- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
Google’s Gemini team is apparently sending out emails about an upcoming change to how Gemini interacts with apps on Android devices. The email informs users that, come July 7, 2025, Gemini will be able to “help you use Phone, Messages, WhatsApp, and Utilities on your phone, whether your Gemini Apps Activity is on or off.” Naturally, this has raised some privacy concerns among those who’ve received the email and those using the AI assistant on their Android devices.
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Dear tech bros,
We, the people, don’t want to use your AI shit. Please stop shoving it down our throats. Thank you.
Sincerely,
-The people
Hahahahhshahahahhahahahhahahahahahahahaha.
Sincerely,
Tech bros.
Is it really the people or just a subset of people that use Lemmy, the vast majority of people seemingly don’t care as is evidenced by the sheer number of people using things like social media.
What might be important to use in this echo chamber isn’t reflective of society on the whole.
It’s mostly lemmy. In real life people go from amused to indifferent. I have never met anyone as hostile as the lemmy consensus seems to be. If a feature is useful people will use it, be it AI or not AI. Some AI features are gimmicks and they largely get ignored, unless very intrusive (in which case the intrusivity, not the AI, is the problem).
If a feature is useful people will use it, be it AI or not AI.
People will also use it if it’s not useful, if it’s the default.
A friend of mine did a search the other day to find the hour of something, and google’s AI lied to her. Top of the page, just completely wrong.
Luckily I said, “That doesn’t sound right” and checked the official site, where we found the truth.
Google is definitely forcing this out, even when it’s inferior to other products. Hell, it’s inferior to their own, existing product.
But people will keep using AI, because it’s there, and it’s right most of the time.
Google sucks. They should be broken up, and their leadership barred from working in tech. We could have had a better future. Instead we have this hallucinatory hellhole.
They need a tech ethics board, and people need a license to operate or work in decision-making capacities. Also, anyone above the person’s head making an unethical decision loses their license, too. License should be cheap to prevent monopoly, but you have to have one to handle data. Don’t have a license. Don’t have a company. Plant shitty surveillance without separate, noticeable, succinctly presented agreements that are clear and understandable, with warnings about currently misunderstood uses, then you lose license. First offense.
Edit: Also mandatory audits with preformulated and separate, and succint notifications are applied. “This company sells your info to the government and police forces. Any private information, even sexual in nature, can be used against you. Your information will be used by several companies to build your complete psychological profile to sell you things you wouldn’t normally purchase and predict crimes you might commit.”
How are you evaluating inferior? I like the AI search. It’s my opinion. You have yours.
Well, in this example, the information provided by the AI was simply wrong. If it had done the traditional search method of pointing to the organization’s website where they had the hours listed, it would have worked fine.
This idea that “we’re all entitled to our opinion” is nonsense. That’s for when you’re a child and the topic is what flavor Jelly Bean you like. It’s not for like policy or things that matter. You can’t just “it’s my opinion” your way through “this algorithm is O(n^2) but I like it better than O(n) so I’m going to use it for my big website”. Or more on topic, you can’t use it for “these results are wrong but I like them better”
Traditional search often is also wrong, showing some 3rd party website or a link farm.
With AI search I get a summary AND the result list, so I have more info to make a decision.
Well, yes, Google has been becoming shittier for years as they prioritize ads and fail to deal with SEO slop. You have to know what’s a good source, but that was true even when we were doing research in libraries.
The AI summary is making the problem worse. The information it provides is not trustworthy. It also deprives site owners from traffic. It’s really bad on like every metric.
I imagine even the fk_ai crowd appreciate the non-gimmick stuff as long as it is nothing like a chatbot
Tiny example from Gmail:
This is all over, and it can be super useful from time to time.
They say “f AI!” but I mean sure they don’t want better searches than were possible five years ago? If it’s not sycophantic and confabulatory etc. etc.
Good point on intrusivity
PS
PS: I translated news from Iran this week using AI tools and using traditional translators. Who would advocate for the garbage traditional translation—soon as I went the “AI” route, it was suddenly possible to understand what the journalists were trying to say. That doesn’t mean I want translators to lose their jobs, it just means I know what the best available technology is and how to use it to get a job done. (And does not mean just because it translates well that I will also trust it to summarize the article for me.)
It’s one of the reasons I use Lemmy a little less these days as it’s evident to me that it’s an echo chamber for a tiny subset of humanity and at times it just feels like a circle jerk where real change isn’t an option.
It’s mainly tech savy people who don’t use it. Tons of people in companies use this shit. The number of people who use “ai” to take auto notes in meetings is insane. It’s a massive security risk but they do it anyways thinking it won’t be stored.
The majority of people eat at McDonalds. It doesn’t make it a good idea on your finances or health. Sheep gonna baa.
If you for some reason think that megacorporations and big tech aren’t monetizing the literal majority to the fullest extent of every single law they can break while getting away with it, you need to wake the fuck up. Big time. I don’t know if this is some psyop from leddit or what but my doors stay closed, my android plays tablet mode with no sim. Thanks tho.
Nauseating.
Very. I get sick just smelling it.
Obligatory Lemmy is social media response
Yes, with the key difference being that it’s anonymous. Publicly viewable but the users can be as anonymous as they like.
it’s mostly just talk. people will hate it and use it at the same time
I’ve been trying to tell people for 15 years. It hasn’t worked a single bit. It’s frustrating that people think they have nothing to hide when their carelessness and lack of tech knowledge is ruining the future of the next generations. I just can’t try to explain it to everyone. They don’t link the relation at all. I thought maybe eventually, they would just get it, but here we still are…
You don’t want to use it.
The companies keep preloading it on new tech, updating old tech so its there, preventing the option from disabling it from even being there, and disabling tech that can’t use it.
This. Shit. Can. Fuck. All. The. Way. Off!
“oh didn we make it not just an automatic update, but you can’t even opt out? Oops! Hee hee don’t worry, you’ll love it in no time. Which is why we’re forcing it on you. You’re welcome.”
yes but what if a company has the ability to create billions of close friends who can recommend sponsored products to you? why would it care about whether you want that or not?
also bard was a way better name for google’s LLM. it has its origins in an isaac asimov story about a robot who is programmed to tell random stories.
The problem is there’s a fair amount of tech CEOs that insist this is the future and everyone needs to hop on which between the hype train, the amount of software peeps out of a job because of layoffs and the amount of snake oils salesmen out of a job because this eats google’s lunch this bubble is just ballooning. You have a lot of people hitching on this bandwagon hoping to sell shovels to the next gold rush.
And for awhile everything is just gonna get shittier.
But the AI people that the tech bros can now create outnumber real people by ♾️:1. The opinions of real people have ceased to matter even the tiny amount that they once did. So open wide and try not to gag.
Linux has become good enough to replace desktop operating systems.
Now, we are back at square one. I’ll be the first to inaccurately declare, “This will be the year of the Linux phone.”
Looking at postmarketOS for my phone too, so sick of this shit
PostmarketOS is cool, but as an actual phone replacement it is tough, at least last time I tried.
I haven’t tried, but I took a closer look at their wiki yesterday:
- the Main (official) devices are QEMU, i.e. virtual
- the list of Community devices is long, but whenever I clicked on something there were significant caveats
IMHO they should focus their efforts on getting at least one actual phone working fully.
I want this project to succeed, but until then I use Sailfish OS, btw.
I’m looking at a Volla phone https://volla.online/en/
But I also have no experience of Linux in general yet so I have no idea if this is a good move.
I just really want to get away from android/apple/windows on all of my devices.
I want SteamOS for desktop, because quite frankly gaming is all I really use a desktop for anymore.
Maybe look into Bazzite if you get impatient waiting for SteamOS to become more widely available.
Volla also has a (reliable, judging from reports) community version of SFOS
I’m going to second a recommendation for Bazzite. If you’ve used normal Linux before, it takes some getting used to the quirks of an atomic distro, but I’ve been using it for a month or two and love it!
Didn’t know volla. Looks cool but expensive.
I don’t think steamos on desktop is a good idea, IIRC it targets specific hardware.
Behold, the Linux phone:
That looks far too polished with locked in specs for them to not have any prototype. I’d trust companies that have actually made a product that has a janky Linux implementation that’s improving, than one that doesn’t exist yet relying on crowdfunding.
This is my fourth comment shilling SFOS here, but it just might be what you’re looking for. It is my daily driver.
That’s pretty cool, I’m working now, but I’m checking out its Android app compatibility.
If it can run my work stuff, I’ll be so happy.
The forum has a thread specifically about banking apps.
Wish it was supported in more countries.
Isn’t Android using a Linux kernel already?
Yes. IIRC it’s based on latest LTS kernel with Google patches. So it’s been “year of the Linux phone” for a while now.
It’s unfortunate that the slop they put on top of it is such a privacy nightmare. PostmarketOS is trying to change that and supports Plasma, Gnome, etc. But it’s early days yet and still rough around the edges from what I’ve been reading.
Yes, but everything above it (including drivers) is custom-made and tightly controlled by Google.
Yeah, but the kernel is a low-level module that handles hardware, memory, and processes—it’s not what users interact with directly, so sharing the same kernel doesn’t make it all that similar as you’d think.
What makes Linux feel like ‘Linux’ to users is the stuff on top: the userland—bash, coreutils, package managers, X11/Wayland, etc. Android replaces almost all of that, so even though it uses the Linux kernel, it doesn’t feel like Linux.
I use Linux since debian 3.0 and I don’t think Linux is ready to replace desktop os yet. The universe has come up with bigger and more powerful idiots.
Linux had reached idiot parity with windows at least. Idiot proof OS is a fable that cannot be reached.
Maybe in “appliances” like the steam deck. There are still driver and software support issues. There’s a big “familiarity” gap. There’s a lack of pre-installed systems. We are not at parity yet.
You think there aren’t driver and software support issues in windows 11?
Not what I said.
What you said only makes sense if you believe that to be true.
Nope.
Android… is a Linux phone…?
Not really.
android is linux and its great. the problem is the google crud on top of it, and their iron fist ruling it. windows is similar tbh.
we have to fight google not compete with android. the problem is not technology itself, its the oligarchs controlling it.
Android is Linux… sure.
But it’s not what anyone means when they say they want a Linux phone.
i know that.
my point is that it doesnt really matter while the oligarchs control the mainstream OS.
Its a vexingly pedantic point.
In the absence of being able to switch to Graphene (Don’t own a pixel), I’ve done everything I can to replace Google Apps with FOSS alternatives, and disabled Google Assistant on my device entirely.
I know none of that will stop a determined Google eventually fucking with me, but at least I’m trying.
I’m so damned tired of the modern corporate world.
I know that they might not be as secure as GrapheneOS, but you should totally give LineageOS or /e/OS a try, as they’re both not limited to Pixels. I haven’t tested them myself however, since I am a Graphene user. The most I ever tried with one of them was testing ROMs by installing LineageOS on my old Moto G7 play.
I usually move to Lineage once my two year warranty is up, just in case.
I know that by law hardware manufacturers can’t deny hardware warranty based on your software (at least where I’m from…I worked in for one of the big three telco’s up here in Canada)
But I’d rather not have that argument with the manufacturer, so I wait for it to run out. If my phone has a rom available I run that until the hardware dies and then I upgrade.
Did you find a Google Drive alternative? I’m strongly considering Peergos, but still kinda shopping around.
Nextcloud sucks in many ways, but it is functional and works for me.
It has always worked fine for me. The occasional upgrade process is manual but literally just a command.
I use it, too. Never had any problems with it.
I just use Syncthing. No cloud, just keeps any folders I choose on any devices synced with one another. Never had a problem, and while the files yes accessible on the internet technically, they’re not stored anywhere except the devices that have access to them. Works like a charm.
Yet we keep empowering them with every purchase we make and half of the consumer base will never see an issue doing so. Some purchases we have no choice but to make, and that’s where they really have control of our lives. They seized the means of production, distribution and access of things necessary for life and leverage access to those necessities for access to more parts of our private lives. The majority appear to be naive morons who will happily sell all of us down the river for more camera filters and some pretty shoes. Basically, toys. We are losing our rights, our privacy, and control of our lives in exchange for toys…
Consumer activism, by itself, has rarely, if ever, accomplished anything.
The best recent examble was Tesla, but that wasn’t a mere non-buying action. Tesla action involved vandalism and a massive word of mouth campaign.
Basically if we want to fight for a future we believe in, we must stop playing patty cakes and fight like it’s a life and death struggle.
Symbolic resistance is not enough.
Don’t get me wrong, I still avoid buying Nestle products, and have for years, but I know this is not the way to real change.
I want us to stop suggesting consumer activism as a valid pathway to change.
Consumer activism kills businesses and products regularly. We call it ‘trends’.
But manufacturing a boycott for long enough to work is almost certainly going to fail. But like you say, it has a role to play, just not by itself. It must be an action used with precision as part of a larger strategy. We have plenty of tools, but nobody puts them together. It’s always an isolated boycott that flairs up and inevitably fades away. The company just waits it out. We also can’t boycott necessities, and that’s where they really get us. Consumer activism doesn’t work all in those cases.
I swear all of this was predicted to happen by open source advocates of the 80s and they’d be called alarmists/whatever and then 30 years later you had Snowden leaks and all the surveillance bills and now Microsoft, Google, and Apple are all advertisement companies mining data through the software and devices they sell
The best people can do is just keep using and advocating for Linux adoption. Try out degoogled Android or a more traditional Linux phone device. Need more users and funding to get the software kinks worked out. They’re not as good as the high end Android and Apple stuff, but it’s a process
Do you have any good material to degoogle Android??
Just saw there’s a sort of large Lemmy degoogle community
https://lemmy.world/c/[email protected]
Personally I think it’s a good start to just replace Google applications. Organic Maps over Google Maps. Proton Mail/Drive/VPN/Calendar over Google stuff. Firefox and forks over Chrome. Duckduckgo over Google search. After that you can maybe find an old old Google Pixel phone and then start flashing ROMs off XDA forums as practice before you try a newer more expensive phone
Ok!!! Thanks. I’ve done all that, so I Think I’m degoogling. It’s Hard to avoid Android in my country, you risk to be out of communication Networks
I’ve been struggling with figuring out how to get google off my phone. I don’t know if I’m doing a bad job of searching or if I’m just dumb, but are there any good communities in Lemmy you can recommend on the topic?
Just searched degoogle in Lemmy
https://lemmy.world/c/[email protected]
There are levels to it. The advanced level is using a custom Android ROM for your phone that has no Google play services/apps on it and that’ll depend on what’s available for your phone from community ROM makers. You can see if any of these support your phone or plan any future phone of yours around these
https://itsfoss.com/android-distributions-roms/
An easier first step is just starting with non-Google apps. You can start with replacing Google apps like replace Maps with Organic Maps or something similar. Replace Gmail with something like Proton Mail. Same with calendar and cloud storage. Proton has alternatives. They even have an okay Google docs feature. Use a different search engine like duckduckgo rather than Google.
F-droid as an app store. Instead of Google authenticator use Aegis. Instead of Chrome use Firefox or a fork of it.
It’s difficult so a process over time of lessening dependency on Google applications
But what about banking apps and surch?
That is an issue that I imagine only being solved with a larger user base that banks don’t feel like they can ignore anymore
As the other guy mentioned, the website. All these apps are usually web wrappers anyways or some sort of cross platform software dev framework that does web/mobile so the website is usually pretty much the same as the apps
banking apps partially work
I’d imagine you can do everything on the website, which can likely be made into an ‘app’ on Firefox via the “Add to Home screen” option.
Maybe this gives me a false sense of security but I bought the adguard pro on social stack (I think…). I just turn all of the connections off on gemini, meta and Bixby. Like this
Why do you keep Gemini installed? Does it even work offline?
Android users won’t have a choice after a while.
I didn’t want Google Now. Uninstalled it, and it’s back and updated. Been fighting for years.
I assume it’s better to leave it and have it not work, then them sneak it on without me knowing or baking it into something else
So there’s an opt-out.
The article seems concerned that the email announcing this doesn’t include a specific path to the opt-out right in the email (which is a weird concern, considering the email provides two links to… presumably that information)?
I’m not sure what this means, either, but it seems the “whether your Gemini Apps Activity is on or off” line is saying that you can still have Gemini send texts for you even if you disable Google storing your apps usage server-side? I don’t use Gemini as an assistant, so I’m not sure, but looking at the Gemini settings menu on my Android phone that’s what it seems to map to.
Saying “You’re not alone” is supposed to be a wholesome thing to show someone that you care. Instead, it’s AI companies squeezing as much data out of customers and injecting as much AI into everything they can.
Society really took a wrong turn didn’t it?
No, Google is using their influence and our reliance to steer society. Please don’t forget how passive language enables the worst abusers.
You’re right, I’m an abuse enabler because I made an observation about companies being shitty. Very well said.
They didn’t say you were an enabler. They said that those words are enabling. Just think about the way you phrase things so as to not hide (intentionally or otherwise) guilt.
Surely overreacting to my correct observation that did not reflect on you directly will make you seem more reasonable.
Society really took a wrong turn didn’t it?
Society has been circling the drain since the invention of agriculture…
I don’t have Gemini loaded to my phone and I have Google assistant voice command disabled
But a few days ago I was having a conversation with my son next to me on the couch with my phone sitting on the arm of the couch.
When I asked him a question, gemini answered with a prompt on the screen I have never seen before and haven’t since.
It still creeps me out
I looked up what the prompt for gemini is supposed to lol like and this looked nothing like that. It looked more like a popup dialogue box from a browser but the only browser I use is opera and it is set as default
Yeah a couple of weeks ago Google secretly activated Gemini on every Pixel user’s phone. I ran into the same problem, my phone suddenly activated and Gemini popped up interrupting a song that I was playing while I was away from my phone. Ended up screwing up the song and having it repeat over and over and over.
I’ve not received any mails or notifications. Though I don’t use Gemini at all. Or Google Assistant. Or any assistant.
I don’t use them either, but still got the email.
Same. My only use is accidental.
Guess I’m should get around to disabling it.
I thought I had disabled it, and I don’t have the app, but I can’t see any way to remove it from any of the settings mentioned in the email 🤷🏻♂️
So is Gemini on there as an app? It isn’t listed as such on my phone
Yes, it’s on there. I have a phone, never downloaded or installed Gemini, but because it’s a motorola with a special extra button… I can push that button and up pops Gemini.
The only way I can stop it is by disabling the Google app, then the button becomes innert again (which is how I like it).
So yes, it’s embedded in the Google app. Disabling the Google app may aslo cause other issues (such as Google Home/Chromecast not working).
Thank you. I disabled the google app (which I tbh low key don’t know what it even does)
Doesn’t the motorola phone have a settings screen for defining what the button does? For Samsung they like to re-purpose the power button.
First of all, it brought up bixby. I turned it back to powering off the phone and disabled bixby.
Then, with the new update they re-assigned the power button to gemini. So, I turned it back to powering off the phone and disabled gemini too.
However, the problem these days is that I’m never completely sure I’ve turned off all of the AI nonsense on my phone.
Yeah, but the question was as to whether Gemini is listed as an app. The answer is no, Google have snuck it in whether you like it or not.
It’s in the app list for me. I set it to disabled.
Phone is Samsung s24 ultra.
Gemini depends on the Google app, disable it, and it dies.
Have you noticed how the Google app, the one that supposedly just does search and list news articles, has like 400 MB? Over time it accumulated 2GB cache… how?
I recently tried using the Google Translate image translator. Totally locked up now, requiring Play Store and Google App. Still didn’t work, but is was seriously just “if you don’t give us everything now, we won’t do basic shit for you.”
Use Yandex or in use google images in the browser.
This headline format makes me irrationally annoyed.
They shouldn’t be making assumptions about what the reader thinks. It almost feels like they’re planting a bias first and then presenting the facts - instead of just laying things out and letting people make up their own minds.
Few years ago I got a Nest Secure to go with my other Google Nest gear. One day Google emailed me to tell me Assistant was now enabled on my security system. Oh, by the way, it has an undocumented microphone!
That’s when I realized what a privacy nightmare Google really is. I know Apple isn’t great but come on.
Dammit don’t make me switch to apple phones, I hate apple. I hate Google too but FFS all you need to do is stay out of my way and the one thing you continuously do is stand in my way…
GTFO of my way! Piss off with that AI crap that nobody asked for
The apple who recently put AI as the core element of their os?
An ungoogled android variant has to be a lot lesser of an evil, no?
Problem is that if you have a critical application (like banking) that relies on Google services you’re SOL.
It’s Apple or Google at that point.
“Do you guys not have laptops?”
Just use the websites instead of the apps.
But then you can’t tap to pay with your phone.
Well then I guess you will have to sell your soul to the devil for those extra seconds of convenience
Apple is pushing AI even for their Mac lineup. Apple is a US company and had to be forced to allow Sideloading in select regions. Jumping to another US company seems like a lateral move.
Moving to dumb phones or custom ROMs is the best alternative available.
You dont have to switch phones entirely, and you’re better off if you dont. iCrap is still far worse than anything Google is coming out with.
Just switch to a different dialer/phone app to replace “Phone” and a different SMS/MMS app to replace 'Messages". I’ve used “Should I Answer” in the past for my default phone app, and I currently use QKSMS for texting.
What about LineageOS?
My guess is the problematic parts here aren’t open source so they should never show up in Lineage OS?
