I had 5 rounds of interviews for a Tier 1 IT job.
HR and Management justifying their existence
Sounds like the HR department needs to be locked together in a room with nothing to eat but bread and water.
This is always the case
Why HR and not the hiring managers?
Depends on how hiring works at your job
Promoting within the company is always faster…
Why are people comparing this to a new hire? Apples and oranges people.
And even outside of the company, I bet it would be significantly faster to hire someone if all the candidates were locked in a office room with the interviewers until a candidate was picked.
That’s just not accessible for so many people for various reasons like disabilities, parental responsibilities etcz
they weren’t making a serious suggestion. they were saying that’s how it works with the pope, of course a hire would go faster if it was done that way.
Interestingly, this is one way people would be chosen for promotion in a worker co-op. The Catholic Church has been syndicalist this whole time.
Edit: let me clarify that. The Papal Conclave gets all the cardinals together to decide on the next Pope. Usually, they choose someone from the cardinals (though not always). So typically, all the candidates for promotion are right there in the room and part of the decision making process.
Technically they can pick any baptized man, even if it has been a couple of centuries since they picked an outsider.
The last time they picked an outsider was in like the 1400s lol.
Well, that moves the question. How come so many companies refuse to promote within?
They would need to hire to fill that old position anyways, or double up someone else’s workload.
And the unfortunate reality, hiring new is cheaper promotion usually implies a pay raise, and if the position you’ve held has already had a few promotions… you usually want to move with some esteem. Not at the very bottom again.
Training everyone for each step up is costly, while training one single person is trivial.
Harvard(?) has done studies that the odds of successfully choosing a candidate via the standard interview process is no better than picking names out of a hat.
It’s the illusion of control that matters the most, not that the process is actually effective.
Excellent point.
Though you can definitely make it worse with a crappy process.
A friend of mine went through 7 rounds of interviews for a senior position in a tech company.
The sixth round was actual work, coming up with a preliminary plan for their first 90 days at the company in the position. It took them about a week to pull together and finalize.
The last round was a 15 minute discussion with one of the founders (who has since moved to the board and isn’t involved in the day-to-day any more).
About 30 minutes later they got a call from the recruiter saying they “weren’t a good personality fit with the founder” and they offered the role to somebody else.
And so they took that plan they made, locked it away, and never implemented any of it since that would be stealing, right? They definitely didn’t just take it and use it for free, right?
7 rounds is way beyond insane. I’ve done 3 and 4 only to lose out to “a better fit.”
I just accepted an offer after a referral and a 30min interview with the hiring manager. That’s it.
It’s not with a VC funded company, which I count as a plus. Fewer circlejerking bike shedders.
Bike shedders? Bike shedding had an explanation wikipedia, if that’s the phrase you meant to pull from. It’s a new term for a concept I’m familiar with. I like it.
I’ve never been near VC companies, so I can only imagine how much of it happens there compared to elsewhere.
Yeah, I bastardized the term pretty badly.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_triviality
It’s like a weird idea factory where 26 year olds who still don’t understand how the world turns go down rabbit holes to hone thoughts to weird points, and then gatekeep the whole thing. It was good money and I learned some stuff, but holy shit I wouldn’t go back.
Because they’re getting good money, they believe they’re doing it all for themselves and improving the world.
Sweet summer children.
I don’t think you bastardized it. It’s becoming standard ‘english’ to manipulate participles and verbs into nouns by adding the ‘er,’ which makes me exceptionally grumpy in some crosswords. I just couldn’t find anything that said ‘bike shedder’ specifically so I wanted to make sure.
7 rounds is way beyond insane. I’ve done 3 and 4 only to lose out to “a better fit.”
Way it works where I live is they had a relative in mind the whole time but still had to pretend to go through the motions of hiring.
Let me guess… they took the plan implemented it and 90 days later do the whole process again with someone else. Basically, they never hire anyone and get free work.
Wow, that is pretty annoying. It might have been something minor in the end because they couldn’t decide between the two top candidates, but still …
Yeah something minor like the candidate wasn’t the nephew of the CEO.
Yup - but still. That should have happened before the big final “show us how you work” interview.
If not, then the founder should have been in those interviews.
I worked for a place where the CEO had a big hard on for saying we were “data driven”. He also rejected my friend as a candidate in the final round based on vibes (as far as we could tell)
The cardinals didn’t have to weed through 1000’s of AI generated resumes of people who don’t really exist. Lol
I’m thinking if corporations started taking our applications seriously and didn’t put up fake offers to abuse quotas then maybe people would also be less inclined to cheat the system by spamming resumes. It won’t stop the bots, but it’d lighten the burden on whoever is looking at the candidates because it’s real fuckin easy to filter fake resumes.
Sadly, neither side would stop abusing the system in my opinion. Besides, a lot of the resume spammers are doing it as a business for others.
Technology increasing the ability to advertise the position to a wider pool of candidates has accomplished nothing but to make companies paranoid about hiring nobody but the absolute most perfect one worldwide, instead of just picking somebody “good enough” from the smaller local pool of candidates and moving on.
Except that current pope has been working with that org for a number of years and is a known quantity vs. some outside guy you’re bringing in from the cold. A nice try at an analogy, but it doesn’t quite stack up.
Nah, my place still requires you to apply as to not to be unfair. It still takes weeks.
Except you still don’t need 5 rounds of interviews since interviews don’t show how hardworking someone is, or even their knowledge. They are a shitty test and a half an hour of conversation. Having more rounds just makes a statememt about your org, which says “we saw how google drills people, we’ll do the same, offer shitty pay and expect good quality engineers to appear magically”.
I’m a lazy bastard but I’m damn good at interviews. I’ve been hired on as a manager at two different places only for me and them to realize it was a terrible, terrible mistake.
I have the skills, I’m just too damn nice and before you know it everyone I’m “managing” is my buddy and the whole thing falls apart.
I never mean for it to happen, it’s partly just the culture here. Everyone is a close friend after a week deep in Appalachia. That’s just how we roll.
Anyways, bye, love y’all. See ya next comment. Be saaafe!
All those interviews, and they just end up hiring North Korean tech workers anyway, Give 'em a break man, things are hard enough over there already!
That’s not the best argument, since historically some popes took many years to select. Like, so long it was a major problem and they had to make reforms that included locking the cardinals in a room and taking away everything but bread and water at times.
Good details about the insanity in this Tasting History episode. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZCs9aMkzBQ
Never do free work! Fucking never! If they ask you to do that kind of thing take the amount of time you think it’ll take to complete, and take the offered salary for that position to find out how much they need to pay you before hand. No exceptions!!
Ha! I like this
Depends on if I have the upper hand. market is not great for dev right now.
Plus this is the dumbest meme ever. Ya pope took 2 days to get the job, same with internal transfer hires.
The quickness of the current pope being selected makes me wonder why it took so damn long last time.
Internal prejudice against Jesuits, if I had to guess.
