Really hoping this happens. I want to be able to replace the battery on my phone after a year because the performance on the battery degraded by nearly half.
That being said, I’m also willing to bet some time shortly after this goes into affect, the cost of mobile service (at least in the US) will go up another $10/$15 a month, and phones will increase in cost by another $100-$200. Not because materials cost more, or designs change. But to preemptively screw people over.
on the battery degraded by nearly half.
One year nearly half ? wtf , even my 24/7 power used phone lost approx only 17% on battery health and its a Poco x3 pro
Holy. 👍
I wonder how thick phones will be because of this, what about phones with dual-cell battery? I know some of them do this for faster charging speed.
Absolutely nothing will change You can already swap the battery very easily, once you win the fight with the glue. Granted, most of the recent phones now allows removing said glue more or less easily, too. The only problem i can see are the IP ratings, as the backplate would need to be swappable
I don’t think the IP ratings are gonna be that much worse.
The galaxy s5 had IP67 with a removable battery back in 2014.
I do miss being able to swap out a phone battery and this will certainly be a step in the right direction in terms ewaste and device longevity.
One thing that I wonder about is waterproofing or water resistance. Some phones are basically waterproof in shallow water. How achievable is this with a device with a trivial way to remove the battery?
The Galaxy S5 sport had a battery door and water resistance. They just used gaskets.
People make this argument and barely anyone really uses the waterprooding features of a phone
You know, I really like my Essential Ph-1. It was a lovely little phone. I had the little 360 camera accessory that snapped on magentically and everything. It was so cool! Then, 1.5 seconds, dropped into water from which I grabbed it instantly, and it was done. No warranty coverage for dropping it in water, and zero waterproofing, and toasted phone. So, yes, more of us “use” waterproofing on our phones than you would think. The thing is that it didn’t need to be this way. There were waterproof phones back before everything was glued glass slabs all the time. Galaxy S5 Sport as mentioned by @[email protected] above (and other “sport” edition phones). We have a lot of hygrophobic coatings and tech we didn’t have in the day of the Galaxy S5 series. We can do better now, if manufacturers are forced to.
Fairphone 3 user here. My main reason to choose this phone a few years ago was because the battery could easily be replaced. Too many phones are perfectly functional but the battery is half dead. Another boon of non-glued batteries : You can carry two (or more) batteries to easily switch when the first one is KO. Meaning no need for portable charger and useless cables in your pocket. Phone at 10% ? Just change it, bam 100% in a second. Easy as that.
I’ll probably not be the target of such regulations because I wouldn’t choose an anti-consumer phone brand anyway, but at least it’s going in the right direction.
Honestly, with Apple making it incredibly fucking hard to take out their batteries with excessive amounts of glue, I’m okay with this.
Do they not have the tabs you can pull out anymore?
They do, but they’re incredibly prone to breaking when you pull and sometimes they’re just hard as shit to grip so you have to use a screwdriver to twist and pull.
I don’t think I need to explain why that’s so dangerous.
As someone who has changed hundreds of iphone batteries, the adhesive sucks. At least they changed to a different adhesive around iphone 8 because alcohol does wonders on it. I don’t even attempt to pull the tabs on those anymore.
May I ask how you do that? Do you just…douse the battery in alcohol? There isn’t much of a gap between the adhesive and the battery in my experience, so it just sits inside the chasis and rolls around. I haven’t had any luck with that but I’m probably doing it wrong.
I drizzle some in the corner and then use a sturdy tool to gently pry up on the battery to allow the alcohol to get deeper under. Since the adhesive patches are small to fit around the wireless charging coil, it doesn’t take much. Once you get one side of the battery loose the other will easily come with it, especially if the alcohol got to them.
And now they just have to force manufacturers to either at least security patch devices for, let’s say 10 years, or force them to open source everything the community needs to continue supporting this device. It never happened to me that the battery died before support ended.
Just had that issue with my Pixel 3a XL. No more security updates. Had to replace it with a Pixel 6a but I liked the 3a XL more. It there was any community support for the 3a XL, I would rather sell my 6a again.
Doesn’t this mean no waterproof then? Idk… I’m all down for right to repair but I’d rather choose struggling to remove glued battery from my phone maybe once every 2-3 years than to lose waterproof…
I’ve never understood the whole waterproof thing. I’ve never been in an instance where my phone was in any danger of getting wet. I get float trips and stuff but that seems like an uncommon case and even then there are ways to waterproof a phone temporarily.
You don’t use your phone on the bathroom or the kitchen? It never rains where you live? You never keep your phone in your pocket next to a sweaty leg?
I want a phone that can survive minor issues. I don’t want a phone that will die because it slipped into the sink while washing my hands or something like that. A degree of being waterproof does that.
I don’t think a phone needs to be 100% waterproof to 50 metres, but some amount of water-resistance is just good product design. Companies should not be encouraging people to dunk their phones in water, I think IP ratings sadly encourage this as well as some of the advertising around their water resistance claims.
But having some amount of water resistance built into electronics helps reduce e-waste because accidents do happen. For more serious water activities people should be buying waterproof bags for their electronics.
Motorola Defy was waterproof with removable battery. A small switch locked the cover in place with a rubber gasket. This was over 10 years ago.
No it doesn’t. you have have IP68 and a removable battery. What’s not as easy it making them paper-thin as the battery needs to have structural integrity of its own.
My old Galaxy S5 was water resistant (IP67, 30min/1 metre submerged)
The rear cover had a gasket to prevent water entering the motherboard, micro sd, battery, sim etc.
If this goes through, I think it would be really good news. Battery failure is one of the leading things that force people to replace their smartphones, and having them be replaceable would go a long way towards making smartphones last longer.
Fingers crossed that this will be implemented well, im tired of having sleek electronics be irrelevant in 2 years when the silicon could go for 5 or six
The silicon could go on for decades if both the modem and processor were fully documented hardware that the community can access and support in the Linux kernel.
I can run a secure and current form of Linux on 30+ year old hardware if I want to, because the hardware documentation was expected by everyone at the time even if some end users were oblivious to what this meant. The whole reason google pushes Android is because they provide a base Linux kernel that hardware manufacturers can easily slip their proprietary junk into without requiring them to add the kind of open source code needed for mainline kernel support by the community. This is the mechanism that depreciates your device. It is totally artificial and an end user exploitation by design.
It’s usually not silicon on the PCB that fails, but the other electronic components (usually the capacitors) that fails first, and since they are surface mounted devices it’s really difficult to solder them by hand.
There are no electrolytics in phones, and most newer phones don’t even have tantalums. So long as there are no flexing stresses induced, which is nearly impossible with the way phones are constructed now, the all MLC capacitors construction has the potential to outlast any PC motherboard or laptop by a large margin.
The most critical issue is board connectors and moisture ingress. The USB-C connector or any other high pin density micro sized connector with a tiny pin pitch, and large electrical potential will fail from charge cycling and a resistance forming between pins. USB-C is particularly bad because reversing the connector doubles the number of pins on the board in a ridiculous amount of space. Just using a standard USB-C connector when ordering a prototype to be fabed at any common board house will double the price. The USB-C pin pitch is too tight for the most common fab process resolution.
The pin pitch only matters for high power application to prevent arcing, and that can also be resolved through the most modern USB-PD standard (See: USB-PD Extended Power Range, which can support up to 240w), and the electrical adjustment you have to make are all on the device side.
I don’t know about the resistance forming between the pins, for low cycle applications the cheapest gold flash plating would easily last 10K plug cycles, and accounting for corrosion from hand sweat/oil/hand lotion, many companies favor going for thicker hard gold or platinum plating nowadays. (Rhodium is the absolute best, but it’s just too expensive now to do at scale because they are used in catalytic converters for electric cars). USB-C lasts for many more cycles than the Micro-USB standards before it (You can read the 4 axis and wrenching test standards for mechanical testing on the USB spec) so I’m not sure what you are talking about here.
Lab tests rarely reflect the real world. I’ve seen several issues with Pixels that had an issue with PD failing due to moisture, corrosion, and a bridge developing at the connector.
Actually, no, the lab tests are standard with all products of all large companies, and they are usually conducted in extreme conditions, like 100% moisture at 80-90C oven for 48 hours and highly concentrated salt spray kind of extreme.
You bring up the example of Google Pixel, yeah, because it’s Google, they are software people who think they can just cheap out on hardware and save a couple of cents by making it up in software. Look at the Nexus 5X and 6P, both devices had an absurd amount of quality control issues compared to the other products made by the manufacturers, and the only factor in common between them is Google.
Things change with time. The Pixel is now the most secure phone available due to its hardware encryption key verification system. It is the only phone that can run a verifiably secure bootloader and ROM on top of the same untrusted hardware situation found in all modern proprietary devices. Running a Pixel on Graphene OS is the most free and honestly liberating experience that has been available since the invention of capacitive touch technology made these handheld computers popular. The hardware build is on par with any similar device of the same price point, made in the same facilities as most devices.
I can’t wait to hear the Apple marketing word for this feature. They’ll add some gimmick like the battery is held in with magnets and say “We call it MagPack and we think you’re going to love it.”
Do y’all remember the days when you dropped your phone and it exploded into 3 or 4 pieces? 🤣 Those were the good days.
Three. Battery, cover and the rest. Weirdly, no damage to the plastic display. How? I guess it was the
weatherbezelWell, it was plastic. Pretty hard to crack plastic like glass
And when you scratched up the back you bought a new one for $12. No $200 glass or machined aluminum cases that we put $35 covers on just to protect them from every day use.
Wonder if phone manufacturers will fragment their offerings to satisfy EU requirements or if we’ll all end up with removable batteries.
It will be a pretty major redesign of the chasis and body to accommodate a removable battery and the cover, so I think it would make little economical sense to maintain two designs for every phone sold here.
This is actually pretty crazy. Wonder how much it’ll affect the overall design of modern smartphones. Will we witness the return of flagships with plastic back covers?
Yeesh I hope not.
I hope everything just becomes brushed aluminum ffs. I hate all these glass back phones
Phones only have glass backs to let wireless charging work so I don’t see aluminium making a come back any time soon.
I hate wireless charging too, though. It’s inherently less efficient than wired, and you have less range of motion while charging. With a wire, I can still use my phone while it’s plugged in. Wireless charging needs to go away imo.
I interested in how your hate for wireless charging has anything to do with this thread?
We’ve had wireless charging in every single material back and it’s absolutely wonderful QOL improvement.
It can’t be done through metal backs, for what it’s worth.
This is great.
Excellent! Batteries in modern phones are surprisingly definitely removable and replaceable. I’ve done it multiple times. However, the unfriendly barrier to entry is glue and clips that require careful prying with spugers. It’s quite clear manufacturers are happy blocking you getting in; plenty people just buy new phones when the battery gets too old.
