This is specifically Bavaria. They also recently found out that their vice president has a past as a Nazi and the reaction of their president was essentially “Oh no. Anyway…”. So, yeah, if you considered visiting the Oktoberfest, maybe reconsider.
DEUTSCHLAND 😎💪🏿💪🏿💪🏿
what is not going to Oktoberfest gonna do?
being out of reach of nazis or conservative christians can increase safety and well-being
But what if I want to snort Wiesnkoks off of a dick?
So you’re saying we should all drop social media? Not a bad idea
Hurt the bavarian economy.
Eh, I don’t expect random tourists to be locked up by the fascists, nor do I necessarily expect the not-quite-fascists to distance themselves from the fascists, just from losses in the tourism industry.
I’m mostly just saying, there’s tons of places you could be traveling to and “drinking beer with fascists” isn’t quite as attractive anymore.
What the fuck
Bavaria is a traditionally very conservative state. The Conservative party is ruling with an iron grip for decades.
But Munich
Bavaria is our Texas.
Germany is not alright and Bavaria is the least alright , nominally leftist parties barely get up to 10% in elections there so yeah was to be expected.
But yeah.
Additional Context: The state government of Bavaria (and several others around that same period, with similar ideas) passed a controversial reform of police laws in 2017-2018 (It was polemically called “The strictest police law since 1945”).
It included changes such as:
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increased allowance of use of personal data by the police forces.
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allowing the police to openly film and photograph people participating in public gatherings.
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allowing the police to infringe on postal secrecy and to confiscate mail without a person’s knowledge. (if given permission by the courts)
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allowing the use of police spies. Including even entering people’s homes if given permission.
As well as making previous restrictions such as on “probable danger” way more lax.
They should put some kind of mark on all those suspicious people and their house, to also let other people know who lives among them.
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This is legal Germany?
Oly in Bavaria. In every other German State this can only be done for a few days max in extreme situations.
Actually, Bavaria has a 2 month limit. Schleswig-Holstein is the one with no limit.
Makes sense, they border denmark after all
Bavaria doesn’t even pretend to care anymore.
I can’t read German, but we have a similar legal system in the Netherlands.
Most likely, these people committed some crime during a previous protest, such as illegally entering private property or vandalism. Often they will get sentences that are conditional.
If there is evidence to believe they are conspiring to commit a similar illegal act, then the conditional part of the sentence gets triggered.
Nope, it’s actually only that the police has reason to believe that they might commit a crime.
No need for them to be prior offenders or anything. The police can arrest anyone at any time if they believe you might commit a crime. And even comparatively minor things like blocking traffic counts.
Is this similar to a conspiracy charge?
It doesn’t sound like it. Conspiracy means there’s documented evidence of a plan and motive to commit a crime. This doesn’t seem like it meets that standard.
Thanks. I have no clue about German law. Oddly even though America has a large German population historically, our laws are based on English, French and Spanish laws.
The difference in regards to a conspiracy charge is that you don’t need a conspiracy behind it.
In Germany, there are actually 18 different laws regarding this, since that part of the law is federated. So each state of Germany (plus the federal police and the federal criminal police) has it’s own law regarding under what circumstances they are allowed to arrest someone before they committed a crime and for how long.
Originally, these laws had two purposes:
- Stop someone from committing a serious crime
- Stop someone from doing harm to themselves
And as such, these laws used to have tight limits on when they can apply and for how long people are allowed to be arrested.
A case could be made for these laws. E.g. if someone announces online that they are going to shoot kids at a school, it would be totally justified to quickly bag that guy before he kills children. Waiting for a court order might not be fast enough to save the would-be victims.
But then they started to expand the reasons why someone can be arrested and for how long.
In Bavaria, for example, it’s enough that someone carries items that can be used for criminal purposes. And there they can jail people for up to two months without a charge.
There have been cases where someone was put in jail for two months for carrying items like crowbars or ropes in their backpacks.
Feels like a half assed Minority Report plotline.
“Okay, so what cool plot idea do we use to determine who might commit crimes?”
“IDK, just anyone maybe? People who use the internet?”
Same way I look for weed in illegal countries; find hippies and dreadlocks.
Well they did identify themselves as members of a group that publicly announced it would continue to commit crimes.
Well, no. Blocking traffic is no crime. It’s just a misdemeanor (Verwaltungsübertretung).
It’s really something for the lawyers but it could be considered “Nötigung” (§ 181 StGB) and/or “Gefährlicher Eingriff in den Straßenverkehr” (§ 315b StGB).
Pretty sure if it’s in the StGB it’s a “crime” (Straftat).
In English, at least for the US, there are typically only misdemeanors and felonies, and both are crimes. There are also violations, but those are usually civil, not criminal (parking tickets, for example).
Sorry, mistranslation. I meant violations. Over here we only split into violations and crimes.
Violations cover most things done with a car/in traffic without actively harming someone.
Yeah, in English (in the US, generally) we’d call that a civil violation. Or a civil action where a lawsuit is brought by a private citizen, like suing someone for damaging your property. It’s against the law, but probably not going to be prosecuted by the government.
Kind of. Iirc it’s a very controversial practice and whenever the police pulls it out in a public case it gets protested again (for good reason). Also, even if the practice is legal right now, there’s a lot of limitations to it. Obviously it’s nudging the ethical boundaries of police work either way.
Maybe they should arrest everyone that might protest against this before they arrest the other people that might protest against climate change. But then people might protest against that too. I guess everyone is under arrest! You’re all under arrest. Get in the hole!
There is a law that lets the police take people into custody to prevent terror attacks, but that’s not the case here.
Complaints have been lodged before, but hitherto dismissed. And final clarity on the legality of the procedure is still pending.
It helps to read the article.
but that’s not the case here
But this is in fact how the police argues. Climate protests are terror attacks (since they disrupt traffic) and therefore this is justified.
Pretty sure the Bundesverfassungsgericht (basically our supreme court) will shut this practice down – just like all the other times Bavarian laws have been ruled unconstitutional – but Bavaria doesn’t care. They scrap the law and replace it with a similar unconstitutional version and wait 2 years until the Bundesverfassungsgericht rules it unconstitutional and so on.
It’s basically our texas or florida, depending on your pov. It’s a place with great nature, interesting culture but also very crude beliefs and you either like the culture or you dont. Most importantly, police is said to be a pot rougher over there and politics is pretty conservative as well.
What does this have to do with technology?
It’s minority report but crappier.
OP may have posted it to this mag instead of another one by mistake
I’d like to know how that’s even remotely compliant with the ECHR???
The Germans have a history of these things, they try to pretend it’s all in the past but here they are right back to their old ways. It’s unacceptable for anyone to be detained in this way, period.
Yeah, us evil, evil Germans … lol
Please educate yourself: There are rightwing tendencies even in your country, but they’re coloured differently.
If you’d take a closer look at world politics you’d find that there is an alarming trend concerning exactly this.
Best example would be Italy - they’ve just elected a right-wing party and all hells breaking loose as they’ve started restructuring the social security system over there, leaving many, many families moneyless. Without any warning in advance. And that’s just the start.
China is still on with their genocide - the Uigur must die it seems, no matter what. There’s still concentration camps.
I could go on for hours.
But yeah. You’re right. Us Germans are notorious and blind towards our history.
It’s absolutely better to let people be free and do whatever they want, than to apprehend them ahead of time when they’re suspected of planning to carry out a crime.
Just imagine if the people who carried out the 11th September attack had been caught in the planning stage? Then tomorrow would just be a normal day instead of a sad day of remembrance.
That would’ve been outrageous!
Ah yes, protesting destruction of the environment and terrorism killing thousands, definitely equivalent acts
So either Germany has like 30 climate protesters, or these particular protesters are thought to be up to something and thus detained ahead of time to prevent them from causing damage either to people or property.
It’s worth noting that
- The legality of this is being disputed and,
- The decision to detain these people is labelled as controversial by the article
You can bet your arsehole that there’ll be people protesting at the event, and protesting hasn’t magically been made illegal.
If you’ve been caught trying to hijack a plane in the past, you might find yourself being under extra scrutiny next time you try to fly. That’s entirely on you.
I frequently call for the heads of big oil CEOs and enabling politicians, I don’t think I’ll ever be let within a kilometre of either type of people.
I’m begging you to take a look at the dangerous nefarious terroristic acts Letzte Generation usually engages in. They do non-violent road blockades. Sometimes they chain themselves to stuff. They might even spray some paint on a private jet sitting in a lot. These are the criminal masterminds Germany needs to crack out pre-crime for. It’s the mildest bullshit you can imagine.
And what is that going to achieve? Because they glue themselves to the autobahn, or chain themselves to a dozen cars, people will magically stop driving?
Then what? How is people not driving affecting the grand scheme of things?
It’s not. Do something useful, like get to the people responsible. Idiotic stunts like super gluing yourself to a table is making a mockery of the entire climate movement.
The suffragettes fucked with census and blew shit up. It’s time to take a leaf from their playbook.
“They must have been planning something terrible”
“They weren’t”
“Well they should have!”
🤔
You’re just being contrarian.
Unironically would be an awful world if people could be arrested for suspicion of wanting to potentially someday do a crime
You’re right. It’s the world we live in, and it’s absolute garbage for a wide range of reasons.
This is sort of a reverse godwin.
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Half of the voting population. Less people actually agree with conservatives in the US than our voting splits indicate. They are either indifferent or have been suppressed from voting.
They want protestors to be quiet and in the distance. God forbid they inconvenience people to get their voices heard
Sadly the US is exactly the same, and even demands permits for protest. But we’re teh freeeeeisst evaeva by crackie
And also the other half
Death to amerikkka
That’s not even a little fun tbh
The other half thinks the protestors should get the electric chair.
PRE-CRIME, JUST LIKE IN THE SCI-FI TREATS
EDIT:
is leaking again; apparently even emojis can get pulled over by the Pedantry Police. 🚔 
🚓What does this have to do with “I have no mouth and i must scream”?
I can’t remember any “pre-crime” in it. Just an AI torturing people for his amusement.
I know.
I was just stretching the application of the emoji to summarize bad futuristic outcomes because there isn’t a Minority Report related emoji yet.
You can’t just use any random emoji you want, that doesn’t make any sense.
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It’s just weird to use “emojis” like that. Maybe it makes sense on hexchat but not so much elsewhere.
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You can’t just use any random emoji you want, that doesn’t make any sense.
the absolute state of lemee
I’ve used it for well over a year.
You are the very first person to ever complain about how I used it.
Fair enough. I don’t believe it is a very popular story so that might be the reason.
Why is there even an Emoji for the book? Does it come up that often on hexchat?
I don’t believe it is a very popular story so that might be the reason.
It was popular enough for me to have known about it before I saw the emoji.
Why is there even an Emoji for the book? Does it come up that often on hexchat?
Because the Hexbear creator of emojis decided it’d be fun to add it, and it was almost immediately used to summarize bleak and terrible future outcomes, especially in reference to this moment mocking the tendency of tech billionaires to miss the point of the fiction they consume and make announcements about how they want to make the bad things in such fiction come true:
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/002/386/548/92f.jpg
Odd, but alright then. Maybe it makes more sense the the “emoji” renders properly.
Have you read the story? If not, do it. It’s pretty great and only around 40 min long.
Harlan Ellison made an audiobook version I listened to, while also reading it at the same time: https://youtu.be/dgo-As552hY
You can also borrow the book for free here: https://archive.org/details/ihavenomouthimus0000harl
Or just get it for free in many other places.
Edit: oh and what is stormfront? Edit 2: the “I have no mouth…” game is also pretty great and was given away for free on GOG a while back so you might already have it, if you keep track of those things. That game is inspired by the book but it is mainly it’s own story.
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audi pardner
this some kind of deep fried 10k times folded turbo meming that wouldn’t even be allowed on the autobahn.
Ohh, I’ve seen this one, it’s a classic!
freedom of association moment
First they came for the environmentalists, and I said nothing because I didn’t want my commute to be inconvenienced…
‘Innocent until deemed inconvenient.’
hmmm this reminds me of something i just cant quite remember
Oktoberfest! Those days were a real gas!
This is the worst thing i’ve ever said online.
To be fair, in this case 16 people are already free since yesterday. The other 9 have been taken into custody while demonstrating. Not because of the demonstrating itself, but for various reasons, ranging from resistance against the police to cases where they technically endangered someones live by blocking emergency vehicles. They will be in jail for another 19 days. Another reason for longer jail sentences are them being impossible to learn, aka. not changing behaviour from previous incidents.
Did i leave the oven on?
Yeah, but there’s a solution for that.
Ohh, I’ve seen this one before, it’s a classic!
I find it funny, you talk about freedom, Europeans will defend their governments as free, shit on the US, defend government power in the name of protecting the public, but then, preemptively jailing people, like previous authoritarian states of Europe would do, and they’re all surprised pikachu face. I doubt they’ll ever get it, Europeans are lemmings.
Except the French. The French light shit on fire when their government displeases them.
This is generalising a bit much done you think? This is like saying all US states are the same, but more outrageous as they’re completely separate countries with different cultures, languages, and governments
well, you have a history of authoritarianism and warrantless detention in many, many European countries, the US is all entirely subject to the US constitution which explicitly forbids warrantless searches, detention absent due process and things like that. It has a few blind spots, and the rules are broken, but generally can be corrected and the culprits prosecuted. Detention in Germany for example without a jury trial and evidence of illegal activity is perfectly legal, as it is in the UK and almost every other European country so long as it protects the general welfare or some other such broad meaningless condition.
constitution which explicitly forbids warrantless searches
Bullshit. I have been arrested for a warrantless search.
It has a few blind spots, and the rules are broken, but generally can be corrected and the culprits prosecuted.
Absolute dog shit take. Sounds like the law has been favouring you. Most aren’t so lucky.
US does shit like this all the time. Guantanamo bay ring a bell? There are still people there who haven’t been convicted of a crime.
That doesn’t count, those were brown people!
