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This headline is subtly dismissive.
“Angry” and “right now” both suggest a transient state. That’s not what we’re seeing.
“Canada has finally had enough of the USA” would be a more apt title; or “Canada reaches its breaking point.”
Alongside of the #Never51 hashtag is an almost equally frequent #NeverGoBack. Canada, as a nation, as a people, are making the decision to go their own way, and never be so beholden to any country as we have been to the USA since 1959.
Never. Go. Back.
I used to be angry.
I still am, but I used to be, too.
I hope you’re right, but the public’s memory is short.
Yea, in the US it lasts less than 4 years.
That’s about right everywhere. 2 is a big ask, only huge scandals last that long.
Most people just aren’t that into politics. They still vote, though.
The public’s memory is immaterial. The public really has no long term power. Decisions are made for us by politicians and businesses.
They’re the one’s who need to remember that the US has threatened their positions.
Voting with your wallet doesn’t make for sustained, long term change. It requires too much work, and it’s umder constant attack by marketing.
The public really has no long term power. Decisions are made for us by politicians and businesses.
If you had said short term I’d agree with you, it’s all politicians, but over the long term public will has made a lot of changes the Lords of old would not have approved of. Getting reelected is hard and even safe seats aren’t forever.
We do not live in a dictatorship, and we don’t have to pay bribes to the local RCMP or say nice things about the Prime Minister like we would in a dictatorship. Hell, businesses can’t even donate the same way as voters in Canada, all they really do is whine and threaten doom.
Some of the public are people like me. I stopped giving any money to Blizzard back when they made StarCraft (II?) require a Battle.NET account…or was it patching out already present offline LAN support? It was also hearing about shitty labor practices and workplace harassment at some point. My memory of why is pretty spotty, but the “don’t give Blizzard money” part has stayed crystal clear for decades now. I genuinely don’t remember why I first blacklisted EA games (might be commitment to DRM, might be just because they’re such a shitty company), but it’s on that list for life.
Heck, between 3rd-party DRM, loot boxes, and everything from “crunch time” development cycles to transphobia, I’ve been all but done with AAA gaming for several years. I could hardly be a gamer at all any more, if not for the rise of indie gaming, but that’s not really my point right now.
The point is I remember the important, actionable bits. And I think most other Canadians will also retain their simple conclusions that won’t need re-evaluation. After this, they’ll have a solitary pedestal in their mind palace just to store one special conclusion from all of this:
Fuck the U.S.
And after floundering around for a bit, Canadians will find the indie trade they love; in a few years, they won’t even miss AAA trading.
Congratulations on being part of the minority who keeps track of things like that. A lot of people just kind of go by their gut on every individual purchase.
As usual in politics and generally anything public facing, it’s not that people are literally incapable of remembering and understanding, as much as just not interested enough to do so.
What happened in '59? Avro Arrow?
The other thought I had was NORAD but my quick googling points to 1958 for that, and 59 for the arrow.
another one issue that I considered was the King-Byng affair, but that was in the 20s
You’re goddamn right I’m furious.
And no less furious at the weak-kneed Democrats who do nothing as their own country is ripped from them by a clown. “Oh sorry; we’ll try again in 4 years” they say. Fuck your thoughts and prayers, how about do something. You won’t get a free election in 4 years, dummies.
Oh yeah, I realize you’re super busy and with your sportsball games and your reality TV marathons. Your inaction today will haunt your future.
And no this isn’t a call to action or a cry for help. We’re going to be just fine. You’re the ones who have to live there, and live with yourselves knowing you did nothing.
And no less furious at the weak-kneed Democrats who do nothing as their own country is ripped from them by a clown.
Republican voters enabled another trump dictatorship, not “democrats”.
Their vote made it so that “democrats” have no power in the house, the senate, the office of the presidency, the supreme court, or the dozens of federal agencies that are now being gutted.
Blame them. Blame only them for voting the way they did, because the outcome is exactly what they voted for.
Funny how the Republicans always manage to stall everything when the Democrats are in power
When Democrats are in power, the Republicans can stall things because they only have a slim majority and the extreme measures that they’d need to take are unpalatable to 5-30 of the most regressive Democrats. So their majority doesn’t count for a lot.
Overall, I think this is partially just that Americans are pretty regressive (possibly because of all the propaganda, possibly because of our poor education). And partially the successful efforts by Republicans to control local government, which allows them to do things like gerrymander federal districts.
That’s the problem with playing fair. Republicans don’t, and Democrats have tried to.
That seems to be over, and everyone has to play dirty these days.
A terrible way of representing the people, but whatever it takes to stop Nazis, I guess.
There was lots of things they could have tried, especially when they had the whitehouse. They didn’t because they were trying to believe civilised democratic norms back into existence, or something like that.
I think it’s fair to say that they were trying to be democratic in their approach, and really couldn’t have anticipated that the public would vote again for a twice-impeached felon with dozens of charges, and the person solely responsible for inciting a violent insurrection against the capital. But here we are! 🫠
Is there a rewind button we could use? ☹️
I dunno, it’s not like the polls ever showed the unstoppable lead “felon” implies. Nor did the problem start with Trump; the angry far-right rhetoric has been slowly escalating pretty much my whole (young-ish) life.
Top democrats have shown very poor judgement, probably because they couldn’t or wouldn’t imagine the stuff that’s happened a million times before in other places could happen to them. Normalcy bias is a bitch.
The reality is, things have been going pretty good for the world in general (minus Putin being a total cunt), especially Canada and the US. And when you consider we all came out of a pandemic in pretty good shape, in spite of trump’s extremely poor handling of it, that should have given most sensible people reason to be humble.
Instead, problems were invented and spread through right-wing social media and regular media. Then false promises given by trump to “fix” those lies.
People were duped, and they voted based on the lies they were fed.
And if elected Republican officials had any concept of duty to the nation, Trump would have been stopped cold after his first impeachment. They should have stopped him cold when we all heard him boasting about sexually assaulting women, tbh.
We can blame both sides all day. The fact of the matter is that enough people voted for Trump, and gave him permission to do what he’s been doing. Whatever course-correction needs to happen will be very difficult and extremely taxing on individuals who now have to literally fight for their lives or livelihoods.
Republican voters got them elected, Democrats are standing by doing nothing as their country is ruined.
There are no attempts to secede, there are no wide-scale protests or strikes. Their democracy falls while they sit back and fret, laughing along with Jon Stewart and smug in their knowledge they are better that Republicans. For all their much-touted “second amendment” they are idle as a tyrant solidifies power.
I do blame Republican for their actions. But I blame Democrats for their inaction. I’m furious because what I see in them I recognize in myself – it’s a challenge for me to not be complacent and fight for my own country. Because if we coast like they do, we will suffer the same fate.
But I blame Democrats for their inaction.
I don’t deny that much more could have been/could be done. But look at the optics on how this would make trump even stronger:
If you had a democratically elected president who’s being shut down by the minority party, which could be seen as “going against what the people voted for”, and once again trying to “steal the election”. It would justify a horrific ramping up of his rhetoric, and seeing how he released 1500 criminals who were on his side, there would be no stopping domestic (right-wing) terrorists from targeting “democrats”.
In fairness, this timeline is so FUBAR, especially when coming off such a strong economy, highly respected presidencies from Obama and Biden, and relative peace with nearly all allies. In just a few months, Trump and Musk have been undoing hundreds of years of progress, which is unprecedented so say the least.
The States, and the world, are in such uncharted territories right now.
You do realize what you’re saying, right?
You’re saying it would be a tragedy of optics to try to stop a dictator from seizing power. That if democrats do nothing they can avoid being targeted in the short term, while Trump chases after others.
Yes. This specific attitude is what I’m furious about. And I’m going to work my damnedest to stop it happening here in my country.
You’re saying it would be a tragedy of optics to try to stop a dictator from seizing power.
No absolutely not! And I’m sorry if it came off that way. Trump and his Nazi regime need to be stopped 100%. What I’m saying is that he only needs “proof” in the form of a handful of elected democrat representatives fighting back in order to really escalate things. He hasn’t even started!
It’s up to the 300 million Americans to do something. Take action. If you’re in the military, don’t follow orders, or take those orders and do nothing with them.
We aren’t at this point in Canada, and the swing in our polls show that common sense matters. Republican voters doubled down when the world was telling them that Trump would destroy everything they cared about. They never once unified for anything. Canada is unifying, because we know what’s at stake. Plus, we’ve got way more allies in our corner than the Americans.
Exactly.
And what pisses me off is the calculation that you implicitly state, that by not reacting now the Democrats know they are “safe” because the ire is pointed somewhere else. It pisses me off because I recognize the same impulses in myself. I didn’t think Canada was in danger when the ire was on Mexicans and Haitians and Muslims. Just like they don’t see the danger now.
But when the barrel is pointed at you, you see more clearly. We are today, and the cowering Democrats are next. The longer they wait, the harder it will get – but that’s how divide and conquer works. The groups all accept the evils being done to the current group to buy their own safety, and they get picked off one by one.
And as you say – in Canada we have a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to break this cycle here. We see what’s coming now, and we won’t break.
that by not reacting now the Democrats know they are “safe” because the ire is pointed somewhere else.
It’s not necessary about self-preservation, but an avoidance of escalation.
If Trump was a reasonable person with right-wing views, he would still be able to cooperate with democrats to better the country for the people.
But he’s an unhinged, narcissistic, unreliable, compromised madman, so much of the world is in damage control at this point.
I’m not even sure how elected democrats would be able to stop him. But I can tell you how 300,000,000 Luigis could.
He’s not playing by the rules, so the strategy to fight back is to also not play by the rules. Sure, this can be self-destructive to a point, but sometimes the sacrifice of a few is what’s needed to stop a nazi uprising.
And as you say – in Canada we have a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to break this cycle here. We see what’s coming now, and we won’t break.
We’ve had enough of a warning, seeing what the hell a deranged lunatic in charge can do for another country. I don’t think we’d allow that to happen here, but I guess we’ll see ‘what the people want’ in our Federal elections.
The States, and the world, are in such uncharted territories right now.
Not really. History is full of dictators seizing power and abusing it. And in every case there was only one course of action to stop it. Stop making excuses to do nothing and take to the streets.
You may not be able to say that Trump’s actions towards Canada specifically could be predicted in any detail but there was an absurd amount of evidence that he would be erratic, self-serving, and antagonistic towards allies in general. We still elected him. There’s tons of reasons for that and many of us want to latch on to some of them in order to absolve ourselves of individual responsibility for this shitshow, but other countries don’t give a fuck about any of those reasons and we should not expect them to.
If you’re an American, you own this administration in the eyes of the world and that’s exactly how it should be. In fact, I would argue that changing course is not possible until the vast majority of us accept that fact and let it inform our actions going forward.
No, fuck this. The best analogy I’ve seen is that the republicans are a school shooter, and the democrats are the uvalde police department. I’m not going to forgive a group thst somehow becomes utterly ineffectual any time they’re needed. This has been brewing for decades. If the democrats were just tooooooooo weak to do anything to prevent it in all that time, what fucking use are they?
That’s like blaming firefighters for not being able to put out fires as fast as arsonists can set them.
Voters are the only reason why Trump is still here. Sure, you can say that democratic representatives could/should be doing more, but aren’t we way past that point now? This is trump’s second term… voters want him in power. As fucking stupid as that is.
It’s more like blaming city council because they refuse to pass any regulations that might reduce the number of fires, because it would hurt their donors in the construction industry.
We are way past the point where democrats could have done anything, and we arrived here because all through my almost fifty year lifetime and before, people on the left have been warning them about the US’s decline towards fascism, the takeover of their media and the dominance of voter suppression, and they’ve chosen to never take any action to stop it. I fail to see why they should escape blame now, after making the bed they are lying in.
That’s like blaming firefighters for not being able to put out fires as fast as arsonists can set them.
Sure, in the sense that the neoliberals are Marcus Licinius Crassus in this analogy.
explanation
Marcus Crassus became the richest man in Rome partly through real estate. He created the first fire department in Rome. Sometimes he paid arsonists to set fire to a house and then he would wait around the corner with his fire fighters. When the fire was underway, Crassus and his men would come running to the rescue. But before they would put out the fire, Crassus would negotiate with the owner. How much was he willing to sell the house for? If the owner found this unreasonable, Crassus would patiently wait as the fire consumed the building. As time passed, the price for the house went down. Usually, the owner would decide to get at least something for his house. At that point, the fire department would put out the fire. Then Crassus would have the lot cleared and a tenement building put up.
– Daily Life in Ancient Rome by Dupont p.54
explanation
Dude, that is FUCKED UP. Mobster racketeering in ancient times!
I see your point of view!
That’s like blaming firefighters for not being able to put out fires as fast as arsonists can set them.
No, that’s a bad analogy because the firefighters are trying to put out the fires to the best of their ability. The Democrats aren’t doing shit, and in some cases siding with the fascists.
It was your fellow man that did this, you really have to face that fact. People will still chose to be dumb and ignorant, and Russia really played into that. Russia has had a singular leadership for the last 30 or so years. No flip-flopping no new fresh faces a singular purpose and that is the destruction of America
of course? All these people are my fellow man. I have no idea what your point is. I don’t think aliens did it.
Their vote made it so that “democrats” have no power in the house, the senate, the office of the presidency, the supreme court, or the dozens of federal agencies that are now being gutted.
Actually, today Senate Republicans needed help from the Democrats to pass a bill to keep the government funded. And 10 Democrats helped them, including Minority Leader Chuck Schumer.
Nearly 90 million voters sat home on election day. That’s more than either candidate. Disenfranchisement plays a part, but it’s more about the complete apathy the American voting population exhibits that’s the problem. If even half those people showed up on election day (much less during primaries) the entire country would look completely different. That is a significantly bigger factor than either party shitting the bed.
That being said… Democrats, for the most part, are playing it way too safe. Their leadership is too neo-liberal and too dependent on the status quo to want to shake things up too much, because their main tentpoles (which eerily match the Republicans) revolve around stagnation and a lack of real societal progress. They bandy about social progress with racial, gender, and sexuality policy reforms, but only when it’s already well past the point that it’d be possible to enact them. Where it would make them look weak if they didn’t do something, and they get quick and easy points by doing the least possible to improve peoples lives.
There’s a ton of reps in the Democratic party that want change, and want to see things move forward at a faster pace… but they’re constantly pushed to the sidelines by the old guard that has a stranglehold on their leadership. Used as scapegoats when they want to distance themselves from more progressive elements, and fodder when they want to push another milquetoast reform that ultimately changes nothing. The problem is they’re hampered by a two-party system. They can either jump ship to a third party, and end up primaried or relegated to pointlessness, or continue on as near-impotent figures that only get soundbites on twitter or facebook.
And that’s only on the American “left”. The more moderate elements on the right are too scared to speak up lest they feel the ire of the Trump cabal, and end up toeing the line. Even if they feel they’re on the wrong side of history.
So there’s plenty of blame to go around, it’s no one thing or another. The biggest problem, though, being an American populace who refuses to band together and listen to each other, and work for each other instead of just themselves.
It doesn’t matter who’s to blame. The question is where is your nation going, and what are you going to do about it? Are you going to let all the terrible things happen because “it’s the other guys’ fault”?
What solutions do you propose for the majority of the population who are struggling to get by and who can’t even take time off work to protest or contact their local representatives? That’s the reality Americans are facing. Those with the most to lose are in the worst position to fight back.
Any protections that people once had are being stripped away each day. I mean, calling it illegal to boycott Tesla? Calling actual protesters domestic terrorists while hailing those who stormed the capital ad heroes?
The situation looks grim for Americans.
What about the democrats that did something how should they feel?
If they took action and failed I don’t hold anything against them. It’s better to try and fail than not try at all.
Unfortunately the scale of what’s happening right now is existential, so they find themselves in the crossfire.
Not a single american voted for THIS. Trump didn’t give any indication he was going to do this. This is ALL his doing. As far as you guys pushing americans to strap up, 1. Our quality if life has yet to be affected, when that happens, more people will act. 2. As for people like myself, I have a bi daughter, if and when the time comes for me to open up the armory, I will but right now, just.acting will ruin all of our lives. 3. I have worked extremely hard for my entire life, I just.got a house, reached my career goal and my lifes goal of making 6 figures.I’m not upper.class, but I’ve come from poverty and I’m not throwing that away. 4. WHEN things get bad or if trump actually acted on trying to take over.canada, more than half of.us would fight with you, but trump is.full of shit. Just.don’t buy.american shit.and.move on with your lives. We got you. Shit will change, but don’t expect me to pull the strap over mediocrity and toothless threats.
Not a single american voted for THIS. Trump didn’t give any indication he was going to do this.
When you say ‘any indication’, since project 2025 and his last term were both real, you mean to say ‘every indication’, correct?
The guy was a felon stalling the investigation of his own mishandling of secrets, during rape trials, and people voted that clown show in.
There’s no trump voter unaware of any of that.
I’m exclusively talking about annexing Canada bro. And I’m not.not defending the moron or his followers. I’m just saying when it comes to annexing canada, no one knew about that shit. But like I said, it’s idle threats. Don’t lose sleep over it. Trump doesn’t control our soldiers, even tho he has the title. Americans wouldn’t follow thru with that shit even if he ordered it.
ooooh maaaaan nobody knew about this specific thing around all the other sea of known fascist, transphobic, racist, xenophobic nazi shit! that makes it alllllll better
With all due respect, did you guys all forget about 2016 to 2020? Did you forget about Jan 6th?
I get that there were other issues to worry about during the election, but Project 2025 was out inthe open, it was in the press, democrats talked about it.
I do not believe for a second that half of you would show up to fight for Canada. How would you actually do that? American’s aren’t even fighting for themselves as DOGE is cutting out your entire government.
Trump just dumped the military lawyers and the top brass who won’t swear fealty.
He’s having his goverment draw up invasion plans for Panama, and do you really expect us to think he’s not doing the same for Canada and Greenland behind closed doors?
WE FUCKING TOLD YOU
HE FUCKING TOLD YOU
THE HERITAGE FOUNDATION FUCKING TOLD YOU
Bluntly, what have you done for me lately?
What Democrats did is a meaningless platitude.
What are all of you doing right now?
What the fuck should we do with your “we did our part”?
Simply put, You the People cannot be trusted to keep fascism at bay.
If you are ever allowed to vote in a free election again, one third of you will vote for more of this bullshit, and one third of you will refuse to vote.
Collectively, you are untrustworthy.
Frankly I think the only thing that’d give me faith in my countrymen would be learning there’s actually truth to Musk/the repubs at large rigging the election, and that’s a long shot.
They’ve freely admitted to it like four times now, just nobody wants to deal with the gigantic clusterfuck that will come from investigating that and finding the truth. So instead they do nothing and act like nothing is wrong.
Modern democrats are operating under the assumption of “if I shut my eyes hard enough then this will cease to exist”
You the People cannot be trusted to keep fascism at bay.
Of course they can’t. The founding mythology? The military fluffing? The pervasive propaganda over American exceptionalism?
It’s a fascist country. It just doesn’t always have a totalitarian government.
If the goal is to get people engaged, does telling them they’re worthless and untrustworthy actually help? I get the anger, but if you want people to step up, what’s the strategy beyond just calling them dummies?
I get the anger
No, I don’t think you do.
Why don’t I?
Only you can answer that.
Ah, the ‘I know better but won’t say why’ routine. Classic move for someone who values posturing over discussion. If there’s a real point, say it. If not, I’m out. Take care.
Hi, fellow American here. You seem to need to understand some things, so I’m here to educate you.
We’ve been gently coddling the conservatives into being better for decades. Their response to this is to laugh at you and then double down on whatever horrible shit they’ve decided is their culture war target today. Gentle reminders that they’re actively working toward the destruction of society does nothing to them. In many cases it actively galvanizes them even more toward their opinions.
So I’m fucking done coddling. Some of my friends and my family are going to die because of things they’ve gleefully voted for and then tried to throw in my face after. My nation is in flames because of what they’ve done. The entire world is falling to authoritarian fascism because of what they’ve done.
So fuck 'em. If you’re a horrid piece of shit then I’m going to tell you that you’re a horrid piece of shit. You have the option to change your ways or go fuck off and die, doesn’t matter one bit to me. But I’m sick and tired of trying to meet someone halfway when their “halfway” is “well maybe we only exterminate half of the blacks and gays and we can just enslave the rest of them?”
In short: Every single conservative “republican” that still idenitifes as such in the modern day is a piece of shit scum human being, who is directly responsible for the hellhole we find ourselves in, and if they know what’s good for them they better be afraid to show their face around me and mine. I’m tired of trying to “play nice” with oppressors. I now flat refuse to put up with their existence. These people have threatened the life and livelihood of my family and others close to me that I love and care about, continue to do so, and show not only a lack of empathy but a sick, gleeful, sadistic joy in the idea that my mother can no longer get her medications or that school children will kill themselves or their peers. I’m tired of subsidizing their idiocy and trying to claw progress out of their hateful, regressive policies. I’m tired of having to explain to people why all persons should have equal rights. I’m tired of feeling threatened in public areas by skinheaded fucks with assault rifles. I’m tired of worrying for my partner’s safety when they leave for work.
Conservatives have, to date, done nothing whatsoever of benefit to anyone but themselves, ever, and I’m tired of having to act like they are rational actors. They are not. They are greedy, spiteful, selfish fucks, they do not have reasonable viewpoints, and I’m tired of having to act like they do. You should be too. The gentle coddling of such ridiculous viewpoints because “all opinions matter!” has directly led us to our two-party travesty and the casual ignoring of all norms or laws by Trump and Co. These people need to be told when their opinions are stupid and wrong and we’ve been very, very long overdue in doing that. Failure to do so leads to - drumroll - take a look around outside.
So yeah. Our Canadian friend here is right. The anger is very long overdue. Fact is, conservatives are untrustworthy and worthless and I don’t actually care if telling them that helps them or not. We’ve tried to help them, repeatedly, and been pushed away and ridiculed for it time and time again. So it’s time to speak a language that they understand.
You said you were here to “educate” me, but what you really did was vent anger and insult an entire group of people. Education means offering insight, a path forward, or at least an argument that changes minds. What you provided was raw frustration, which I understand… but let’s be clear, that’s not education.
If your goal is to express rage, you’ve done that. If your goal is to actually fight back against the forces you’re angry at, then I have to ask: what’s your strategy? Telling people they’re scum and irredeemable might feel cathartic, but what does it accomplish? Are you trying to mobilize people or just burn bridges?
History shows that lasting change happens when people organize, persuade, and build coalitions. That doesn’t mean ‘coddling’ extremists, but it does mean recognizing that not everyone who votes a certain way is beyond reason. Writing off everyone as an enemy is how you lose, and I assume you don’t want to lose.
So, if you’re here to educate, then educate: What’s your actual plan? What do you believe works? Because if your only message is ‘hate them all, there’s no hope’ then you’re not fighting fascism, you’re just surrendering to it with a different kind of rage.
For what it’s worth, I do want change, and I am angry too. But anger without strategy doesn’t fix anything. If venting is all that matters to you, then we have nothing more to discuss.
History shows that lasting change happens when people organize, persuade, and build coalitions. That doesn’t mean ‘coddling’ extremists, but it does mean recognizing that not everyone who votes a certain way is beyond reason. Writing off everyone as an enemy is how you lose, and I assume you don’t want to lose.
The problem is we have two groups of people remaining in support of conservatives in the United States. We have the unapologetically evil; and this group will not be reached. Then we have the irreparably stupid. This group is much larger, and capable of reform, but is clearly so incapable of higher level reasoning that they can’t recognize that they have been voting against their own best interests time and time again, despite everyone in the left screaming at the top of their lungs.
Donald trump has made it apparent that the only way to reach these morons is through their emotions. We clearly cannot appeal to their sense of empathy, so we will make them feel a shame so deep they cannot hide from it.
No I was absolutely being a angry dickhead and that’s totally fair. Those are my true feelings though, and to my best judgment logical ones. What do you do when you are faced with a person you can’t reason with? Historically speaking, the only real way to deal with it is to imprison them or kill them. I don’t want us to get to that state. I just feel like we’re being driven towards it. I find the world that we exist in now to be utterly absurd with these sorts of people at the wheel and I will no longer tolerate those who support them. We’re bringing punching Nazis back.
I hear guillotines are cheap to make. I’m down to bring those back too.
There’s no relevance to “did”. There’s “doing” and “not doing”.
I have the utmost sympathy and care for democrats and independents who tried and failed. I can’t tell them how to feel, but I’d feel scared and helpless.
Bernie Sanders and Alexandria Ocasio Cortez are heading out to states to lead town halls after this most recent budget passing.
This is what Democrats should be doing: preparing for 2028 by reaching out to people now, or at the very least educating them on what’s happening and what might happen in the other 46 months (or more…) of Trump’s second presidency.
I expect the authoritarian posturing and nationalism will be successful inside America as the world unites against them. And that any further hopes they have of opposition will be strangled by increasing anti-democratic measures as time goes on. That’s the playbook that has been successful elsewhere and I see no basis for believing in American exceptionalism here.
Will be extremely happy to be wrong on this, but I can’t see a world where waiting until 2028 works out for Democrats.
The Democrats have no power in the US now. They still hold a few governorships, but the GOP has complete control of the US federal government and that’s all that matters on the international scene.
It’s a distinctly American thing to blame the Democrats for anything the government does even when they don’t control the government. Then they wonder why the Democrats struggle to win elections even against insane GOP candidates like Trump.
In what other country is the opposition party blamed for what the governing party is doing? Only in America.
Things are the way they are in the US because people voted for it. The Democrats aren’t doing anything because anything they do now would be purely performative and have no effect. They’re a political party, not a revolutionary movement. They aren’t doing anything until the next election (if there is one!) because that’s how it works with political parties in a democracy.
It would be the same in Canada. If Pollievre got a majority and brought in Elon Musk to kill the government there would be nothing the Liberals, NDP, or any other party could do. That’s why it’s important to vote and vote wisely.
Chuck Schumer just sold us out. What a flaccid pussy.
Very inadequate response so far. G7 meeting did not result in any unity with G6.
It is straightforward to destroy US auto industry and agriculture. Export tariffs on energy, materials, potash. Stop reciprocal tariffs on China. China just tariffed US auto parts. Canada specializes in these. Great idea to get closer to Europe, but they do not have our back, and its not producing any results so far. Democrats definitely not a check on US empire/extortion.
It’s very easy to get a cost advantage in Canada for auto industry. Export tariffs provide revenue support for subsidies to ensure it. Fuck WTO rules, until “fake emergency” is revoked. Force automakers to side with Canadian plants. Michigan provincehood. Cancel all US military cooperation, kick them out of NORAD, demand refund for all F35s, and cancel rest without paying penalty on corruption grounds. Exterminate Boeing orders.
Immediate diplomacy with China, North Korea, Russia, Mexico. Hoping that other colonies choose Canada friendship over US boot licking, should be read as a long shot, unless we/they coordinate on destroying US auto, aerospace and weapons industry.
Where Trump/US (stop saying this is “one man” or even one party responsible) is very successfully keeping the colonies divided against China, and begging for submission to US military evil. That is precise path that loses our country. It’s time to commit to destroying US economy, until they back down, and we gain a better relationship than we had before.
Sorry Tankies, we aren’t going to run to China, Russia, and NK just because the US is starting act more like them.
You had me until the “China/Russa/NK” part…
Do you really think a good solution to the US slowly going haywire over the past 20-30 years or so is snuggling up to dictatorships, of which two have boots on the ground in the first major European war of aggression since WWII, and the third is the only thing keeping the economy of the other two afloat? I think not. I think alienating said dictatorships is a good idea. I also think the US needs to be confronted and forced to make a decision on whether it wants to remain on good terms with the civilised world.
HumanSpiral is a tankie who comments a lot. Have him tagged as such and I recommend you do the same, because these guys are prolific commenters trying to slowly normalize relations with Russia/China. It’s good to spot them early so you can move on.
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russia: Invades neighbouring country, causing hundreds of thousands of deaths.
Ukraine: Defends itself.
Pretty much everyone: Tells russia to stop and to leave Ukraine.
Russia:
NATO started this lmao gottem
Do people like you really fall for this?
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Amazing your ass hasn’t been banned for disinformation you lying bot
war is not amazing for world. Clinging to your view of reality is destructive for Canada. It is unfair to call peace advocacy “a bot”.
“Great state of Canada”…
To be fair, I heard a news anchorwoman in British Columbia refer to the US as “the lower provinces” lol. I had never heard this before, but since it was used casually on a newscast I assumed it was a fairly common expression. Maybe Bonespurs heard about that and got a burr in his diaper.
Upper and Lower Canada making a comeback, with slightly different meanings.
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There is a significant difference between a regular person, even a TV personality, and a politician saying that. Enough so that I don’t think the term “to be fair” can be applied to it.
I was speculating that calling the US “the lower provinces” might be a fairly common figure of speech. Wasn’t comparing newscasters to politicians. But whatever.
I’m down with that. In fact, can Canada just annex Oregon and Washington? I would consider emigrating to Canada myself. But…that’s hardly a trivial thing to do. Plus packing is such a pain in the ass. Plus, selling a house, moving companies and all that. Ugh. What an effort. It would be a lot more convenient for me if we could just move the border a good ways south.
Trump did not campaign on a war with Canada. No one elected him to do this. Everyone who isn’t mad has brainworms.
He literally started this tariffs thing last time too. No one can claim to be blindsided by this.
Everyone who voted Trump - including those mad because they did not elect him to do this - has brainworms.
It’s just that Americans don’t care, so they wouldn’t remember how Trump tried to strong-arm Mexico and Canada using tariffs in his first term. Americans will burn the rest of the world in the hopes of cheaper gas. Now, increasingly burning themselves in hopes of cheaper gas.
The threats to Canadian sovereignty feel very new and the reaction from Canada feels very different this time.
To be clear, I think Trump voters are idiots being scammed, but are too morally repugnant to be sympathetic, they 100% suck. Even if Trump stuck to the things he promised, those things would also be very bad.
I do care, I served with Canadians and have Canadian friends. I hate what we’re doing to our neighbors and am ashamed to see a flag I served twice, more and more resemble a nazi flag.
The threats to Canadian sovereignty feel very new and the reaction from Canada feels very different this time.
That much is fair to say. The disrespect amped up a thousand percent compared to just threatening tariffs like last time, which explains why the reaction feels so different.
But once again, even though the scale is increased and it might feel new to you and to many Canadians, nothing here should be a surprise. Trump praised Putin on invading Ukraine, he in no uncertain terms threatened the invasion of Venezuela, and floated the idea of bombing Mexico.
Threatening to annex Canada is surprising insofar as being a surprising choice of target. That he’s deranged and bellicose towards other countries, it’s nothing new. So every time he points his enshitification gaze at some other group, Americans voting far-right (or not voting at all) will still be defensive as we tell them: yes, you voted for this shit, exactly this shit, you just didn’t realize you were doing because you didn’t give a fuck.
Now the target is kind of a friend, so a few fucks are given. That’s the only, and very minor, difference. Can I predict which country he’ll threaten next? No. But he will keep at it. Over and over.
Edit to add one last thing: “They elected him based on his campaign” is a cop-out. Electing someone based on what they say (promises) instead of based on what they did (specially to others) is a form of “not giving a fuck”.
I think it’s a pretty big difference, if Trump was campaigning on a strategy of invading Canada from the start, I see things playing out very differently.
if Trump was campaigning on a strategy of invading Canada from the start, I see things playing out very differently.
Obviously, but irrelevant. Like I said… Electing someone based on what they say (promises) instead of based on what they did (specially to others) is a form of “not giving a fuck”.
Trump will not campaign on being aggressive towards allies. He’ll do it after securing power. During campaign, that’s what the “America First” rhetoric means: vote me to strong-arm everyone I can. People voted him in for this, now we’re seeing it.
There was ample evidence that he would be belligerent against allies.
I see your points, but it also seems you’re trying to make your adversary a whole lot smarter than they actually are in order to feel more righteous in your upset.
These are not deep thinkers. They are often poor and poorly educated, quick to fall for a scam. They don’t think, they believe. The best reaction is ridicule, it strikes at the heart of their biggest insecurity. Though anger is understandable and I’ll help make sure it’s heard.
I don’t know why you think I’m assigning Trump voters any intelligence. I am certain they’re incapable of critical thinking.
I’m not saying people are interpreting what “America First” means. What I’m saying is that the meaning of “America First” is clear to anyone who thinks it through, and it takes a moron to not to consider that eventually Trump’s aggression will turn to allies, and to large swaths of his own voter base as well.
But the fact that the meaning is obfuscated in discourse doesn’t change that people voted for this, because there was ample evidence of the true meaning, evidence that can only be ignored purposefully. They voted for this, they voted him for “America First”. It’s like driving home without thinking, with the brain fully on autopilot. People know what they’re doing, even if they’re not thinking it through.
Problem is, tens of millions of ignorant people elected him to do whatever. They just liked that he hated educated people, brown people, trans people, women, gays, foreigners, and so on. Apart from that they didn’t really care about the details.
But that’s the thing, they elected him based on his campaign and he never mentioned anything like this during his campaign. If what you say is the case, why did he talk nonstop about grocery prices right up to the election? Did they like the hate? Very much, conservatives are hateful people. It just doesn’t pass the smell test. Invade Mexico? That kind of matches all his other hateful rhetoric for everyone south of the US, but a country full of white people? We only do that if your asian ally bombs us first usually.
I’d have less trouble believing this if there was any meaningful backlash from his supporters. Currently there isn’t even meaningful backlash from his opposition, so colour me doubtful.
To be fair, even though it feels like 2 years already, it’s only been a couple months. I’m not expecting much though, so your point stands.
If you’re going to judge his plans based on his campaign speeches, then you deserve nothing but ridicule.
It was a full fucking YEAR before the election that he was invited to say he wouldn’t be a dictator, and he declined.
“We love this guy,” Trump said of Hannity. “He says, ‘You’re not going to be a dictator, are you?’ I said: ‘No, no, no, other than day one. We’re closing the border, and we’re drilling, drilling, drilling. After that, I’m not a dictator.’"
That was from December of 2023.
Oh, and how about his faithful?
“We’re going to come after the people in the media who lied about American citizens, who helped Joe Biden rig presidential elections,” said Kash Patel (gain, from late 2023)
Here’s an article from a month earlier: "A mass deportation operation. A new Muslim ban. Tariffs on all imported goods and “Freedom cities” built on federal land.
Every single person who voted for Trump in 2024 or didn’t bother to vote at all has explicitly said they support a violent, expansionist, nazi regime. Nearly every person who voted against him did not enough to keep him from gaining power, and ARE STILL NOT DOING ENOUGH. Instead of taking up arms (literally or figuratively) against him, you are defending his voters.
Take some ownership of your problems.
Well it’s not so much a problem of my personal making, I was saying all the same things you’re saying. I talked and talked to people, which I hate doing, going down the list for why this guy sucked and why Kamala was way better than Trump, no matter how you slice it. He scammed stupid people (we have a lot of stupid people) and stupid people also tend to be bigots. He also had a billionaire buy votes in crucial areas and our courts didn’t see a problem. We’re fighting the same billionaires you’re going to be fighting when the same fucking thing happens to you. We’re all on this spaceship Earth together. If it gets nuked, that fucks you too.
Edit: replied to wrong comment
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Look, I appreciate what you’re trying to say.
But man, do I really not care. When they say “at the US”, it means “at the US”. If there is one silver lining to this whole mess is that it is extremely, fundamentally, not about your feelings right now. We had to watch that trainwreck in slow motion, wondering what entitled nonsense of an excuse you were going to ride all the way to fascism (Gazan eggs, was it?) and now we don’t have to give a crap anymore because it’s done. I intend to take advantage of that.
But hey, you do all those things. If you guys ever come out of the sinkhole send a postcard. I’m sure our own survivors would loooove to know how it all went down from the Commonwealth of Eastasia or whatever is left at that point.
I am an idiot. I was yelling into the void and hoping to reach out and maybe give inspiration? to someone, BUT as an idiot I didn’t realize that I posted in a Canadian community. Yeah, we deserve everything we get. I can’t stand to even talk to other people I work with who helped make the situation the way it is. We are fucked here.
I am sorry
It happens.
Get organized.
I just was involved in a yelling match this morning about Polievre.
Just some background: I’m a farmer in N. Alberta. We farmers love coffee and visiting. There’s half a dozen of us around the shop talking about this, and I safely would say everyone was against Trump, even weirdos that defended him during the election. Even then, though, I’d say the Trumpists here were about 1:10. Now it’s zero.
But one person tried to stand up for Polievre this morning, saying he wasn’t going to back down to Trump. Everyone else, and these are all what you would call older men, between 50 and 70, had a crack at this guy. The prevailing attitude is that Polievre isn’t telling the truth, doesn’t have our backs, and nobody is willing to take the chance that he’s not lying.
That’s in backwoods, buttfuck Alberta. I don’t know if this holds true across the prairies, but this is an area where the word Liberal is an epithet. But I wouldn’t be surprised to see the CPC get decimated at this point, even in rural ridings.
I’m worried Trump will back down when an election is called, and it will take the edge off, and Polievre will get in. I don’t trust the fucker, but most rural voters just need the barest hint of a reason to not vote for the Liberals. In the end, nothing that happens west of Ontario matters, but I imagine if it’s like this here, it’s way more obvious in the East.
I live in the Ottawa region and the attitude around here is simply that Trump handed the Liberals the win. I don’t think this election is unsalvageable for the Conservatives (and frankly I think it’s dangerous to think so) but they’ve got a mountain to climb, that’s for sure.
Ontario’s demographic in Toronto and Ottawa could be summed up as “urban conservative”. Interestingly many of them think of themselves as left-wing or progressive and think the same of the Liberals. The reality is very different: they view public servants, the poor, and any other right-wing punching bags as undesirables, they protest any efforts to get housing built, and they even harass striking workers. But hey they’re down with “the gays” so they’re forward thinking right?
I’m sure enough about Polivre to stump for the Liberals. I’m just worried about bursting into flames when I cast a ballot with an L on it.
The polling suggests that the CPC is capturing young, angry, and terminally online voters same as Trump did. So that’s a bit concerning.
I’m from the east, but have some in-laws from Alberta. Not farmers though, people with family in the oil industry. They seem to 100% support Pollievre and went from Trudeau is evil to Carney is evil before they knew anything about him. So the CPC will probably still do ok in Alberta.
There’s also people who’ve read the newspaper every day of their lives and now that newspaper is owned by postmedia. They tend to hate every prominent Liberal, wonder why?
But yeah Pollievre lost a lot of support in the eastern part of the country. Hearing about the security clearance stuff from family members unprompted, and people are very suspicious of a guy that doesn’t want to even look at the intel about who in his party may be a foreign asset.
Given all of the factors of American oil industry influence, American postmedia influence and American social media influence, I think it will be close.
What I can say for sure is the odds that there will be some kind of political or economic rupture between the US and Canada that lasts decades into the future have gone up substantially just over the course of the past few months.
Yup. Trump’s legacy will not be a glowing one at all.
Trump’s legacy will not be a glowing one at all.
It might literally be glowing at this rate. Also smouldering.
A boy can dream…
It might be a glowing one. I’m more worried about nuclear war now than I have been since the late '80s.
I doubt that. He fucked up the first time around, broke shit, wrecked things, stole classified documents, convicted of 34 felons, stole PPE from blue states to kill them during covid and millions needlessly died during covid. What happened? Nothing. People don’t really remember any of that. He was never punished for any of his actions or crimes.
Trump is the prime example of American hubris and apathy.
As they should be. This administration is trying to bully them into being the 51st state for absolutely no reason. So dumb and unnecessary!
You have oil. Always look at what he or putin sees as bringing in lots of cash.
And water. Remember he just ordered the release of the reservoirs in California so now they’ll have none in the summer. One guess where he’ll come looking for some
He’s doing an excellent job of derailing the rework of the Columbia River agreement the PNW has been working on too. Goddamnit.
Damn right we are fucking mad.
Lmao, I’ve got a bullet for every magat fuck that crosses the border. Last thing they’ll hear is a tree speaking French
Please stop radicalizing yourself and others. This is a conflict manufactured by Putin to sew disharmony between allies. There are better solutions, don’t stop looking for them.
Also, you may have just placed yourself in legal jeopardy. Fucking be cool.
Yeah and it worked. Canada and the us are fully enemies at this point. The best solution is for the what remains of the us to rise up and stamp out this dictatorship before things go too far.
Lol. Putin of course had a lot to do with it, but he targeted american trump supporters for a reason. They are particularily susceptible to manufactured division, they are subhuman hateful violent trash. I will gleefully kill the magat cultist freaks when they come to Canada. I have no doubt that Trump will try to send the military, and I have no doubt that his cultists will go along with it. Best of luck to anyone who wants to pursue “better solutions,” but I have been politely debating the issues for 10 years with republicans and they have only gotten crazier and crazier over time. The republican cult media ecosystem is pretty unanimous in their support for the annexation of Canada. This cannot be tolerated, not even 1 word of it. The line was crossed. There is no going back now, there is only one way out of this situation and its the expulsion of all the magats from the world. Send the cops to come arrest me. I won’t pretend that things are normal while the US prepares their citizens to accept Canada as an enemy that deserves to be attacked.
subhuman
you sure you’re not a fascist? you have some alarming things in common with one.
thank you though for providing a pitch perfect example of self-radicalization. i don’t think you’d even argue with that characterization, you’re proud of it.
Absolutely. You will find out soon enough why my characterization of the magats is justified.
It’s incredible seeing an almost exact replica of MAGA radicalization but that is fueled by hatred of the MAGA group instead of (American) democrats.
Humans are fucked.
Edit: I guess people misunderstood my point, the magas are wrong and fueled by lies and alternate reality, whereas the other commenter is fueled by self defense and hatred of the maga. But the Maga are convinced in their stupidity to be in the same self defense mode of the “other” who they’re told are bad
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Your comment actually kept me up last night ngl. There is no way that is your actual take right. Hypothetically, lets pretend we are both in Czechoslovakia, and Hitler is about to invade. If I am really pissed off at the Nazis, because they are fueled by misinformation and unjustified hatred of out groups, does that make me the same as the Nazis? Like, was the worst thing about the Nazis the mean language they used, or was it the substance of their beliefs?
I agree with a lot of your points, but take a step back dude. You’re in too deep. Plan for the worst, sure, but don’t lose your humanity.
Oh yeah? Is defending your country against an invasion illegal? Fuckin’ dweeb
This is a conflict manufactured by Putin to sew disharmony between allies.
It’s sow, not “sew”. But yeah, basically. He’s smarter than he gets credit for, not like it’s hard to fool someone like D-bag, but still. He saw a juicy opportinuty to manipulate a western bootlicker, and he got 77m other idiotic bootlickers to meme him into office.
Putin is absolutely extremely intelligent. Just also very evil.
it would be great to remind americans how many sniping records get broken by canadians. start making that gear domestically, if you don’t already. maybe start taking out tires on trucks with american plates. just so they know how unwelcome they are, and if they want to take something across the border, it had better be a canadian getting paid to do it.
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Ah, the French Canadian spirit!
Brb gotta affix a bayonet on my shovel.
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I’ll be on this side of the border lighting off freedom displays of fire works to signal every raiding party heading over.
im with you 👊
I’m putting a new scope on my crossbow as we speak. Reusable ammo is an underrated perk.
I am interested in hobby archery. Can you suggest a crossbow?
Elbows Up!
After reading about Rubio’s stupidity during the G7 meeting, Brussels should ask Canada to join the EU. It would force the UK to vote again, the EU would be number one in GDP and Putin’s Fucking Sock Puppet would have an aneurysm.
Trump’s goal was to sow division
Everything’s going to plan
as instructed by daddy putin
Except he got divisions in the USA and unexpected unity in Canada.
With a division between the US and Canada
That’s EXACTLY what Putin wanted. Hell, that’s what Putin’s aide wrote as a blueprint for destruction of the west, a decade or so ago.
I just hope people remember than even AFTER the government changes, the companies and people behind them are still the same.
The anger I’m seeing isn’t just at Trump, it’s at Americans in general.
They voted for this lunatic, twice. How can we possibly trust that shit like this won’t ever happen again?
Not to mention the 1/3 of eligible voters who couldn’t fucking be bothered to vote at all. Fuck them too.
It was over 1/3 of people who didn’t vote.
Same in Ontario. Thanks for giving us Doug Ford 3 times in a row, non-voters.
Couldn’t agree more. It’s hard for North Americans to get off the couch to cast a ballot.
Well yeah! It’s winter for crying out loud! Also I’m paying for Netflix, prime, Disney,crave… I’m behind on my shows.
Yeah and we don’t have voter suppression laws.
I voted by mail, super easy.
This. There were more voters that didn’t vote, than voted for trump. This is all because of ignorance and laziness. The US deserves everything it gets.
The rest of the world doesn’t.
Fucking A
1/3 good Americans, 1/3 bad Americans, 1/3 that are just pretty clueless.
TBF that more-or-less describes all nations in bad times. I’m just up close and personal with this one.
That’s one of the biggest things. The first time they voted for Trump, we could forgive them, since it was hard to predict that he would be quite that awful. But this time? They knew. They knew what he was, what he stood for, and what he would do. They knew, and they chose him anyway.
Especially when he spent the four interim years purging the party of anyone not 100% faithful to him, and publicly upping the aggressive rhetoric.
Everyone outside the US who was paying attention saw this coming. If we were blindsided, it was only in how much he’s been able to get away with so quickly; but we knew what most of his goals were.
There was an 800 page book laying out project 2025 step by step. But reading is for nerds I guess.
Let’s leave a little bit of anger for those at home who are enthusiastically supporting Poilievre. They would happily lead Canada down the same path as the USA.
That is a different anger budget
We can’t and whatever comes after trump will be worse. The US cannot be trusted and is not reliable.
Oh the North Remembers.
