluoridated paste to their teeth regularly (hell, many people don’t even brush their teeth regularly!). Nor would many people take steps to ensure they had a recommended dose of iodine if they had to think about it, rather than just getting it through their daily meal …
It should be clear to anyone that it’s the incidental daily, weekly, monthly, yearly cumulative effect of fluoridated water, even in the brief interval before it is swallowed, swishing in the mouth and in direct contact with teeth, that can be of benefit.
Explain to me the science of how municipal fluoridation causes health issues so severe that it should be discontinued.
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I see you haven’t interacted with many kids with special needs. Not everything in life can be easily “enforced” for everyone.
Also watch them ban fluoride toothpaste next.
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Prescriptions are still fine.
This article is about the FDA pulling approval from prescription fluoride. Reading comprehension is hard, I know.
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Do you really believe they will have fluoride prescriptions?
Edit: from the article: will begin the process of pulling prescription fluoride drops and tablets for children off the market.
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“Well I sort of agree with my flawed understanding of what they’re doing so it must be fine.”
We’ve already played this game with abortion. Stop justifying insanity.
They’re not on general sale, they’re prescription. I’ve never been recommended these as a kid or as a parent (for my kids) and this is the first I’ve heard they even existed. They must be uncommon at best.
The tablets get chewed before they are swallowed.
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Having fluoride in the water means that you are constantly maintaining a level of fluoride in your saliva which then integrates with the surface layer of your teeth throughout the day as you drink water. If you limit it to just toothpaste then that function only occurs for the small amount of time following brushing your teeth.
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What? Dilute to rest of the body mass? Don’t think u understand how this works…
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Jfc, multiple studies have shown that increased flouride in drinking water decreases the number of caries in the populations teeth. Its not homeopathic, if it was you wouldn’t even be talking about it because the levels wouldnt be testable. It’s not the ingestion that matters, its having the appropriate level of fluoride in the thing you put in your mouth all day every day that keeps the levels up in your mouth so your teeth keep absorbing it. The benefits of improved population dental health far outweigh the public monetary cost of doing it and the personal health cost to you, a person who brushes your teeth, which is zero.
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Luckily one of my friends has already been down the ridiculous path you’re travelling, so I’ve had the opportunity to spend quite a lot of time reading studies relating to this subject. I’m all good on the topic of water flouridation and dental hygiene thanks.
The mechanism for preventing caries via fluoridated water is the same whether the water is treated by a municipality or treated at home. It is proven effective. Your tips on brushing are great, but they are only effective for the 2 to 3 half hour periods following that brushing. Fluoridated water prevents caries, that is a fact. So why rob yourself of a safety net for good dental hygiene?
So as much as I ‘loved’ watching my friend descend into madness with anti fluoridation nonsense, I’ve had my fill. You asked for the scientific backed mechanism for how fluoridated water helps prevent caries, and I provided that. You clearly didn’t actually want that, so I’m done here. Have fun bud.
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then you put it there using toothpaste
You’d be astonished how many people don’t brush their teeth, so…
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No I think they should just flourinate the water
Well really people should brush their teeth but also since people won’t - including parents who won’t make their kids do it, and that’s not their fault. So flourinate the water.
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They just banned it in Florida, with Meatball DeSatan calling it “forced medication,” and that if parents want their kids to have fluoride, they can give it to them. Now they want to ban those products, too.
So now we’re just going to reconfigure our entire society to indulge the fantasies of conspiracy theory weirdos?
I kinda buy the “forced medication” argument, but rather than removing the municipal water requirement, I think the municipality should provide water filters for those that want to opt-out.
I think the evidence is fairly clear that, in this case, opt-in should be the default as it protects VASTLY more than it harms.
Nah, I’m perfectly ok with “forced medication” when the societal benefit vastly outweighs the side effects. Mandatory vaccination, nutritionally supplemented food for children to aid in development, minor things like fluoride that reduce healthcare costs and promote long-term health, bring it on.
Giving credence to unsupported “skepticism” undermines the necessary faith in public infrastructure. Faith is a careful word choice here. I don’t expect the average person to really understand the benefits and chemistry and p-values, as much as I’d like them to. Some things just need doing because you trust the authority saying so. (And right now there are precious few American authorities worthy of trust.)
I can’t agree. Bodily autonomy isn’t a compromise position for me, and I think “faith” is a vice, not a virtue.
It’s not a compromise it’s the cost of a functioning society. Measles. Smallpox. Polio. Whooping cough. There are extremely real costs to “personal choice” in the face of disease. Those costs are quite often passed on to children. Rickets. Fetal alcohol syndrome. I don’t think parents should be free to make harmful choices for their offspring.
Faith is the compromise. I wish that every single adult had the education, interest, and wherewithal to make ethical and well-informed decisions about themself and their dependents but that’s not the world we live in.
Bodily autonomy doesn’t allow parents to make choices for children. It does allow people to make choices for themselves. Nice try at shifting those goalposts, tho.
The context of this thread is healthcare for children.
So now we’re just going to reconfigure our entire society to indulge the fantasies of conspiracy theory weirdos?
Until Americans get off their couch and do something, yes.
No reason to reconfigure anything. They have droves of people willingly agreeing to and gobbling this shit up. Our society is fundamentally broken
When my husband was like three his especially neglectful mother wasn’t watching him like always and he ate an entire bottle of fluoride tables and had to get his stomach pumped, this was in the 70s. With childproof caps and general awareness this should really not be considered an issue, kids shouldn’t have unfettered access to pills in general, it’s not a fluoride thing.
Silk Road for fluoride, got it.
