Gentle reminder to everyone that support for #windows10 ends in about 90 weeks. Many computers can’t upgrade to Win 11 so here are your options:
- Continue on Win 10 but with higher security risks.
- Buy new and expensive hardware that supports Win11.
- Try a beginner friendly #Linux distro like #linuxmint. It only takes about two months to acclimate.
I’ll wait until the 11th hour, start testing the kids out on Debian and steam see if proton can bridge the gap for them. Wife is Mac. My servers are already Linux One of my laptops is already Debian. Anything else I have from work that needs Windows is already new enough to run 11.
I do have a camera server running win 10 and blue iris. Not really sure what to do there. I have a lot of time wrapped up in Blue Iris on that box and I seriously doubt I’ll be able to run hardware acceleration in any type of compatibility layer. That box may just get cordoned off from the internet and network, or I’ll do a upgrade hack.
Anyone that still wants a supported version of win 10, look into Windows 10 IoT Enterprise LTSC (2021) - supported until 2032 and can be activated by MAS with HWID
You said a lot of things I don’t understand
It’s a version of Windows 10 targeted at businesses that choose to run Windows on “Internet of Things” devices. It is a “Long Term Service Channel” release that receives primarily security updates (little to no features updates), because the devices that will use this need to be in service for a very long time. Enterprise Windows typically activates with a licensing server that’s subscription based. But you can use the “Microsoft Activation Scripts” to activate it as if it were a retail copy you pick up the store.
Good bot
How long until Steam drops support on W10?
That’s the important event, lol
Well they only just dropped support for Win7 and that came out in 2009.
Probably around the time developers to start requiring W11. That TPM requirement is going to be abused to hell and back.
What incentive is there for a developer to abuse that?
Kernel-level anti-cheat drivers for games, mainly.
All of them. You want to play your single player role playing game? Better have a hardware-attested system or else we can’t verify you’re not receiving that armor you need for the boss through anything but a microtransaction. It’s just 4.99€!
A bleak future
I am using windows 10 on my tv pc so that’s all I cae about.
I missed the “90 weeks” bit - you made it sound like it was coming soon, you cheeky scamp.
Windows 10 will reach end of support on October 14, 2025. The current version, 22H2, will be the final version of Windows 10, and all editions will remain in support with monthly security update releases through that date.
Yeah who measures that timeframe in weeks, sheesh
Gives me these kinda vibes.
I’m a certified Microsoft hater, but man, 90 weeks? I get it, we want Gnu-Linux to be more streamlined, but his is certainly not the way. This is tech fearmongering.
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Yeah. Did you know that Andromeda Galaxy will collide with Milky Way in 4.5 billion years? Gotta watch out for that one as well.
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You may be pretty heavily discounting the influence of gravity.
I do not think that risk of collision based on current trajectory is the only thing to consider.
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Gravity is not just attraction to the closest thing but also the heaviest thing.
As the galaxies “pass” each other, all stars will be attracted to the dense cores of each galaxy. That is going to change the trajectory of individual stars and, as an aggravate effect, the overall shape and distribution. Unless the galaxies are aligned on the same angle, this is going to drag stars off the primary plane.
As the galaxies approach, the arms will stretch out to each other. As they pass through each other, the planes will tug on each other, and after they “exit”, the arms will reach back.
All this new motion will disrupt the natural shape and trajectory of the galaxy as a whole. Depending on the momentum, it could get pulled back and the whole process could happen again ( and again ) with greater disorder each time.
The moment steam ends support for win10, is the moment I fully switch to Linux.
Why wait? Carpe Linux.
Is it still that many computers that cannot upgrade, btw? They dropped all the TPM requirements later IIRC? Doesn’t that then include most PCs?
They haven’t dropped the requirement, but you have to manually go in and disable that check yourself on the windows 11 installer if you want to install it on a non-tpm 2.0 machine
Basically, it’s a faff that only the techie people will realistically do. Everyone else will just go out and buy new hardware.
For those wondering, no it isn’t just a check box. You need to create some registry files.
It is a checkbox in Rufus. Ventoy will also do this for you.
You need to uncheck the checkbox so the iso can install on non tpm hardware but you also need to tweak the registry when installing windows so the installer doesn’t check for tpm compatability.
Once Windows 10 loses support I’m moving to XP for security
I was trying to make a Windows XP compatible app last month and my god is it ever difficult. Nothing works on XP anymore, so it’s insanely hard to test/develop software. All the legacy download links are dead too, so you can’t go install older versions of things either.
I did this for React os
Windows XP was introduced 20 years after the sale of the first IBM PC in 1981.
It has one been 23 years since then!
Things certainly changed a lot more before than after.
I have a nice preserved ZIP of all the latest 32-bit XP software that can be run successfully without any issues. I use it on a VM, and it even has MS Office 2007! You will be surprised how new most of it is.
This is from July 2023.
You should switch to React os. It has an app store of outdated software.
And why do I need that, when I have a self curated repository for XP software for an offline XP VM, and I use updated software on Windows 10? Besides, I daily Debian Stable way more than I use Windows for specific needs.
.NET 4.0 runs on XP and it is still very easy to create a .NET 4.0 application on a more modern machine. A well tested .NET app will deploy and run on Windows XP with few surprises. You cannot ask for better tooling. So, I would not say that creating new software for XP is really all that hard.
If you want to be much cooler but put in more work, check this out!
Try making an app that runs on 23 year old Linux (GTK1 \o/). The fact anybody still uses XP in any context is insane.
Can’t modern Linux run on 23 year old computers? What are you running a 23 year old stack for?
A modern desktop? Probably not. It expects working modernish OpenGL and software rendering would be too slow.
Something very basic, likely somewhat functional.
My point was 23 years is forever in software.
You might be surprised. First, I run EndeavourOS daily on a 2008 iMac and it not only runs but is very useful. I browse the web, watch YouTube, video conference, create office docs, play older games, do basic programming, run Docker ( well, Podman ), watch movies, read ebooks, edit audio, etc. With EOS, all my software versions are up to the minute.
The reason I use that machine so much is because of where it is. I like that spot. The reason I have not put something else there is precisely because it works so well that I have no reason to. I use XFCE to keep it light and have to restart the web browser from time-to-time to free up RAM but it is fine.
The first 64 bit Intel chips were in 2007 but AMD released the K8 way back in 2003. I do not have one to try but my guess is I could install the most recent EndeavourOS on such a machine.
That gets us to 21 years ago pretty easily.
You would be amazed at the upgradability of older hardware. You can drop 16 GB of RAM and an SSD in a 2009 MacBook.
However, you can run a 100% modern Linux distro on hardware much older than that. Many distros, including Debian, have 32 bit versions that support Pentium Pro and up. Most software available in regular Debian is also available in the 32 bit versions. The package release numbers are the same. So, totally up to date and modern software. You can run Debian 12 on 32 bit processors.
That takes us all the way back to hardware from 1995! That is just 14 years after the first IBM PC!
In practice, the biggest problem is going to be RAM. Anything below 6 GB for 64 bit and 4 GB for 32 bit is going to struggle with the size of modern software ( especially web browsers! ).
I am not sure how far back you have to go before the processor is just too slow for everyday stuff. I would guess around 2003 or so, depending on what you are doing.
You can drop 16 GB of RAM and an SSD in a 2009 MacBook.
You got a tutorial for that? Because I have a 2009 MacBook and I’d love for it to run better than it does currently. I put Debian 12 XFCE on the thing and it works, just very slowly.
Sysadmin noises
1 it is.
That is so misleading, when you can just disable the TPM 2.0 requirements with a single click in Rufus
That’s a great tip.
And then hardly anything will work, so whats the point ?
If your system doesn’t have a TPM chip, you can still emulate it in softtware, but then everything will run like molasses, so again basically poitnless.
I have installed Windows 11 on my old Thinkpad x230 and everything works as it should. You are just talking out of your ass
- Go to windows 10 enterprise to 2025 or if you want as little windows as possible go with windows 10 ltsc and you have support until end of 2032
I’ve seen non-tech users in Linux many times. It doesn’t take them 2 months to acclimatise, at most 2 weeks but typically just 2 days. If there’s a blocker, there’s a blocker (like “my shitty bank requires some shitty software installed and they don’t support Linux”) but if there are no blockers it’s really quick. 95% of normal users just need a browser. The next 4% need LibreOffice. It’s only the last 1% that have some need that doesn’t sit in an office package or the browser.
We, the gamers, the geeks, the golems, WE have needs that may not be satisfied with Linux. But we are not normal users. So about 3% of us can be bothered to try and accept the missing software (and learn to love the new - God there are some apps I miss when in Windows), the remaining 97% either try and can’t accept the new habits required or don’t try.
But normal users?! Stick them in Mint Linux and show them where the browser is and they’ll be fine.
IMHO.
Further evidence for this is ChromeOS. It’s just a Linux distro, but worse. It does little more than run Chrome. Yet it’s popular. Anyone that tolerates ChromeOS would have an even better time on most of the standard distros if they had someone to set it up for them.
Why is Libre Office always the goto? I’ve been trying every MS Office alternative and Libre is way down on this list. It doesn’t compare. In my searching, I even found video of the creators seeming more keen to (rightly) blame MS for compatibility issues. Meanwhile alternatives just work with the reality and reduce differences in exchanging files from the world’s most common option. Plus, and this is more personal, Libre Office is dog doo ugly. Ditto for Gimp.
As someone newer to Linux, people really don’t emphasize enough the need to find alternative software that fits into one’s life. It’s all fine to say it’s all just new setups and once you learn them your good, but most world interactions with tech that isn’t your own will be Windows. Why fight the stream when you Don’t have to? There are lot of alternate Office programs is what I am saying and some are almost as good as massively funded MS Office.
Dunno really. I hardly use any office app except for Excel on Windows. What are the best alternatives in your view?
Sorry I vented on you lol. WPS Office is one I liked a lot but I learned they are following local laws and so have had instances of invading privacy when using any cloud connecting aspect. It made me not trust them even outside of cloud use. It’s very very well out together though. I wish it weren’t something I felt insecure using because it is really nice.
I consider Only Office to be my goto at the moment. I still have more to try though, more obscure ones. It has only bugged on me once when I resized the window a lot, greeting me with an all white window with no UI.
Libre I tried a lot to make me love it. It just feels designed by someone who wants to make a point against MS. I did also try a complete overhaul to adjust the UI a lot but even the functionality of it just doesn’t seem to do as well when working closely with MS Office users.
We, the gamers, the geeks, the golems
What does ‘golem’ mean in this context?
I’m old. I’m low-end overweight. I don’t shave for days. I’ve been in tech for decades. I was describing myself and my ilk as golems.
Also, it just happened to alliterate with gamers and geeks.
I am curios too!
Normal users don’t even need a PC. Most of what they do can be handled on a phone or tablet.
I don’t get why people are removing support for Windows 10. Nobody likes Windows 11 and Windows 10 is the most popular operating system with no change of that in sight.
Windows 10 is Windows 11 at this point (look at the UI and AI features)
Yeah they said that about Windows 8 too and I sat my happy ass on 7 until 10 came out.
I do not think this is happening. Windows 7 support has barely started to be removed since this year (Steam) and Firefox ESR, WinRAR et al popular big software is still updated. Infact, WinRAR only dropped XP support few months ago with v 6.02 IIRC.
Windows 10 was quite the revamp over 7/8, and 11 is just cosmetic paint plus AI garbage on 10. Support for 10 is here to stay till atleast 2 years till 11 EOL comes around, since 11 and 10 are same inside. And this is assuming 12 has fundamental developer API changes on top of 10/11.
I feel like it is by design. Windows 11 collects vastly more info about a user than Windows 10, or so I’ve read. There’s probably better sources out there than this article, but I’m lazy right now.
Its interesting as I remember people saying the same thing between Windows 10 and Windows 7/8, and that they’d never move to Win10.
Not trying to discredit what you’re saying of course, but the pattern is still there 9 years later
Both can be true - everyone always hates on new Windows versions (usually for legitimate reasons) and Windows 11 captures and reports more telemetry.
Oh I wouldn’t doubt it but what really kept me from touching it was them “testing” putting advertisements in the file explorer. Hard fuckin pass.
I’ve been wanting to ditch Windows for a while now. I’ve tried dual booting so that I only boot to Windows if I need to play some game that only works on it.
But usually the thing I do the most on my PC is: play videogames. And majority of the games I enjoy are using 3rd party anti-cheats such as EAC and so on. And to my understanding, there are no really a good ways to get those games work on linux at this moment.
Sure, if I played mostly Linux supported games or single player games (I guess big chunk of those work thanks to Steam and Proton) there would be no such a big issue but I am not willing to quit some of these games just so I can make the switch to Linux.
But what I have decided on is that W10 will be my last Windows on my home PC.
I am curious, if anyone has been in similar situation and have come up with a good solution? Maybe two PCs + KVM switch?
Surely if I search the internet I can find many solutions but I am interested to see what this community has to say about this.
I switched to Linux three years ago. I was dual booting until I realised I was barely launching windows anymore. So I just removed it. But just to be sure it wouldn’t be an issue if I ever needed windows again, I installed it on an external ssd with rufus, and it’s actually more handy than your usual dual booting. I had the same issue with some games not yet properly working on Linux (like Vermintide) but in the end it was solved and I ended up never using windows for anything…the last two times I’ve had to use it was to unlock the Iphone of a friend and to make a pesky printer work…and it was half a year ago.
I have used Linux as my main for 20 years, but I have a dedicated windows computer for games (hooked to my TV in the living room). A lot of my steam games work in Linux nowadays, but the windows computer just works without fuss. I use it ONLY for games and turn it off when I’m not playing anything.
Ironically some older games (older win95/98/XP era games) work better in Linux under wine or emulation…
I have also used a windows vm with gpu pass-through to play games on my Linux machine, though I’m sure a lot of your anti cheat would probably not allow that. I don’t bother with that anymore since so many games work in Linux with proton.
For non-gaming use I feel that 99% of dual boot scenarios should probably just be virtual machines instead. I have a windows VM I fire up for proprietary software or work related stuff when necessary.
I actually used to run a Linux laptop + Win laptop setup with a kvm switch a couple years back. It worked just fine, but I found myself barely even using my Windows machine for anything but gaming. Eventually I found out my games ran perfectly on Linux, and ended up switching to linux on the second laptop as well, as navigating the windows desktop had become painfully clunky, lol
tl;dr: a kvm setup is great but be careful what you wish for. Once you start running Linux there is no going back…
I have an old potato laptop with two SSDs, i dual boot between Win10 and OpenSuse.
I have tried using Linux only but it’s not ideal for games, there is notable difference in FPS drop with directx games running on Linux (especially on old PCs like mine).So I use win10 for gaming and Linux for everything else (surfing web, movies, manage documents, small rpi projects).
It’s a good compromise for me.I’d say gaming on Linux can be great but it heavily depends on your hardware and what you play (also it’s getting better over time so with all that we’re on a constant «your mileage may vary» situation) .
On old/potato machines though, yeah it has more chances to be less ideal than windows in most situations. (I am only talking from experiences with various computers, to be clear. I am sure it can be less or more optimistic for others.)
