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Trade:
- One person’s wages
For:
- Mortgage payments on a reasonably sized house
- All bills
- Food for two adults plus children
- Entertainment
Then you might see more babies.
It was their greed that caused this.
That won’t even cover half of the (insured) cost of even the smoothest birth with my plan, and I work for a multi-billion dollar company.
This country, man. Having traveled abroad a bit, you start to realize how tunnel-visioned people stateside can get. Don’t even realize how much they/we are getting fleeced.
Meanwhile Id kill for those 5k bucks. But thats becausw the right to stay alive doesnt cost me a kidney
Having traveled abroad a bit, you start to realize how tunnel-visioned people stateside can get. Don’t even realize how much they/we are getting fleeced.
It’s the classic of someone having to visit a doctor while in Europe. And they’re always shocked at how cheap it is in comparison. Even people who know it’s much cheaper tend to think it’s like 50% , not 99-100% less. I had an emergency room visit with blood and urine testing, painkiller injection, private exam room, etc… It took a few hours and was about $25 that you could pay at a machine on your way out.
I was gonna day $5k is just a handout to insurance companies for just the birth of the baby.
Which is, well, the end of Republicans giving a shit about babies and children.
Oopsies, births cost $5k more now tee hee.
giving birth in a hospital costs $10k, after insurance payback?
Our deductible was about 6,500. It depends what kind of plan you’re on
I wouldn’t use the word “tunnel-visioned”. That implies focused on something and ignoring the things nearby.
I think it’s more accurate to say “ignorant”. Many, probably most Americans just have no clue about most things outside the USA. You’ve travelled abroad, most Americans have not. The US is such an insular society that people can get away with saying things like “Canadians hate their healthcare” and people actually believe them.
Agreed. Solid point
This wouldn’t even cover the hospital bill for most people lol.
And since hospitals know moms will be getting an extra 5k they will just add that into the cost somehow. /s
No need to put a /s there
WE CAN’T DO THAT, IT’S LIKE PUNISHING THE MOMS WHO ALREADY HAD CHILDREN!!! /s
That’s the nice thing in a social democracy
When the next generations has better education, my pension fund will be more filled
In practice though, it seems people are the same kind of stupid…
This is literally going to be an argument if people start proposing free daycare/child care :/
“I had to suffer so you should too!”
It’s already been done to college students - that’s the parallel I was trying to draw
5000$ is a lot. In Germany you get only 250€
well, that's
per month until they’re 27 (as long as they’re still in school/university)
plus free healthcare for mother and child
plus free daycare (depending on the state)
plus free schools and universities
…You got me in the first half.
We can all hope once the nazis leave, we too can be a civilized country.
I’m with you here, but we need to keep in mind that the nazis never “leave”. We’ll need to forever and continually keep these bastards from power.
This was the whole problem, they’ve been here all along.
We thought we beat them in the civil war, they just hunkered down and changed the name of slavery to Jim crow.
Now they think this is their moment.
Same thoughts here. Once they’re beaten, no “reconstruction” can be offered this time around. They’ll need to re-assimilate into our society.
If it’s like the civil war, we’ll kick them out and then build statues and name bases after them.
You forgot maternity leave, something the 'mricans don’t know, either.
whats leave
The paid variety. You stay at home for a certain time for being a mom (or dad!), and you employer respectively the state still pays for it. Horrible, this “communism”, isn’t it?
i understand the individual words you use, but when you put them in that order my blood starts getting all bubbly and full of nitrogen. i think i’ll take a nap
To add on, seems like the 5k (USD) is a one-time lump sum. Your price quote from Germany is already 3k (EUR) after a year. It only ever outscales the 5k.
See. Let’s ping Trump and tell him about it.
Maybe he’ll see the light
They chose to use a stock photo of a million dollars.
$5000 is only 2 and a half of those bundles of $20’s.
These people are trying to run propaganda for Trump, they can’t even keep their fascist bullshit straight.
but when you look through maga glasses, that’s what you see when a black single mom of 2 receives a wic voucher for a couple gallons of milk.
You see, its not one black mom, its the millions of moms getting subsidies!
Lets ignore the part where we somewhy have a million moms needing subsidies.
Is that a million? They’re 20 dollar bills in packs of what looks like it might be 100, so $2000 per pack. There’s about 50 of those, so $100.000 in total. Maybe I underestimated the pack size and number of packs and it’s actually $400.000, but I think it’s unlikely to be a million. (I still agree with the rest of your comment of course)
I worked both Brinks type security and for Chase, so the inside and outside. That’s not a million. It’s probably somewhere between a quarter and a half, but the picture doesn’t make it super easy to tell.
Your point is very valid however, they used a deceiving picture on purpose.
Yeah looks about right with the hundred stacks in there. I’m not putting a ton of effort in here, but eyeballing it looks about like what I’d expect.
Was gonna say actually you’re probably right because it was probably a couple of suitcases and then the 300 K backpack
Cheers for low effort irrelevant curiosities
Lol so even if they were $1 bills that wouldn’t be an accurate pic hahaha
Thank you! Maddening!
Daycare cost $2k a month
Is that for real? That’s more than (many) private schools in Europe.
A 2 bedroom 1 bathroom house in Toronto costs more than a castle in france
Decent houses in France typically cost more than a castle. Nobody wants a castle.
It seems fun until you look at the upkeep and maintenance fees. The initial price is peanuts.
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/05/15/business/child-care-cost-average-annual
It can depend of state to state too. In Oklahoma, our cost of living is considered low but we have a high poverty rate. Our median income per household is 67k, and single income is 35k. Childcare for infants averages around $800 a month
Well to be fair, that’s what it costs in many European countries, too.
That’s why many women don’t work. The cost is basically as high as a low paying or part time job.
That’s why everyone needs free daycare. That will generate a higher GDP for everyone.
That’s why many women don’t work. The cost is basically as high as a low paying or part time job.
Interesting point. We should re-normalize the idea of the stay-at-home mom.
Let’s be real, the people who promoted women going to work were almost always willing to shame those who decided not to. Let’s stop doing that.
What in the tradwife?
Well you see it’s actually empowering because it’s the only way they can afford it. /s
I sort of agree, because no one should be shamed. The issue I have with the statement is that current “trad wife” trends are at best exclusive and at their worst completely toxic. I definitely don’t want to see that either.
Let’s just leave it at: let every woman choose themselves and make it as easy as possible for those who do want to do paid work.
Stay at home parents should get paid. If free daycare would cost the government $20 a day, offer stay at home parents $10 a day and you save money while allowing people to raise their kids instead of strangers.
$10 a day? What is this 1915?
Lets promote stay at home dads too. No reason to make this a gendered thing
Or we could have 2 day shifts of 20 hours and parents could each work one, that way neither is particularly vulnerable to financial abuse and neither has to sacrifice as much of raising their children.
As a stay-at-home mom, you need to let people make that choice.
Having to do something because of finances isn’t a choice.
https://www.daycarefee.com/countries/germany/
I don’t have a full analysis, but at least this source points at 1500 to be the high end of the expensive cities in Germany, with public care as low as 100.
So is 2000 a “normal” value in many areas, or a high end of some?
I have the feeling this is inflated and we just accept.
$3000 is average in the big cities for infant care in a daycare center, and it drops down to about $2000 for toddlers.
Some places have options for home-based care where a person can get licensed to take care of children in their own home, and the prices are generally about half of that of the center-based care.
One big issue is ratios. If the wage for a child care worker is $30/hour including the cost of paid vacation, health insurance, and you need coverage for 9 hours per day, 5 days a week, while needing to maintain one teacher for every 4 kids, that’s $340/week or about $1450/month for labor alone, assuming no overtime and perfect staffing ratios. Throw in food, rent, utilities, insurance, other operational expenses, and it’s pretty much impossible to provide care for less than $2000/month per child on the costs side.
Thanks for sharing.
I checked for Netherlands and it seems to be easily over 2k a month for fulltime care (172-240 hours).
The thing I wasn’t aware of is the subsidies low income parents receive. Up to 96%. Seems to be a bit lower in practice, but still almost all is covered.
That doesn’t account for high cost areas, and is dependent on income. But the conclusion seems to be that it’s far cheaper than I mentioned for the end consumer.
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The source doesn’t say it’s the norm, but there very high end, an extreme.
The low was 0 to 50
I’m just pointing out how even the outlets are not close to 2000, as somebody said.
So 2000 a month is greater than the max of the range in the most expensive states.
All values are crazy, don’t get me wrong. But less crazy than originally stated.
Even the most expensive states are averaged out between cheap suburban and rural areas and the actual expensive cities where the jobs are. $2000/month would be an unbelievable bargain in cities like San Francisco or New York.
Daycare is like a fraction of actually raising a child.
Outside of daycare:
There’s diapers. There’s meals. There’s meds. There’s clothes and recreational material.
I have a toddler, I’m aware
They said cost of daycare, that’s what I’m inquiring about. If somebody wants to share and discuss full cost that’s fine, but a different thing.
Very much depends on the area. I’m in a middle class (what’s left of it) neighborhood and to send my 2 kids to daycare is about $2400 a month. $2000/month for a single kid would be a pretty nice day care in a fairly expensive city.
$5k in a Roth IRA in the sp500 at birth is the only way that it is worth anything.
Haha, what’s $4k in the sp500 gonna do? I guess having $3k in the sp500 is better than nothing…
Well $5,000 given 65 years to grow tax free in a retirement account becomes quite large.
Just a little joke about the challenging moment the stock market is currently experiencing.
The s&p 500 is up almost 2% Hope you bought the dip /s
Wages have not kept up with productivity and GDP increases since the 1970s.
How about making single income middle class families possible again, so you can have one stay at home parent.
Ironically, thats the exact idea behind the whole trade war thing. It has lead to TSMC already accelerating their plans to expand the Arizona microchip fabrication lab, which means… Factory jobs, the thing we used to have in the 70’s.
US economic output is more than adequate to achieve this already, but we choose instead to concentrate the benefits in the hands of a few.
Regarding tarrifs bringing back manufacturing: https://www.kcl.ac.uk/trumps-tariffs-what-is-behind-them-and-will-they-work “but this is very unlikely to work. Manufacturing has changed, with production now spread across multiple countries in so-called ‘global value chains’. Moving whole supply chains back to the US is going to be prohibitively expensive, result in rising consumer prices and make US-produced goods internationally uncompetitive. The model of manufacturing that underpins Trump’s approach simply hasn’t existed for the best part of 40 years, and is not coming back.”
When last could a family in America raise two kids, have a stay at home parent, buy a house send them to college and still save for retirement on a single teachers salary. Most of the Abby boomers had that.
That’s not going to solve anything because it’s going to make products more expensive, which is the ‘exact idea.’
Enrich American oligarchs instead of those abroad that might be giving us a better deal.
The problem is they are not moving the 500+ factories that feed that lab. They are not moving the over 100 raw mineral resources supply chains.
They are just moving the last few steps to the US.
They are doing this ass backwards.
Daycare is free where I live. It has to be. You can’t expect people to pay for public services themselves; that’s done with taxes. Corporations can’t have customers or employees without people, and to get people to make more people, you have to make it easier for them. So what makes the most sense is cutting corporation porfits, which they don’t need past a limit if they aren’t investing in things that will benefit the public. So if a corporation isn’t doing anything good, raise their taxes, use them to pay for daycare.
60 years ago, wages were sufficient that one partner could be a homemaker even if the other only had a modest job, and they could afford a house and a car. We’ve only needed daycare as wages have stagnated against the cost of living.
After he rolls this out he’ll start pushing to drop the child tax credit arguing, “they already get so much investment up front. They’re so greedy.”
Clinton Floats $5,000 Baby Bond
~ September 28, 2007
It’s nice to know these two are still in touch.
put into an index fund over the last seventeen years, that $5k is now $30k. it was not a terrible idea.
Not on its face, no. I think it’s still a band-aid attached to a bigger problem of generational inequality. Public housing, education, and a large competitive public hiring sector would have gone much farther in rectifying poverty in the US.
But the extra insulting aspect of “Baby Bonds” is that they’re an idea dangled over a public hungry for economic reforms which never actually gets delivered. When liberals lose, they get to nag centrists and insist “We had all these good ideas but you were too racist and stupid to accept them”. When they win, we get an earful about how the federal courts, the super-majority Senate, the prior administration’s mid-level bureaucrats, the state legislatures, and two dozen of DC’s biggest lobbying firms all have to agree to go along with it or the reforms can’t pass.
Seems like Republicans are getting in on the same act, now that kitchen table liberalism is experiencing a popular resurgence.
Of all the people who are so strapped they could receive $5k and not immediately blow it on visa bills and rent, parents aren’t even close to the list. $5k into investments? Most of them are either flirting with bankruptcy or engaging in some heavy petting in a corner booth.
Don’t judge me. I got kids to feed.
It’s really gonna help to pay for diapers in an index fund.
In Bill Clinton’s defense it was intended for the child, not the parent.
From the article: “I like the idea of giving every baby born in America a $5,000 account that will grow over time,” said Clinton, “so when that young person turns 18 if they have finished high school they will be able to access it to go to college or maybe they will be able to put that down payment on their first home, or go into business.”
Personally I think the policy is a good idea, especially since it doesn’t encourage unwanted children from a short-term desire for cash. It would be great along with medicare for all, free tuition, a livable minimum wage, government housing for all, UBI…
I think it sounds like a way to give a bunch of money to Wall Street so they can gamble with it
Totally original idea
https://www.npr.org/2024/08/15/nx-s1-5077776/kamala-harris-child-tax-credit-housing
Are these those welfare babies Republicans always screeeched about?
They just cut head start, slashed medicade(51% of us babies are born on this program), no medicade no pediatric care for your baby either, cut hud, slashed the department of education, blocked student loan forgiveness, are dismantling the aca preventative care mandate, gutting worker protections, canceling child labor laws, laid off 275,000 workers and destroyed their livelihood and tanked the economy ……yea the birth rate is going to plummet. 5k lol doesn’t even cover a fraction of the utter devastation coming to American families from these moronic policies. Who in their right mind would want to bring a child into this racist sexist tech bro oligarchy?
And all to fund tax cuts for the wealthy - who don’t need them.
Are you saying the game of achieving highscores for world’s richest person with ever higher numbers isn’t important? /s
But that is a lot of complicated words, 5k is much easier to make a headline about, and re-elect the same people.
yea the birth rate is going to plummet.
I’m not so sure. Impoverished countries have the highest birth rates. I can imagine the logic of the wealthy 0.001% being “if we make the rest of the country as broke as Somalia, the birth rate will also be as high as Somalia.”
The Headstart cut hurts a lot. I know people that gone to that when they were little and had nothing but good things to say.
With the tariffs that hardly helps.
