Wow this post got popular. I got called into work and didnt see the replies, sorry ladies and gentlemen! Trying to catch up tonight.
I’ll let my lazy tub of lard know that she’s a “lethal danger” next time she waddles over to a new visitor shes never met and lays down with her head in their lap
I’ll let the dead kids know your dog is harmless.
Their dog hasn’t killed anyone, what’re you talking about?
That’s the equivalent of me blaming you for every murder ever committed by another human being.
All humans are one species. We have no breeds. Now if the government genetically modified some humans to indiscriminately murder for no reason then you could blame that “breed” of humans, yes.
Unironically a racist dog whistle…
Them telling me their dog is harmless is fucking meaningless, what’re you talking about?
That’s the equivalent of me telling people that no human would ever murder because I know this one guy that’s never murdered.
It’s the equivalent of you telling me that a specific person you know personally would never kill anyone.
Telling me that your mom, for example, would never hurt anyone, isn’t a crazy meaningless statement to make. You probably know your mom pretty well.
If the other commenter said “no dog would ever hurt anyone” then yeah, you’d be right. But that’s not what they said.
lmao, my mum wasn’t bred for violence, bro, gtfo. I’m glad my country keeps dangerous dogs out of peoples’ hands.
Nature vs nurture my friend - we have no idea how much of that breeding actually affects their psychology. This has been debated for god only knows how long.
Some slaves were also bred for violence. So, by your own logic, we should ban all of their ancestors as well right?
Humans are not fucking dogs you degenerate cunt. Why do pointers point without being taught? Why do herding dogs herd? Millennia of selective breeding with an animal that is known for having highly adaptable genetics. Fuck right off.
Lol were they? Because I severely doubt they realized that humans aren’t anywhere near as primitive as a dog and yoy can’t just breed violence into a human like that. It takes generations of foxes to be bred to be docile, it would take 100 years or so to get any wanted result in a human.
Oh you sweet summer child you sweet and innocent summer child you have absolutely no idea do you. I guarantee you your mother was just as you were just as I was. We murdered every single other hominid. We butchered the Dezavonians and the Neanderthals. Then we committed to several hundred thousand years of warfare against the last remaining hominid, other homosapiens. We are the violence monkeys. As far as I’m aware we have only seen humans and certain other great apes commit to sustained generational warfare. Just because we stand up walk around and put on clothes and talk to each other doesn’t mean we’re not vilant unpredictable animals. It doesn’t mean we’ve lost a capacity for violence far exceeding any dogs ability.
You sound like you make your livelihood off the blood of those dumb enough to buy the dogs you’ve immorally bred.
Is this a copypasta?
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Source?
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This site is an advocacy group for breed specific legislation.
And it’s all very well cited. Makes sense why an advocacy group exists for this
The National Rifle Association will offer a very well cited claim that strict gun laws increase violent crime. The Violence Policy Center will offer a very well cited claim that the opposite is true. Reality is likely more nuanced.
The hole in dog breed bite statistics is usually accurate identification of the breed.
Maybe I’m missing something, what does this advocacy group stand to benefit from banning pitbulls? The NRA is backed by weapons manufacturers. This seems to be people who actually see a problem and are taking actions to help protect people.
They are pushing arguments in favor of eugenics and genocide and have coopted dog-related injuries to push lies about history and genetic science.
Just go on their site and wherever they mention pitbulls, replace it with “Jews” and you really start to get the flavor of their bullshit.
People often hold strong beliefs that are not related to personal gain nor particularly rational. I don’t think their intent is nefarious, but I think it’s likely mistaken.
It’s not well cited because in over half of dog injuries the breed is unknown.
Also, two thirds of dogs identified as pitbulls by veterinarian staff have zero pitbull DNA.
The problem is that an advisory group trying to push legislation is much more likely to cherry pick and misrepresent their citations.
Okay but what is the motive for them to do this. You are claiming malice but you aren’t providing a motive for said malice
Not exactly. Studies on this are hard to accurately. In breif, people suck at id breeds, and mort studoes only ask the peraon what breed bit you
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=N7F4OfDSvPU&pp=ygUYcmViZWNjYSB3YXRzb24gZG9nIGJyZWVk
Thanks for telling me the same thing people have been parroting for an eternity. Check out Occam’s razor
What wrong with the counter studies
About 15 years ago I volunteered with a pitbull rescue, then did a bunch of research on pitbull attacks in grad school. The problem then was that most statistics like this were unreliable once you saw what they labeled a pitbull. In most cases it was just any “mutt” was considered a pitbull. I don’t know if things have changed, never really looked into it since then, but I’m still a bit wary of stats like this without knowing their data is accurate.
It doesn’t help that a lot of strays/rescues have a good chunk of pit bull blood in them.
Both of my dogs are rescues from programs in the southern US. One of them certainly seems to have some pit in him…beautiful brindle coat, block head, incredibly strong jaw, stocky-muscular build. He’s dumb as a bag of rocks but incredibly loyal and affectionate. Because of the stigma around pits, though, I’m afraid to get him DNA tested.
My little dog doesn’t have an ounce of pitbull in her. Her mom was a border collie/lab mix, and the Father was the Neighbor’s boston terrier/english pointer mix. The only thing remotely pitbull like about her is her underbite. That said, I’ve lost count of the times somebody at the dog park, usually someone with a little ankle biter dog of the teacup persuasion, has gotten uppity about me having a “pitbull” off leash. People are dumb.
Every breed you listed besides lab are nippers but are not notorious maulers. Sorry your little nipper is getting lumped in with the murder muffins.
I remember when climate change deniers were not sure about the science either…
were?
In most cases it was just any “mutt” was considered a pitbull.
Seems like an issue specific to wherever you went to school.
Most rational people would immediately draw clear separations between mutts and pitbulls or pitbull mixes.
I don’t think this comment is indicative of the problem at all.
Curious where you went to school though, lol. Might want to get a refund for that degree.
Most rational people would, but it was an indicator that people who report dog bites did not know the difference.
And I’m not sure what my school had to do with it. At that time I was sourcing data from external sources, using data reported on police reports or by other organizations. Someone else commenting referenced the breed specific legislation advocacy group that was a source for some of that data.
My comment might not have been clear, I was criticising the data I was finding.
The studies I’ve seen that people cite to say “you can’t identify a breed by looking at it” usually are playing a semantic game - and what often is not emphasized is that the same research shows that when people identify a dog as a “pit bull,” that those people are quite accurate in identifying–by morphology alone–the presence of genetics from one of the several aggressive breeds people call “pit bulls.” And that the morphology is positively correlated with higher aggression.
Actually it’s more likely a pitt is labeled incorrectly like a lab etc to get them adopted to people too ignorant to know better. So that’s gonna invalidate that statement.
And it’s probably worse if you do rate by breed.
But I suspect that it’s mostly due to a combination of breed and neglect/non-training. The kind of people who want a pit bull in particular, and the kind of people who just chain up their dog outside and never train or socialize it, probably have significant overlap.
Wrong. You’re misrepresenting the stats. You’re leaving out the fact that in over half of all dog bites the breed is unknown.
Also, in studies where vet personnel are asked to visually identify the breed of dog, they are wrong two out of three times. So if vet personnel can’t even do it, dog bite victims, police reports, and hospital reports, from where these statistics on dog bites are obtained, are definitely not getting right.
The truth is that we have absolutely zero legitimate idea what dogs are causing injuries. Even if the numbers on pitbulls were accurate, the breed is unreported in more than half of cases, which statistically speaking means there could be another breed of dog that you’ve never even heard of that’s responsible for more than half of all bites.
The other issue for me is the inherent racism by those who advocate for these policies. In every conversation, it eventually devolves to the proponent of breed bans doing one of two things: admitting that they are targeting certain types of people, not breeds, and arguments that rely on false assertions of history, genetic and behavioral science, that are identical to those put forth by eugenicists. The easy example is the false assertions that pitbulls were “bred for fighting.”
They were bred for hunting and loyalty to their families and children. The guy to originally bred them wrote several books which you can read on Google Books and discusses at length their loyalty to people and kids as a primary characteristics, moreso than any violence. It was their strength and determination that made them useful for hunting, not aggression.
They were used only for dog fighting decades after the big game hunting they were bred to do was banned, and even then, dogs that showed aggression to humans were banned from the “sport” if not outright euthanized.
The studies that you would cite to support your “you can’t tell a breed by its look” also tend to show that people are quite accurate at identifying that one of the many breeds that are called pit bulls are present in a particular dog. in other words, they can’t accurately say “this is a pure bred Staffordshire Terrier” but they can say, “this is a pit bull” and they’re correct, unless you’re playing stupid semantic games.
I don’t see where the study says that.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S109002331500310X
That study seems to state a conclusion precisely the opposite of what the experimental results were. Based on a small sample set, there’s a high degree of match, far more accurate than random chance, between the observations and the genetic findings.
Of the 25 dogs identified as pit bull-type dogs by breed signature, 12 were identified by shelter staff as pit bull-type dogs at the time of admission to the shelter (prior to the study visit), including five labeled American Staffordshire terrier mix, four pit bull mix, two pit bull, and one American Staffordshire terrier. During the study, 20/25 dogs were identified by at least one of the four staff assessors as pit bull-type dogs, and five were not identified as pit bull-type dogs by any of the assessors. …
Of the 95 dogs (79%) that lacked breed signatures for pit bull heritage breeds, six (6%) were identified by shelter staff as pit bull-type dogs at the time of shelter admission, and 36 (38%) were identified as pit bull-type dogs by at least one shelter staff assessor at the time of the study visit
So, at intake, 18 dogs were identified as pit bulls but only 2/3rds were at least 12% pit bull.
During the study, 56 dogs were identified as being pit bulls, but only about 1/3rd were in fact at least 12% pit bull.
This is the classic ‘base rate fallacy’. The false positive rate isn’t that high, and the false negative rate isn’t that high either. But because the true positive rate is pretty low, the ratio of true positives to false positives is much worse than you’d intuitively think.
Tests for rare diseases and attempts to behaviorally profile terrorists at airports runs into the same problem. Sometimes, a 99.9% accurate test just moves you from searching for a needle on a farm to a needle in only a single haystack.
And yet still wrong two thirds of the time.
Yeah that study probably relied on faulty data. Most dog bite data just the person what the breed was.
Did tou know putbull is not 1 breed but 3 different ones.
Most people cant reliably tell an american pitbul from other breeds in a line up.
Did you know that all of the breeds that are identified by the name “pit bull” rate high in aggression? And that the same studies that pitbull afficianados cite for “you can’t tell a breed by appearance” also support the idea that when people call a dog a “pit bull” based on morphology alone, that the dog stands a very high chance of having decended from one of the several breeds identified as a pit bull?
Not in the study i reaf. They lined pure American pitbull and some pitbull mutts and dogs with no pitbull. They only to reliably guees who was the pitbull, even counting the mutt as pb, was if the dog was showing teeth.
Actually, “pitbulls” are now well over a dozen different breeds people just randomly consider “pitbulls”
If it’s a stocky mutt with short hair . It’s a pitbull!
Dogs, when involved in killings, are identified by FIRST RESPONDERS or POLICE OFFICERS, not by anyone with ANY KNOWLEDGE OF DOG BREEDS OR HUSBANDRY
We DO NOT HAVE AN ACCURATE COUNT on which breeds commit the most violence because THE PEOPLE REPORTING THE BREEDS OFTEN DO NOT HAVE QUALIFICATIONS TO DETERMINE BREEDS
Generic Street Dogs and any medium sized mutt CAN BE and ARE MISIDENTIFIED AS PITBULLS. Unless first responders, the police, and other people recording dog violence learn how to actually identify dog breeds, INNOCENT DOGS AND FAMILY MEMBERS WILL BE GENOCIDED FOR NO JUSTIFIABLE REASON
Yeah, you’re a liar.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26403955/ https://nationalcanineresearchcouncil.com/visual-breed-identification/ It only takes a 2 second google search to find that visual identification of breed by people who EVEN WORK WITH DOGS is often incorrect, which is also to say people who DON’T work with dogs will have a poorer time correctly identifying breed by appearance alone
Lol, that’s breed identification. Most people don’t know most breeds. A lot of people who work with dogs don’t know all breeds.
Everyone can identify pitbull or pitbull mix vs not.
*Lack of consistency among shelter staff indicated that visual identification of pit bull-type dogs was unreliable. *
I mean if you’re not gonna click the links at least say so
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What a weird thing to come out with. Someone has suffered a terrible injury and you’re concerned with a bloody DNA test.
Wanting to exterminate an entire breed of dogs is the harder solution than actually figuring out the cause of the attacks
Alot of those dogs have pitbull in them.
Considering before the 70’s the American Pitbull was “the American Dog”, it is the most populous single breed in the entire country, consisting of more than DOUBLE the second most common breed
That is completely untrue
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First UK bans guns, then knives, now big dogs… what are you supposed to protect yourself with?
Thank God they’re focusing on the worst hardships that are being inflicted on the British people.
When the UK has had such a massive increase in KSI rates they have to act. As Gregorum said they can deal with more than one issue, even feckless fucks like ours.
if governments weren’t capable of doing more than one thing at a time, all of global civilization would collapse.
That is not as strong an argument as it used to be in 2023
Neither is “but what about this?”
Its called “Whataboutism” now aint it?
British govt seems to have stagnated for the last 70 or so years.
Well they’re not doing much about the climate and it feels like global civilization is collapsing, so…
The British government isn’t capable of doing any things any of the time. Not to add that while hundreds of refugees are dying trying to cross the channel, Suella bravermen (our home secretary) instead of rescuing, supporting and letting them in she’s complaining about dogs?? The point is that she of all people has bigger things she should be worrying about.
As Home Secretary this issues is EXACTLY part of her job! She has the power and finances to do both. Lets not assume she should give up on her other duties because of the boats, dont be conned.
What obligation does the UK have to rescue and take in people trying to illegally enter the country? Seems like a risk people have assumed for themselves and that helping them will only encourage more to try.
But it’s not illegal??? It’s international law that you have to take in any refugees seeking asylum and that applies to the uk as well. The uk is breaking international law and that had been certified multiple times by bodies like the echr and UN.
You’re right. I didn’t realize that the international law of aiding people in distress at sea includes those who intentionally create the risk for themselves in order to provoke rescue. But it does.
The o ly reason they have to create intentional risk is because they aren’t let past at the border like they should be.
Where are they disembarking from? France? EDIT: The right to cherry-pick the country one seeks asylum in is not clearly established in international law.
At the risk of pissing off the UK anti-dog chuds; it seriously makes me wonder how people in the UK are treating their dogs that’d cause them to act like this. I’ve known several people with pitbulls throughout my life. My dad had one as a child. None of those pitbulls ever hurt someone, but then again, none of them were beaten, abused (afaik), or trained as attack/home defense dogs. While I know pitbulls are different from an “American Bully XL” (damn, I love dog breeds that sound like marketing company named them), they’re pretty similar. If anything, a pitbull is more aggressive than a bully, so it would have been more likely for any of the pitbulls to suddenly “”“snap”“” and start attacking people for no reason.
They never did.
In fact, despite pitbulls being legal in the US, I’ve never personally heard of someone being attacked by one. I know it happens, I’ve heard about it in the news, but no one I’ve talked to has ever had an issue with a pitbull or known someone who has.
The only conclusion I’ve come to is that either the UK has a culture which encourages beating or abusing your dog to discipline them (causing them to eventually lash out), or (the more likely of the two) is that the dogs are being trained as attack dogs. That means it really shouldn’t be surprising to anyone when an attack dog, well, fucking attacks a human.
YOU TRAINED THEM TO FUCKING DO THAT YOU DUMBASS HUMAN SHITHEAD AND THEN YOU HAVE THE BALLS TO ACT SURPRISED WHEN THEY DO WHAT YOU TRAINED THEM TO DO.
Don’t blame the dog, blame the asshole who trained them. If your dog attacks another person and maims or kills them, you should be the one held accountable. You should be taken to court and tried as if you shot or stabbed someone. Maybe the UK already does that, but if not, I wonder how many people would still train dogs to attack an intruder or (aggressively) defend their home if they knew they could be locked away for 1st degree murder or treated like a mass shooter if their attack dog goes on a rampage.
Advocating to ban a dog breed because humans are pieces of shit is like saying we should ban climate activism because some climate activists engage in eco-terrorism.
The dogs were bred to be incredibly violent and dangerous. Pointers point, herders herd, and pits and bullies fucking kill.
citation needed
It’s in the name numbnut, Pit bull, it’s a pit fighter dog.
Bullies actually weren’t. They were bred to be strong, but another goal was to for the breed to have a lowered prey drive.
The reason why they’re so dangerous is because if one does become aggressive, then it is more than capable of completely ripping you apart. There are, however, breeds of dogs designed to defend livestock and homes (attacking intruders like animals or humans), but most of those are very rarely banned because they’re typically trained by a professional instead of a random chav who wants a dog to boost his ego because he can’t own a gun. Some examples are: Komondors, Great Pyrenees, Tibetan Mastiffs, Rottweilers, German Shepherds, Doberman Pinschers, and yes, Pitbulls (but not bullies).
Any dog can be trained to be aggressive (except maybe golden retrievers). Any dog can be mishandled, abused, beaten, or otherwise conditioned to lash out at someone. Stop blaming the dog and instead blame the human. The dog does what it’s been trained to do and if it’s been improperly trained, then it will appear to act erratically and lash out at random people, regardless of whether they’re a threat.
Same goes for EVERYTHING. The civilised world banned guns for less. USA still have cock fighting and bullriding. Like wtf. Of course responsible owners can handle a dog of that breed. Problem is those fanged weapons attract shitty people.
Cockfighting is illegal in every state in the USA.
Goddamn homophobes smh
En garde! 8==D
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Advocating to ban a dog breed because humans are pieces of shit is like saying we should ban climate activism because some climate activists engage in eco-terrorism.
I’d love for you to try to explain that simile.
I was trying to come up with a simile that people would be upset about. If I said, “it’s like saying we should ban Republicans because of the white supremacists” then people would be saying, “yeah, we should ban Republicans”. If I said, “it’s like banning Russians because of the war in Ukraine” there are a lot of people who’d unironically agree with that.
I know it’s not a perfect simile; there’s likely a growing number of people who believe that eco-terrorism is quickly becoming a necessity if we hope to have a chance of surviving the next 20yrs. However, there are a still a lot of people who’d tell you that blowing up an oil rig or assassinating the CEO of BP is too extreme.
American Bully XL
Dog breed or energy drink?
McDonald’s order. “I’ll have the American Bully XL, please, with a diet soda as I’m watching my figure.”
Every dog is a reflection of it’s owner. Every time this debate comes up I just think how incredibly dumb these people are. Punish the dog fighters and abusers. People can make any breed aggressive and dangerous.
I find it particularly hilarious that England calls these American bully XL, while America calls them Staffordshire Terriers. Wonder which state of the US these were native to. America is well known for cultivating dog breeds over hundreds of years. England exporting shit and then relabeling it and pointing fingers is nothing new I guess.
“I find it particularly hilarious that England calls these American bully X”
"The American Bully Kennel Club divided the American Bully into four categories, including the XL, Pocket, Standard, and Classic, whereas other registries, including the UKC, have approved one consistent size standard.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Bully
When you hate the English so much, you just spout bullshit and end up looking silly…
Some people that breed dogs known for fighting and have a club for breeding fighting dogs have a bunch of sub labels for the dogs they bred? Crazy. I should start a club and make your family inbreed. I can call them things like super fatty XL.
That is very tangential. You could just admit you were wrong and that it wasn’t a British creation, name wise. Seems your ego is a little too frail for that. Sorry to see that.
They’re not staffies, though.
They’re the same dog, it’s just been selectively bread for muscle mass and jaw size. Plus the assholes who breed them for that purpose like to clip the ears and doc the tails so they look more different than they should.
https://www.akc.org/expert-advice/dog-breeds/american-staffordshire-terrier-history-amstaff/
They’re not, though, they’ve been cross-bred to fuck.
Assholes breed dogs for muscle mass and size is kind of what I just said. Thanks for agreeing with me?
You said they’re the same dog. If they’re cross-bred, they have other breeds mixed in. Are you being intentionally obtuse?
So they bred a dog with a dog that looks like a dog to make a dog that still looks like the dog you say? Impressive how it still looks like a more muscular version of the same dog after all that.
Seriously, though, the wiki page is really easy to find:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_BullyThe breed is based on pitbulls, and has a bunch of other breeds mixed in. So they’re not staffies, have never been staffies, and you’re just making yourself look like a fucking moron.
So you’re just fucking stupid, then, lmao
Why doesn’t that include every breed of dog ever then? Since every breed is exactly that.
Cultural question to Brits as this happened in UK. Do people care if their dog attacks someone or is highly agressive to humans in UK?
By what I’ve heard from my friends, dog owners often put the blame on attacked/harassed passers-by, they don’t feel accountable for their wrongdoings (i.e. not using leash and not paying attention to where their dog is and what is it doing).
On no, my sweet velvet hippo wouldn’t hurt a fly! Says the pitbull owner as it eats what is left of grandma.
Hippos are extremely dangerous and viscious.
Ugh, please go back to Reddit with that attitude
On a public forum? You can kiss my ass.
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The attitude of a joke?
“Go back to Reddit” is the cringiest thing you can say on Lemmy.
Edit: different terminology… but bullyism is a thing so I’m gonna leave it up.
Bullies are a genetic anomaly that aren’t just pitbulls. For example, Wendy is a somewhat famous bully whippet:
Most responsible breeders don’t allow for pairings that would create it. Mostly because if they get too excited they have heart attacks- their heart can’t keep up.
It should be banned, but not because it makes dogs more violent than they otherwise would be.
Basically it comes from over breeding for muscle mass. It crops up in racing breeds mostly- whippets and greyhounds. But also, apparently, in beef cattle:
More info on Wendy and bully whippet mutation for those curious
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/strongest-dog-in-the-world/
People should learn about the history of media fearmongering around specific breeds, which is largely based in racism and a product of the drug war. Most studies around this topic simply gather stats from newspaper articles, which is problematic because the media consistently misidentifies dog breeds, overreports on certain breed attacks, and under reports on others. It’s one of the reasons why the Humane society and the CDC opposes any breed specific legislation and why more than 20 states have outlawed it.
Also, everyone on Reddit and here getting so worked up about certain dog breeds and dog bites is the most Karen-ass shit ever. You’re far more likely to be killed by a mosquito than a dog. Even other humans rank higher on that list. So, maybe recalibrate your outrage.
People getting mauled to death by a certain dog breed isn’t “karen-ass shit”.
Well I’ve only had one breed crawl through a picnic table and jump on me to get at my dog. Yes the owners where shit for letting the dog roam a campground. But I have never seen a dog so determined to get at another dog before and completely silent no growling barking just going in.
It’s literally a terrier breed. It’s what they’re bred to do. They’re all varying degrees of cracked out regularly and people though breeding one jacked breed of them was a) a good idea and b) okay for your average dog owner.
Kengals, malinois, hell even gsds; so many other breeds are equally as lethal and do just as much damage but they’re harder to obtain for the most part. The issue is that bullies (or bully breeds) are easy to get and people are either ill equipped to deal with the breed or are ignorant/neglectful dog owners.
Kengals, malinois, hell even gsds
They also just don’t randomly attack as much.
You’re far more likely to be killed by a mosquito than a dog.
Do you have a source on this? I’ve not seen any US cases of a person dying from a mosquito bite.
I see West Nile encephalitis all the time in my hospital. Not terribly unusual to get diseases from mosquitos.
That’s not to say pit bull breeds are dangerous or not, but we often misidentify the greatest risks in this world.
But we have a choice to allow pitbulls as pets. We don’t have much of a choice about the existence of mosquitos.
You have to look at risk, cost, and benefits on all these policy decisions. At some point your efforts are better spent elsewhere.
How much does it cost to stop breeding pitbulls?
Not going to happen without national policies in place.
We actually do, we can make the mosquitos that bite people extinct
Which would have far reaching consequences on other insectivores. Also, it’s not a foolproof solution we’ve created, the infertile male mosquitos will reduce the wild populations numbers, but likely not make them extinct.
Once the population dips too low it can’t come back easily, for several reasons.
But there are a lot of mosquitos, and the infertile males won’t fully displace the healthy male population, so it’s unlikely the population will ever dip too low to drive them to extinction.
Wait, does that mean no more mosquitos or can you simply have non-biting mosquitos? Because if the latter then what the fuck are we waiting for?
You missed the point. You’re basing your assumption on the idea that pit bulls are somehow inherently bad dogs kind of like society treats people of a certain color as if they are inherently criminals.
The CDC and Humane society are saying that’s an incorrect and poorly supported approach. That’s why they don’t support breed specific bans.
That’s not to say dog attacks don’t happen. Dogs of any breed can be aggressive. It depends on a lot of factors.
Here is an example of poodles being aggressive: https://nypost.com/2022/11/14/pack-of-10-poodles-attacks-california-beachgoer-and-her-elderly-corgi-service-dog/
And yet Pitbulls and pit mixes account for 85% of fatal dog attacks. Poodles account for 0%.
And studies have shown bad and neglectful owners only account for about 20% of dog attacks, so yeah, pitbulls suck as a breed.
You aren’t citing any studies. Even if you did cite a study, you won’t find one that isn’t based on news reports, and guess what? News reports are problematic because the media likes clickbait and fearmongers in order to get clicks and views, even as far back as the 1970s and 1980s. There is a documented history of the media misidentifying dog breeds, overreporting certain breed attacks, and underreporting others. That means the entire basis of your argument is not based on reality or truth because there is no reliable source. Your views are informed by media narrative that originated in the 1970s and 1980s and that has reinforced itself through folks like you repeating platitudes and anecdotes. It’s the same type of thinking that enforces racism and racist views. Actually, don’t you find it interesting that the same dogs preferred by people of color were painted as vicious beasts by the media? It’s almost like that was intentional.
Myself, I’d rather listen to experts like those at the CDC or the Humane Society, which dismiss this type of thinking.
I don’t feel like digging up the study I read a little while back, it was reviewed paper based on hospitalization data for dog bites, and I honestly don’t give a shit if you believe me because nothing will change your mind about that shit breed.
And pits contaminate every breed they touch, pit mutts are violent unpredictable shits too, and are the result of most of the non-pit attacks out there.
And fuck off with the racist claims, everyone I know who owns a pit is white as fuck.
yes, but do they die from it? i’ve seen more stories of people dying from pit bulls
Everyone I know that has been severely bitten by a dog it was a pitbull owned by a white person. Fuck off this this racism dogwhistle shit. Pits are an unpredictable and dangerous breed.
I had half my face ripped off by a dog when I was a kid. I take dog breeds and their danger potential seriously. Some animals shouldn’t be bred anymore. Pits are one of those animals.
It’s amazing to me that you’re not 30 points negative already. Maybe this place really is different than Reddit.
I’m actually disappointed their comment is still positive
Well you’re a twat
Don’t worry I downvoted them
My SIL got a rescue pitbull, worked with it every day and it was very well behaved. One day they came home and there was blood all over the house. It had attacked their other dog and luckily only grabed the collar which was ripped off and the tags all bent up. Dog was unrescued.
Few years later, I went to a dog park with my poodle. He sniffed a pitbulls butt and the dog whipped around and latched onto my dogs neck completely unprovoked and without warning. It took minutes and two adult men to get the pitbull off. Got lucky again and the pitbull only grabbed my dogs scruff but he still has scars years later. If it grabed just a little bit up my dog would have died.
Just a few weeks ago, me and my wife were walking down the street with our two dogs and 2.5 year old. Some dumb kids are chasing their 3 pitbulls through the streets as they got out. The loose pitbulls see our dogs from a block away and sprint at them. One runs up to my dog attempting to pick a fight immediately. I have had enough at this point and physically remove these dogs over and over until I can get the kids to control their dogs (which the never really do).
A bird dog naturally points birds. A bloodhound naturally follows scents. A cattle dog naturally corals animals (and toddlers). Is it so unbelievable that a dog fighting dog naturally fights dogs?
I go to the dog park all the time… dogs can be aggressive, but I haven’t seen it tied to breed. At my park, personally, I’ve seen aggression from Huskies, Poodles, German Shepherds, and plenty of others. I’ve also seen the most beefy muscular pit bulls that are lazy and chill and just want to lay around. The point is you can’t just look at the breed and assume the dogs demeanor. There is more to it than that. That is why breed specific bans are harmful.
Why? Do you breed them? Are you profiting off this crap?
I’m just curious, when the UK banned pit bulls, did the government just go around and round up everyone’s suddenly illegal dogs and put them all down?
Some of them, yes. They didn’t go hunting them but any complaints or incidents or they find one when investigating some other crime then you can be sure your pitbull would be taken away and destroyed.
I don’t think owners got prosecuted or anything as long as the dog was born before the ban, just the dog taken away. Breeders that continued selling them certainly did get prosecuted though.
Wait, like if a neighbor had a problem with you or something they could just report you have a pit bull and the government would then come and take your pet and kill it?!!?
I mean yeah basically. Same as if you have anything illegal.
No, not like that. A workmate had a staffy with longer than usual legs. For some reason the neighbours thought it was a pitbull so reported her. Police came, checked the garden was secure, gave some recommendations (like muzzle the animal in public - which she complied with) and left it at that.
It wasnt illegal to own them, it was illegal to buy them after the cutoff date, or to breed new dogs. The police got new powers but couldnt just take the dog without finding actual problems (to protect dog owners and give some fairness).
I mean that picture wasn’t chosen intentionally…
Reality is pitties are a protection breed like GSDs, Rotties, dobermans.
The main difference is those breeds are expensive. Pits have become the poster child for uncontrolled breeding among people who often specifically raise them to be aggressive. They are probably by FAR the most populous breed in cities in the US. It’s easy to have the most dog attacks when you’re the most popular bread.
I honestly don’t think most pits are any more dangerous than any large bread. And banning pits isn’t going to help the issue. Which is the people raising them to be aggressive and breeding them uncontrollably. They’ll just switch to another breed.
Shhhh, people would prefer to be emotional about this topic and base their views on anecdotes and media fearmongering. Please take your reason and logic elsewhere.
They are probably by FAR the most populous breed in cities in the US.
I’d love to know what your source for this information is.
Open the website for any city shelter. Get back to me.
Knowing full well I’m going to get trounced for not having “facts” the reality is there are no statistics. Even the shelters themselves refuse to keep track because of the stigma involved for pits. They use terms like “mixed breed” and “unknown”. I can say 90% of the dogs in my local city shelters are all at least a fair amount of one of the Pit breeds. As a long time involved member of the dog rescue community.
“It’s not a pitbull until it bites someone” could be a unwritten rule.
The fact that pit bulls have more difficulty than other breeds in finding a home doesn’t really work in your favor lol
This story is about the UK not the US. Pitbulls have been banned in the UK since 1991. There are not many pitbulls in the UK. Although the American XL Bully is closely related to the pitbull, it is not currently banned, but that may soon change.
How many breeds does the UK propose to ban?
Depends how many children they kill.
That’s not fair at all.
Sometimes they just maul the children’s faces until they’re permanently disfigured.
Unless it’s the right kind of children. Then the UK would demand everyone get that breed. If only there was a dog specifically associated with massive profits from the slave trade and horrible racism.
So they shouldn’t ban dog breeds because racists exist? Weird take.
I pulled a muscle trying to pretzel my brain around that, too.
I mean fuck the empire but if you’re gonna throw that shit down it feels only fair to mention the part where they also stopped the slave trade using force.
Well, that’s certainly the part they like to talk about constantly isn’t it?
I mean, in the 19th century London was the biggest city in the world, and like most cities was very progressive. If you look back now and judge from our current lens then it looks really conservative but people in the streets campaigned to end slavery, and the British government outlawed slavery across the whole empire and used their very large and impressive navy to enforce these laws. Just because some private individuals made vast profits off of selling slaves to the US doesn’t mean it was legal or even a popular thing.
That certainly is the part they like to talk about constantly isn’t it?
You brought it up. How is slavery in England’s history even relevant to dangerous dog legislation in the UK now? Which I assume isn’t the country you live in.
Fucking hell. Remind me to stay the hell away from the UK.
These should remind you to stay away from many countries/states:
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-specific_legislation#Canada
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-specific_legislation#United_States
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-specific_legislation#Central_and_South_America
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-specific_legislation#Republic_of_Ireland
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-specific_legislation#Other_European_countries
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-specific_legislation#Asia
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-specific_legislation#Oceania
deleted by creator
We’re better off without you, no fucking worries there mate.
Indeed you are.
I mean it sounds like just the one, American XL bully. Seems perfectly reasonable to me given how ridiculously powerful these dogs are makes them extremely dangerous when they’re being aggressive.
People are more dangerous than any dog. Can we ban them on looks too, please?
Oh wait. The US already does this. It’s called “racism.”
In the sense that humans are responsible for these natural abuses existing, sure. Humans can stop being dangerous in this sense by not breeding these unnatural predators.
Dogs have highly adaptive genetics, and have been selectively bred for millennia. Comparing dogs to humans shows how fucking ignorant you are.
Username checks out
I tell you what, if we specifically genetically engineer people to be aggressive and powerful and they start eating toddlers faces then I’m cool with banning them too.
“Dog racism”, fuck off.
It’s a bad faith argument people make to use people’s morality against them. Pitt owners tend to be conservative nazi types and they think they’re clever trying to use "woke"language
