Summary
Vivian Jenna Wilson, Elon Musk’s daughter, accused her father of giving a “definitely Nazi salute” at two rallies in January, calling his actions “fucking cringe.”
In an interview with Teen Vogue, she criticized Musk’s involvement in the Trump administration and advocated for trans rights, emphasizing the importance of gender-affirming care for minors.
Wilson, who transitioned as a teen, described Musk as cold and absent, and revealed she no longer associates with him or his family.
She also expressed fear over anti-trans legislation under Trump’s administration.
In the past two months, while some of y’all motherfuckers have been busy arguing over whether it was a Nazi salute or not, this guy and his orange fucko have been dismantling the Constitution in real time. But sure—carry on. This debate is clearly way more important.
Goddamnit.
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What in the constitution has been dismantled?
Everyone existing on US soil is supposed to have the same rights no matter what. Not only natural born citizens.
I’m not being snappy, but what part of the constitution are you talking about? Anything in specific?
I was hoping it would, but this article does not show how the constitution applies to non citizens. It names many amendments that they say protect non citizens, but it does not show the constitution saying that those rights are for non citizens, the article just says they are.
The idea is that it’s an inclusive document. I think the two parts that directly say they are rights for citizens clearly imply that the rest of it is for everyone. It’s a shame we have to rely on this ancient document, which is in some places poorly written.
Good luck getting 3/4 of states to agree that water is wet though, so rewriting, rewording, or amending the Constitution is off the table. That leaves us stuck with interpretations from the courts, which I hope we can at least agree are largely corrupt.
Yeah, there is a lot of corruption for sure. I think there needs to be a solid document of rights for non-citizens, both one for those here legally, and one for those here illegally. I do not think non-citizens should have all the same rights as citizens, because the citizens of a country should come first. And I would then say those who came legally should come second. But, a good country should want to treat people correctly, and so I do think non-citizens deserve some rights, to prevent them from being mistreated. But the current rights in the constitution are for citizens, unless they specify that they are for non-citizens.
It might surprise you but people can do more than two things at once. Such a misdirected fake outrage comment.
His arm says “Nazi”, but his actions? His actions say “Super Nazi”.
Elon and Trump’s actions are indeed more nationalist, but we should not confuse it with nazism, that had nationalism as one of its traits but was much more than that. The genocidal part is what makes them evil, not the nationalism part.
If we take seriously the notion that nationalism = nazism, then China would qualify.
Oh for fuck sakes, the nazis were nazis long before they revealed any mass murder plans. In many ways the original nazis were more circumspect than this group of shit gibbons.
Just read any reasonably serious definition of fascism, which ‘nazi’ is a synonym for in casual international English.
PSA - the comment history of the user you responded to shows they are clearly either a really mediocre troll or have had their brain melted to a severe degree. You might improve your Lemmy experience by blocking them 👍
Indeed! And thanks. I was more responding to potential readers of the thread who might be in a vulnerable state of mind, but a block is now appropriate.
Borders aren’t real my guy
Like this needed confirmation.
Is it because she has working eyes? That’s really all you need to come to this conclusion.
Yeah, we know.
Everyone that isn’t braindead or a pathetic shill knows.
Do we really need her opinion on this? I mean we all know what it was, I mean we might as well ask the baker at this point and make an article?
Her statement isn’t for you. It’s for all the Trumpanzees that are still in denial.
You have a higher chance of winning the lottery than a Trumpanzee listening to a trans woman.
Kids her age often tend to only care about the opinions of other kids their own age.
TV: Do you ever feel scared? He’s the richest man in the world.
VW: He’s a pathetic man-child. Why would I feel scared of him? Ohhh, he has so much power. Nah, nah, nah. I don’t give a fk. Why should I be scared of this man? Because he’s rich? Oh, no, I’m trembling. Ooh, shivering in my boots here. I don’t give a fk how much money anyone has. I don’t. I really don’t. He owns Twitter. Okay. Congratulations.
Absolutely based. The pathetic man-child was probably fuming when reading those lines. :)
While slowly dancing to the tune of The WMV Took My Baby Away
(WMV: woke mind virus)
This is the sort of person who would taunt her ex father by saying “shoot coward you’re only going to kill a woman” and I’m here for it
Well, according all the comments here that I’ve read, I’m stupid.
Yes, when you watch the motion as a small repeating gif, of course it looks like a salute. When I watch the actual video, and listen to him speaking, I do not think its a salute.
His child in the article is obviously not happy their father, even before this happened. Reading the article, its obvious their opinion is based on the trans issue, and because they disagree on the topic, then he must be a Nazi. Since they give no other reason for him being a Nazi, I don’t think their opinion holds much validity.
The way you avoid saying “daughter” and “her” makes it clear that you don’t understand her or her opinion.
Also, it was a Nazi salute. The first time I saw it, I was watching the actual video and not a GIF. He wants deniability so people who don’t like Nazis will be gaslit and people that do like Nazis will praise him.
I avoided calling them anything other than his child because I don’t know anything about his kids or that situation.
The title says daughter. How else would you have known she’s “his child”? You are still going out of your way to say “them” now. Elon has many children, but this article is specifically about his daughter’s statements, not his other children.
If you aren’t going to bother to be specific or accurate, why post at all? Are you posting your disingenuous comments in an attempt to unconditionally defend Musk, or are you just a troll? I’m just asking questions.
I can see that the trans issue is a touchy subject for you, but that’s not what I’m discussing here. So please don’t take offense.
You’ve either drank the Kool aid too or you’re not paying attention if you think that’s the only reason people think he’s a Nazi
No person in their right mind would make such a gesture, especially not speaking in front of millions. It was not a 100% clear Hitlergruß. To me it seems pretty obvious that it was an intentional move to further divide the US population into people claiming he did a Nazi salute and those brushing it off as a random gesture, ridiculing the other side. Ragebaiting by doing a 99% nazi salute is not much better than doing an actual one.
How come its mostly people who behave exactly like nazis who ‘accidentally’ make very similar gestures to nazi salutes? I wonder…
What if he just made a motion, and it happened to look like that, even though it was not intentional? Watching the video, that’s how I see it. I think he just got caught up in the moment, and made a gesture of thanks, not trying to look like anything.
so he’s a fucking idiot is your excuse?
Then he would have disavowed it and apologized for it immediately. You don’t accidentally Heil Hitler and then just pretend it didn’t happen.
He did it again, just a second later.
Also, a ‘gesture of thanks’ usually doesnt involve tensing up your whole body and stretching your right arm with the palm facing downwards. This is as unnatural of a gesture as it gets.
He bent his whole body to give a salute. It was quite off-center and awkward, not really like the nazi salute as seen on historical videos of Hitler, which is a much more deliberate and aligned hand motion in relation to the body. If Elon time traveled to Hitler rallies and did this salute, he’d be reprimanded for doing it all wrong.
Yep, I just can’t buy that its legit.
When your defense is, “Actual Nazis would say you need to work on your Nazi salute if you want to do it right,” you need to realize you’re also saying, “Actual Nazis would recognize this as a poorly done Nazi salute.” And him being an unfit, physically inept fuck doesn’t make it less of a Nazi salute, no more than my hour of playing tennis doesn’t make my attempt at a backhand swing any less of a backhand swing just because Serena Williams would fall on her ass laughing if she saw me do it.
Ah yes. When people ask if Im a nazi and I tell them “no, my nazi salute is too weak” they immediately understand.
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You are right. Most neo Nazis will only make that nazi give heart out to hitler gesture only when caught up in the moment. when they lose control, their true nature is revealed, and they will even do it 2 or more times.
Watching the original video it absolutely looks like it even alone without Hitler right beside it. It did the first time and it has every time ever since that. I watched it live and immediately said, “what the fuck”
Maybe you wanted to see it? I don’t know if you did but if you already thought he was a Nazi, then of course you’d see it.
Nobody “gives their heart out” like this unless they’re a Nazi giving it up for Hitler.
People will see what they want to see. Even if Elon discovered the cure to all types of cancer, people would still nitpick anything about him to justify their hate.
Nah, elons actions and behaviors are justification plenty.
Is it really nit picking when he, a nazi is dismantling the us government?
People voted for this “dismantling”. If you ask, Trump voters seem pretty satisfied on this regard.
So it’s not nit picking. Thanks.
He did it twice. With gusto. You’re clearly struggling to reconcile that your idol is a Nazi and you’ve been wrong to worship him, or you’re also a Nazi.
He is not my idol, I don’t even care much for the guy.
Why go through the effort to defend what we clearly not one, but two nazi salute then?
It’s incredibly bizarre that there are people in the world defending this shit.
It’s even more incredibly bizarre that anyone could actually look at that video and see anything other than a fucking nazi salute.
People like you are why this world is turning to absolute shit. Just another cog in the wheel.
I’m not defending it, because that’s not what I think it was, and that’s all I’ve said about it.
Why do so many of you here have such a hard time with just understanding that it is possible that other people can see something a different way?
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Cmon, guy. You know the truth, deep down. Well maybe not that far down
You may not be aware, but Nazis (both traditional and the neo variant) love dog whistles.
Obscure and hidden symbolism is core to their ideologies.
Nazis (and most hate groups in general) love doing things that are just innocent enough, but with a wink or a nudge, demonstrate clear intention.
It’s quite easy to not do a nazi salute and when public speaking, politicians (and people who practice their public speaking skills in general) have traditionally been coached on what features may be construed as, just look at the traditional ‘non-threatening’ two finger point.
Finally, I don’t think it really matters what it technically was or wasn’t, what matters is perception and reception.
Edit: I want to add some concrete examples of nazi dog whistling and symbolism.
Historically the numbers 88 have been used by neo Nazis to represent HH (8th letter of the alphabet) as a disguised way to say ‘heil Hitler’
The numbers on their own don’t mean anything, but given additional context, behaviors, or related ideals, then an additional meaning can be found.
This is often used as an intentional way to inform sympathizers to your position that you are on their side (for example a group at a political gathering) without overtly communicating your position to those opposed.
Another example is skinheads (not sharps) wearing and lacing their boots in a certain way with specific color laces.
Hitler himself was immensely into the occult and found hidden symbolism to be very powerful, it’s part of why he repurposed so much religious iconography.
Yeah, I understand that. And I’ve spent some time online talking with neo Nazis, and I know how they act. I just don’t think he actually is. Conservative, yeah, but not a Nazi.
Does it really matter if he’s deliberately advancing a fascist agenda?
Yeah, because if he’s indeed a nazi, he’s pretty incompetent at converting people into nazism. Some politicians such as Elizabeth Warren and Kamala Harris have done a hand gesture that resembles the nazi salute in their political rallies, but nobody at the time screamed they were dog whistling nazi symbology. Raising one’s hand to salute the audience is just a natural gesture, not some intricate gesture that’s exclusive to a bonafide nazi apologist.
It’s very easy to find an image of a politician, or anyone really in the public eye, doing what appears to be a Nazi salute. Pretty much any gesture that starts with the hand below shoulder level to above head level may well briefly transition between those two that could result in an image that appears to be a Nazi salute from one angle or another. It’s much harder to find video that closely mimics actual videos of Adolf Hitler doing a Nazii salute, even harder to see it happen twice just moments apart.
Lol, no they haven’t, and if you have a hard time seeing a chest pounding and sharp arm raising as a Nazi salute but buy a frozen frame of a wave as potentially equivalent you’re deep into the conservative media ecosystem looking for a reason to excuse him.
It’s not a hand wave, it’s a frame-perfect Nazi salute with the beginning middle and end. There’s nothing he could have done to make it more accurate a Nazi salute other than speaking German at the time.
What I see is Elon haters clinging to this salute as if it’s the one silver bullet that will somehow make him lose Trump’s or the Republicans’ support. But their insistence on this is like preaching to the choir, as right-wingers simply don’t care—some even like Elon more for being gutsy.
If that’s all they’ve got on Elon, then he’s sure to keep his job at DOGE. And Trump is laughing all the way to the bank, as the anti-Elon sentiment shields him from criticism, as social media’s attention is mostly spent on Elon instead of Trump.
Nazi symbolism is “gutsy”. God Elon-stans are such fucking losers.
oh yes the “everyone that disagrees with me thinks im a nazi” comment, get over yourself, you know you are one. Also another saying if everyone is A B" around you, you most likely are. hence you are probably here because reddit banned you for the same reason you will be on most forums.
Get over yourself. I didn’t even say “everyone thinks I’m a Nazi.”
I said “Well, according all the comments here that I’ve read, I’m stupid.” And I said that because plenty of the comments I was reading said that anyone thinking (what I said I think) is stupid.
And no, I’ve never had a reddit account. Not sure what your problem is.
My favorite explanation for this is that he’s autistic. It never fucking ends with these people, lol
Tourette syndrome makes people do involuntary Nazi salutes. Not Autism.
Yep, its fucking outrageous and insulting. He’s not an autistic person that needs 24 supported living, he can function to a high level in day to day society. He’s been in the public eye long enough to be well aware of how his actions can be perceived. He fucking knows exactly what he was doing, and chose to do it.
To be honest, you’d have to be very stupid to belive otherwise.
I suspect 90% of the people who want to give him the benefit of “doubt” when there actually is none, is very well aware of what he did.They are.
Everyone knows it was not one, but two, Nazi salutes.
The people who won’t accept it are either trying to cover for their team, or are too full of pride to admit they support Nazis, or both.
Wilson, who transitioned as a teen, described Musk as cold and absent, and revealed she no longer associates with him or his family.
So he’s a sociopath. That checks out
He literally just said “empathy is weakness” the other day, I think it’s pretty clear he’s got some serious personality disorder. Narcissism and sociopathy both seem to fit him pretty well but I’m just a blue-collar guy.
Idk one way or another he’s a piece of shit and I firmly believe one of the most evil people kicking, if anyone can be said to be evil, it’s him.
And I’ve played a LOT of evil in DnD over the years. Both sides of the screen. I feel like I’ve got a pretty good grasp of the concept. If he was just a character in literature I’d go “damn, that’s a good villain”, but he is, sadly, alive and real.
The first time I heard about him beyond a vague “electric car person” post was from a tech co-worker in 2017, where they said they read a biography of Elon where they basically labelled him a sociopath. So, just to emphasize to anyone in the back-row, it’s certainly not news.
I always got a bad vibe from Elon, back when people were praising him, I just shook my head.
No private company is ever going to save the world, not enough money in it. And even if there was, it’s not enough for the rich to have a lot, others must have very little or it doesn’t “mean anything”
funny thing is that is the time he revealed the plans for the cybertruck, im guessing they never changed the design since then.
Evil is the absence of empathy, so by his own admission he is absolutely evil.
hes the guy that uses SON, who he name X-2AE,etc/ and uses him as a human shield.
Anti trans?
Trump. My man. You brought yourself back a bit, well done.
I know because I have functioning eyes and intact mental faculties.
It’s mindblowing how anyone still genuinely thinks what he did was anything but.
“iT wAs A rOmAn sALuTe” oh you mean the “salute” that appears in exactly one painting from the 1700s, long after the Roman empire had fallen?
There are videos of people being asked to recreate it, and while most refuse to do it (because of the implication), some add their own flourish to make it look like something else. That should tell you everything you need to know.
And was the direct inspiration for the Nazi salute.
Indirect inspiration. Hitler got it from Mussolini, who got it from Gabriele d’Annunzio, who got it from a Broadway production of Ben-Hur, which got it from the US Pledge of Allegiance, which got it from the painting.
Interesting. Do you have a source on that? I’d like to research this more.
Looks like people reaching out for swords rather than a salute to me. The Nazis played some mental gymnastics to get to where they are.
That was my thought when I first saw it. If it was a real salute, don’t you think the soldiers would be more uniform in their portrayed appearances?
If that’s a Roman Salute, then what happened to Richard Spencer was a “Roman Face Massage”
What happened to him?
He got punched in the face for being a white supremacist dickhead.
Excellent.
My coworker is convinced it was just ‘my heart to you!’ and to him is why he no longer trusts the news. It’s crazy to watch educated people get sucked into the alt right misinformation hole.
Show them this and ask again. It’s probably not going to change their answer, but there will be a moment of confusion that passes behind their eyes as they try to reconcile reality with their beliefs.
Does he ever tell people his heart goes out to them in the same way?
Not that I know of…
Are they an engineer?
They aren’t, no.
Your coworker is a nazi who hasn’t come out yet.
The one that always gets people to accept reality for me is
“If it’s just “My heart goes out to you!”, then do it in public and see what happens, do it at work and see if you still have a job.”
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Having been on several bar trivia teams, I can say that at least 80% of Americans know virtually nothing about history. I could imagine someone with only a vague familiarity with a Nazi salute just assuming there’s no way a fortune 500 CEO would actually do one, not recognizing how spot on of a Hitler impression that was.
Just watched it again. I didnt remember it being that obvious…
It’s not ambiguous.
Its noted in the wikipedia page for the ADL that since 2014 it’s chair has been a silicon valley tech CEO
Referring to this? The Anti-Defamation League is a joke.
If he didn’t mean it it would be very simple to at the very least post a tweet afterwards saying he’s sorry for the misunderstanding and that he didn’t mean it to look thay way. Like any innocent person would do in that situation.
The fact he didn’t shows all you need to know.
ADL Logic: Drinking milk is racist, the Hitler salute is not.
I saw a gif earlier that I can’t find. It has Elon’s seig heil salute that is perfectly timed to a group of Neo-Nazis executing the same salute. They were absolutely identical.
Does anyone know where to find it?
Here you go
For some reason, lemmy absolutely will not allow me to upload that one gif. Here’s some alternatives:
Adding to the others, here’s that pairing alongside Musk actually doing what normal people would accept is “my heart goes out to you”.
Ooh good addition!
